RadeFox

I think this is a GREAT idea. It would add a lot of flavor to games if each race or culture had its own dogfighting style. Vicisous in your face dive bombers, or slick roll overs and slides, you could give moves to each race that would simulate their 'feel'. Now if I only had a copy of FREd.

I think the save idea posted above by Mike is good. I disagree that it's in there already as Keneton posits. Mage casts spells, hits target. Subtract ED and armor, apply stun and body. In Hero CON, acts to bolster body and stun somewhat, and helps with ED. In D&D this is pretty much the same as as say +2 hp per level from a 16 CON. Added toughness, harder to drop. It in no way address the luck or sheer hardiness or stubborness or fleetness that saving throws emulated. Dodging for cover, is good against fireballs, for DEX, but I still think the idea of the new disad (Stat roll, for 1/2 Damage, this roll could easily be penalized just like a Skill Roll, say -1 for every 10 active points in the spell thats being resisted.) is pretty cool idea. This is a neat way for fighter types or monk types to "take it on the chin" against fortitude trying magics, or mages and priests to "stand strong' against mind blasting magics. Thanks for the idea Mike, its one Im defineatly scribbling into my FH book in the magic section.

I usually like to see magic done up as a MP, and the GM gets to design the spell slots the the wizard buys. Having to fork out say 30 pts for a minimum magic MP works quite good at dismissing the one spell warriors. However, low level pervasive magic can be fun, just remembering the fun I had in RuneQuest. Everyone had magic, some more then others, some divine, some spirit, some had sorcery. IT was wicked fun and cool as hell. So if your group likes the idea of everyone having a few spells or charms, grab out RQ and use a similare world.

I usually like to see magic done up as a MP, and the GM gets to design the spell slots the the wizard buys. having to fork out say 30 pts for a minimum magic MP works quite good at dismissing the one spell warriors. However, low level pervasive magic can be fun, just remembering the fun I had in RuneQuest. Everyone had magic, some more then others, some divine, some spirit, some had sorcery. IT was wicked fun and cool as hell. So if your group likes the idea of everyone having a few spells or charms, grab out RQ and use a similare world.

Hmm, thats not bad. I'll play with some more sample combats using something akin to that, to see how it plays out.

I do believe SteveL already posted in a thread around here somewhere, that the Martinez Scale, is roughly the active points in the power shown divided by 10, Though he did point out that UNTIL's methods of measuring aren't perfect, and so, some of the powers may be mis-reported in their files.

I know there are literally dozens of top notch game sites on the web devoted to Star Wars. There is even a major long thread on these boards on Forces Powers done up in Hero. So you will have absolutely no trouble with a simple google search coming up with more research info then even Yoda would have time to read... Also, it has been noted in several canon sources for Star Wars, that technology between the Old Republic era and Empire era star wars is virtually indistinguishable. So the only thing you are really changing is the appearance of ships and tools/droids, etc. So any write ups you find for Star Wars tech is pretty good to go into your Old Republic era game.

heehee, Rock on CC!

my comment about the change environment being too simple, was that Id make this with BOTH the Force Wall and the Change Environment. Not just one or the other. And as for making the Wall silent or whatever, its easy enough to do, and since its equipment, active points don't really mean much in the end. But you could designate the sound the Force wall makes as a sound that is annoying to most known insects and animals. Like a UV squeal or somesuch, to make the whole thing a bit more solid state.

My mistake, I figured it as a normal attack. It would be 87 body, almost every time. Edited above post.

With a +3 advantage per scale in place, big ships guns would still cost every bit as much, if not more then a straight dice RKA. What I'd like to avoid in my own game, is the 25d6 RKA, crap. Good gods of tech, why even roll? You know its going to be 87 Body or damn close every time. Not too mention thats a farking LOT of dice to roll, they must think we all game on 6'x8' tables to have room to be rolling multiple handfuls of dice. I've been playing with the numbers in mock battles and it's been working pretty well so far. Larger ships don't have a lot to fear from craft two or more scales down from them, but, with a good AP attack, and a 'lucky roll', it is possible for a fighter to do damage to a ship of the line. I think I will polish and test some more, but Im pretty sure I'm going to use something like this in my SH games. Another thing that I'm seeing as a common component in space battle using scales, is that a Find Weakness comabat program (or something like Luke Skytrotter using the force), will be a damn nice thing to have as part of your fire control systems.

