Kintara

Well, if you read the system, the limit is still there (in a way). The system works so that you tally the mana you spend, and when it reaches a threshold, you have to roll on a calamity table. You can spend as much mana as you want, but you will cause all kinds of havok to you, the people around you, and even the world. Edit: I'm going to expand on why this system is a little bit difficult to implement. I can simply import the Calamity table and threshold stuff whole cloth, and make it a Side Effect. Or I can think of some sort of way to make it an END reserve, and cap it at a very high level (not my favorite option). But the problem doesn't end there because of the way spells work in GURPS. In GURPS the limit on power is defined by how much fatigue you spend. In HERO, it's more about the point cost of the spell. To put it another way, GURPS spells are pushable to an extent that HERO spells aren't. In fact, many GURPS spells are unlimited in their pushing ability, and are instead limited by the amount of Endurance (Fatigue, in GURPS) you can practically spend.

*LINK* Here is a magic system I've always wanted to use. You might be familiar with it. I was thinking about how I would implement it. It's really great, and lends real mysticism to magic. Of course it doesn't play well with Hero, in a few respects. It is open-ended with respect to mana. No limits in HERO equal issues. Also, the way that GURPS magic worked allowed for spells to expand in scope with the amount of fatigue you spend. To get the flavor of the system, there needs to be spells that can be rather epic in scale, if the mage wants to expend a lot of power at once. There also needs to be no limits on the amount of mana you spend. Anyway, the mana system might be covered by making the spells No End, and taking a Side Effect that simply inserts the system in. I would have to think on what it was worth. Of course, I still need to think on how the spells would work. How do you envision implementing this?

You think a similar ability (like a naked Personal Immunity, Usable on Others, Area Effect) might work to describe a one way Force Wall? One way would mean you can attack out but not in. We were thinking that maybe another Defensive power is required for something like that.

Remember that a lot of the time, when people get knocked back sickening distances, it's the result of them flying. If you knockback a character with Persistent Flight, and do enough damage to stun them, they'll fly back quite a distance.

It's because a power advantage like, say, Armor Piercing is usually written in with ONE specific power. For example, Energy Blast 10d6, Armor Piercing (+1/2) (75 Active Points). But it would be written "naked" if it applied to, say, all the guns he uses. In this case, he buys Armor Piercing with a maximum AP limit. Any gun he uses that is lower than the AP limit can be Armor Piercing. Armor Piercing (Pistols), Max AP: 60. Real Cost: 30. Anyway, the point is that it's a notation thing. Most of the time a power advantage is part of the write up of a power. Sometimes it's divorced from a specific power, and is just there alone. Alone=naked. (Edit: Also note that this isn't the only style of naked power advantages. Read here.)

Or a suit of magical armor that was magically bound to a hero. The trouble is that the hero's been dead for three hundred years, and the intelligent armor simply cannot become unbound from the warrior's skeleton. So it has decided to move around, just leaving the limp skeleton there behind the visor. Edit: On second thought, that sounds vaguely familiar. . . .

Hmm, so powers are derived from magic. But do you need to study magic to effectively use your abilities? I'm assuming that there are wild talents who just have inherent abilities. I think it would be neat, however, to limit it to real mages, with all the studying that entails. If someone wants to be a Brick as described above, he must engage all matter of study, sacrifice, and rituals to obtain said powers. It also gives each power a set of various magical limitations. Of course, you probably already decided something as big as this, worth mentioning though. Anyway, so he's vulnerable to cold iron. Fey blood? If so, a Fey name makes sense; Oberon springs to mind.

I completely agree, which makes the power interesting, as it comes down to "according to the sword".

Except when the other heroes take offense from this. I'd say quite a lot of heroes would be skeptical of the sword, regardless of how right it turns out to be. So there are plenty of hiccups to the vigilante's life.

Ok, I think the setting needs a synopsis. What is the nature of superpowers, for instance?

Well, hmm. Since the villains don't know they are in a game, it's probably likely that they call upon other aspects of the setting or character to define themselves (and therefore, their names). I'm not saying that stats can't be the focus of a character's concept (in fact, I like doing that), but I am saying that it's likely to be more complicated than that. Maybe they are empowered by some natural essence of humanity's make up; they are the primary stats that define the characters in the world. If so, then perhaps each piece of essence has a name. I'd make them up wholy, but drawing on mythology or theology is good as well. Since they are villains, either the Universe is very dark, or they are the "Dark Side" essence avatars. Anyway, I'd make each of the essences themselves godlike beings, and the avatars, well, their mortal avatars. This makes The Avatars killable as individuals, but not as a group, as the essences can somehow create new avatars. I'd say they'd need to be reincarnated from birth.

Well, I think that if a sword was meant to kill the guilty in this way, it would mean guilty enough to die (perhaps all those guilty of killing or torturing for utterly selfish reasons). So the sword killed a murderer, just the wrong one. That said, the advantage would be sizable, not immense. After all, who trusts the righteousness of the sword, beyond the hero? What about its fallability? It certainly works in a pinch though.

Take each character, make them primarily good at one sort of archetype, and a novice at another. Then have each really love their novice powers, and hate their primary ones. A Brick who is obsessed with his minor magical aptitude, and the group's Mystic. A Speedster who fanatically trains with the Mentalist to develop his technokinesis powers. A Energy Projector who loves Kung Fu Fighting (but has only the ability of a minorly talented normal at it). And a Mystic who desperately wants to understand the idea of patriotism. He's an alien, and is as arcane as can be, and has never heard of patriotism. Maybe his society is naturally anarchical (from our perspective) and is slowly dissolving from it. The Energy Projector is a Patriot (Chinese?). A Mentalist with a wicked temper and a love of destruction. He follows around the Brick. And a Martial Artist whose talents don't include flight, the one thing he was expecting to finally master in his Eastern travels (the Speedster is the Flyer). I guess he saw Crouching Tiger too many times. Call them The Envious. Oh, and strengthen the explanations for why they hate their primary powers (the comics are filled with them).

