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Building a Light spell is harder than I thought

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How do you "pin" Change Environment to an object? One of the oldest tricks in the D&D book is to cast light on a rock and chuck it down a corridor or perhaps drop it in a deep pit in order to perceive dangers that lie in wait.

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12 minutes ago, Ragitsu said:

How do you "pin" Change Environment to an object? One of the oldest tricks in the D&D book is to cast light on a rock and chuck it down a corridor or perhaps drop it in a deep pit in order to perceive dangers that lie in wait.

Make it with a mobile advantage.

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Again, if you build it requiring an OIF (nearby useful object) then you don't need mobile or any of that.  Its the source, so when the source moves, so does the power.  As Palindromedary noted, you cannot then use it to put that on an opponent's item but it serves for the old "glow a rock and throw it" trick

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On 2/27/2018 at 12:05 AM, Lucius said:

An enlightening discussion!

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary accuses me of making light of it

 

Bad necromancy! ;)

 

1 year old thread brought back to life.

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On 3/2/2017 at 6:47 PM, Armitage said:

 

 

Area effects can only be moved if they have the Mobile Advantage, which requires an Attack action to move the effect a limited distance each Phase.

 

The Mobile Advantage (6E1 324) says "Ordinarily a Constant Area-affecting power cannot move once established, unless it has the No Range Limitation so that it "sticks to" the character generating it and moves as he moves, or the Usable As Attack Advantage so a character can "stick" it to a target and have it move as the target moves."

 

Usable As Attack says the same thing on 6E1 358.  "Usable As Attack allows a character to "attach" a Constant Power to a target and have that Power follow him as he moves."

 

That doesn't appear to have made it into Champions Complete or Fantasy Hero Complete.  They just say that a Constant Area Power can't be moved unless it has Mobile added.

 

From the first page of this thread. :)

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On 3/10/2017 at 11:23 PM, kevinn1243670 said:

i know a lot it, Steve Long is of the opinion that Change Environment cannot remove penalties

 

The annoying thing is that, according to RAW, it can remove some penalties (wind, temperature), but not others (dimness1).

 

1Lack of light, as opposed to the Darkness power.

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There is an option for cost END only to activate.  That would get around the END issue.  You also don’t need such a large area of effect.  That lights up a 50’ radius.  I also would not use explosion. 

 

It may not be what you are looking for but a darkvision spell is actually much cheaper.   Nightvision is 5 active points and does not cost END.

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This thread has me thinking about this a lot.  It is a simple thing that the system does not quite tackle and forces us to twist things in quite serious ways sometimes...

 

My current thinking is that I am going to use Darkness in reverse.  I will buy it such that within the defined area, one targetting sense group does work.  If you create Reverse Darkness in a brightly lit room, then noone would notice any difference, if you create it at midnight in the middle of Glencoe moors, then there will be a blob of light within which targetting senses do work (but not in the surrounding areas).


That should mean that people a mile away with the right perception abilities and enough range, could target things in there, just like it should work....

 

Doc

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OIF even if it's the of opportunity version is not going to impart the effects of the Mobile Advantage for free.

 

If the object is the source of the power and the source is moved, it moves the effect.  The balance here is that your enemies can use it too, its basic focus rules.

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1 hour ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

 

If the object is the source of the power and the source is moved, it moves the effect.  The balance here is that your enemies can use it too, its basic focus rules.

I was thinking about this too. If I put a light in an arrow, and an arrow is RKA, should I need to buy some form of range for the light spell?

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Putting the light in the arrow IS using the UAA Advantage for attachment.  Unless you are talking mundane equipment in a heroic game in which case the argument for portable lights that don't screw up an arrows flight means guns are likely available as well and beg the question. Why carry a bow and arrows?

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3 hours ago, Hyper-Man said:

Putting the light in the arrow IS using the UAA Advantage for attachment.  Unless you are talking mundane equipment in a heroic game in which case the argument for portable lights that don't screw up an arrows flight means guns are likely available as well and beg the question. Why carry a bow and arrows?

That was a weird assumption about the gun. 🤔

 

I assumed that the OP was talking about a standard fantasy game where arrows are for free.

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I mean, I buy a flame thrower, I can walk around with that cone blazing all over the place, I don't have to buy "mobile" on the cone because its in the focus, and the power goes where the focus goes.  Literally nobody has ever bought the device requiring mobile because it doesn't need mobile.

 

That's how the limitation works.  The reason its balanced is that anyone can use the focus, even enemies against me.  And anyone can remove it to stop me from using it, break it, etc.

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1 hour ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

I mean, I buy a flame thrower, I can walk around with that cone blazing all over the place, I don't have to buy "mobile" on the cone because its in the focus, and the power goes where the focus goes.  Literally nobody has ever bought the device requiring mobile because it doesn't need mobile.

 

That's how the limitation works.  The reason its balanced is that anyone can use the focus, even enemies against me.  And anyone can remove it to stop me from using it, break it, etc.

 

You're confusing the effect with the origin of the effect. The flamethrower has No Range and probably Hole in the middle. Technically the AOE is still centered on the person holding the flamethrower and therefore moves with them including turning the facing of the cone of effect.

 

A flashlight would be similar.  Hanging a lamp from a UAV would be the Mobile Advantage.

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You're confusing the effect with the origin of the effect. The flamethrower has No Range and probably Hole in the middle. Technically the AOE is still centered on the person holding the flamethrower and therefore moves with them including turning the facing of the cone of effect.

 

And yet they still are able to move around continually using their ability without buying mobile.  Why? Because its on a focus.  Same with the flashlight.  Nothing about hole in the middle and no range negates the need for mobile on an area effect.  But because the power is built on a focus as the source and location of the power, then it doesn't need it.  As the source of the power moves, so does the power.

 

If the flashlight put a glowing ball somewhere distant and isolated from its self and lit up an area and then was able to move that light around, then it would require mobile.

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No.

 

I strongly recommended that you reread the first paragraph of the description for Mobile Advantage on 6e1 page 324. 

 

3 legal methods are described and taking No Range is one of them.

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Focus by itself should never provide a benefit beyond the base powers without the focus limitation. A Universal focus is the only exception and the book notes that it shouldn't be used as a cheap UBO workaround. 

 

 

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