Chris Goodwin

Edition purity is a myth.  When playing any edition, if there's something from some other edition that does what you want it to, why wouldn't you use it?
 
There's three major rules changes between 3rd edition and 4th, and one between 5th and 6th -- note I'm not talking about the host of minor differences from one to the next in terms of changing point costs for some power or skill.  
 
I don't understand the notion that if "we're playing 4th edition" that something from a later or earlier book  is off limits.  At least if I'm the GM.  If you want a concept, ask me, and I'll try to come up with a point cost or something; what's the difference whether I pull something from a different "edition" or make it up myself?
 
More tools for the toolkit!

And let's not forget the 4e Trifecta of Cobble:  EDM, Desolidification, and Transformation Attack.
 
No matter what kind of unusual-- or downright weird!-- notion you had, someone had a way to do it with the Trifecta of Cobble.   
 
 
 
 
Just to pick a little fun out of this:
 
Would that indicate that the new volumes are not wordy enough, or that making them more and more wordy isn't actually helpful?
 

 
 
 
 
 
And there was a relative lack of social media.  Seriously:  don't for a minute think that all of humanity hasn't been subtly changed by that.  All we really had in the early days of 4e were magazines (if you were lucky enough to be near a store that carried them), conventions (if you were lucky enough to have money, time, and one close enough to you that wasn't hosted by a pedophile  DragonCon), and-- if you were really, _really_ lucky, all the hardware and infrastructure that gave you access to a chatroom or two.
 
The difference?   We couldn't reach out and say "hey!  What does this mean?"! on a whim.  We would study it, interpret it, and keep re-doing those things until we found something that worked _for our groups_ or we tossed it (which also tended to work).  It wasn't really until we had the ability to reach out and question publishers and authors directly that we ever felt we had a _need_ to do that.   Once upon a time, we made it work in a way that made us completely happy.  A few decades later, we have a compulsion to make sure we are doing it exactly like ten thousand people we will never meet.  And better still ( I learned this one the hard way with Red October, way back when): finding out something that you and your groups "made work in a very satisfactory way" and had been doing for several years was actually _not_ what the publisher / authors had in mind, and that what they had in mind was something that your group didn't like at all.
 
In light of all those things, I have to believe that we tend to put a lot of unnecessary pressure on ourselves to attain some point of rules perfection that just flatly doesn't exist.
 

 
Makes for tons of books to read, though!     
 
 

Perhaps not; but I was on discussion forums, including this website, years before 5E was published. Debates over the meaning and implication of specific words in the 4E rules were frequent, lengthy and detailed, and sometimes heated. When 5E came out, while a few folks did post complaints about their increased wordiness, most welcomed the clarifications. The proof of that was the rules questions to Steve Long, which were compiled into a FAQ making up a hefty volume in its own right, and which had to be updated several times.
 
The inevitable conclusion was that, while there perhaps was not a need for longer and more precise definitions of specific points, there was clearly a demand for them from the clientele. Of course taste and fashion in gaming was different then.

I wouldn't buy the book...the PDF is cheap, tho.
 
I'd suggest you review the document Lord Liaden linked.  TL;DR -- 5th is conceptually cleaner, but has some (relatively isolated) issues of its own.
 
But I also agree that there's no perfect edition.  6E APG, for example, has one of the nicest limitations I've seen...damage-based END cost.  It's not so much that you're knocked out but beaten down.  It's adaptable to any edition.  For 4E on, I have a house rule I call High Scale...acts like MegaScale but at lower levels.  Teleport needs MegaScale;  but running and flight with MegaScale either get INSANELY!!! fast, or just scream for the abuse of buying next to nothing in the base power.  (Recognize, 4" flight, with a 3 SPD, and 1" = 1 km means you're moving 1 kilometer per second...roughly Mach 3.)
 
And maybe you just want to adapt some things...like the stats decoupling in 6E, but mostly use 5E.  Makes sense;  6E can be a mess.

