My Cat Is Possessed!

[BoloOfEarth]

Okay, I have an NPC in my game, a kid with powers who can (among other things) "possess" animals, either just riding along and tapping into their senses, or actually taking command of their bodies.

 

She can also "hop" from one animal to the next, as long as they're not too far apart (say, within 1m), and if her host animal is injured, she takes damage as well.

 

My initial thought was an astral body-type Desolid, with a Mind Control, Affects Real World, No Range. Or is there a better way to draw this up?

 

And if that's the way to go, does she also need Invisibility? Additional movement powers (i.e. Flight) to "tag along" with the host? Or would Clinging, Affects Real World, Fully Invisible Effects work okay to stay "inside"?

 

Edit: I did the injury / damage thing with a Susceptibility.

[Escafarc]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

If you have the APG I'd use the Possession Power linked to the Projection version of Desolidification and you don't need Susceptility as that is included in Possession.

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Unfortunately, I don't have the APG yet.

 

I did find the Bodyjacking power in the 5th Ed USPD, which used a combination of Desolidification + Mind Control (Aff. Real World) + Clinging (ditto) + Telepathy (ditto). I think that can be modified to work.

 

Thanks.

[csyphrett]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

you can also use clairsentience and mindcontrol, Bolo. I dont know what would be cheaper

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

I thought about Clairsentience / Mind Control, combined with Mind Scan so she can stay "linked" to the animal when out of sight. (Actually I used Telepathy instead of Clairsentience, so she could read the animal's surface thoughts to perceive what it perceives.) It was definately a cheaper route. The problem I encountered was that I wanted her to be able to switch to another animal relatively easily, and that seemed to take several phases to do that.

 

Keeping in mind that this is all still 5th Edition...

What I've got currently is all in an Elemental Control (Animal Empathy):

• Desolidification, 0 END, Persistent, Leaves body behind
  
• 2d6 Mind Control, Telepathic command, Invisible power effects, Affects Real World (ARW), Cumulative (8x max), 0 END, Persistent, No Range, 1/2 DCV throughout, Only while Desolid
  
• 2d6 Telepathy, Invisible power effects, ARW, Cumulative (4x max), 0 END, Persistent, No Range, 1/2 DCV throughout
  

Outside the EC, she has Clinging, ARW, Only to stay with a possessed animal while Desolid

 

 

The reason the Mind Control is still separate from the Desolidification, instead of Linked to it, is that she doesn't always want to take control. (She thinks that would be rude to do every time.) Sometimes, she just wants to "ride along."

[Haerandir]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

I've never cared for the Desolidification + Clinging build. Always seemed inelegant to me.

 

Possibly a form of Duplication (or perhaps Multiform) with the 'leaves physical body behind' limitation. The target animal would be a Focus, I guess (OIF: "Small, ordinary animal of opportunity"? Sounds funny, if nothing else). The alternate form could be built with Shapeshifting and VPP to mimic the appearance and abilities of the possessed animal... Eliminates the need for all of the Mind Control/Telepathy/Affects Real World/Clairsentience jiggery-pokery you end up wanting to cram into such a build, and there are already rules for damage to the alternate form being communicated to the main form.

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Hmmm... seems like the alternate form would just be an Astral form that needs Transdimensional on its Mind Control and Telepathy / Clairsentience powers to possess the animal and see through its senses. IMO, no need for Shapeshift or a VPP, nor a Focus, since the character is actually on the Astral plane and linking to the animal Transdimensionally.

 

I'll give that a try and see how it works point-wise. Thanks, and Repped. (Tried to rep Escafarc and csyphrett, but I have to spread more rep around first.)

[concord]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Tried to rep Escafarc and csyphrett' date=' but I have to spread more rep around first.[/quote']

 

Got them for you...

[Haerandir]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Hmmm... seems like the alternate form would just be an Astral form that needs Transdimensional on its Mind Control and Telepathy / Clairsentience powers to possess the animal and see through its senses. IMO, no need for Shapeshift or a VPP, nor a Focus, since the character is actually on the Astral plane and linking to the animal Transdimensionally.

 

I think you're over-thinking this. You don't need anything but the Duplication power to model this effect. Set aside what the power is called, and how it's described. It doesn't really matter whether you call it "Mutant Psionic Animal Possession" or "Scroll of Polymorph Self", the effect you want is "this character can lurk around in the form of small animal, doing small-animal things, then turn back into a human". So, the Duplicate isn't an Astral Form that has to do other stuff to control the animal - the Duplicate IS the animal. The presence of a given animal is just a necessary precondition to initiate the power, satisfied by a found object in the environment that happens to have fur (and/or feathers/bristles/scales), thus it's a Focus. Metaphorically speaking, when you activate the power, you 'pick up' the critter and 'use' it to achieve the effect, just like picking up a bar stool and hitting someone with it (+3d6 HA, OIF: Barstool of Opportunity).

