Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

[matrix3]

I am looking at creating an NPC, and he will be dexterous with a little bit of superstrength, some stealthy powers, and martial arts attacks. I was wondering what people thought of a character with powers and martial arts versus a character that just has powers, some of which mimic martial arts attacks? I'm looking more for ease of use, trying to keep track of everything for multiple NPC's simultaneously during combat, rather than point efficiency. Any opinions or pointers?

[ghost-angel]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

various Advantaged Hand Attacks will be your friend here.

[GoldenAge]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

If it's fun and you're GM is okay with it, all's well....

 

However, As a GM I tend to dissuade my players from exploring the Martial Brick. I find the purist route to be the best way to go. Martial Artists have plenty to work with without adding extra DCs via Strength. I loathe the 30-45 STR character with Martial Arts even more than I dislike the Swiss-Army-Knife superhero. Especially if the Martial Arts fly in the face of the character’s color. A semi-Brick who is well versed in HTH combat needn’t stack his character with Martial Arts. It’s simple enough to add HTH DCs and “call” them Martial Arts.

 

For me, it’s all about the color of the character. If the powers (and skills) fit the character’s concept and color, and the build seems elegant, then I’m likely to approve just about anything (that’s not campaign disruptive).

 

I must stress, however, that most concepts (even those I disagree with) are perfectly fine and often represented on these boards. It’s really all about having a good time. Fun is the name of the game!

[GoldenAge]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

various Advantaged Hand Attacks will be your friend here.

 

Limited to Found Objects is fun too.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

I am looking at creating an NPC' date=' and he will be dexterous with a little bit of superstrength, some stealthy powers, and martial arts attacks. I was wondering what people thought of a character with powers and martial arts versus a character that just has powers, some of which mimic martial arts attacks? I'm looking more for ease of use, trying to keep track of everything for multiple NPC's simultaneously during combat, rather than point efficiency. Any opinions or pointers?[/quote']

 

This sounds a lot like a character I played a couple of years ago except for the lack of much in the way of stealth.

 

Titanium-Chef

 

I do think it's a bad idea to mix High STR, Martial Arts maneuvers AND Advantaged HTH Attacks as it allows for uber-abusive Damage at extremely low cost.

[Wyrm Ouroboros]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

I just go with regular strength, martial attacks, and 'advantaged HA's to represent the things that the game-built Martial Arts can't do directly. Rope with a horseshoe or a firehose? Stretching. Etc. etc.

[matrix3]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

Thanks for the replies, everybody. A question, though:

 

various Advantaged Hand Attacks will be your friend here.

 

Do you mean several Hand attacks, each with a different advantage, or one HA with "Variable Advantage" on it?

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

Thanks for the replies, everybody. A question, though:

 

 

 

Do you mean several Hand attacks, each with a different advantage, or one HA with "Variable Advantage" on it?

 

Actually, both methods have their uses.

 

example:

 

assume a 60 Reserve Multipower...

 

You can build the following 2 slots for 4 or less real points each.

 

1) Hand-To-Hand Attack +6d6, (Maximum of 30 STR can be combined with HA; +0), Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; Affects Desolidified, AOE 1 Hex (Can be Blocked but not Dodged), Armor Piercing, Autofire x5, Penetrating; +1); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)

Notes: Haymaker adds +4 DC. Move By subtracts -3 DC's (1/2 STR 30) and adds +1 DC/10". Move Through adds +1 DC/6". Replace bonus for movement with VF/2 if using those optional rules. Move By Damage: (20"/VF=6, 11d6/12d6), (15"/VF=5, 10d6/11d6), (36"/VF=8, 12d6/13d6) . Move Through Damage: (15d6/15d6), (14d6/14d6), (18d6/16d6). Cannot combine Autofire with other manuevers. Each shot costs 9 END per shot w/STR 30

End: 6

 

2) Hand-To-Hand Attack +6d6, (Maximum of 30 STR can be combined with HA; +0), Indirect (Same origin, always fired away from attacker; Cannot Be Blocked; +1/4), Double Knockback (+3/4); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)

Notes: Indirect allows this attack to be used through personal Force Wall.