I wouldn’t say it’s a myth. There’s a lot of groups out there. Now should you play edition purity? That’s up to the group. Either way the point is that no edition is perfect so a rule or build will come up and the GM will make a decision one way or another. Hence simplier is the myth.
Yes because there was no one at the time clambering for a Fifth edition and the question thread was void on the boards by people looking for answers.  <Roll the eyes>.

Edition purity is a myth.  When playing any edition, if there's something from some other edition that does what you want it to, why wouldn't you use it?
 
There's three major rules changes between 3rd edition and 4th, and one between 5th and 6th -- note I'm not talking about the host of minor differences from one to the next in terms of changing point costs for some power or skill.  
 
I don't understand the notion that if "we're playing 4th edition" that something from a later or earlier book  is off limits.  At least if I'm the GM.  If you want a concept, ask me, and I'll try to come up with a point cost or something; what's the difference whether I pull something from a different "edition" or make it up myself?
 
More tools for the toolkit!

Edition purity is a myth.  When playing any edition, if there's something from some other edition that does what you want it to, why wouldn't you use it?
 
There's three major rules changes between 3rd edition and 4th, and one between 5th and 6th -- note I'm not talking about the host of minor differences from one to the next in terms of changing point costs for some power or skill.  
 
I don't understand the notion that if "we're playing 4th edition" that something from a later or earlier book  is off limits.  At least if I'm the GM.  If you want a concept, ask me, and I'll try to come up with a point cost or something; what's the difference whether I pull something from a different "edition" or make it up myself?
 
More tools for the toolkit!

Sorry about the delays, folks. Partly it relates to some health matters and other real life causes for delay, partly it relates to me being lazy, partly it relates to what Hugh pointed out -- since I don't work full time for Hero/DOJ anymore, sometimes other things ambush me and take priority. But I'm working out some things, and Jason and I have figured out an arrangement that will give me the ability to answer rules questions on a regular basis. First I will have to clear out the backlog and delete all responses from other people, but that's what I get for taking so long.

I think it's important for everyone (maybe Steve Long most of all) to consider just how unusual that Q&A Forum is.  I don't believe that even the biggest players, like D&D or Pathfinder, make their top staff available to answer any and every rules question someone wants to post.  Those games have a lot more resources backing them than Hero does.
 
This is not "something Hero has to do to be in the game", it is a value-added which exceeds the norm - maybe someone else is aware of some other games that do this, but I doubt there are many, even if there are some.
 
It was only notable by its absence because we have been spoiled by its presence.

Yes, converting their 5e characters as we go.  My previous Pathfinder campaign gave me some ideas which I refined during the Pillars of Eternity test run campaign.
 
D&D spells are converted to rough equivalents using a points per level basis.  (Cantrips start at 30pts, 1st level 45 pts, 2nd level 52 pts, 3rd level 60 pts, etc.).
 
D&D Armor converts exactly as is to rPD/rED.  Plate armor is +8 Armor class in D&D and 8 rPD/rED in Fantasy HERO.
 
The players continue to level up their characters using 5e templates/applications.  And I convert the abilities over to HERO equivalents between sessions.
 
So far the only part that has required some GM work is converting spells.  But I had worked out Active Points per D&D spell level in a previous campaign.

@Chris Goodwintup those are considered level 1/Introductory play now.

To be honest, I just did the conversions and saw where they came in at.  They were almost all about dead on at 150.  
 
 

Oh yeah!  Some of the Americanized anime that made it over in the early 80's more or less was giant robots as superheroes. 

For years I've been trying to figure out Construction Points as they relate to the Escape Pod (as opposed to the ejection seat which is part of Life Support).  I just today realized that instead of a small robot that ejects from a bigger robot, it's a big robot that sheds most of its broken mass.  
 
That means that Combine, Leap (which is a System but relies on the robot's Lifters), and Transform (Multiform) don't come along, but all of the robot's other Systems do.

@Chris Goodwinfor Battletech, Sarna.net is your friend.

I think with the COVID that many of us are subconsciously thinking about the advantages of being isolated inside a large invulnerable robot body.   

I am going to assume the first couple of questions were directed specifically at Chris, since he's posting updates of the old material.
 
However, I really wanted to comment on this "Defector" idea you have here! 
 
