Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Yes' date=' I suck as a GM, that's my problem![/quote']

 

Try gum instead of boiled sweets, then you can chew as a GM.

 

**Ba-da ba-da-ba ba-da-da**

[tesuji]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Yes' date=' I suck as a GM, that's my problem![/quote']

 

huh?

 

man you must have quite an ego.

 

I have gmed for a long time and you know what, there are lots of cases where i know as gm i cannot in my game adequately reflect this or that mechanic, and so i adjust the mechanics to suit the game.

 

Most often it is an issue of setting and genre - the elements involved dont fit mechanically with what we will be trying to emulate. So we adjust the mechanics to suit.

 

For example - in a fantasy game summons will often be intelligent free willed individuals and so as gm i would often think i could adequately reflect the differences between high and low ego summonees. However in a tech game where the summon power most often might be used for computers or robots, then i would not really expect a lot of ego based issues to play a role. So it should not be surprising that i use slightly different mechanics.

 

Another issue might be the desires and playstyles.

 

neither of these, none of these, say one whit about your quality as a gm.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

A Steve Long goes to the doctors and asks why he's been feeling ill. The doctor examines him and replies "I'm sorry to tell you, you've got the disease known as Yellow 24."

 

"What's that?” Steve asks.

 

"It means your internal organs have started turning yellow - you've got 24 hours to live".

 

Steve goes home and tells his wife the bad news. His wife says "Well, will you come to bingo with me tonight then? Otherwise you'll never be able to."

 

Steve agrees so he and his wife go to the bingo. He finds that he's won the one-line and £10. He begins to think this isn't such a bad day after all. Twenty minutes later, he's won the full house and £150. He enters the lucky draw, worth £500, and wins that too. The bingo caller calls him up on stage.

 

He says "I don't believe it, mate. You've won three competitions in a total of £660 in one night. You must be the luckiest man on the earth!"

 

Steve says "Well, no, I'm not. I've got Yellow 24."

 

The bingo caller looks down at the piece of paper he's holding and starts clapping. "I don't believe it; he's won the raffle as well!"

[Vondy]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

؟

[Sean Waters]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

؟

 

'Surely you're Joking, Mr Long?'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What?

[Susano]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Yes' date=' I suck as a GM, that's my problem![/quote']

 

Okay, I'm back.

 

I never said you couldn't GM. I was trying to offer counter-points to your argument about the math being wrong. I also admitted to not having gotten as far as Summon in 6E, but instead offered observations based on 5E, Summon, and your 60 EGO Imp example. I never said anything about you personally, your GMing skills, or your style of play.

[Ice9]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

While a 5-EGO golem might have it's own disadvantages, a 10 EGO, 20 INT creature will be smarter than most humans and fully able to work without your micromanagement. Going from that to 30 EGO is going to make the summon a lot more difficult for not that much benefit - it won't even have increased DMCV.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

The biggest problem with Summon in 6E is that it's still not Duplication. And Duplication isn't Summon.

 

Oh well, maybe by the time 7E rolls around

[Jhamin]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

The biggest problem with Summon in 6E is that it's still not Duplication. And Duplication isn't Summon.

 

Oh well, maybe by the time 7E rolls around

 

May I ask what you mean by that?

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

" ... and don't call me Shirley."

[JmOz]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

May I ask what you mean by that?

 

not to speak for him, but I have always felt that the two powers were similar enough to be rolled into one, espesialy if you allow the Player to control the summons if they are loyal enough

[Bloodstone]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

not to speak for him' date=' but I have always felt that the two powers were similar enough to be rolled into one, espesialy if you allow the Player to control the summons if they are loyal enough[/quote']

 

Pretty much this. They serve a near identical function. The mechanical differences should be handled by limitations/advantages to a single base power.

[rjcurrie]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Pretty much this. They serve a near identical function. The mechanical differences should be handled by limitations/advantages to a single base power.

 

I think you'd need so many exceptions to represent the two concepts as one power that it is not worth it. Starting with, but not limited to the fact that Summon brings GM-controlled characters with limited free will into play and Duplication brings player-controlled characters with complete free will into into play.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Starting with' date=' but not limited to the fact that Summon brings GM-controlled characters with limited free will into play and Duplication brings player-controlled characters with complete free will into into play.[/quote']

 

I feel the default setting of bringing more critters into a battle/scenario is that they do what you want them to. The whole Ego roll, levels of loyalty and such is, IMO, a clear example of a limitation on the base power.