End 6

[Checkmate]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

Personally I so hate the advantage HA that automatically carries over to your STR. If I buy a 4d6 EB and then add a 5d6 Armor Piercing EB does that give me a 9d6 AP EB?

 

IMHO you should have to buy no ranged EB's if you want cool martial arts effects. I realize most probably don't agree, but so what else is new?

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

I think the unappealing aspect of the damage adding rules for HA's (advantaged or otherwise) and to a lesser extent HKA's is how they show that HARD CAPs on Active Point or Damage Class are really quite porous when ALL aspects of the system and combat are taken into account (HTH vs. Ranged, movement maneuvers, Haymaker vs. Martial maneuvers, etc..)

 

The situation is not too unlike that teams in the NFL who have the 'hardest' salary cap of all the major sports in the US.

 

The teams have a maximum spending limit per calender year and most if not all spend 'the limit'. However, total 'take home' pay of each teams total roster is almost never going to match the salary cap figure due to prorated signing bonuses. Each owner has a lot of leeway in deciding the actual amount of money being spent on the roster without deviating from the maximum salary cap #.

[matrix3]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

Ok, so here is what I have currently. It's a low powered game, so I made him with 300 pts. Any big errors? What would you recommend? (p.s., what is the best export template? I'm using HD v2.42, if that makes a difference)

 

Player: 

Val	Char	Cost
30	STR	20
20	DEX	30
15	CON	10
15	BODY	10
13	INT	3
14	EGO	8
20	PRE	10
8	COM	-1

6/11	PD	0
3/8	ED	0
4	SPD	10
11	REC	4
30	END	0
38	STUN	0

6"	RUN	0
2"	SWIM	0
6"	LEAP	0
Characteristics Cost: 104

Cost	Power
30	Multipower, 30-point reserve
3u	1)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 2d6 (4d6 w/STR) (30 Active Points)
3u	2)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (2d6 w/STR), Armor Piercing (x2; +1) (30 Active Points)
3u	3)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (2d6 w/STR), Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (30 Active Points)
2u	4)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +6d6 (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
2u	5)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +3d6, Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
2u	6)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +2d6, No Normal Defense (Rigid Resistant Armor; +1), Does BODY (+1) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
15	Life Support  (Immunity: All terrestrial diseases and biowarfare agents; Longevity: 200 Years; Safe in High Radiation; Safe in Intense Heat)
4	Damage Resistance (4 PD/4 ED)
10	Invisibility to Hearing Group , Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (15 Active Points); Only When Not Attacking (-1/2)
10	Invisibility to Sight Group  (20 Active Points); Only When Not Attacking (-1/2), Increased Endurance Cost (x2 END; -1/2)
19	Armor (5 PD/5 ED), Hardened (+1/4) (19 Active Points)
10	Energy Damage Reduction, Resistant, 25% (15 Active Points); STUN Only (-1/2)
3	Mental Defense (13 points total) (10 Active Points); Only to Resist Fear Power does not work in Ubiquitous Circumstances (-2)
3	Power Defense (10 points) (10 Active Points); Only to Resist Fear Power does not work in Ubiquitous Circumstances (-2)
Powers Cost: 119

Cost	Martial Arts Maneuver
3	Martial Grab:  1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, -1 DCV, Grab Two Limbs, 40 STR for holding on
4	Martial Escape:  1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +0 DCV, 45 STR vs. Grabs
4	Joint Lock/Throw:  1/2 Phase, +1 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab One Limb; 1d6 NND ; Target Falls
3	Legsweep:  1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, -1 DCV, 7d6 Strike, Target Falls
4	Choke Hold:  1/2 Phase, -2 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab One Limb; 2d6 NND
Martial Arts Cost: 18

