Blocking Transmissions One Way

[iamlibertarian]

How would you build a field blocking transmissions one way?

 

Say you have a Base. You don't want outsiders to be able to read outgoing transmissions (or at least want to hinder them), say, Radio, but you want to be able to receive transmissions from the outside (like Internet).

 

Or you want something effectively working like a Darkness, say to Sight and Hearing, but you want to be able to see and hear out of that field (talking about the entire area and those within it, so Personal Immunity wouldn't work)?

 

Or a field where Mystic Senses cannot penetrate, but you could use Clairsentience out of that field?

 

Is any of this possible?

 

Thanks!

DC

[IndianaJoe3]

Darkness, with Personal Immunity bought as a Naked Advantage so you can buy it Usable By Others.

[unclevlad]

Probably better to work with the rules than try to work around them.  I will almost never allow an advantage on an advantage;  it's far, far too cheap, and this is just trying to ignore the power's fundamental limitation.  

 

Option 1:

Very simply, they can't scry from within the area.  So what?  They go to some nearby secured location and scry from there.  Or buy it with Personal Immunity for you, and *you* are the only one allowed to do so.  That's perfectly fine in my book.

 

Option 2:

Create an advantage:  +1, blocks in one direction only.  EDIT:  I'm thinking *for this application and this power* it's probably a +1 advantage.  I'm assuming you're thinking permanent Non-Detection, warding a room.  For other uses, and definitely for other powers, the size of the advantage could well be higher.

[dmjalund]

How about enhancing Personal Immunity to make it Selective Immunity 

[unclevlad]

2 hours ago, dmjalund said:

How about enhancing Personal Immunity to make it Selective Immunity 

 

That's what the +1 advantage in option 2 is suggesting...but Selective would be even higher in principle.  If it's one-way, depending on exactly what it's blocking, an enemy could use it against you.  With selective?  Can't happen.  Not sure this'd be a big deal in practice, so perhaps it wouldn't increase the cost much, if at all.

 

Note that Barrier does include a One-Way Transparent.  It's +1/2 (single attack or small group of attacks) or +1 (any attack).  6E1 173.  It's also got a Caution indicator.

 

 

[dsatow]

23 hours ago, IndianaJoe3 said:

Darkness, with Personal Immunity bought as a Naked Advantage so you can buy it Usable By Others.

 

That wouldn't work as you seem to suggest.  If you bought the Naked Advantage as personal immunity and then Usable by others only on the naked advantage, that would in effect allow the target of the naked advantage to be personally immune to any darkness they generated on their own subject to the active point limit of the naked advantage.  It would not give them the darkness power.

[dsatow]

1. Darkness with personal immunity could work.  The immunity being those with access to a VPN of sorts to the radio communications.
2. Security Systems could also work.  Basically, you use the base's security systems skill roll to encrypt the transmissions.  This has precedence in early Hero supplements.
3. As unclevlad noted.  Barrier can also be used.  Any power which can prevent a sense can be used to block radio reception and personal immunity used as an exception.
4. You could use Clairsentience to go outside the restricted area, but this might be limited to receiving, depending on the GM and special effects.  It also could be blocked depending on the GM and special effects.
5. You could by special effect make the walls lined with copper, or place the base under 6' of concrete.  Communications would then be limited to wired retransmission.  Again, it depends on your GM.
6. You could suppress radio within the area of the base again with personal immunity.

That's all I can think of right now.  Probably, the cheapest would be the Security Systems route or using the special effect of the building location/materials.

 

[IndianaJoe3]

On 3/8/2020 at 5:45 PM, IndianaJoe3 said:

Darkness, with Personal Immunity bought as a Naked Advantage so you can buy it Usable By Others.

 

3 hours ago, dsatow said:

 

That wouldn't work as you seem to suggest.  If you bought the Naked Advantage as personal immunity and then Usable by others only on the naked advantage, that would in effect allow the target of the naked advantage to be personally immune to any darkness they generated on their own subject to the active point limit of the naked advantage.  It would not give them the darkness power.

 

Making them immune to someone else's Darkness is the point (hence, UBO on Personal Immunity). Perhaps an example will clarify things.