My first thought was "Yeah!  That'd be a _great_ tie-in to large metal action!  Meet and escort under the cover of an arranged "attack" or something-- good idea!"
 
 
But before you go with a defector, particularly with the Slissil campaign as laid out in the book, remember that it changes the nature of your campaign _forever_.  Perhaps not in over-the-top unrecoverable ways, but in small ways:
War works because humans have the defensive ability to dehumanize the enemy: if it's not a valid living person, I can kill it; no problem.
 
That goes away with a defector: you have someone who, if not sympathetic to your side, has some personally-important reason to separate himself-- likely forever-- from his own people.  That's _big_, and not just in terms of what he's doing and how it impacts him, either.  You are showing that, as you said, they are not all in agreement.  You are showing dissent, and you are showing a personal code of ethics so strong as force him to leave his own people and surrender to a hostile alien force.  In short, you are making him a people, and the players may seize on that:  the Slissil asre just like us: they disagree and they argue and have they have rank and file and independent though and and and......
 
Now if that's not a problem for you-- if that's a direction you are either prepared for or are actually seeking, I say _go_ for it! 
 
 
If it's not a direction you're wanting to go (at least not yet), but you like the mech action of the defector situation, consider a spy.  A fake defector.  You can do several things with that, and several more long term, but right off the bat you've got someone who can be tracked by the enemy (presumably) and who is reporting back with who knows what sort of intel....   How much of what he shares with the players is deliberate misinformation, and what effect does this have on the war effort?   How do the heroes react when the truth comes out (if it ever does)? This angle gives you the advantage of  keeping a united enemy who cannot be trusted, right back where you started from when the story ends.   Even better!  Suppose a game year or two later, a _real_ defector makes contact!   How do the heroes handle it?  Does the last experience color their actions?  (yeah-- you bet it does!   ) 
 
 
 
Salvage and Recon are both classic bits, and work well with _any_ sort of war-themed game.
 
If you are really having some difficulties thinking up in-armor scenarios, try this:
 
Where do the superheroes go?  What can you do in this story that would require superheroes to show up and wrestle with the situation?   That's where you put the mechs.  That's why the mechs exist:  people don't have superpowers.  As a result of needing them, we built these beg metal beasts to do the superhuman things we ourselves cannot.
 
It sounds hokey, but at least give it a practice test or two.   It helps me tremendously. 
 
 

To clarify, I can envision scenarios outside of the Mecha but inside them is the problem.  One idea just hit me before this post would be Scavenger. The heroes learn of a Slissil ship that crashed out in the desert.  The PCs go in the Mechs to check it out and encounter Patrol Mechs. Or at least they have to be the diversion for the NPCs to leave the wreck?

When I bought Robot Warriors this was the campaign that I’d use. Alas nothing more than dreams. I do have (sorta) some of the Mechs updated though.  
 
For the Slissil how do you represent their lack of buoyancy? Is it worth bothering? 
 
My biggest problem (and this goes for Battletech too and man I love Classic BT!) is coming up with a good scenario/game?
 
One scenario I thought of would be Defector. I’ve felt that even in the short premise of the this particular sample campaign not all Slissil are in unison. Thoughts on that?

Since we don't have a general Robot Warriors discussion thread, I thought I'd start one.   It's here because RW is under Star Hero in the store.  
 
Rules questions, questions about how the build system works, mecha builds, weapon builds, character builds, anything Robot Warriors is welcome here.  And for any edition.  
 
I'll post some stuff shortly!
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Mike "Blazer" Machido
 
