Magusinvictus Posted January 28, 2010 Report Share Posted January 28, 2010 Hiya, I’ve just seen over on the WotC boards that Wizards will no longer be the holders of the Star Wars RPG licence, which apparently expires in May this year. I was wondering, would this licence be something that Hero might pursue, or being Lucasfilm, would it be too costly…? Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nolgroth Posted January 28, 2010 Report Share Posted January 28, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... HERO has a policy of not pursuing outside licenses like that. They have done one that I know of and I suppose technically since Cryptic now owns the Champions line, that makes two. Steve Long has mentioned that the headaches that go along with the license make such deals unattractive to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Watts Posted January 28, 2010 Report Share Posted January 28, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Heh. If the license is too expensive for WotC, I doubt it's anywhere near our ballpark. One can dream... dw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magusinvictus Posted January 28, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Yeah, I thought that would be the case! But it does seem to be a bit foolish of Lucasfilm to be pricing themselves out of the market, does it not...? Heh. If the license is too expensive for WotC' date=' I doubt it's anywhere near our ballpark. One can dream... dw[/quote'] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobGreenwade Posted January 28, 2010 Report Share Posted January 28, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... But it does seem to be a bit foolish of Lucasfilm to be pricing themselves out of the market' date=' does it not...?[/quote']Arguably, though they'll barely know the difference. Income from the RPG market would be miniscule compared to what they'd make in the movie, TV, novel, and similar markets. That's bad for us, but not big enough for them to really care that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... The net effect will be to remove the Star Wars property from any ongoing and supported presence in the RPG market. A minuscule loss in licensing revenues, yes; but what about lost opportunity costs around marketing the property to an otherwise generally receptive group? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobGreenwade Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... The net effect will be to remove the Star Wars property from any ongoing and supported presence in the RPG market. A minuscule loss in licensing revenues' date=' yes; but what about lost opportunity costs around marketing the property to an otherwise generally receptive group?[/quote']It's still just a few hundred to a few thousand dollars, in a franchise that totals in the tens of millions. I agree that they'd be better off overall with the license out there, but the negative effect just isn't big enough to be that big of a deal to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I think it more likely that Lucasfilm will retain the license and create their own RPG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristopher Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... It's still just a few hundred to a few thousand dollars' date=' in a franchise that totals in the tens of millions. I agree that they'd be better off overall with the license out there, but the negative effect just isn't big enough to be that big of a deal to them.[/quote'] I think what Peregrine is saying is that having an ongoing Star Wars RPG on the market, that someone is paying you a fee for, amounts to someone paying LucasFilm to market LF's brand for them -- that even if they sold the license for $10, it would be a win for LucasFilm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... The StarWars SAGA edition, is probably the single best use of the d20 system yet put together. I think the folks above though are missing something, but then it's only something that's apparent, if you've been playing and buying all the SWsaga stuff. All the books that CAN be written for the game, within the confines of canon and license, have been written. Unless you are Paizo, the adventure Module is not a very much liked Idea in the gaming industry at the moment, and even then, when modules do appear, they are Big. Collected Temple of Elemental Evil Big at the minimum. So, if you are not going to do Modules (Modules would work well though as purely pdf material), and you have Written ALL the books, and are fairly confident you've saturated your market with those books. Why pay Lucas more money to keep the license? ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I think it more likely that Lucasfilm will retain the license and create their own RPG. That would surprise me. But what other RPG company has money on the scale of WOTC? I think what Peregrine is saying is that having an ongoing Star Wars RPG on the market' date=' that someone is paying you a fee for, amounts to someone paying LucasFilm to market LF's brand for them -- that even if they sold the license for $10, it would be a win for LucasFilm.[/quote'] Not when you weigh it against license admin fees. At the very least, someone at the Ranch has to work with the company to make sure the product is up to snuff. Of course one could argue it counts as marketing as much as licensing, but Lucas didn't become a billionaire thinking like that. Why pay Lucas more money to keep the license? Because you can't reprint the existing books without the license? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... If you have Saturated your market there is no NEED to reprint the books. You think HERO players don't like upgrading to New Editions, try being ground Zero in the Star Wars fanbase, when West End died and it hoped to WOTC, then WOTC decided to go SAGA with it. They've pretty much sold, ALL they are going to sell, and have untapped markets for material they already own the rights to, so it's a lose lose situation if they expend more money on the product. It's all Been Written. Everyone that WANTS a copy of it, Has one so to go into a reprint cycle, is just wasting money. ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSword Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... That would surprise me. But what other RPG company has money on the scale of WOTC? My first impression was that Lucasfilm wouldn't care and would not produce an in-house RPG, but looking at the "Essential Guides...of the Star Wars Universe," those are pretty well written and good quality for a niche market. I could see a person trying to use those books as leverage to write an RPG. If you have Saturated your market there is no NEED to reprint the books. You think HERO players don't like upgrading to New Editions, try being ground Zero in the Star Wars fanbase, when West End died and it hoped to WOTC, then WOTC decided to go SAGA with it. They've pretty much sold, ALL they are going to sell, and have untapped markets for material they already own the rights to, so it's a lose lose situation if they expend more money on the product. It's all Been Written. Everyone that WANTS a copy of it, Has one so to go into a reprint cycle, is just wasting money. ~Rex I think the bigger issue with market saturation is that an RPG publisher is no longer the sole publisher of reference material for the Star Wars universe. Looking at the Ultimate Guide to Aliens in the Star Wars Universe, it is much better than WotC's alien species guide, the only thing the Ultimate guide doesn't have is the game rules for each species, but since its cheaper I can just spend some time guessing at stats for each species. Ditto for droids, ships, history, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted January 29, 2010 Report Share Posted January 29, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Excellent point as well, and one that we HERO folks, have utilized for Decades. I think one of the first things I translated to HERO that way was Barlowe's Guide to Extraterrestrials. Got to love open tool kit game systems heh, just need to know the scale, and the mechanics follow. ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I think what Peregrine is saying is that having an ongoing Star Wars RPG on the market' date=' that someone is paying you a fee for, amounts to someone paying LucasFilm to market LF's brand for them -- that even if they sold the license for $10, it would be a win for LucasFilm.[/quote'] You said it better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Desmarais Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I think what Peregrine is saying is that having an ongoing Star Wars RPG on the market' date=' that someone is paying you a fee for, amounts to someone paying LucasFilm to market LF's brand for them -- that even if they sold the license for $10, it would be a win for LucasFilm.[/quote'] Except that the earned income from the license must be enough for LucasFilm to justify the cost of vetting and approving all materials created under the license. Having someone "market your brand" is only a good thing if they do it the way you want it done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I don't think it was a case of not being able to afford it, but rather that the game just wasn't performing at Hasbro's level of expectation ... In any case, I'd rather see the d6 version come back with a vengence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Divago Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I don't think it was a case of not being able to afford it' date=' but rather that the game just wasn't performing at Hasbro's level of expectation ... In any case, I'd rather see the d6 version come back with a vengence [/quote'] YEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! even if i'm a uberfan of hero system, sorry but SWRPG could exists only with d6 System >_> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Was a huge fan of the West End material myself. Got it all signed by Luke Skywalker himself. Still. It died, those folks moved over to a new company and new system. SAGA edition has sold amazingly well. Brilliant marketing and formatting, not to many hiccups, but in the end, like Sci Fi in general, Star Wars is a Niche Market, that is saturated with product options. Unless you are Lucas, you are not going to make a lot of money off of it now. Unless of course you want to sit down and Pen the LARP rules for the Star Wars cosplayers to use. After that then, it's done. Best to let someone else try something then to continue with a product you've already squeezed all the juice out of. ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... I'm not sure I really agree. Granted the market isn't big, but the Clone Wars cartoon is going gangbusters with new, cool material and there's the live-action TV show on the horizon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Pretty much all covered in the last three books that came out. Again, the line is done. Even great Sci Fi Novels, go to ground for years if not decades, and let's face it, Starwars, as a game, is not a great Sci Fi novel even at it's best. Effectively, as I said earlier, everyone that wants it, has it. ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Wait, they've covered material that hasn't been produced yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted January 30, 2010 Report Share Posted January 30, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... Not to mention not covering things in a concise manner. Between the 3 eds that WotC did, not one of them covered the whole saga in its edition. Between missing characters, ships, eras ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... One. The material that hasn't been produced yet, is irrelevant in the purpose of a game. They've covered the KOTOR material to the Legacy Age, in a Fashion, that allows the GM's at that point, to fill in the blanks, and make their own campaigns. It's cost effectiveness as well. Here is your Outline, and off you go. Anything else you want, there is all that material, you have the outline, add away. To continue to babysit the license, and publish "updates" for a handful of things, so that a handful of people will buy (And remember, Gamers SHRIEK, if you try and make them do something). The Saga Editions guys did a fantastic job, with their only hiccup being losing a main writer midway though the development process for some of the books. It's done. Now it remains to see, if someone else picks it up and does something different with it, but the d20 market for it, is super saturated to the point I can find the books laying about in normal book stores, marked down at a discount (which was cool I got the Galaxy at War book for like 35% off heh). Who knows, maybe West End will resurrect itself again and it will go back to a retooled WEG d6 system with gimmick dice (Like their DC Universe attempt), and all the old d6ers will come out of their caves and rejoice. Better WOTC lets it go, otherwise, they'll do a 4e DnD version of the Starwars Rules next. *Shudder* ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 Re: Star Wars licence news... One. The material that hasn't been produced yet' date=' is irrelevant in the purpose of a game. They've covered the KOTOR material to the Legacy Age, in a Fashion, that allows the GM's at that point, to fill in the blanks, and make their own campaigns.[/quote'] Spoken like a Hero gamer. Seriously, most gamers I know are quite interested in updates for new material, like the extreme coolness in the Clone Wars show. It could be that even considering new material, the income from the license isn't worth the expense. But you're not going to convince me SW gamer geeks aren't interested in material with Ahsoka Tano and Cad Bane and commando droids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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