Well, all good superheroes have arch-nemeses. And most that are sucked from an alternate dimension have one from their old dimension. So pick one of those up. He may or may not be from an alternate dimension, but the character probably thinks so (rather than simply a magical construct made from imagination, or some such thing). Lots of anime characters have strange quirks, obsessions, hobbies, and phobias. For example, many react strangely to the opposite of sex. From what I can tell from your description, it sounds like a character who would be on some sort of mission. Give him some sort of "futile" mission, like trying to obtain the last 37 Octahedrons of Civeraku, or something. Something like that would mesh well with your archnemesis. The items may or may not exist in this reality, but that won't stop them from constantly wasting time trying to find and control them (and villains can bait the character with them). Or maybe his obsession is to simply get home.

Yeah, or just change the special effect of Deduction to "Luck", and buy it up nice and high.

Buy Absorption tied with your defenses. Then, as your character does really stupid things (that would hurt him), you can channel it to your powers.

Shouldn't Telekinesis be used instead, or am I missing something?

Well, an inch happens to be to what one level corresponds. I see your point though, non-combat movement could be confused with inches of normal flight, if I used the term "level" too much. Did I mention, ? Anyway, do most GMs use minimum costs, as outlined in the book? What power level do you stop using them? Maybe this problem with Flight implies that there should be some starting level that costs more. After all, that single inch of Flight is far more useful than any other successive level. Maybe that should be modeled more directly.

Ah, beat me to that one. I'm not a real expert with the rules yet, so I was about to check on that. So, yeah, the END cost. So, to make them rather closer to eachother in safety, and not rather fatiguing, you'd want to buy it to the Persistent level. So that makes it 4 points a level.

Right. Also, I think that the danger Flight poses as a Constant power is notable. If someone hurts you enough to deactivate your flight, you might get rather inconvenienced by gravity. But the fact that Running starts at 6" is a good point. Of course, I wouldn't let a character buy only a single level of Flight, even if it was enhanced with power advantages, because I think the benefit of defying gravity requires a significant investment.

I'm not really going through the trouble. I'm just looking at options. As for the skills, I wasn't thinking a complicated formula. In fact, I was thinking one formula. You see, HERO already divorced characteristics from skills when you don't invest points in them. As an Everyman skill, you roll 8- (or sometimes 11-). That's it. Why not just forget the whole characteristics tie to skills thing and buy them to whatever level you feel comfortable with? The idea is that you won't be paying for the part of the characteristic that adds to all the skills. You just pay for the skills. There's no more "package deal" aspect to characteristics. This might make characters more expensive in the end, but maybe it will allow for more variety in character design. There will be no such thing as breakpoints if you do it like this. Every point in a characteristic will mean something, and something very particular.

Well, there are certainly plenty of ways to obtain the specificity. But still, I like the idea of making everything independant of everything else. I suppose that the major problem with this is that it complicates some powers, like Adustment powers. Of course, it doesn't have to be much of a problem. I think redefining what an expanded effect is covers that problem pretty well.

I'm curious about how far people have gone in desconstructing the characteristics. I remember the debate about the figured characteristics; they seem like more trouble than they are worth. But how far can you take this? Pretty darned far. You can pull Str apart. First, obviously, would be figured characteristics. But you can also pull Str damage away from lifting and encumberence. Although they are usually logical together, they don't have to correspond so directly. Dex can be pulled from skills entirely, including CV. So Dex could pretty much disappear. If you want high skills, pay for them at the right level. There would have to be an Initiative characteristic, though. Con is a simple extraction of figureds. Then you make characteristic for health-related things (Health), and another for Stunning Protection. Int would, hmm, go away, I suppose. It's mostly a skill thing. Just take Perception into consideration. If you want to be smart, buy skills, like Dex. Pre is another skill extraction thing, just leaving the Presence attack aspect. I know this has been thought of before, it has to have been. I can understand why it wasn't done officially, it's too abstracted. HERO is already a lot of work for some people. Still, I like the idea of things being highly isolated. So back to the question: How far have you gone in this direction? Edit:The major problems in what I laid out seem to be making sure that characteristic rolls are covered by something, and keeping skills point balanced. Skills done like this would be more expensive, if you didn't make changes. The cheapening of Characterisic costs wouldn't alleviate the problem totally, I don't think. What else needs deconstructing, btw? Any powers you consider too structured? Also, about skills, I suppose you could make the skill categories their own characteristics. Giving the option might be nice, if it fits into the balance of things. But, on the other hand, that's adding a fair amount of structure. Skills can have many "special effects" after all. In fact, there is often the complaint that skills are based on a combination of factors. Adding categories biases the system in a way that makes it more helpful to conform to a particular conception.

Yeah but Monolith said this is true (right?): +10 Dex with the limitation Doesn't Add to Skills X,Y,Z (-1/4) recieves the effects of the No Figured Characteristics limitatation, but not the point savings. Why shouldn't you get +10 Dex Doesn't Add to Skills X,Y,Z (-1/4), No Figured Characteristics (-1/2 [? don't have my book])? Edit: Ok, last time I bring this up, this time. Don't want to be too off topic.

I understand why you might get free points out of it. The question I have is why can't you take No Figured Characteristics when you take another limitation? (Monolith said you have to lose figured characteristics with no compensation as soon as you take another limitation. So you take a 1/4 limitation on Dex, and it's like taking No Figureds and the 1/4 limitation.)