VAL CHA Cost Total Roll Notes 15 STR 5 15 12- HTH Damage 3d6 END [1] 18 DEX 16 18 13-   10 CON 0 10 11-   13 INT 3 13 12- PER Roll 12- 10 EGO 0 10 11-   10 PRE 0 10 11- PRE Attack: 2d6 6 OCV 15 6     6 DCV 15 6     3 OMCV 0 3     3 DMCV 0 3     3 PD 1 3   3 PD (0 rPD) 2 ED 0 2   2 ED (0 rED) 3 SPD 10 3   Phases: 4, 8, 12 5 REC 1 5     20 END 0 20     11 BODY 1 11     23 STUN 2 23      
Movement Combat NCmbat Notes Running 14m 28m END [1] Swimming 4m 8m END [1] Leaping 4m 8m 4m forward, 2m upward  
Cost MARTIAL ARTS   Basic Martial Arts 4 1) Martial Block: 1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, +2 DCV, Block, Abort 4 2) Martial Strike: 1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +2 DCV, 5d6 Strike 3 3) Martial Throw: 1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +1 DCV, 3d6 +v/10, Target Falls  
Cost SKILLS 10 +1 with All Attacks 7 AK: American Southwest 16- 7 Combat Driving 15- 7 Combat Piloting 15- 3 Concealment 12- 5 CuK: Alien Culture and Notables 14- 5 KS: Tech Underground 14- 2 Language: Spanish (fluent conversation) 3 Mechanics 12- 3 Paramedics 12- 3 Streetwise 11- 3 TF: Mecha, Helicopters, Small Planes 6 WF: Common Melee Weapons, Small Arms, Earth Force Mecha Weapons  
Cost TALENTS 4 +2/+2d6 Striking Appearance (vs. anyone attracted to men)  
COMPLICATIONS Value Hunted: Sirians Infrequently (Mo Pow; Harshly Punish) 15 Hunted: Tech Underground Infrequently (Mo Pow; Watching) 5 Social Complication: Subject to Orders: Tech Underground Frequently, Major 15 Psychological Complication: Needs to prove his manhood (Very Common; Strong) 20  
BACKGROUND/HISTORY "Blazer" Machido was a young punk running around the southwest in a jeep when the Slissii came. He was trying to get away from the city where he had grown up. The kids had always treated him as a "pretty boy" and he was always fighting to try to get respect. When the aliens landed he went right on fighting and found his way into the Tech Underground.  
CAMPAIGN_USE Mike "Blazer" Machido is a sample player character for Robot Warriors, and can also be used as an NPC robot pilot.  
PERSONALITY Mike feels like he has a lot to prove.
Base Pts: 150
Exp Required: 0
Total Exp Available: 0
Exp Unspent: 0
Total Character Cost: 150

Roger "Scotty" MacDermott
 
VAL CHA Cost Total Roll Notes 18 STR 8 18 13- HTH Damage 3 1/2d6 END [2] 15 DEX 10 15 12-   13 CON 3 13 12-   13 INT 3 13 12- PER Roll 12- 10 EGO 0 10 11-   13 PRE 3 13 12- PRE Attack: 2 1/2d6 5 OCV 10 5     5 DCV 10 5     3 OMCV 0 3     3 DMCV 0 3     5 PD 3 5   5 PD (0 rPD) 3 ED 1 3   3 ED (0 rED) 3 SPD 10 3   Phases: 4, 8, 12 7 REC 3 7     26 END 2 26     12 BODY 2 12     28 STUN 4 28    
 
Movement Combat NCmbat Notes Running 12m 24m END [1] Swimming 4m 8m END [1] Leaping 4m 8m 4m forward, 2m upward  
Cost SKILLS 5 +1 with mecha weapons 5 KS: Tech Underground 14- 7 AK: American Southwest 16- 5 CuK: Alien Culture and Notables 14- 4 PS: Video Games 13- 4 WF: Small Arms, Earth Force Mecha Weapons 3 Climbing 12- 9 Combat Driving 15- 9 Combat Piloting 15- 5 Computer Programming 13- 3 Electronics 12- 3 Inventor 12- 3 Robotics: Mechanics 12-  
COMPLICATIONS Value Hunted: Sirians Infrequently (Mo Pow; Harshly Punish) 15 Hunted: Tech Underground Infrequently (Mo Pow; Watching) 5 Social Complication: Subject to Orders: Tech Underground Frequently, Major 15 Psychological Complication: Intensely Curious (Common; Strong) 15  
BACKGROUND/HISTORY "Scotty" MacDermott was a video game designer on a rock climbing holiday, when the aliens landed. His curiousity about the alien technology, along with his clever abilities with computers and electronics, made him a useful mechanic for the Tech Underground. Happily, he also showed great promise as a pilot, and now alternates between examining alien technology and blowing aliens away.  
CAMPAIGN_USE Roger "Scotty" MacDermott is a sample player character from Robot Warriors, and can also be used as an NPC robot pilot.  
PERSONALITY Scotty loves figuring out how things work. He also loves piloting a giant robot!
Base Pts: 150
Exp Required: 0
Total Exp Available: 0
Exp Unspent: 0
Total Character Cost: 137
 
