Pattern Ghost

You're thinking of Turett's. AS is believed to be a form of autism. Some of the symptoms include a lack of social skills/development, preference for sameness/resistance to change, inability to read body language cues, tendancy to take things very literally, and so on. On the "up" side, AS patients can be highly skilled in certain areas and show a high degree of intelligence, though not all. Typically seen as very naive. Not quite "Rain Man" level, but some people think it may be another form of High Functioning Autism. Heck, I think a lot of gamers have it. =) Seriously, on the RP aspects, it does make an interesting basis for a character. I'd play up the literal-minded aspects and naivity, and to a lesser extent the resistance to change/need for a routine (that'd be the most disruptive in a group game). I'm guessing the character will be a savant in some area? I'd take the limitation as a physical one, since there is no EGO roll which will circumvent the limitation.

I see! How about making it a Side Effect to the extra STUN? He changes class of minds as a SFX (no point value) and gains a Physical Limit to represent the AI's limitations (i.e., runs off of a program, has pre-set priorities or orders to follow, basically limits the char's actions).

Re: Cramming goodness into 500 words To be fair, these are just small scenes. The last two Hero ones are some of the better stuff IMO. Actually, nothing happens, except I gripe about it, so they don't need to do anything, but it'd be nice if they improved a couple of things. Some of the victories have been pretty lame, though I suppose the pulling a rabbit out of a hat thing is in genre.

I thought you were also gaining the ability for the pilot to be knocked out, and have the suit continue to function? That's a lot more bang for the buck than changing class of minds. As for the problem with creating two whole characters: Aside from Skills, it's going to be the same character. Just give the PA character all of the same basic stats and powers, and some automaton powers, and ditch non-combat related skills. Shouldn't be that hard. On the other hand, you might use the Only In Hero (or in this case Autopilot) ID on some additional powers. You'd probably want instachange. The Hero ID and Insta-Change combo should be sufficient justification to change the class of minds. Then, you can buy extra STUN or Takes No STUN, OIHID, Trigger (Pilot at incapacitated). You might buy down some of your pilot's non-combat skills with OIHID (Pilot) to reflect that they're not available to the autopilot, if the GM allows limitations on skills. You might want to buy extra BODY as well, so the suit can be "killed" without necessarily killing the character. That part of it is a little tricky. Interesting problem.