Cost	Skill
10	+2 with HTH Combat
3	Acrobatics 13-
3	Breakfall 13-
3	Climbing 13-
3	Concealment 12-
3	Contortionist 13-
3	Security Systems 12-
3	Shadowing 12-
3	Sleight Of Hand 13-
3	Stealth 13-
3	Systems Operation 12-
3	Tactics 12-
5	WF:  Common Melee Weapons, Small Arms, Off Hand
5	Defense Maneuver I-II 
Skills Cost: 53

Cost	Perk
3	Anonymity
Perks Cost: 3

Cost	Talent
3	Ambidexterity (-2 Off Hand penalty)
Talents Cost: 3

Total Character Cost: 300

Pts.	Disadvantage
10	DF: Inhuman (Pitch Black Skin, Blood Red Eyes):  (Concealable; Noticed and Recognizable; Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses)
20	Hunted:  Seekers of the Golden Truth 8- (Mo Pow, NCI, Capture)
15	PsyLim: Code versus Killing Humans:  (Common, Strong)
10	Vulnerability: Qlipothic Magic:  2 x STUN (Uncommon)
10	Vulnerability: Qlipothic Magic:  2 x BODY (Uncommon)
10	Vulnerability: Qlipothic Magic:  2 x Effect (Uncommon)
15	PhysLim: Color Blind:  (All the Time, Slightly Impairing)
10	SocLim: Unsocialized:  (Occasionally, Major)
Disadvantage Points: 100
Base Points: 200

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

If it's fun and you're GM is okay with it, all's well....

 

However, As a GM I tend to dissuade my players from exploring the Martial Brick. I find the purist route to be the best way to go. Martial Artists have plenty to work with without adding extra DCs via Strength. I loathe the 30-45 STR character with Martial Arts even more than I dislike the Swiss-Army-Knife superhero. Especially if the Martial Arts fly in the face of the character’s color. A semi-Brick who is well versed in HTH combat needn’t stack his character with Martial Arts. It’s simple enough to add HTH DCs and “call” them Martial Arts.

 

For me, it’s all about the color of the character. If the powers (and skills) fit the character’s concept and color, and the build seems elegant, then I’m likely to approve just about anything (that’s not campaign disruptive).

 

I must stress, however, that most concepts (even those I disagree with) are perfectly fine and often represented on these boards. It’s really all about having a good time. Fun is the name of the game!

I think this boils down to an overly literal and narrow interpretation of what "Martial Arts" means in the HERO System. I mean, your game your rules, but you really miss out on a lot of variety with such a stance.

 

 

To the OP's question...

 

Martial Maneuvers are just Combat Maneuvers that you pay points for. Correspondingly they are better than the "free" Maneuver that anyone can attempt. They tend to be very efficient, bundling various modifiers and effects that are otherwise clumsy to replicate. To prevent them from being cherry-picked as they were in previous editions, there is a very soft control applied in the form of a minimum buy in.

 

That's the bottom line on Martial Maneuvers.

 

Now, as design elements they present a very modular opportunity to compose several together to fit an overriding "style" or "theme", but a) that is not a requirement and such a "style" or "theme" doesn't have to be "trained in a formalized fighting art developed in the far east". It can be anything at all, including "just a naturally talented bad ass".

 

 

On the other hand, if all you are interested in is the DAMAGE causing aspect of Martial Maneuvers, there are other, more direct ways to accomplish this, ranging from the obvious (more STR, Hand Attacks, Hand Killing Attacks), to the more esoteric (No Range EB's and Body Drain Offensive Damage Shields and other nonsense). These are typically more appropriate in a Supers campaign, or other "high power" venue, but again the needs of a given campaign vary.

 

 

The way I put it to my players is this: if you just want to make a simple attack roll and throw a lot of dice for damage when you hit something, buy a power. If you want to interact with the combat rules in a very direct give and take way making trade-offs between offense and defense, and have various circumstantially useful options then a well chosen collection of Martial Maneuvers is the way to go. This may be an existing style, it may be an informal arrangement of things your character happens to be good at. Whatever is appropriate.

