Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

[Archon]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Thia,

 

Here's the build for my long running character in FH at the start of his career. I'll post his final version later. That version went through 2 long running campaign and several one-shots. He also picked up some fairly powerful magic equipment.

 

Mixtlel Gryphonclaw

Val Char Cost Roll Notes

15 STR 5 12- Lift 200.0kg; 3d6 HTH damage

20 DEX 30 13- OCV: 7/DCV: 7

15 CON 10 12-

10 BODY 0 11-

13 INT 3 12- PER Roll 12-

10 EGO 0 11- ECV: 3

18 PRE 8 13- PRE Attack: 3 1/2d6

14 COM 2 12-

5 PD 2 Total: 5 PD (0 rPD)

3 ED 0 Total: 3 ED (0 rED)

4 SPD 10 Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12

6 REC 0

30 END 0

26 STUN 0 Total Characteristics Cost: 70

Movement: Run: 7"/NC"

Swim: 2"/NC"

 

Cost Powers END

2 Fast Runner: +1" Running (7" total) 1

 

Half-Elven

5 Elf Sight: Ultraviolet Perception

2 Elf Life Span: Life Support , Longevity: 400 Years

 

Martial Arts: MA NAME

Maneuver OCV DCV Notes

4 Slash +0 +2 STR +4d6 Strike

4 Running Stroke +0 -2 STR +4d6 +v/5 Strike, FMove

4 Parry +2 +2 Block, Abort

4 Sidestep -- +5 Dodge, Affects All Attacks, Abort

 

Skills

6 +2 with Fencing

6 +2 with bows

 

6 WF: Common Melee Weapons, Common Missile Weapons, Off Hand, Whips

3 Acrobatics 13-

3 Breakfall 13-

3 Concealment 12-

7 Fast Draw 15-

2 Gambling (Card Games) 12-

3 High Society 13-

2 KS: Fencing 11-

3 Oratory 13-

3 Paramedics 12-

 

Total Powers & Skills Cost: 80

Total Cost: 150

 

75+ Disadvantages

0 Normal Characteristic Maxima

25 Campaign Hunteds

15 Psychological Limitation: Duelist Code (Common; Strong)

15 Psychological Limitation: Protective of Innocents (Common; Strong)

10 Reputation: Duelist 11-

10 Rivalry: Professional (Jingoro), Rival is As Powerful, Seek to Outdo, Embarrass, or Humiliate Rival, Rival Aware of Rivalry, Rival is a Player Character

 

Total Disadvantage Points: 150

 

Archon

[Archon]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

There's a few differences in skills and disads because I recreated the 150 version without referencing the high version and my memory missed a few things. I'm also too lazy to go back and fix it.

 

Mixtlel Gryphonclaw

Val Char Cost Roll Notes

15 STR 5 12- Lift 200.0kg; 3d6 HTH damage

20 DEX 30 13- OCV: 7/DCV: 7

15 CON 10 12-

13 BODY 6 12-

13 INT 3 12- PER Roll 12-

10 EGO 0 11- ECV: 3

18 PRE 8 13- PRE Attack: 3 1/2d6

16 COM 3 12-

6 PD 3 Total: 6 PD (0 rPD)

4 ED 1 Total: 4 ED (0 rED)

4 SPD 10 Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12

6 REC 0

30 END 0

29 STUN 0 Total Characteristics Cost: 81

Movement: Run: 7"/NC"

Swim: 2"/NC"

 

Cost Powers END

6 +2 with bows

6 +2 with swords

20 +2 Overall

 

5 Rapid Attack (HTH)

5 Defense Maneuver: I-II

7 Fast Draw 15-

8 Killing Blow: Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (plus STR) (vs. PD) (15 Active Points); OIF: Blade of Opportunity (-1/2), No Knockback (-1/4) 1

15 Master of Blades: +6 with DCV (30 Active Points); Only to Counter DCV negatives from Rapid Attack (-1)

6 Master of Blades: Missile Deflection (Arrows, Slings, Etc.) (10 Active Points); OIF: any sword (-1/2), Will Not Work Against Heavy Missiles (-1/4)

 

Half-Elf

5 Elf Sight: Ultraviolet Perception

2 Long Life: Life Support , Longevity: 400 Years

3 Language: Elven (Completely Fluent, w/Accent)

 

Martial Arts: MA NAME

Maneuver OCV DCV Notes

4 Martial Strike +0 +2 STR +2d6 Strike

4 Charge +0 -2 STR +2d6 +v/5 Strike, FMove

4 Martial Block +2 +2 Block, Abort

4 Martial Dodge -- +5 Dodge, Affects All Attacks, Abort

4 Martial Disarm -1 +1 Disarm; +10 STR to Disarm roll

3 Legsweep +2 -1 STR +1d6 Strike, Target Falls

 