Change Environment is good, but its too, um, simple...not enough to hang your suspension of disbelief on. Adding in a Force Wall, even a 1/1 or 2/2, give the players a point of reference for WHY its warm and dry inside. Also, any good explorer will be quick to point out, that the ability to make the walls opaque is a nice feature, especially if the local environment is full of flashing light bugs, or heavy storms. Another thing to keep in mind, is that many things other then simple vermin might wander by in the night. Having a decent force wall in place could well mean the difference between life and death if a local carnivore happens upon you. In old Traveller, Scouts often worked ALONE. So the ability to have a small force wall hut (I'd offer a 4/4 or 6/6 military/scout issue version) would be a highly sought commodity. The defense of the force wall, just as highly prized by solitary scouts and prospectors, on those lonely worlds filled with unknown and likely hostile critters.

The core of the idea was/is, that in Hero, things with COMBAT worth tend to cost more then non-combat. STR, especially in heroic settings, is seriously more value/use then INT. So that would be why INT cost is fine, even though you get a lot from INT too. It is pretty apprarent to most FH players, that a fighter and a mage made along similar point lines are serisouly scewed in favor of the fighter in terms of Combat effectiveness. A mage burning long term END is out of the battle after two turns, and then is useless for the rest of the day, while the fighter just sits down for a few seconds and is ready to go do it all again. I think with SteveL's sidebar on the topic and most folks who have issues with the cost of STR, just switching it to 2/1 in their games, the matter is easily handled. I am glad, though, too see I was not alone in my views. A little confirmation is a good thing.

With scaled damage in place, those ships wouldn't have a 25d6 attack in the first place. It'd be bought to maybe 4 or 5d6, with applicable Advantages as we are working out here, then simply multiplied. As I stated earlier, using a smaller set of dice for damage an multipliers favors the little guys a bit more, since, as mentioned, it is easier to max out a 2d6 or 3d6, wuth multiples, then it is with 15d6. Once you get past 10d6, you are almost guaranteed an Average result every time. Which in gamestory terms pretty much sucks. Your main guns will ALWAYS do the same amount of damage, and if another ships armor is higher, you arent likely to ever get through. I like the idea that lucky shots get through more often, and I think, in real world battles, damage in fleet actions tends to follow similar lines. One good hit/lucky shot, and a ships fate is decided. As for cross over stuff, if you plan on having supers in SH/TE games, then by all means, stick with the handfuls of dice, since the PC's are unlikely to be in normal ships anyways. And super powers in comic settings are able to rip up battleships in space. But in a more hard sci-fi world, the concept of a mutant taking out a battleship with his powers should be out of the question, imo.

Hmm, +2-3 Advantage per Step on the Scale Chart. That could work. Add in a Limitation of x5 or x10 End for every level bought should be good for a -3/4 to -1 to help keep the points from running amok too. Would mean you'd need a much bigger power plant at each Size Scale to power your guns and /or Force Fields, which of course, also makes sense. This might work... The cost increase of the +2-3 advantage per Scale also would work to make it likely that ships would be armed with a wide range of weapon scales. A Battleship might only have 4 batteries of Captial class weaponry, 8 banks of Ship class missiles, and 24 Fighter class point defense turrets. I like this idea a lot!

I had no idea of the history of this debate. Learn something new every day. I noticed OldMans poll on the base Hero forum. Should have made an adjustment that the STR cost increase would apply mainly to heroic settings, but it will be an interesting result either way. I'm glad to see Lord Liadem is on the side of 2/1 for heroic settings. Im pretty sure I'm going to do the same. Someone said they HAD a template for designer that had STR cost at 2, perhaps they'd be willing to share it here????

Thats pretty much my assumption to. Points wise, it kinda screws with things, but from a realism or strory standpoint, scaling damage seems to make sense. Just constantly giving things more and more dice of KA and 10's upon 10's of Armor seems like it would only end up with HUGE amounts of dice, and too much counting and math to maintain either Fun or Story flow.

From the Thread Yamo started about plate mail being overly effective, I saw an interesting idea. Keeping in mind the core rule for Hero, the more USEFUL something is, the MORE points you pay. A Disad that never come into play, you get 0 pts. DEX, used for loads of stuff, you pay 3 per 1. The idea briefly posed and lost in the thread was this: STR could cost 2 pts per 1 STR bought. Thinking on how MUCH more useful in a FH setting STR is (Not too mention its cascade effect into secondary stats!), then in just about any other setting, I sort of like this idea. So I put it forth to all us assembled Hero players and GM's, what do you think of this idea, bearing in mind the 'spirit of Hero' rules ideas.

We need the zip Prefabs for the main power plants, thats the only one you forgot!! Thanks loads for those too, MUCH goodness...mmmmm!