 

 

Here are a few Supers characters from my website you might find useful as examples:

 

SUPERS:

John Wrath is a "Super Agent" style character that relies heavily on Martial Arts. He has a custom art, called simply " Inestimable Wrath Fu". He didn't learn it in a monastery in Tibet, or from an ancient master, or anywhere else. He was just born bad to the bone and got badder as he went along, picking up things from here and there and doing what felt right to him. It aint pretty, but it gets the job done.

 

Rook is a uber-powerful mutant telekinetic with a bizarre power design. He also knows a few Maneuvers that he pulls off thanks to his unique powers.

 

Hype is a mutant speedster. He has a multipower of Speed Tricks. He also has a 23 points in martial maneuvers that suit his powers. Like Rook, Hype's maneuvers reflect how he uses his powers to interact directly with the combat system.

 

Turbofist is another speedster, who differs sharply from Hype. With 76 points in Martial Arts, he's even more dedicated to it than Wrath is. He relies on it as his primary combat venue, lacking range, and the only "tricks" he has as powers are things you just can't do w/ Martial Arts maneuvers like Missile Deflection. He also knows an actual style with an established history, taken from the UMA, and built up from.

 

Major Savage, a Terran Marine from the far future, has a no-nonsense commando style that he was trained in as part of his Terran Marine background. It is based directly on the commando style in UMA. This wasn't an important part of the character; it was background flavor. I think it only ever came up once and was something of a surprise since it was a previously undisplayed ability set. Which suited the character well -- if he had to rely on primitive fisticuffs something had clearly gone wrong somewhere. Reactor is similar in this regard. It's not the character's focus, but he does know how to fight dirty if he has to.

 

Chitin is a Bricks Brick. Big, very strong, very tough. He also has 31 points of martial arts based on the Brick Art from UMA. It reflects the character's signature moves very well. Again, not a "Kung Fu" martial art, just a means of interacting directly with the combat mechanics in a way appropriate to the character's shtick.

 

Agent X is another Super Agent sort of character, with 63 points of generic martial arts. He is just really good at fighting. IIRC we started w/ Krav Maga and just added Maneuvers to cover all the bases one might encounter in supers hth combat. The Machine is very similar in this regard as well. Fracas on the other hand is a low-level superhuman whose superhuman physique enables him to be a very effective fighter.

 

Bronto and Seizure, Slinger and Crux all use some combination of Powers and Maneuvers to be effective grapplers.

 

WU on the other hand is a pure Martial Artist, uber Kung Fu character.

 

On the other hand, here are some supers characters that just use Powers for their fisticuffs:

 

Jackhammer is the quintessential HA guy. He's got a really big swing, and that's it.

 

Breakneck uses a multipower of HA's and other Powers for his strikes.

 

The King of Kung Fu, by OddHat, is the epitome of the "Multipower Martial Artist".

 

My version of Magnus, Robot Fighter is also a Multipower striker.

 

And so forth.

[matrix3]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

 

Wow, thanks for the lengthy reply and all the examples!

[ghost-angel]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

Thanks for the replies, everybody. A question, though:

 

 

 

Do you mean several Hand attacks, each with a different advantage, or one HA with "Variable Advantage" on it?

 

Hyper-Man pointed out all the math and builds . . . either method works just as well. Depending on Concept, GMs feelings on the issue and how you envision modeling the SFX.

[matrix3]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

 

I played with this character a bit more, I'm calling him Shadow for now. I expanded him to 350, since the characters won't meet him for some time, and he's supposed to be a powerful entity.

I added another multipower and some flash defense. I looked at Killer Shrike's examples (thanks again for posting those!), but I'm still dissatisfied with the character, he seems to be a mish-mash. Any thoughts? Maybe I'm trying to cram too many archetypes in there?

