How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Does 2.5 mean Skills and Powers?

 

Yes sir Though most of us didn't actually get into all the character variable builds that you could do with the point system. At that time, it looked like their version of HERO which wasn't bad, just not our cup of milk at that time. We did use the Combat and Tactics and eventually the High Level Campaigns book.

[Wolf]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I was comparing Hero in general to D&D 3.5 in general. If you want to throw house rules to make the experience better for yourself' date=' then that's fine. It does become very awkward though, to compare D&D base rules to your house rules.[/quote']

The only house-rule I mentioned was the ignoring the "overcoming and obstacle" with D&D rules. Hero is based on modeling what you want... There are no rules for drowning, suffocation, etc. there is a suggestion for falling, but again, that's based in the core concepts, so we can model whatever we want and both call it core and house-rules, but since it's done within preview of the rules, then it's not a "true" house-rule, because nothing is being changed and the system is being followed.

In other words, do to the "hard lined" nature of D&D and the "table for everything" mentality, then it's very easy to have "house-rules," Whereas in Hero it's a much more slippery monster, because the core concept is that you model what you feel is appropriate, so again, the entire game is really made up of a structured "house-rule" format.

 

I think you're playing with the wrong crowd. Every DM I've seen has been pleased if a player's creativity allowed them to bypass an encounter. Then again' date=' I usually play with roleplayers rather than hack and slashers.[/quote']

Here, I think we agree. My old group back home was awesome to play with. It was only after I made it to Arizona, and found that the D&D books were to be taken as literally as a pentecostal priest reading the book of David, and hose rules were abhorrent. The gaming culture has grown out from miniatures (Warhammer is like a religion in most stores) and with that you get folks who view D&D more as a personal level miniature gaming event, than a story based combat engine... so there are some issues with the new gamers out here.

 

 

First of all' date=' your comparing your house rules to the D&D base rules. A fairer comparision would be if you compared your house rules to what you would house rule a fall in D&D if you used that system. Second of all, your cap in Def is 10 which means the average fall will do 0 Body to someone at the cap. Even someone with 7 Def only takes 3 on average, which means they've probably taken about the same percentage of their hits as a medium level fighter in D&D falling 100 feet.[/quote']

Again, not house rules, In hero I'm simply mimicking what a fall does... as the system asks you to do... quite plainly actually (you can put on whatever armor, modern through ancient, and I guarantee you still won't want to take a 100' dive into pavement).

I said my Cap was 10, not that that's what most folks would have. In my games 10d6 would avg end up in about 5 body, and against a 10-15 body person, that's pretty nasty. Not to mention all the stun they'd end up taking... in which, they would be pretty shaken up (possibly even con-stunned), and they would NOT be at peak fighting condition, as they would in D&D... and even that 3 body, in Hero (not counting healing in either system) would take much longer than a comparable amount in D&D to heal, making it that much more threatening.

 

 

I don't believe that a base CV of 6 represents a 20th level character very well. Part of the problem is the terms we're using. Your definition of "Heroic Scale" probably refers to lower than 10th level characters in D&D. There's no way that a 20th level wizard is any way less than a Super in power level.

I actually believe that the whole gamut of D&D runs in the Heroic Scale, up to 30+ levels. then you transfer to a Superheroic scale, and are finally challenging gods and what-not.

 

Superheroic vs Heroic represent a way in which characters interact with the system (knockback vs knockdown for example, ways in which push is used, there are more) there are suggestions on what points to use for each, but you can have a heroic scale game using 500 or even 10,000 points if you wanted to, and you can have superheroic games using 100 or even 50 points (though it's less entertaining going in that direction, it's none the less, possible).

 

With a 6 CV, a buff of +3 OCV for melee fighting, and 6 CSL's in Bastard sword you can model a fighter who can have a 12 OCV with his bastard sword, and a +1d6KA on his swings with it... all broken down propperly to the focuses in his training.

If he picks up a machine gun that was mysteriously transported, it all goes back to his base CV then subtracted by using a weapon he's unfamiliar with (itsn't it something like -2 or -3, haven't read those rules in a bit). So it models the entire situation pretty darn well.