I was always happy with the damage scales used in the old d6 based Star Wars games, and thought it did add a lot to games and realism in play. I like my Sci FI both operatic and hard at the same time, which can be a damn hard thing to pull off or find, I admit. Anyways, I was toying around with some ideas with our group for a suitable means to incorporate similar damage scales into Hero system. Here is what we came up with, put forth for perusal and polish. Standard: Would be personal/character or small vehicular scale. Damage and Defenses are normal. Fighter Scale: Equivalent to weapons/armor mounted on fighters, tanks, Mecha, or other military styled vehicles. Starship Scale: The standard for most ship based weapons/armors, from merchants to pirates to system defense boats and destroyers. Capital Scale: The Big Guns of the Fleet. This level include the weapons/armors mounted on ships of Frigate size, on up to and including the massive battleships and most dreadnoughts. Planetary Scale: The planet killers. Maybe not as huge as the Death Stars gun, but, it would take a dreadnought spinal mount, or a huge starbase or planetoid to mount weapons/armors of this scale. To use the levels in play, damage and defenses are adjusted per the following: Level......Dmg X....Def X Standrd......1.........1 Fighter.......3.........3 StrShp........5.........5 Captial........7.........7 Plntry.........9.........9 By using a multiplier instead of increasing the number of dice, it allows for more 'lucky shots'. It is far easier to roll max on a 2d6 weapon and have it multiplied for scale, then it would be to roll max on 6d6, 10d6, etc... This allows for that bit of fear factor in combat to remain, while at the same time, not totally dissing the little fighters in a fleet actions. One good shot at a weak point is all it might take to seriously affect a larger ship. This also makes it a bit more realistic in that a PC's Ion Blaster is quite unlikely to pose any threat to a fleeing bounty hunters starship. I mean, if ships and shields have to withstand micro-meteors travelling at astromical speeds, would a little gun really hurt them?? I realize too, this seriously wonks the whole points values for those folks who are stringent points calculators. I admit, I'm not sure how to work this sort of scaling system into the points designer. Would love suggestions to that end, for the number addicts.

I think it is also in place to avoid the VERY easy to abuse points monsters. Since vehicles are /5 in points already, and Summons are similarly divided, you'd end up with ridiculously cheap, and very powerfull vehicles being summoned with a dimes worth of real cost.

I would disagree. With the way skill levels are priced in FREd (1,2,3,5,8,10), I'd say an overall penalty skill level would cost 8 pts, with no limitations being applied (your proprosed skill level affects range penalties, targetting penalties, skill roll penalties, and Stat rolls too, it is hardly limited). Most Penalty reductions cost one step less then a normal skill level (sometimes one half), and since this one is a penalty level just shy of the 10 pt overall skill level, it would be 8 pts per, imo. Offering such a skill for 5 pts per would make buying DEX or INT levels for 5 pts not as usefull, and be a bit overpowered for the price, again though, thats just my take.

A BIG Thank you to Comfortmd for all his posting. Does anyone know how we could make all these into a prefab file for Hero Designer?? That would be the absolute BOMB for us GM's.

Quick Chime from another source... I too prefer to allow the STUN to be the penetrating force, even for KA's. Its just way too messy otherwise, and too deadly. We are working on a conversion for Vampire to Hero, and one of the GM's is considering make the a Gangrels Feral claws a 2d6, Double AP, Pentrating HKA. I am not happy with that, I feel is WAY too powerful. Espectially since most Vamps could easily bump their strength enough to get that up to 3 dice. It would mean that no matter how good your Armor or Fortitude, someone with claws is going to kill you in a very few phases, no matter what. Is something to think about seriously for GM's. I think when I get around to running Hero, Pentrating is going to be one of those Stop Sign's from 4E.

Sounds to me like the Tatoo is a kind of barbarian or tribal magic. In D&D Wisdom is willpower, so in Hero it'd be closer to the Straight EGO loss. +4 Str in D20 would be closer to +15 Str in Hero, and I get the impression the Tatoo should make you more prone to losing your temper (The Wis loss?), try this on for size... Tattoo - Muskhorn: +15 STR (15 Active Points); Requires An EGO Roll (-3/4), Side Effect: - 5 EGO, Side Effect occurs automatically whenever Power is used (-1/2), Side Effect: Enraged when Threatened/Challenged: Comm/Strong, (5 pts) Instead of an EGO Roll you COULD make the Tatoo charged, that way the extra Str will not cost your Character END, which would maintain the feel of the original power from the d20 sysem. Charges: 2 Continuing Charges, Duration 1 Minute, Recover 1/day (-3/4)