 

Shadow

Player: 

Val    Char    Cost
30    STR    20
20    DEX    30
18    CON    16
15    BODY    10
13    INT    3
14    EGO    8
14    PRE    4
8    COM    -1

6/16    PD    0
4/14    ED    0
4    SPD    10
12    REC    4
36    END    0
39    STUN    0

6"    RUN    0
2"    SWIM    0
6"/11"    LEAP    0
Characteristics Cost: 104

Cost    Power
30    Unearthly Fists: Multipower, 30-point reserve
3u    1)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 2d6 (4d6 w/STR) (30 Active Points)
3u    2)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (2d6 w/STR), Armor Piercing (x2; +1) (30 Active Points)
3u    3)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (2d6 w/STR), Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (30 Active Points)
2u    4)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +6d6 (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
2u    5)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +3d6, Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
2u    6)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +2d6, No Normal Defense (Rigid Resistant Armor; +1), Does BODY (+1) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
20    Unearthly Aura: Multipower, 30-point reserve,  (30 Active Points); all slots Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    1)  Clinging (normal STR) (10 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
2u    2)  Drain STR 3d6 (standard effect: 9 points) (30 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    3)  Energy Blast 4d6, Armor Piercing (+1/2) (30 Active Points); No Range (-1/2), Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    4)  Force Field (5 PD/5 ED), Costs END Only To Activate (+1/4), Hardened (+1/4) (15 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    5)  Leaping +5" (6"/11" forward, 3"/5 1/2" upward) (Accurate, x4 Noncombat) (15 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    6)  Invisibility to Sight Group  (20 Active Points); Only When Not Attacking (-1/2), Increased Endurance Cost (x2 END; -1/2), Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
15    Life Support  (Immunity: All terrestrial diseases and biowarfare agents; Longevity: 200 Years; Safe in High Radiation; Safe in Intense Heat)
4    Damage Resistance (4 PD/4 ED)
10    Invisibility to Hearing Group , Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (15 Active Points); Only When Not Attacking (-1/2)
15    Unknown and Unknowable: Invisibility to Mystic Group , No Fringe, Difficult To Dispel (x2 Active Points; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2) (45 Active Points); No Conscious Control (-2)
19    Armor (5 PD/5 ED), Hardened (+1/4) (19 Active Points)
10    Energy Damage Reduction, Resistant, 25% (15 Active Points); STUN Only (-1/2)
3    Mental Defense (13 points total) (10 Active Points); Only to Resist Fear Power does not work in Ubiquitous Circumstances (-2)
3    Power Defense (10 points) (10 Active Points); Only to Resist Fear Power does not work in Ubiquitous Circumstances (-2)
5    Hearing Group Flash Defense (5 points)
5    Sight Group Flash Defense (5 points)
Powers Cost: 161

Cost    Martial Arts Maneuver
3    Martial Grab:  1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, -1 DCV, Grab Two Limbs, 40 STR for holding on
4    Martial Escape:  1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +0 DCV, 45 STR vs. Grabs
4    Joint Lock/Throw:  1/2 Phase, +1 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab One Limb; 1d6 NND ; Target Falls
3    Legsweep:  1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, -1 DCV, 7d6 Strike, Target Falls
4    Choke Hold:  1/2 Phase, -2 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab One Limb; 2d6 NND
4    Martial Dodge:  1/2 Phase, -- OCV, +5 DCV, Dodge, Affects All Attacks, Abort
4    Martial Disarm:  1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, +1 DCV, Disarm; 40 STR to Disarm
Martial Arts Cost: 26

Cost    Skill
10    +2 with HTH Combat
3    Acrobatics 13-
3    Breakfall 13-
3    Climbing 13-
3    Concealment 12-
3    Contortionist 13-
3    Security Systems 12-
3    Shadowing 12-
3    Sleight Of Hand 13-
3    Stealth 13-
3    Systems Operation 12-
3    Tactics 12-
5    WF:  Common Melee Weapons, Small Arms, Off Hand
5    Defense Maneuver I-II 
Skills Cost: 53