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Roberta "Magic" Baker
 
VAL CHA Cost Total Roll Notes 13 STR 3 13 12- HTH Damage 2 1/2d6 END [1] 20 DEX 20 20 13-   10 CON 0 10 11-   13 INT 3 13 12- PER Roll 12- 10 EGO 0 10 11-   10 PRE 0 10 11- PRE Attack: 2d6 7 OCV 20 7     7 DCV 20 7     3 OMCV 0 3     3 DMCV 0 3     3 PD 1 3   3 PD (0 rPD) 2 ED 0 2   2 ED (0 rED) 3 SPD 10 3   Phases: 4, 8, 12 5 REC 1 5     20 END 0 20     10 BODY 0 10     24 STUN 2 24      
Movement Combat NCmbat Notes Running 12m 24m END [1] Swimming 4m 8m END [1] Leaping 4m 8m 4m forward, 2m upward  
Cost SKILLS 5 +1 with mecha weapons 7 AK: American Southwest 16- 7 Combat Driving 15- 7 Combat Piloting 15- 3 Computer Programming 12- 3 Concealment 12- 5 CuK: Alien Culture and Notables 14- 3 Disguise 12- 3 Electronics 12- 3 KS: Camouflage 12- 5 KS: Tech Underground 14- 2 KS: Trick Tactics 11- 3 PS: Stage Magician 12- 3 Paramedics 12- 3 Sleight Of Hand 13- 3 Stealth 13- 4 WF: Small Arms, Earth Force Mecha Weapons  
COMPLICATIONS Value Hunted: Sirians Infrequently (Mo Pow; Harshly Punish) 15 Hunted: Tech Underground Infrequently (Mo Pow; Watching) 5 Social Complication: Subject to Orders: Tech Underground Frequently, Major 15 Psychological Complication: Will always try to outmaneuver rather than outfight opponents (Common; Strong) 15  
BACKGROUND/HISTORY "Magic" Baker was on tour as the assistant of a second rate magician when the aliens attacked. She was picked up by the Tech Underground as a refuge. Her amazing reflexes made her a natural robot pilot, and she had a knack for pulling nasty tricks and tactical misdirections.  
CAMPAIGN_USE Roberta "Magic" Baker is a sample player character for Robot Warriors, and can also be used as an NPC robot pilot.  
PERSONALITY Magic is a good tactician and pilot, and enjoys proving it to the Slissii.
Base Pts: 150
Exp Required: 0
Total Exp Available: 0
Exp Unspent: 0
Total Character Cost: 149
 