It even mimics the "power attack" option as he takes a hit, down to 9 OCV with the sword to get a +2d6KA damage, or even buffs his OCV to a bloody 15 if he puts nothing additional into damage from the CSL's... again, I think that mimics a high level fighter pretty darn well... you can even naked advantage an autofire on there to represent a rapid attack that you get from D&D high level fighters.

 

Under that power build, there is no reason to assume that a mage has a high CV with "any weapon he/she picks up" (4CV, plus 5 OCV with combat spells, plus 4CSL's with "fire-magic" I think makes a pretty convincing mage, though I'd agree not such a good "combat mage" specifically. But if he picks up that sword, there is no way it's very functional for him, even if he does have a prof.) But that's how I generate characters for my game, not house-rule, just my way of doing Hero, all by the rules.

 

 

Shields throughout the life of Hero System have been build as +DCV.

Again, those are suggestions, and in no way represent the totality of the system. from the beginning of the "generic" aspect of Hero, it's a build what you see, this is how we would do it, but feel free to make what you need with these tools. I've never used a Hero specific world, so that's why I've never seen it that way. Heck before 5th edition I didn't even know there were any books beyond Dark champions 4th ed, Champions hard-bound, and Ninja Hero... I got those books in the "old" section of a store, and that's all they had, it was the only gaming store in the area, and they closed a few weeks after I got my Champions books... that was like, '96. So yah, I may be "out of the loop" but that doesn't make my build a House Rule, it just makes it how I build that particular thing in Hero.

 

 

D&D 1 and 2 never scaled well. With most armor classes maxed at about -10 or so' date=' a high level fighter would hit everytime unless he rolled a 1. With the current system, you can scale a monster as high as you want in order to challenge a party.[/quote']

1&2 scaled wonderfully, I don't know how you came up with 1...

AC did top out at -10, and a fighter at 20 (without an insane strength, remember you didn't start getting buffs to things until after a stat of 16, and I think for str that only gave you damage, but no to-hit buff... so looking at it your average fighter (and remember, magic items really didn't go above +4 unless you were a paladin or had a specific hammer).

To hit= thac-o (20) minus AC (-10)= 10 minus 4 (for your plus weapon) 6+ to hit.

Now if your a strait fighter you "may" have specialized, and that can modify, along with higher str... And I'll admit that's pretty good, but still, your a fighter... No one else has it that easy in this edition.

 

Especially helmets which were usually angled to deflect a blow.

Again we agree, it's really only modern personal armor that's all about absorption... though there was padding in historical armor, that was mainly to protect the person wearing the armor from the armor itself during daily ware.

 

 

I think you're quibbling. A 500 pt character is going to be far more powerful than a 100 pt character unless you're deliberately trying to make it not so, or unless you're trying to munchkin the 100 pt character. And if you're going that route, than a higher level D&D character who chooses suboptimal feats and character classes and has low ability scores can definitely be weaker than a lower level character who optimizes his feats, prestige classes, and has high ability scores.

 

And I also must reiterate that I believe a 20th level wizard is far closer to a Supers character than a Heroic character.

A 500 or 10,000 point character still has to abide by your campaign limits... I set my stats at 20, double cost for up to 30 (admittedly this is a house rule, and is dealt with in a side bar in 6th edition). My Active point limit is at about 60, and my CVs stop at 8, my Dice cap is at 15, etc... the points put into the character don't matter in terms of what limits your GM puts on things.

 

And that's what I'm referring to. In terms of "the max," in certain things you can reach it quickly, but the breadth of the two characters... options, skills, etc. is much different. The 100 point character is far more focused than the 500 point character.

 

The Harbinger of Justice is a perfect example, he's got an immense amount of points, but blow for blow there are quite a few characters in Champions who can wipe the floor with him, and most are under his point total by a good measure. That's all I'm saying with that statement.

 

 

Perhaps at low levels. If he thinks that's the case at 10+ level' date=' I have to seriously wonder if he has ever played the game at higher levels.[/quote']

It's taken me long enough to reply, he's already probably done it.. .

 

 

Yep. Everything in the end boils down to personal preference.

Again, very much in agreement. I hope you take this as me speaking in conversational levels, I'm in no way meaning to be argumentative with these posts, I understand at it's core it's one of those, my opinion vs yours and I don't (in anyway) want you to think that I undervalue that specific thing, I think you probably have your own experiences and preferences that have led to you gaming and viewing your games as richly rewarding for you, much as mine have for me, otherwise, how would we still be able to do this as older than highschooler aged folks... lol. And in the end, we learn something of the community in the end... maybe even get a glimpse of a different perspective.