 

Similarly, bring in critters that are exactly like me and under my control would thus be easy to do, thus removing many of the complexities of Duplication. Why is it ok to be able to summon 64 demons with a single activation of a power, but if I want to make multiple duplicates I suddenly need a hefty advantage?

 

And I shouldn't have to pay for altered duplicates if my dupe/summon has slightly or radically different abilites. That's just silly.

 

When dupes/summons die, the default setting is I can just summon more. It's a limitation that death is permanent for some types of critters and not others.

 

If I want to share experiences and wounds when I recombine/unsummon something, that's just a very basic +0 advantage/limitation.

 

And hey, as a side effect starting level characters can suddenly afford Vehicle Summons like Ghost Riders motorcycle without spending a huge amount of points, since no one is paying for slavishly loyal anymore

[prestidigitator]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

I think Summon, Duplication, and even Multiform could do with some revision to make them more consistent with each other. I'm not sure after such revision there should be fewer Powers than there are now, but it could be.

[director13]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

"A character using a Mental Power uses EGO

instead of DEX to determine when he acts in the

Phase. (However, his SPD still derives from his

DEX.) If he wants to take any physical actions

(such as making a Half Move) first, he must wait

until his DEX comes up, move, and then use his

Mental Power."

 

His SPD still derives from his DEX?

[Susano]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

I'm pretty sure that's been that way for since 4th at least.

[director13]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

I'm pretty sure that's been that way for since 4th at least.

 

How much SPD is a 20 DEX good for in 6e?

[Michael Hopcroft]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

How much SPD is a 20 DEX good for in 6e?

 

2, same as it is for everybody else. The quote you mentioned is probably one of a few things that somehow made it past 700+ pages of proofreading.

 

What was probably meant was that SPD is the same for Mental Powers as it is for Physical Powers even if EGO is used for initiative. You have the same number of Mental actions as you do Physical actions in a turn.

 

Perhaps you could buy some of your SPD with the limitation "Only for Mental Actions". That means you only get 2 actions to act physically, but can think a lot quicker and take more actions with your mental powers. But how many of the GMs here would find that a somewhat dodgy build?

[Susano]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

How much SPD is a 20 DEX good for in 6e?

 

Sorry, I was reading it the wrong way. That's an interesting typo there. That and I'm still getting used to "No Figured" so my first reading was "and where's the problem?"

[rjcurrie]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

How much SPD is a 20 DEX good for in 6e?

 

So Steve missed something. It was bound to happen.

[director13]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

So Steve missed something. It was bound to happen.

 

Sure, and I was pointing it out in a humorous forum. What's the problem?

[director13]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

2, same as it is for everybody else. The quote you mentioned is probably one of a few things that somehow made it past 700+ pages of proofreading.

 

What was probably meant was that SPD is the same for Mental Powers as it is for Physical Powers even if EGO is used for initiative. You have the same number of Mental actions as you do Physical actions in a turn.

 

Perhaps you could buy some of your SPD with the limitation "Only for Mental Actions". That means you only get 2 actions to act physically, but can think a lot quicker and take more actions with your mental powers. But how many of the GMs here would find that a somewhat dodgy build?

 

Well, now it's been identified and can be fixed. Or not, it's much the same to me. I still find it amusing.

 

(And I absolutely have pre-built powers for my game with "only for Physical Actions" and "Only for Mental Actions" trying to mirror source material. One of my players has one now. Turned out to be more trouble than it was worth, darn it.)

[rjcurrie]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Sure' date=' and I was pointing it out in a humorous forum. What's the problem?[/quote']

 

I guess I don't view it as a humorous thread (cause certainly the whole forum is not humorous) because humor was clearly not the original intent, but rather that it was intended as a place for people to post their pet peeves about 6e. Hence, I took your post as a serious pet peeve with the system.

[Karmakaze]

Re: Surely You're Joking, Mr Long.

 

Perhaps you could buy some of your SPD with the limitation "Only for Mental Actions". That means you only get 2 actions to act physically' date=' but can think a lot quicker and take more actions with your mental powers. But how many of the GMs here would find that a somewhat dodgy build?[/quote']

 

It would depend on the concept, but I might allow it. I'd have to think about how much "Only for Mental Actions" is worth. After all, if you can buy Lightning Reflexes (DEX only to move earlier in combat), then there's some precedent for that sort of thing. I think it might be balanced by the fact that in most genres, your mentalist is still facing physical attacks, which the mentalist would not be able to respond to.