Perks

2 Reputation: Duelist / King's Agent (A small to medium sized group, 11-) +2/+2d6

 

Skills

3 Acrobatics 13-

3 Climbing 13-

3 Breakfall 13-

3 High Society 13-

3 Paramedics 12-

3 Riding 13-

3 Shadowing 12-

3 Stealth 13-

 

3 AK: Karathorn (INT-based) 12-

3 AK: Southern Continent (INT-based) 12-

3 Survival (Mountain, Temperate/Subtropical Forests) 12-

3 Tracking 12-

 

0 PS: Weapon Master 8-

5 WF: Common Melee Weapons, Common Missile Weapons, Off Hand

3 KS: Fencing (INT-based) 12-

1 KS: Savate 8-

 

Total Powers & Skills Cost: 159

Total Cost: 240

 

75+ Disadvantages

20 Hunted: Enemies of Karathorn 11- (Frequently), As Powerful, Harshly Punish, Extensive Non-Combat Influence

10 Hunted: Moravin (Cousin) 8- (Occasionally), As Powerful, Harshly Punish

10 Rivalry: Talon Professional (; Rival is As Powerful; Seek to Outdo, Embarrass, or Humiliate Rival; Rival Aware of Rivalry; Rival is a Player Character)

10 Reputation: Duelist / King's Agent Frequently (11-)

10 Distinctive Features: Fencing Style Concealable, Noticed and Recognizable, Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses

15 Psychological Limitation: Duelist Code Uncommon, Total

0 Normal Characteristic Maxima

 

Total Disadvantage Points: 240

 

Gryphonclaw (for some reason no one in my group wanted to use his given name) had reached that plateau mentioned earlier, and he was picking up abilities that broadened and extended his abilities.

 

 

Gryphonclaw also carried a very powerful bow based loosely on Ranger's bow from the old D&D cartoon show, a sword that looked like a rapier but did double the normal damage, a mini-crossbow that shot cable bolts for swinging around the scenery, and wore magical spider silk armor.

 

Members of that party became along the way the king of a nation, arch-mage of a continent, chief historian for the king, and high priest of a major diety. Gryphonclaw semi-retired to a keep to train warriors for the king, but he and Talon had a habit of vanishing from their respectable positions and running around the kingdom looking for wrongs to right and trouble to get into.

 

Archon

[Old Man]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Archon, I'm going to rep you for proving that you are not a munchkin. A 240-point FH character with but a 15 STR and 6 total levels... he's almost too weak!

[Archon]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Archon' date=' I'm going to rep you for proving that you are not a munchkin. A 240-point FH character with but a 15 STR and 6 total levels... he's almost too weak![/quote']

 

We had a LOT of fun with those characters.

 

Don't get too rep happy, my present archer in an FH game has 10 lvls. 2 with bows and crossbows and 8 for different types of shooting penalties. But I can counter the munchkin allegations by saying my GM has given my an eventual goal of shooting a gold arrow through a string at 100 paces.

[Old Man]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I think my best-ever FH archer was 23 DEX with eight bow levels (straight up, not penalty). OCV 16, called shot to the left pupil... twanggg whack! The GM hated me.

[Archon]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

8 more xp from the GM and guess what? Eye balls are going pop all over the game map because I'll have 8 ranged penalty skill levels usable against any penalty.

[Steve]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

The last few posts reminds me about a really old PC of a friend of mine, run with 1st Edition Fantasy Hero and the Talislanta world: Kierkan Assante, the Doomed Flamebowman of Talislanta.

 

Although the other players quickly nicknamed him Beercan.

 

As for the doomed part, he had an artifact-level magic bow with an unspecified number of charges, but when he ran out, he'd die. He was essentially shooting little pieces of his soul.

[Markdoc]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I think my best-ever FH archer was 23 DEX with eight bow levels (straight up' date=' not penalty). OCV 16, called shot to the left pupil... [i']twanggg[/i] whack! The GM hated me.

 

 

Urgh - I had a guy similar to this in one of my games, but the person I really hated was the Earth Mage. what would happen was:

 

"I turn the earh to soggy clay so that they all sink into it!" (Entangle, transparent)

 

Followed by:

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

 

at all the entangled, helpless targets.

 

cheers, Mark

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I think I would hate you too, I was considering some sort of cap, but I'm content realizing that accuracy and the ability to deal damage or penetrate defenses are two separate creatures in HERO, whereas in d20 once you've dealt damage, unless the target has Damage Reduction (what we call Defense) you're going to get through. You may nickle & dime him, but you're getting through.

[Markdoc]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I think I would hate you too.