 

Glitterbomb:  Darkness to Sight Group 8m radius (40 Active Points); No Range (-1/2), OIF (-1/2), 6 Continuing Charges lasting 1 Minute each (-0) (40 AP, 20 real)

(Note: AoE is not an 8m radius, but a 4mx16m line.)

Glitterblock Goggles:  Personal Immunity (+1/4) for up to 40 Active Points of Glitterbombs, Usable Simultaneously (up to 2 people at once; +1/4), Grantor must grant power one Recipient at a time., Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (17 Active Points); IIF (They look like a pair of chunky, not particularly stylish sunglasses.; -1/4) (17 AP, 14 real)

Edited March 10, 2020 by IndianaJoe3
A note didn't get copied.

[unclevlad]

Glitterbomb would probably have Range Based on STR, not No Range...?  

 

Also, I'd require the goggles to be bought as x2 Number of Items;  each person gets a separate set of goggles.  Still have to pay for the Usable Simultaneously for however many sets of goggles you need to support.

 

 

 

[IndianaJoe3]

31 minutes ago, unclevlad said:

Glitterbomb would probably have Range Based on STR, not No Range...?  

 

Also, I'd require the goggles to be bought as x2 Number of Items;  each person gets a separate set of goggles.  Still have to pay for the Usable Simultaneously for however many sets of goggles you need to support.

 

I thought about basing the range on STR, but the SFX is that it starts to spray glitter particles as soon as he activates it, so the cloud starts with him and ends where it lands (at the end of the line). (There was a note that didn't get copied into the original post.I've corrected it.)

 

I also thought about buying a duplicate Focus, and decided it wasn't necessary. Why should I have to buy an Adder to use what I'm already paying points for?

[unclevlad]

You have to buy the additional unit to hand to someone else.  The way you have it, you have one set of goggles that can protect 2 people at once...how?  The protection is the goggles.

[IndianaJoe3]

The SFX is that there are two sets of goggles.

 

I do see the point you're trying to make, but, "Usable By Others" and, "Five-point doubling" are performing the same function. The character shouldn't have to pay extra for an ability simply because it happens to be modeled with a Focus.

[dsatow]

On 3/9/2020 at 3:22 PM, IndianaJoe3 said:

Glitterblock Goggles:  Personal Immunity (+1/4) for up to 40 Active Points of Glitterbombs, Usable Simultaneously (up to 2 people at once; +1/4), Grantor must grant power one Recipient at a time., Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (17 Active Points); IIF (They look like a pair of chunky, not particularly stylish sunglasses.; -1/4) (17 AP, 14 real)

 

Again this build doesn't work the way you think it does.  The difference is where you put the the Usable Simultaneously.  If you put the Usable simultaneously on the personal immunity, then you are transferring the ability of the personal immunity to the recipient but not the darkness power itself.  That power is still with the active user.  Thus if the recipient has the darkness power of up to 40 active points, they could use it for their power, but if they didn't have the power, the naked advantage does not apply.

 

In order for it to work you need to attach the Usable Simultaneously as part of the naked advantage making the power 30 active points.  Naked advantages of Personal Immunity and Usable Simultaneously on 40 active for 20 points.  Reduced End on the Naked Advantage for +1/2 = 30 Active.  IIF on power construct reducing final cost to 24 pts.

 

In all honesty, its a waste of points.  You can put Personal Immunity on the original darkness and then define that the personal immunity is due to special goggles.  Then anyone with the special goggles would be immune.  This could be copied by the villains but they would have to somehow discover this initially before implementing a workaround.

[theinfn8]

On 3/4/2020 at 5:46 AM, iamlibertarian said:

How would you build a field blocking transmissions one way?

 

Say you have a Base. You don't want outsiders to be able to read outgoing transmissions (or at least want to hinder them), say, Radio, but you want to be able to receive transmissions from the outside (like Internet).

This is actually covered in the Equipment Guide (in more general terms). Basically, if the transmissions are completely undetectable, you apply the Invisible Power Effect advantage to the sense ability tied to the radio receive/transmit. Season the special effect to taste. There is a second option discussed that gives a more "this is highly encrypted" feel to it, but I can't recall what it is.