[Kraven Kor]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Same in Hero. A 500 pt character is going to laugh at attacks that strike fear into 100 pt characters.

 

 

I'm going to contest this one point.

 

HERO is, to me, always consistently balanced within the given genre and only if the GM puts some thought into AP limits and such.

 

Take Fantasy Hero. NCM on all characters, with some races maybe having a higher maximum due to package deals, etc. So you have your Conan clone barbarian; 8 PD, 20 BODY, 20 STR, 3d6k Greatsword, etc. He has reached the limit of a human so far as taking and dealing damage, remaining XP will go to skill levels, martial maneuvers, etc. Even with heavy armor (6 or 8 PD max for such a genre), a longsword - using hit locations especially - can still be very deadly to our hero. Even at 500 points he won't have been able to go much over the NCM if any - though he might be exceedingly difficult to actually hit, if he is hit, and takes BODY, he is as wounded at 500 points as he would have been at any other point level depending on at what point he bought his BODY up to 20.

 

Now in a Superheroic game, yes, a 100 point character (unless very, very specialized) is not going to fair well against a 500 point character, nor should they.

[Wolf]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I'm going to contest this one point.

 

HERO is, to me, always consistently balanced within the given genre and only if the GM puts some thought into AP limits and such.

 

Take Fantasy Hero. NCM on all characters, with some races maybe having a higher maximum due to package deals, etc. So you have your Conan clone barbarian; 8 PD, 20 BODY, 20 STR, 3d6k Greatsword, etc. He has reached the limit of a human so far as taking and dealing damage, remaining XP will go to skill levels, martial maneuvers, etc. Even with heavy armor (6 or 8 PD max for such a genre), a longsword - using hit locations especially - can still be very deadly to our hero. Even at 500 points he won't have been able to go much over the NCM if any - though he might be exceedingly difficult to actually hit, if he is hit, and takes BODY, he is as wounded at 500 points as he would have been at any other point level depending on at what point he bought his BODY up to 20.

 

Now in a Superheroic game, yes, a 100 point character (unless very, very specialized) is not going to fair well against a 500 point character, nor should they.

 

Yes, this.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Just to throw my 2 cents in, visualizing heroic/superheroic in D&D would be better interpreted as non-planar adventures as heroic and planar as Superheroic. I could view "Superheroic" in D&D at around 12th level and in keeping with the HERO concept, 12th level= Low-powered Super. Clerics can get Plane Shift as a 5th lvl spell i believe which in 3.x means they need to be 9th lvl. 9th lvl in D&D is generally looked upon as a transitive lvl, meaning that it's the divider between low lvl play and moving into high level play.

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

My $.02:

 

I see D&D as less fun than HERO by default. I don’t want to say that D&D is not fun at all, simply that more fun can be had by using HERO rules.

 

By who?

 

Fun is subjective. You can't run both games through some equation and determine that HERO is worth 87 fun points while D&D is only worth 63.

 

The "advocacy game" fails utterly, because it assumes that the things one person advocates are equally important to everyone, and that everyone agrees with your point in the advocacy. And when you (the general you, not you specifically) say things like "HERO is simpler" or "HERO is more active" those are mushy buzzwords that mean whatever you want them to mean.

 

In the 5E days, I used to point out that, with Figured Characteristics, just to build Characteristics you have to perform at least 54 arithmetic operations. Does that mean a system where you have to do only 35 or 22 or 10 is superior? Or that one where you have to do 110 is inferior? (Not if you don't mind or enjoy doing arithmetic. Not if you feel that the balance you get from tweaking numbers and watching the cascade effects can be artistic. Note that these are subjective.)

 

It all strikes me as saying that Normal Rockwell is a better artist than Salvador Dali, because Dali paints things that can't exist in real life. There are plenty of ways you can measure the one vs. the other (output and commercial success being the two easiest) but neither of them means one is better than the other.

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

By who?