 

Hey, don't hate me - I was the GM . The Earth Mage was my wife's character and the archer was played by a co-worker of ours. They were translations of characters from an earlier GURPS game, done mainly as a design exercise on 150 points - Baaaad idea!

 

This was in the early days, about 13-14 years ago, when I started experimenting with different magic systems and rapidly came to the conclusion that Mages needed to have all kinds of weights tied to them if they weren't going to trample a campaign into the mud.

 

In that short-lived story arc, the earth mage and the archer slaughtered all the ordinary soldier types (and the earth mage had a crawling mud type spell that helped them slaughter the stronger opponents - an NND suffocate) so that they reached the castle of the evil warlord with nary a scratch (in fact, the two fighter types mostly stood around watching and picking their noses). The mage then used her "earthsense" to work out where the dungeons were and then tunnelled directly to them, bypassing the castle o' doom and allowing them to free the hostages without any significant combat

 

At that point, it was clear to everybody that we needed a reboot, so the characters were retired and we started again (this time with fewer points and more restricted magic)

 

cheers, Mark

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Not YOU, Mark. Old Man for pulling that insane stunt in the first place. No hatred of Markdoc was used in the creation of my former post.

[megaplayboy]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Hmm, how many points is a large castle/keep, defended by a hundred elite knights, 400 archers and infantry, with siege weapons--plus a mansion and a small fleet of sailing ships?

Top it off with favors or contacts with kings, sorcerors and friendly giants and dragons, and you can burn through a LOT of points on useful perks.

 

Also, AKs and CKs are probably worth the points. Some warriors might gravitate towards becoming field commanders, with such skills as Tactics, Teamwork, KS: Siege Warfare, KS: Cavalry tactics, KS: formation tactics, KS: logistics, and maybe knowledge of terrain, etc.

thieves and rogues might become leaders of their own syndicates. Mages might become sages in certain areas of esoterica. Priests--who knows?

[Old Man]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Urgh - I had a guy similar to this in one of my games, but the person I really hated was the Earth Mage. what would happen was:

 

"I turn the earh to soggy clay so that they all sink into it!" (Entangle, transparent)

 

Followed by:

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

twanggg whack!

 

at all the entangled, helpless targets.

 

Ha! That's brilliant! My poor archer had no such team combo, but at DEX 23 he was death to opposing mages.

 

GM: "Phase 12. I take it the archer reserves, again?"

 

Me: "Yup."

 

GM: "(sigh) At the far end of the hall, the evil wizard raises his arms and begins to chant--"

 

Me: "Is he half DCV yet?"

 

GM: (through clenched teeth) "Yes."

 

Me: "I shoot him in the tonsils."

[Curufea]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

This is also why wizard often cast defensive spells before they get into combat too. The truly paranoid ones may even have magic items that do it for them.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I was thinking about exactly that last night. Any mage worth his salt should have some sort of basic shield or shell in place.

 

"I shoot him in the tonsils."

"There's a flicker of light as your arrow deflects and clatters harmlessly on the ground. The next thing you see is the roiling blood red flame coming towards you..."

[Susano]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I'm working on my definitive Conan right now, and I'm pretty sure he's going to be 500 points.

 

150 points of stats (STR 25, DEX 23, 8 PD & ED, 4 SPD, and so on).

 

A basic armed combat MA package.

 

Powers -- Running, Swimming, PER bonuses for all senses, Clinging, and so on.

 

Perks -- Reputation, Contact

 

Talents -- Lightsleep, Danger Sense, Deadly Blow, Follow-Through Attack

 

Skill -- Oodles and oodles of languages, AK, KS, and CuK skills, plus things like Stealth, Tracking, Climbing, WFs, TFs, Survival... (on and on and on).

 

He's a monster.

[Vondy]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Its important to remember that higher point totals don't always amount to significantly higher power levels. This is doubly true when heroic characters grow in organic rather than linear ways (their experience is spent based role-playing concerns, rather than roll-playing concerns). Certainly, wizards will pick up new spells (maybe more powerful, maybe not), fighters will pick up martial manuevers or corresponding talents/etc, new skills will be learned over time, or skills will be improved, and then there are a gazillion background skills and perks to pick up that, while useful and colorful, won't shift the campaign balance (at least in combat terms) too far out of the original conception (unless the idea was to dramatically increase the overall power level). And don't forget skill levels, which will become necessary, especially if you are relatively stringent about buying characteristics up beyond starting levels (I usually allow one stat to be defined as a specialty, and in that the player may exceed NCM at double cost, or start with it in the 21-30 range).

[Old Man]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I was thinking about exactly that last night. Any mage worth his salt should have some sort of basic shield or shell in place.

 

"I shoot him in the tonsils."

"There's a flicker of light as your arrow deflects and clatters harmlessly on the ground. The next thing you see is the roiling blood red flame coming towards you..."