 

On 3/4/2020 at 5:46 AM, iamlibertarian said:

Or you want something effectively working like a Darkness, say to Sight and Hearing, but you want to be able to see and hear out of that field (talking about the entire area and those within it, so Personal Immunity wouldn't work)?

 

Or a field where Mystic Senses cannot penetrate, but you could use Clairsentience out of that field?

 

Is any of this possible?

 

Thanks!

DC

In short, yes. I was starting down an AoE-based Invisibility rabbit hole on this, but the KISS answer is, Selective (+1/4). Since Darkness is already AoE, you tack that advantage on and just simply choose to let anyone inside the AoE be immune to the effect. Which can include yourself. People outside of the Darkness are still affected in the same manner that they would be normally and that actually answers both questions. Unless you want a personal "can't read my aura" or "can't be tracked with scrying", then it might be better to use Invisibility with a "Mystic Senses" sense group, or some such. But it's after midnight and I'm not going to put more brain power into it ATT.

 

Hope that helped! 

[iamlibertarian]

17 minutes ago, theinfn8 said:

This is actually covered in the Equipment Guide (in more general terms). Basically, if the transmissions are completely undetectable, you apply the Invisible Power Effect advantage to the sense ability tied to the radio receive/transmit. Season the special effect to taste. There is a second option discussed that gives a more "this is highly encrypted" feel to it, but I can't recall what it is.

 

In short, yes. I was starting down an AoE-based Invisibility rabbit hole on this, but the KISS answer is, Selective (+1/4). Since Darkness is already AoE, you tack that advantage on and just simply choose to let anyone inside the AoE be immune to the effect. Which can include yourself. People outside of the Darkness are still affected in the same manner that they would be normally and that actually answers both questions. Unless you want a personal "can't read my aura" or "can't be tracked with scrying", then it might be better to use Invisibility with a "Mystic Senses" sense group, or some such. But it's after midnight and I'm not going to put more brain power into it ATT.

 

Hope that helped! 

 

It does! It at least gets me much closer to the solution, if not all the way there.

Basically, we have a base with multiple characters inside. We want to resit or defeat scrying upon us within the base (mystically, tech, etc.). But we still want to watch TV and surf the internet and make calls, etc.

 

In the case of transmitting out (like the 'calls'), if they capture our signal after it leaves the field, so be it. That's on us.
 

So, Darkness to Scrying, make the Area cover the base, add Selective (because I am assuming Selective can be applied to the equipment as well as characters).

[iamlibertarian]

2 hours ago, theinfn8 said:

Hope that helped! 

 

So here is how I ran it. Two 'spells'. Good until dispelled:

1) Blinded Eye:  Darkness to Scrying to Hearing and Radio Groups, Detect, Infrared Perception, Spatial Awareness and Ultraviolet Perception 13m radius, Persistent (+1/4), Personal Immunity (+1/4), Selective Target (Proper Guests of the House; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (139 Active Points); OAF Immobile (Sanctum; -2), No Range (-1/2), Requires A Roll (Magick Roll; Casting/Changing Spells; -1/2), Limited Power Magick Only (-1/4)
** 6E1 109 says "Sensory Talents" are just all just that, Talents (Bump of Direction, the Absolutes, etc.) and are all subsets of Detect.

 

2) Blinded Eye:  Darkness to Scrying to Clairsentience and Mental Groups, Danger Sense and Combat Sense 13m radius, Persistent (+1/4), Personal Immunity (+1/4), Selective Target (Proper Guests of the House; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (117 Active Points); OAF Immobile (Sanctum; -2), No Range (-1/2), Requires A Roll (Magick Roll; Casting/Changing Spells; -1/2), Limited Power Magick Only (-1/4)

 

That should cover it all, right (at least until Dispelled or Drained)? I mean, there is a way around everything (as there should be). But it should be generally good against basic spying.

 

Thanks!

[Greywind]

The walls are Barriers to whatever you want barriered. TV/internet/whatever gets piped through the cable.