 

I haven't had a chance to sit down and tinker with the writeup, but by my estimate, a 150 Duplicate should be more than sufficient to model any small animal you're likely to possess (this is where the Shapeshift and Animal Powers VPP comes in), and should run you somewhere about 10-15 Real Cost after the "Leaves original body helpless','Feedback', OIF and any other appropriate Limitations. The ability to 'possess' elephants and tigers will run you more, of course.

[Haerandir]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Duh. It just occurred to me that you could probably model the effect with Mind Link, too...

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Duh. It just occurred to me that you could probably model the effect with Mind Link' date=' too... [/quote']

 

Mink Link pre-supposes that the target is willing, which isn't necessarily a given.

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

I think you're over-thinking this. You don't need anything but the Duplication power to model this effect. Set aside what the power is called' date=' and how it's described. It doesn't really matter whether you call it "Mutant Psionic Animal Possession" or "Scroll of Polymorph Self", the [i']effect[/i] you want is "this character can lurk around in the form of small animal, doing small-animal things, then turn back into a human". So, the Duplicate isn't an Astral Form that has to do other stuff to control the animal - the Duplicate IS the animal. The presence of a given animal is just a necessary precondition to initiate the power, satisfied by a found object in the environment that happens to have fur (and/or feathers/bristles/scales), thus it's a Focus. Metaphorically speaking, when you activate the power, you 'pick up' the critter and 'use' it to achieve the effect, just like picking up a bar stool and hitting someone with it (+3d6 HA, OIF: Barstool of Opportunity).

 

I probably *am* overthinking it. It's what I do.

 

I get everything you said (and believe me, I'm not trying to be difficult; I do appreciate the input), it's just not *quite* the same effect I'm looking for.

 

As long as you look at any animal she might possess as "Nameless Creature #3" (or whatever #), GM fiat that the Possessee can't resist the possession, and that the Possessor can't really be removed or attacked separate from the Possessee, then the straight Duplication route works fine.

 

See, part of the problem comes in that the foe the teen heroes will face is an evil druid, able to (among other things) summon animals (Friendly to him) to do his bidding. Now, let's say he summons a lion to attack the teens. What happens if one of the PC teens tells their friend, "Possess that lion and go attack the druid." By the Duplication route, as soon as she decides to do this, there's no way that can fail. The threat to the teens is not only instantly over, but the heroes suddenly have a completely loyal lion on their side. (This assumes her Duplicate is enough points to *be* a lion.) If the Duplication requires extra time, it delays this, but it's still a foregone conclusion.

 

By the Astral form route (either through Desolid or Duplication), she probably needs additional time to take full control; the druid may figure out what's going on and attempt to expel her from the lion; etc. It seems like it would add a lot more uncertainty and, more importantly, roleplaying opportunity. ("Okay, guys, we have to hold the lion off, without hurting it, until Sarah has taken control!")

[Haerandir]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

OK, I see where you're coming from now. I was working from the assumption that you were trying to model the effects you'd described in the Quote of the Week thread, which made it more of a minor knack for a secondary NPC. If you're planning to expand her role to include actual adventuring and superheroic combat, you'll definitely want a more robust build.

 

Do you really need an 'Astral Form' build at all? Does she actually spend any time roaming around on the Astral Plane looking for animals to possess? If it's primarily a target-driven process, you can get the effects you want with a suite of standard Mental Powers that apply to the Animal group of minds. You can model the 'leaves her body behind' effect with Concentration (0 DCV, unaware of surroundings, must Concentrate throughout the use of a Constant Power), and the 'damage feedback' becomes a Side Effect of her Mind Control (Major Side Effect, happens whenever certain circumstances occur).

 

Make the Mind Control Cumulative, and she can take over ordinary animals quickly and easily, but may have to spend more time on smarter/magical/mutant animals. Over and above that, you can buy Mind Scan (if she can initiate the possession beyond LOS range), Telepathy and/or Clairsentience (Linked to the Mind Control). Buy them as an EC or Unified Power (depending on which edition you're using), rather than in a Multipower, since she'll generally be running multiple Powers simultaneously.

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

OK' date=' I see where you're coming from now. I was working from the assumption that you were trying to model the effects you'd described in the Quote of the Week thread, which made it more of a minor knack for a secondary NPC. If you're planning to expand her role to include actual adventuring and superheroic combat, you'll definitely want a more robust build.[/quote']

 

I don't anticipate her taking a major role in a combat (that's the PCs' job) but my players have surprised me in the past and I like to be as ready as possible. I plan to have her appearing to the teen heroes (who will be guest-played by my players) mainly, if not only, while possessing an animal, so that's why I want to make sure I have it nailed down.

 

Do you really need an 'Astral Form' build at all? Does she actually spend any time roaming around on the Astral Plane looking for animals to possess?

 

No, not really.

 

If it's primarily a target-driven process, you can get the effects you want with a suite of standard Mental Powers that apply to the Animal group of minds. You can model the 'leaves her body behind' effect with Concentration (0 DCV, unaware of surroundings, must Concentrate throughout the use of a Constant Power), and the 'damage feedback' becomes a Side Effect of her Mind Control (Major Side Effect, happens whenever certain circumstances occur).