Cost    Perk
3    Anonymity
Perks Cost: 3

Cost    Talent
3    Ambidexterity (-2 Off Hand penalty)
Talents Cost: 3

Total Character Cost: 350

Pts.    Disadvantage
10    DF: Unearthly (Pitch Black Skin, Blood Red Eyes):  (Concealable; Noticed and Recognizable; Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses)
20    Hunted:  Seekers of the Golden Truth 8- (Mo Pow, NCI, Capture)
15    PsyLim: Code versus Killing Humans:  (Common, Strong)
10    Vulnerability: Qliphotic Magic:  2 x STUN (Uncommon)
10    Vulnerability: Qliphotic Magic:  2 x BODY (Uncommon)
10    Vulnerability: Qliphotic Magic:  2 x Effect (Uncommon)
15    PhysLim: Color Blind:  (All the Time, Slightly Impairing)
10    SocLim: Unsocialized:  (Occasionally, Major)
Disadvantage Points: 100
Base Points: 250

Background: More than sixty years ago, a secret ceremony was performed to bring forth the perfect mortal, a herald for greater powers beyond the veil. At the end of the taxing and bloody ritual a perfect baby girl appeared on the altar. The cultists gathered her up, named her Sophia, and raised her as the herald.

 

She soon exhibited great esoteric power, a cunning and ruthless nature, and a superlative intellect. Overall, she possessed stunning mental and magical abilities. Unfortunately, it was soon discovered that her physical abilities fell short of expectations. Sophia was simply not perfect.

 

Eldritch powers are notoriously fickle, and a thorough investigation and post-cognitive review of the ceremony revealed that a second entity was deposited behind the altar, quite invisible. Instead of one perfect mortal, two imperfect halves emerged, Sophia, a mental and magical genius, and her shadow, unknown and unknowable. Further investigation and divination failed to track this shadow, but later attacks proved that he was the physical counterpart to Sophia's genius. If he were to be captured, perhaps the two halves could form a truly perfect whole.

 

Motivation: Shadow actually is as conscientious as his "sister" is ruthless and evil. He has spent the last six decades training and trying to stop their machinations while simultaneously avoiding capture. He has found a few groups that share his goals, and sometimes spent some time training and learning from them, but has not allied with any for fear of bringing them to the Seeker's attention.

 

Notes: I tried to show that even though he cannot be tracked mystically, he has a severe vulnerability to the cultists' magic. If they target him normally, or use psychic senses rather than mystic, he could be in for some serious trouble.

[Guest Goradin]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

 

The HTH attacks had to be bought up to the level of the characters strength to have all those juicy advantages or only use the level of STR up to the level of the HTH to be permitted.

 

So your NND is limited to 4d6 which is perfect amount and not unbalancing but a little weak in some campaigns but your variable advantage may be suffering as it will be limited to 6d6. I think these levels fit your concept very well but your going to be sucking wind against a big time villian in most campaigns. You still got that 12d6 one that should suffice though.

 

Page 408 HERO System revised.

[BoneDaddy]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

 

There are other powers that can mimic (and even improve upon) martial maneuvers. A Suppress Dex (no range, requires a skill roll) could be used to reflect a style tricky enough that it keeps opponents off balance, and effectively reduces the opposition's SPD, OCV, and DCV. An Entangle, (no range, one limb only, BOECV, Mental power based on CON) can be very effective for temporarily disabling a limb with a nerve strike.

[bubba smith]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

 

I played with this character a bit more, I'm calling him Shadow for now. I expanded him to 350, since the characters won't meet him for some time, and he's supposed to be a powerful entity.

I added another multipower and some flash defense. I looked at Killer Shrike's examples (thanks again for posting those!), but I'm still dissatisfied with the character, he seems to be a mish-mash. Any thoughts? Maybe I'm trying to cram too many archetypes in there?