 

Part of what gave the GM fits is that any time he tried to employ countermeasures against the archer, the dice would usually thwart him. If the mage had a FF, the archer would roll a crit; the master ninja with missile deflection missed his roll by one.

 

Also note that it's really hard to come up with a FF that'll stop a 2d6k head shot cold.

 

Anyway, I'm sure you can see why we quickly banned 2pt. OCV levels from our games when using hit locations.

[Vondy]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Part of what gave the GM fits is that any time he tried to employ countermeasures against the archer, the dice would usually thwart him. If the mage had a FF, the archer would roll a crit; the master ninja with missile deflection missed his roll by one.

 

Also note that it's really hard to come up with a FF that'll stop a 2d6k head shot cold.

 

Anyway, I'm sure you can see why we quickly banned 2pt. OCV levels from our games when using hit locations.

 

I had a player who always - and I mean always - rolled critical failures at critical plot junctures. It got to the point where I'd have a gut-check that he was about to blow it and quirk my eyebrow as he'd roll the dice to make it look like I was jinxing him. The average was so high it turned into an in joke. He'd try to do false starts and feints with the dice to "outfox the eyebrow" (not that it helped him any). And then, my players noted, that I rolled critical hits at the most inconvenient possible moments in combat on a regular basis, accompanied with high damage rolls and stun multipliers. It was decided that we needed a designated die roller. It wasn't the hardware man! It didn't change anything!

 

(though it did speed things up and gave math-wiz buddy player a feeling of importance).

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

I can definately see where the +2 OCV shouldn't qualify for that. Thanks for the tip... Old Man. Your usefullness is now at an end!

 

*Sksssssshhhhh!* Vwrooon, vwooorn, wumwumwumwum...

[Old Man]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Strike me down, and I will become more powerful than you could possibly imagine...but you won't, because I brought my boomstick! *chk-chk*

 

Deflect buckshot, Darth Wuss!

[Archon]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Most mages in our games have some sort of force field worth 8-12 def. They're actually the hard ones to kill because they have the same def all over. It's the knight in shining armor that are easy. After you kill their horse with an arrow or 2, you slice their throats while they're trying to get up. If they do get up, an arrow through the eye slit is fairly easy. All that armor really lowers their DCV.

[Archon]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Its important to remember that higher point totals don't always amount to significantly higher power levels. This is doubly true when heroic characters grow in organic rather than linear ways (their experience is spent based role-playing concerns' date=' rather than roll-playing concerns). Certainly, wizards will pick up new spells (maybe more powerful, maybe not), fighters will pick up martial manuevers or corresponding talents/etc, new skills will be learned over time, or skills will be improved, and then there are a gazillion background skills and perks to pick up that, while useful and colorful, won't shift the campaign balance (at least in combat terms) too far out of the original conception (unless the idea was to dramatically increase the overall power level). And don't forget skill levels, which will become necessary, especially if you are relatively stringent about buying characteristics up beyond starting levels (I usually allow one stat to be defined as a specialty, and in that the player may exceed NCM at double cost, or start with it in the 21-30 range).[/quote']

 

Don't forget the equipment you pick up can have game shaking effects. Gryphonclaw's sword, armor, and mini-crossbow didn't have too much effect on game balance, but that bow of his!

 

It was called Thruma, the Bow of Thunder and Lightning. The AOE lightning blasts from it let him slaughter groups of 5-10 guys per shot. It also had autofire and a really powerful single shot setting. In addition it could blind and deafen people over a 50' plus radius. Or if the battle was at night, it could light up an entire battlefield and deprive the enemy of the cover of night.

 

While Gryphonclaw's was the most powerful single artifact in the group, the others had items with a good deal of non-combat power. One of them could build walls and small forts in a very short time using the magic of her hammer.

 

So as I said, never forget the equipment you pick up can have more effect than the xp you gain.

[Vondy]

Re: Higher Point Characters in FH/Heroic setting

 

Don't forget the equipment you pick up can have game shaking effects. Gryphonclaw's sword, armor, and mini-crossbow didn't have too much effect on game balance, but that bow of his!

 

It was called Thruma, the Bow of Thunder and Lightning. The AOE lightning blasts from it let him slaughter groups of 5-10 guys per shot. It also had autofire and a really powerful single shot setting. In addition it could blind and deafen people over a 50' plus radius. Or if the battle was at night, it could light up an entire battlefield and deprive the enemy of the cover of night.

 

While Gryphonclaw's was the most powerful single artifact in the group, the others had items with a good deal of non-combat power. One of them could build walls and small forts in a very short time using the magic of her hammer.

 

So as I said, never forget the equipment you pick up can have more effect than the xp you gain.

 

Yes, but these are things a wise GM can tailor for his game, and control in form and impact.