[iamlibertarian]

3 minutes ago, Greywind said:

The walls are Barriers to whatever you want barriered. TV/internet/whatever gets piped through the cable.

 

That's true...however, a 100m Barrier (25m per side of the Base) is more than my little (lol) VPP can manage.

[iamlibertarian]

You know, its funny. This character I am building can Easily take down a Jet at 30,000 feet with the blink of an eye and wave of her hand. But she can't put a Barrier around her house/base even with 0 pts in all defenses, lol.

[theinfn8]

If all your worried about is it being difficult to find, you can have the Sanctum Sanctorum buy Concealment and run it up to something high (21-?). This would mean the base rolls against the skill of the person trying to find it, with the higher success winning (check 6E2 pg. 190 under perceivability). It wouldn't be perfect defense (is that really much fun anyway?) but it would have the same effect without the cost.

 

Anti-Location Sigils: Concealment 21- (39 pts). With the base discount: Real Cost: 4 pts.

[massey]

Buy Mind Link for your transmissions.  Buy Radio Hearing (whatever they call it now) to pick up receptions.  Don't overcomplicate things.

[iamlibertarian]

11 hours ago, theinfn8 said:

If all your worried about is it being difficult to find, you can have the Sanctum Sanctorum buy Concealment and run it up to something high (21-?). This would mean the base rolls against the skill of the person trying to find it, with the higher success winning (check 6E2 pg. 190 under perceivability). It wouldn't be perfect defense (is that really much fun anyway?) but it would have the same effect without the cost.

 

Anti-Location Sigils: Concealment 21- (39 pts). With the base discount: Real Cost: 4 pts.

 

This is an excellent concept. Thanks!

[iamlibertarian]

3 hours ago, massey said:

Buy Mind Link for your transmissions.  Buy Radio Hearing (whatever they call it now) to pick up receptions.  Don't overcomplicate things.

 

Believe me, I love the concept of not over complicating things. But in this case, it isn't specifically communications I am trying to protect. The character is a bit paranoid, and is Hunted (Watched) by both the government and a couple of smaller groups. They know the Base is there (if nothing else, so does the whole town, as too many weird, mystical things happen around there). She rather wants to prevent spying on the inner workings(or at least try to). I mean, she has built traps around the place and the like (see, paranoid, lol).

[massey]

12 hours ago, iamlibertarian said:

 

Believe me, I love the concept of not over complicating things. But in this case, it isn't specifically communications I am trying to protect. The character is a bit paranoid, and is Hunted (Watched) by both the government and a couple of smaller groups. They know the Base is there (if nothing else, so does the whole town, as too many weird, mystical things happen around there). She rather wants to prevent spying on the inner workings(or at least try to). I mean, she has built traps around the place and the like (see, paranoid, lol).

 

Ah, I see.  I read the thread a few days ago, didn't comment, and then reread the first post yesterday and commented.  Had forgotten all the other details.

 

Make the base extradimensional.  XD Movement, usable by other, to place where the base is located.  Buy your own scanning equipment transdimensional, and assume that other people don't.  The XD Movement doesn't actually have to be to another dimension, special effect wise.  Just define it as "super duper protected from outside scanning".

[iamlibertarian]

4 hours ago, massey said:

 

Ah, I see.  I read the thread a few days ago, didn't comment, and then reread the first post yesterday and commented.  Had forgotten all the other details.

 

Make the base extradimensional.  XD Movement, usable by other, to place where the base is located.  Buy your own scanning equipment transdimensional, and assume that other people don't.  The XD Movement doesn't actually have to be to another dimension, special effect wise.  Just define it as "super duper protected from outside scanning".

 

Yeah, I like that. Or, other dimension could be one which is just slightly out of phase with 'reality'. Can be seen, but needs an extradimensional power or portal to enter/leave/affect. But if I remember correctly, it would have to be usable as attack to place the house there. But that is easily done.

Still, in my case, I have to build it in a way which fits into a VPP. So unless you have a better way, I would have to pay for it as a Summon within the VPP, but without a Focus it still wouldn't have to pay the Specific Being cost? Hmmmm...