 

Shadow

Player: 

Val    Char    Cost
30    STR    20
20    DEX    30
18    CON    16
15    BODY    10
13    INT    3
14    EGO    8
14    PRE    4
8    COM    -1

6/16    PD    0
4/14    ED    0
4    SPD    10
12    REC    4
36    END    0
39    STUN    0

6"    RUN    0
2"    SWIM    0
6"/11"    LEAP    0
Characteristics Cost: 104

Cost    Power
30    Unearthly Fists: Multipower, 30-point reserve
3u    1)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 2d6 (4d6 w/STR) (30 Active Points)
3u    2)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (2d6 w/STR), Armor Piercing (x2; +1) (30 Active Points)
3u    3)  Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand 1d6 (2d6 w/STR), Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (30 Active Points)
2u    4)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +6d6 (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
2u    5)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +3d6, Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
2u    6)  Hand-To-Hand Attack +2d6, No Normal Defense (Rigid Resistant Armor; +1), Does BODY (+1) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/2)
20    Unearthly Aura: Multipower, 30-point reserve,  (30 Active Points); all slots Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    1)  Clinging (normal STR) (10 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
2u    2)  Drain STR 3d6 (standard effect: 9 points) (30 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    3)  Energy Blast 4d6, Armor Piercing (+1/2) (30 Active Points); No Range (-1/2), Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    4)  Force Field (5 PD/5 ED), Costs END Only To Activate (+1/4), Hardened (+1/4) (15 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    5)  Leaping +5" (6"/11" forward, 3"/5 1/2" upward) (Accurate, x4 Noncombat) (15 Active Points); Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
1u    6)  Invisibility to Sight Group  (20 Active Points); Only When Not Attacking (-1/2), Increased Endurance Cost (x2 END; -1/2), Conditional Power Power Only Works In Darkness (-1/2)
15    Life Support  (Immunity: All terrestrial diseases and biowarfare agents; Longevity: 200 Years; Safe in High Radiation; Safe in Intense Heat)
4    Damage Resistance (4 PD/4 ED)
10    Invisibility to Hearing Group , Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (15 Active Points); Only When Not Attacking (-1/2)
15    Unknown and Unknowable: Invisibility to Mystic Group , No Fringe, Difficult To Dispel (x2 Active Points; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2) (45 Active Points); No Conscious Control (-2)
19    Armor (5 PD/5 ED), Hardened (+1/4) (19 Active Points)
10    Energy Damage Reduction, Resistant, 25% (15 Active Points); STUN Only (-1/2)
3    Mental Defense (13 points total) (10 Active Points); Only to Resist Fear Power does not work in Ubiquitous Circumstances (-2)
3    Power Defense (10 points) (10 Active Points); Only to Resist Fear Power does not work in Ubiquitous Circumstances (-2)
5    Hearing Group Flash Defense (5 points)
5    Sight Group Flash Defense (5 points)
Powers Cost: 161

Cost    Martial Arts Maneuver
3    Martial Grab:  1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, -1 DCV, Grab Two Limbs, 40 STR for holding on
4    Martial Escape:  1/2 Phase, +0 OCV, +0 DCV, 45 STR vs. Grabs
4    Joint Lock/Throw:  1/2 Phase, +1 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab One Limb; 1d6 NND ; Target Falls
3    Legsweep:  1/2 Phase, +2 OCV, -1 DCV, 7d6 Strike, Target Falls
4    Choke Hold:  1/2 Phase, -2 OCV, +0 DCV, Grab One Limb; 2d6 NND
4    Martial Dodge:  1/2 Phase, -- OCV, +5 DCV, Dodge, Affects All Attacks, Abort
4    Martial Disarm:  1/2 Phase, -1 OCV, +1 DCV, Disarm; 40 STR to Disarm
Martial Arts Cost: 26