 

Uh, by me. OP asked for opinions of HERO gamers, and my opinion is that it is less fun for listed reasons.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Hey Roy, i have found that the best check on spell power in D&D is its save. If a spell allows no save, it's one to be looked at, otherwise it's really not an issue. I wrote up a "few" necromancy spells for our Pathfinder game and several do not allow saves. Thus they get relegated to higher level spell slots. Knowing the spells in a game is good so you can look at a players spell selection and know at a glance whether it's a yay, nay, or lets talk

[Nolgroth]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Does 2.5 mean Skills and Powers?

 

Yes sir Though most of us didn't actually get into all the character variable builds that you could do with the point system. At that time' date=' it looked like their version of HERO which wasn't bad, just not our cup of milk at that time. We did use the Combat and Tactics and eventually the High Level Campaigns book.[/quote']I never did use the High Level Campaigns book, but I did read Skills and Powers. I thought it was a step in the right direction, but I never did get to test the rules in actual play. I'm sort of hoping that I still have some 2nd Edition books in my brother's garage. If so, then I bet those Skills and Powers books are still there. Would be fun to take a look at and run my kids through "old style" just so they can see how the D&D game has evolved.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I never did use the High Level Campaigns book' date=' but I did read Skills and Powers. I thought it was a step in the right direction, but I never did get to test the rules in actual play. I'm sort of hoping that I still have some 2nd Edition books in my brother's garage. If so, then I bet those Skills and Powers books are still there. Would be fun to take a look at and run my kids through "old style" just so they can see how the D&D game has evolved.[/quote']

 

Thats actually a great idea Nolgroth The Sub-Attribute scores under the actual attribute make it more realistic, just a tad more book-keeping. Just make sure that the sub-attributes dont exceed race limits, it can become a little like getting over on the spirit of the rules doing that unless you're ok with. The High Level Campaigns book is good to look at to really see where feats evolved from. I think they are advanced skills in 2.5. I do recommend the Combat and Tactics book to enhance the game, enjoy sir

[Wolf]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Wow. I think teh Bunneh said it best; you have to walk into either game with a different set of expectations. I don't walk in to a D&D game expecting HERO or vice versa. There are elements that I would like to translate between systems (Skill Challenges from D&D to HERO being first on my mind) but the two games are very different. I have become somewhat attached to the easily spelled out rules in D&D 4 (specifically the Essentials line). D&D is great for a pick up game' date=' whereas HERO requires a minimum amount of preparation for even the most simple game. Knowing that the D&D rules are "quick play," I understand that they are not going to be as flexible as HERO. I do wish there was some serious rules for actually designing monsters (as opposed to the "Buy More Books" message). That lacking is probably what is going to keep D&D from every replacing HERO. Well that and the lack of multi-genre, do-it-yourself, rules building.[/quote']

 

When I'm playing checkers, I'm not wishing I were playing chess. I'm enjoying checkers.

 

I've gotten away from one-true-wayism for RPGs. HERO will always be my go-to game, and there are games I probably won't check out because they fall on the wrong side of the cost/benefit curve (be the cost effort, money, or something else), and there are games I won't play because I don't enjoy them, but there aren't any games I won't play because they're not [game X] or because they're "inferior".

 

I think I've figured something about myself with these two posts, and maybe a reason I dislike D&D at times enough to gouge my eyes out, and hang up my dice.

 

I've often described myself as a gamer... and well, I don't think I am. I'm a role-player, sure, but I don't much like gaming.

I don't like many board games, I try to get out of them as much as possible when I can, though I met my wife at a board game event at our local game store. I have played and have memory for the times I've had playing the "classics" Risk, and Axis and Allies, but in the end, they are pretty boring for me, and I'd rather be doing shots at the bar.

video games... well, I don't own any for the computer. I have a WII, but that's really for the wii sports, though I do dig the crap out of Mario Kart. Other than that, I don't have much interest in anything they have to offer. I even tried one of the MMO's (Champions, in a beta test, and after about 30 min, I quit, never to look back). So no dice there.

Miniatures... meh. I collect some because I love modeling and painting them, so why not fight with them, but it get's old quick.

CCG's... blach!

Now, granted I have enjoyed time doing some of these, and even like some games within these broad categories, but I just would rather be doing just about anything else... heck, I love going to bar's and tossing a few back, be it brew, wine, or harder drink... but I dislike moving over to the pool table, even.