 

Make the Mind Control Cumulative, and she can take over ordinary animals quickly and easily, but may have to spend more time on smarter/magical/mutant animals. Over and above that, you can buy Mind Scan (if she can initiate the possession beyond LOS range), Telepathy and/or Clairsentience (Linked to the Mind Control). Buy them as an EC or Unified Power (depending on which edition you're using), rather than in a Multipower, since she'll generally be running multiple Powers simultaneously.

 

The above is almost *exactly* what I had before (except I originally had the taking-damage part being a Susceptability, though Side Effects is a better method I agree). Take an extra XP for the successful Telepathy. My big reason for changing was the desire for her to be able to more easily switch from animal to animal. (With the above, she has to Mind Scan to lock on to the new animal first, then establish Telepathy and/or Mind Control, requiring a Turn for a SPD 3 character.)

 

Since she's a DNPC to one of the PCs, I kinda like the thought that maybe she could get forcibly separated from her body, making for a very interesting and different type of hostage situation. So as the GM, I'm more inclined toward either the Desolid (leaves body behind) or the Duplication (Astral Form w/ incapacitated original body) routes.

 

I did create the framework for an Astral Duplicate build with Transdimensional on her Mind Scan, Mind Control, and Telepathy. Point totals are fairly comparable, but since I don't see her wandering the Astral plane, I'm thinking the Desolid build might be the way I go, for ease of play.

 

Many thanks again. That's what I love about HERO -- take three people, and you'll get five different ways to create something.

[Haerandir]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Dunno... If she's jumping from a possessed animal to a new animal, she should be able to get LOS on them with Clairsentience. She'd only need Mind Scan if she was trying to initiate a possession from scratch.

 

That doesn't give you the option of the 'discorporeal hostage', though, which does sound promising from the "It's called a 'Complication' for a reason" perspective.

 

I'm thinking of writing up the straight-Duplication version for my own use. I've got a super-mage for whom it would be ideal. That's the other great thing about Hero... Pinching bits from other people's characters to build your own!

[Chimera 12]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Dunno... If she's jumping from a possessed animal to a new animal' date=' she should be able to get LOS on them with Clairsentience. She'd only need Mind Scan if she was trying to initiate a possession from scratch.[/quote']

 

Technically, Clairsentience can't be used to establish LOS. (Barring GM permission, of course.) So, strictly speaking, she would need LOS from her original body or else Mind Scan to get a 'lock' on a new target.

 

That may make more sense if you consider her body, not her detached viewpoint, the true source of her powers with this build, I suppose. (I don't think the rules ever quite define what, if anything, the physical location of a completely disembodied mind with not even an astral form to its name would be. ) If she's using a Mind Control/Clairsentience combo to 'ride' a cat that's a couple of miles away now and suddenly a big, mean-looking dog pops up, that's a problem because the cat doesn't automatically share her powers -- those are still rooted in her body (and most likely her brain) back home! Which of course means that if she wants to now take hold of the dog, she has to do it from there...

[Haerandir]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

It's a question of interpretation. The Clairsentience rules state you need GM permission to use it for LOS, but the Mental Powers rules state that all you need is to know where the target is. To me, that means 'no you can't use Clairsentience to target your 10d6 LOS Laser Blast on someone halfway around the world'. As a GM, I'd allow Clairsentience (with the Targeting Sense modifier, of course) to work for Mental Powers unless some other circumstance precluded it.

[Badger]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

Too impossible.

 

Now if you were to say have a cat possessing the kid I can buy that.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

If you go the "possession/astrol projection Duplication" route, couldn't the duplicate get Line Of Site? So, give a limited version of the power to the Duplicate to allow it to switch bodies. It's a thought anyway...

[Chimera 12]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

It's a question of interpretation. The Clairsentience rules state you need GM permission to use it for LOS' date=' but the Mental Powers rules state that all you need is to know where the target is. To me, that means 'no you can't use Clairsentience to target your 10d6 LOS Laser Blast on someone halfway around the world'. As a GM, I'd allow Clairsentience (with the Targeting Sense modifier, of course) to work for Mental Powers unless some other circumstance precluded it.[/quote']

 

Let me quote you something from the very section on Mental Powers (specifically, 6E1 149, last paragraph before "Classes of Minds"):

 

"A character must establish LOS with his "naked eye" -- with his Targeting Senses unaided by any outside enhancements. Thus, he could use his innate Telescopic Sight to establish LOS, but not binoculars. Characters cannot establish LOS through Clairsentience, television, or similar methods."

 

So, no, you need a bit more than just "knowing where your target is". (Otherwise it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to claim that any old mentalist could try to take over the President each time he's making a live speech on TV.) My default take on using Mental Powers via Clairsentience would be to actually require Mind Scan as well -- with the Clairsentience potentially helping the character narrow down just where to 'point' his scan, of course.

[BoloOfEarth]

Re: My Cat Is Possessed!

 

As far as using Clairsentience to establish LOS for Mental powers, as a GM I only allow it *if* the Mental Power in question has the Indirect Advantage. Basically, if they want to do something like that, they have to *pay* for the privelege. So it is allowed in my game with GM permission, plus a little extra.