Cost    Skill
10    +2 with HTH Combat
3    Acrobatics 13-
3    Breakfall 13-
3    Climbing 13-
3    Concealment 12-
3    Contortionist 13-
3    Security Systems 12-
3    Shadowing 12-
3    Sleight Of Hand 13-
3    Stealth 13-
3    Systems Operation 12-
3    Tactics 12-
5    WF:  Common Melee Weapons, Small Arms, Off Hand
5    Defense Maneuver I-II 
Skills Cost: 53

Cost    Perk
3    Anonymity
Perks Cost: 3

Cost    Talent
3    Ambidexterity (-2 Off Hand penalty)
Talents Cost: 3

Total Character Cost: 350

Pts.    Disadvantage
10    DF: Unearthly (Pitch Black Skin, Blood Red Eyes):  (Concealable; Noticed and Recognizable; Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses)
20    Hunted:  Seekers of the Golden Truth 8- (Mo Pow, NCI, Capture)
15    PsyLim: Code versus Killing Humans:  (Common, Strong)
10    Vulnerability: Qliphotic Magic:  2 x STUN (Uncommon)
10    Vulnerability: Qliphotic Magic:  2 x BODY (Uncommon)
10    Vulnerability: Qliphotic Magic:  2 x Effect (Uncommon)
15    PhysLim: Color Blind:  (All the Time, Slightly Impairing)
10    SocLim: Unsocialized:  (Occasionally, Major)
Disadvantage Points: 100
Base Points: 250

Background: More than sixty years ago, a secret ceremony was performed to bring forth the perfect mortal, a herald for greater powers beyond the veil. At the end of the taxing and bloody ritual a perfect baby girl appeared on the altar. The cultists gathered her up, named her Sophia, and raised her as the herald.

 

She soon exhibited great esoteric power, a cunning and ruthless nature, and a superlative intellect. Overall, she possessed stunning mental and magical abilities. Unfortunately, it was soon discovered that her physical abilities fell short of expectations. Sophia was simply not perfect.

 

Eldritch powers are notoriously fickle, and a thorough investigation and post-cognitive review of the ceremony revealed that a second entity was deposited behind the altar, quite invisible. Instead of one perfect mortal, two imperfect halves emerged, Sophia, a mental and magical genius, and her shadow, unknown and unknowable. Further investigation and divination failed to track this shadow, but later attacks proved that he was the physical counterpart to Sophia's genius. If he were to be captured, perhaps the two halves could form a truly perfect whole.

 

Motivation: Shadow actually is as conscientious as his "sister" is ruthless and evil. He has spent the last six decades training and trying to stop their machinations while simultaneously avoiding capture. He has found a few groups that share his goals, and sometimes spent some time training and learning from them, but has not allied with any for fear of bringing them to the Seeker's attention.

 

Notes: I tried to show that even though he cannot be tracked mystically, he has a severe vulnerability to the cultists' magic. If they target him normally, or use psychic senses rather than mystic, he could be in for some serious trouble.

good one

[Lord Mhoram]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts SFX?

 

Nice stuff there. Easy to use, and nice variety. I like the characters.

 

If you really want to see some stuff you can do with MA powers take a look at Black Cat in my sig.

[Vulcan]

Re: Martial Arts versus Powers with Martial Arts1 SFX?

 

Ok' date=' so here is what I have currently. It's a low powered game, so I made him with 300 pts. Any big errors? What would you recommend? [/quote']

 

20 DEX, 4 SPD, 11 PD, 8 ED (granted with 25% Reduction), and only two HTH skill level. In most games I've played (short of heroic level games) this guy is going to get murdered in short order. But I don't know what the relative power levels are in the game he's intended for.

 

But if the PC's can reliably achieve 10 OCV, they're going to be hitting him a lot, and he doesn't have the defenses to withstand more than 6 DC's per hit for very long...

 

Edit: Whoops, didn't see the invisility...