So I think a great deal of my issue with D&D and some groups, is that I am not a gamer, and they have made it a gamer style game, always was really.

I never had an issue with much of White Wolf, other than the whole whiny Emo thing (I dug Warewolf) and of course I disliked the "1's take away from 10's thing" I always felt you were getting worse the more dice you rolled.... but anyway... hmm, it's always nice to learn something about yourself, thanks for assisting in that endeavor.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I think I've figured something about myself with these two posts, and maybe a reason I dislike D&D at times enough to gouge my eyes out, and hang up my dice.

 

I've often described myself as a gamer... and well, I don't think I am. I'm a role-player, sure, but I don't much like gaming.

I don't like many board games, I try to get out of them as much as possible when I can, though I met my wife at a board game event at our local game store. I have played and have memory for the times I've had playing the "classics" Risk, and Axis and Allies, but in the end, they are pretty boring for me, and I'd rather be doing shots at the bar.

video games... well, I don't own any for the computer. I have a WII, but that's really for the wii sports, though I do dig the crap out of Mario Kart. Other than that, I don't have much interest in anything they have to offer. I even tried one of the MMO's (Champions, in a beta test, and after about 30 min, I quit, never to look back). So no dice there.

Miniatures... meh. I collect some because I love modeling and painting them, so why not fight with them, but it get's old quick.

CCG's... blach!

Now, granted I have enjoyed time doing some of these, and even like some games within these broad categories, but I just would rather be doing just about anything else... heck, I love going to bar's and tossing a few back, be it brew, wine, or harder drink... but I dislike moving over to the pool table, even.

So I think a great deal of my issue with D&D and some groups, is that I am not a gamer, and they have made it a gamer style game, always was really.

I never had an issue with much of White Wolf, other than the whole whiny Emo thing (I dug Warewolf) and of course I disliked the "1's take away from 10's thing" I always felt you were getting worse the more dice you rolled.... but anyway... hmm, it's always nice to learn something about yourself, thanks for assisting in that endeavor.

 

And a legend is born

[Nolgroth]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

.... but anyway... hmm' date=' it's always nice to learn something about yourself, thanks for assisting in that endeavor. [/quote']Always happy to help.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

In all seriousness Wolf, having a moment of clarity like the one you mentioned is great. Being self-aware regarding what interests you have in the big picture view of gaming really does help, not only as a player but as a GM.

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Uh' date=' by me. OP asked for opinions of HERO gamers, and my opinion is that it is less fun for listed reasons.[/quote']

 

I think all seafood tastes like butt, but if, in a thread asking about opinions on seafood, I'd posted "All seafood tastes like butt," I'd be rightfully crucified.

[Wolf]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

And a legend is born

 

lol, yah, but now it means that I also realize that games that are too... I guess "gameist" will be avoided by me outright... lol... I think. I'm not saying that this has led me to be more accepting, just realizing what I want out of an rpg is in-built, and now much more at point. So now when I role-play, I'll have a much better definition of what I'm looking for, rather than what has happened with the others who have had a realization, they seem to have strayed less into bias. I see this as taking me further into a bias... unfortunately, but at least I am starting to understand it. lol.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

lol' date=' yah, but now it means that I also realize that games that are too... I guess "gameist" will be avoided by me outright... lol... I think. I'm not saying that this has led me to be more accepting, just realizing what I want out of an rpg is in-built, and now much more at point. So now when I role-play, I'll have a much better definition of what I'm looking for, rather than what has happened with the others who have had a realization, they seem to have strayed less into bias. I see this as taking me further into a bias... unfortunately, but at least I am starting to understand it. lol.[/quote']

 

Lol, your good brother

[megaplayboy]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I have some mixed-to-fond memories of playing 1st and 2nd edition. Great source material, including such stuff as Planescape, Spelljammer, Ravenloft and Dark Sun, plus the monster manuals and deity guides. Not crazy about the game system, but since lots of players are familiar with it, you pretty much have to know it, in order to convert the essential parts of it, upon request, into Hero.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I have some mixed-to-fond memories of playing 1st and 2nd edition. Great source material' date=' including such stuff as Planescape, Spelljammer, Ravenloft and Dark Sun, plus the monster manuals and deity guides. Not crazy about the game system, but since lots of players are familiar with it, you pretty much have to know it, in order to convert the essential parts of it, upon request, into Hero.[/quote']

 

I guess in all fairness to both systems i could say that D&D set the standard and HERO raised the bar

[RexMundi]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

DnD's big thing back then was the settings. The Settings were always very rich, and I had a lot of fun shilling for T$R back in those days, especially with the Spelljammer, Dark Sun, and of course my personal favorites of Ravenloft, Birth Right, and Al-Qadim.....