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Andrew "Tex" Carlton
VAL CHA Cost Total Roll Notes 15 STR 5 15 12- HTH Damage 3d6 END [1] 17 DEX 14 17 12-   13 CON 3 13 12-   13 INT 3 13 12- PER Roll 12- 10 EGO 0 10 11-   10 PRE 0 10 11- PRE Attack: 2d6 6 OCV 15 6     6 DCV 15 6     3 OMCV 0 3     3 DMCV 0 3     4 PD 2 4   4 PD (0 rPD) 3 ED 1 3   3 ED (0 rED) 3 SPD 10 3   Phases: 4, 8, 12 6 REC 2 6     26 END 2 26     10 BODY 0 10     25 STUN 3 25      
Movement Combat NCmbat Notes Running 12m 24m END [1] Swimming 4m 8m END [1] Leaping 4m 8m 4m forward, 2m upward  
Cost POWERS END 4 Brawling: Hand-To-Hand Attack +1d6 (5 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/4) 1  
Cost SKILLS 10 +1 with All Attacks 7 AK: American Southwest 16- 9 Combat Driving 15- 9 Combat Piloting 15- 5 CuK: Alien Culture and Notables 14- 3 Demolitions 12- 3 Electronics 12- 5 KS: Tech Underground 14- 3 Mechanics 12- 4 PS: Wildcatting (oil drilling) 13- 3 Paramedics 12- 2 Survival (Desert) 12- 2 TF: Mecha, Agricultural & Construction Vehicles, Small Planes 4 WF: Small Arms, Earth Force Mecha  
COMPLICATIONS Value Hunted: Sirians Infrequently (Mo Pow; Harshly Punish) 15 Hunted: Tech Underground Infrequently (Mo Pow; Watching) 5 Psychological Complication: Devoted to Personal Freedom (Common; Strong) 15 Social Complication: Subject to Orders: Tech Underground Frequently, Major 15  
BACKGROUND/HISTORY "Tex" Carlton was a young man learning to be an independent oil driller, or wild cat, when the Slissii landed. His knowledge of the desert, his ability to take care of himself, his ability to drive and fly, and his love of the freedom of the desert made him an early member of the Tech Underground.  
CAMPAIGN_USE Andrew "Tex" Carlton is a sample player character for Robot Warriors, and can also be used as an NPC robot pilot.  
PERSONALITY Tex is strongly devoted to personal freedom.
Base Pts: 150
Exp Required: 0
Total Exp Available: 0
Exp Unspent: 0
Total Character Cost: 147

Thanks.
 
I'm rather taking time with it, picking things I like and studying them to see what will and won't fit.  I like a lot of individual elements that I've had to lay aside already-- my initial idea featured alien occupation, etc-- very similar to the animated series WCW recommended as a reference, really (thanks again, WCW), but I really want that "fear of the unknown" angle, and eventually had to just pull out a few bits and leave the larger parts of the plot alone.     Still, I had a flash of the setting, and I want to stay as close to it as possible.
 
It won't be quick:  I'm working on so many things, and I am only off one day a week.  The other days are from 6am "until," with "until" usually 7pm or later, so I don't have copious amounts of spare time.  However, as I stated, I am looking at a rework of Robot Warriors (anyone else notice that a lot of us have giving that considerable attention lately?), and I'd like to have a setting in place for play testing, but I've also been pecking away at a fantasy setting (that I haven't touched in a couple of months    ), getting the truck road worthy again, etc, etc, etc....  And of course, cataloguing the entirety of "compatible with HERO."  That's gotten harder to do since I started researching the old gaming magazines.  Way back when, I thought there were maybe a dozen.  Evidently, for everyone of which I was aware, there were a thousand I had no idea existed.    
 
 
 
 
Lots of projects: no time.  
 
It's all good, though.  Something will get finished eventually.  

Funny you should say that:
 
I was considering a "once we got to the belt and started mining, we found evidence, here and there-- only small hints and suggestions-- that the asteroids were once a world, inhabited by a race that died long before there was life on earth, a race that made technological strides further than our own, but at some point stopped reaching for the stars, and turned all their efforts to war...."
 
Something along those lines. (and yes; it would be some of these discoveries that led to the development of "mech tech" in the campaign universe).
 
Haven't put much thought into the aliens yet, but honestly, the entire campaign could play all the way through without learning anything about them.  The approach taken in the video Thia posted is very much akin to how I pictured the initial encounters going: mysterious, seemingly-invulnerable invaders from beyond....

I'm sort of low on time to complete and post the Locust conversion I'm working on, and I'm thinking that the best way to convert is to do it the way you'd convert anything else to Hero.  Convert the spirit of the original.  The converted Locust should be a small, fast, lightly armed and armored mech with no hands that only crazy people pilot more than once.

I only played Battletech once, at a tiny con in about 86 or 87. The people running the game gave us like a 10-20 minute orientation then threw 40 mostly inexperienced players and their mechs to protect a convoy against...Godzilla.
 
It was a real blast.
 
I've been reluctant to buy the Battletech online game because I'm afraid I'd get addicted and disappear down a rabbit hole for the next 10 months.