 

Lot of stuff got converted to HERO Always thought it was nice all those other companies would make all those cool boxed sets and maps for me, that way all I had to do was convert a few stats.

 

~Rex

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

DnD's big thing back then was the settings. The Settings were always very rich, and I had a lot of fun shilling for T$R back in those days, especially with the Spelljammer, Dark Sun, and of course my personal favorites of Ravenloft, Birth Right, and Al-Qadim.....

 

Lot of stuff got converted to HERO Always thought it was nice all those other companies would make all those cool boxed sets and maps for me, that way all I had to do was convert a few stats.

 

~Rex

 

Lol, they were there for you man, remember that

[RexMundi]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Gets harder to recall that stuff though.....oh wait...Kids on my Lawn! *Goes to get the 12 gauge and Rock Salt*

 

~Rex

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

Gets harder to recall that stuff though.....oh wait...Kids on my Lawn! *Goes to get the 12 gauge and Rock Salt*

 

~Rex

 

Lol, i dont know why but that comment took me to the scene in the Huey in Full Metal Jacket.

[Sean Waters]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I'm somewhat new to this system' date=' having come from more d20 based systems. I am relishing the creative freedom that I have to do anything I want. I've been reading on the boards that a lot of people put down the DnD game, which is fine by me, however it got me to wondering what angle or viewpoint do Hero System gamers come from when viewing DnD. Is it just scoffed at for being a simple game? I am interested to hear what people think.[/quote']

 

I started on DnD, then found Hero (well, it wasn't Hero when I found it).

 

I loved DnD 3. I'm far less sure of DnD 4, which feels like a video game with largely homogeneous characters.

 

DnD and Hero are surprisingly similar mechanically, but the character generation system in Hero is vastly different. Sometimes I just like the simplicity of DnD character generation and relish the challenge of breathing life into a relatively simplistic contruct. Hero character generation can sometimes get far too prissy - the character being a realisation of an existing concept, and already unique. In fact smetimes the actual compexity of construction can be a barrier to role playing, as you are playing a fully formed idea.

 

It can often be far more of a role playing challenge to make a 4th level fighter interesting as a character, given that all the other 4th level fighters look and smell very similar mechanically.

 

I'm not taking a pop at Hero, more at the attitudes that it sometimes engenders: that character creation is the be-all and end-all of role playing, that having a cool character concept somehow freezes the character in amber.

 

No, I love DnD (3) and like to return there every so often to ground myself, but I'm inevitably drawn back to Hero because of how much more it can be.

[AirborneRob]

Re: How do Hero System players/GM view DnD?

 

I started on DnD, then found Hero (well, it wasn't Hero when I found it).

 

I loved DnD 3. I'm far less sure of DnD 4, which feels like a video game with largely homogeneous characters.

 

DnD and Hero are surprisingly similar mechanically, but the character generation system in Hero is vastly different. Sometimes I just like the simplicity of DnD character generation and relish the challenge of breathing life into a relatively simplistic contruct. Hero character generation can sometimes get far too prissy - the character being a realisation of an existing concept, and already unique. In fact smetimes the actual compexity of construction can be a barrier to role playing, as you are playing a fully formed idea.

 

It can often be far more of a role playing challenge to make a 4th level fighter interesting as a character, given that all the other 4th level fighters look and smell very similar mechanically.

 

I'm not taking a pop at Hero, more at the attitudes that it sometimes engenders: that character creation is the be-all and end-all of role playing, that having a cool character concept somehow freezes the character in amber.

 

No, I love DnD (3) and like to return there every so often to ground myself, but I'm inevitably drawn back to Hero because of how much more it can be.

 

With most games, you get out of it what you put into it. People will always have preferences but i have never sat down to a D&D game and wished it was another. D&D will remain a go to game as will a couple others. HERO allows me to get creative in a different way.