Heck, I'll do a blow by blow. This is a character I made to practice creating a lower-powered, 50 + 50 heroic type for a science fiction campaign. First off, I made some assumptions about the campaign ground rules. Normally, you'll get these from the GM (unless you are the GM). First, I'm going with 50 pts plus up to 50 pts in Disadvantages for the build total. Second, I'm assuming typical NCM for 0 pts for a heroic game. Third, I'm going to assume a few of the options like Hit Locations and Impairing are turned "on" for this game, so it's a bit more lethal than say a supers game. Next, I decide on a concept. I'm going to go with a veteran combat pilot, a rough and tumble sort of guy, but not an Arnie type either. I decide he's the kind of guy who's down on his luck all the time, always looking for the next job, and might be wanted, probably for bad debt. Concept in mind, I rough out some skills: Combat Pilot, a no brainer Navigation (Air, Space), another necessity Transport Familiarity (Combat aircraft, space ships), another no brainer Mechanics, to keep things running (figruing any ship he's on is going to need regular repairs) Electronics, also to keep things running Systems Operation, to know how to run things (ship's life support, artificial gravity if in the setting, navigation system, etc. space ships should have plenty of complex systems) Tactics, he's a combat pilot after all Trading, to negotiate contracts PS: Pilot, for those mundane aspects of being a professional pilot, such as record keeping, knowing various regulations, etc. Language: Trade Argot, this assumes the existance of some kind of pidgin language used by people for trading, but might just be changed to the second most common language in the setting, depending on what the GM has in mind, one pt for basic conversation WF: Blades, General Purpose/Heavy Machine Guns, Grenade Launchers, Small Arms, Vehicle Weapons, ex-military, so he's got basic training in some weapons, though I added Blades b/c he's the sort of guy who'd have one stuffed down his boot, just in case the blaster gave out. 1 Level with All Combat, for his general rough and tumbleness and combat piloting abilities. He's no combat monster, but he has a level he can toss anywhere, which is handy. Fringe Benefit: Starship License, going to need one of these if he's going to get work AK: Spaceways Good to know where you're going. I could call this Trade Routes, Known Space, Local System, whatever. Just his general area of operation. I also considered Gambling, Seduction (womanizing), and KS: Bar Jokes, to add some more flavor, but decided I didn't want him to be a professional at being rowdy, it's just a character trait. I also wanted to have some decent stats. Next, I did the characteristics: STR. Went with a 15 here. He's a big boy, and packs a mean left hook. DEX. Went with a 14 here. He's a capable pilot, so he has good coordination and reaction times, but he's no Bruce Lee. CON. Decided that a bit above average is in order, for dealing with G-forces, so I picked 13. Mainly settled on 13 b/c I want to buy up his BODY score (assuming somewhat lethal campaign), and b/c it rounds evenly and I like nice round numbers. BODY. Giving him a 15. He's a pretty tough guy, and the setting will probably be low on resistant defenses and high on killing damage. And I don't want him to die. INT. Have to be fairly smart to be a pilot, so I set it to 13 to get a 12- on all of those INT skills he has. EGO. It's hard to resist buying a point of EGO to get that ECV bonus, so I gave him an 11 EGO. By concept, there's no particular reason for him to buy up EGO, but then again, there's not particular reason not to buy a point. PRE: He's kind of personable, but not particularly imposing, so I gave him a 13 PRE. That gives him a 12- on his PRE Skills. This also makes things easy for me: Most of his skills are DEX, INT, and PRE based, so having them all at 12- makes it pretty easy for me to remember what his roll is with any given skill...they're all the same! COM: I decide he's got rugged good looks, but he's no sissy model type, and give him a 14 COM. PD and ED: I randomly set these both to 5. He's pretty tough, but he's not a professional boxer or anything. SPD: I set it to 3. He's a good pilot, has some military training, but he's no ace. Just a working stiff. REC, END and STUN: I used the figureds of 6, 26, and 30. Running: I bought his running up an extra inch to 7"...why fight the bad guys when you can outrun them? Next, I picked some Disadvantages: NCM comes for 0 pts in most heroic level games, so I note that. Next, I decide to give him a Psych Limit: Sticks to the Contract. I set it to Moderate level so he doesn't annoy the other PCs too much with the "That'll cost you extra" aspect of it. Of course, the "We got paid to do the job, so we're going to do it, even if there's an Imperial Navy fleet between us and the objective," part is a bit more noble, but...also inconvenient. Kind of helps define who he is. I don't want a bunch of Psych Lims or really to have any duplicate categories, so next, I give him a Rivalry, another freelance pilot who's a professional rival, for 5 pts. I give him a social limitation, "disreputable sort" to reflect that he's got a below average social status. I took this instead of poverty to reflect the down on his luck aspect of the character, because it sucks to actually be poor. He's just on the edge of poor. I gave him an 8- hunted by organized criminals, more powerful, limited area. Probably limited to one or a few planets in the area he operates in. I haven't decided what he's done to tick these guys off, but can work that out with the GM when I know more about the setting. I'm thinking at this point, that maybe he found out he'd been tricked into carrying some illicit cargo and didn't want to take the fall for smuggling, so just turned it over to the authorities. (Not a violation of his psych limit, b/c that'd be a breach of contract by the other guys.) Finally, you can't be unlucky without a die of unluck, so I gave him 1d6. So, right now I have a good idea of his recent history, his motivations, and his personality. Enough to start playing. More background detail than that should be worked out with the GM so that he can best fit into the campaign world. That's pretty much how I go about creating characters.

The main problem with this approach is that you're gaining advantages as a part of a Disadvantage. I'd say buy a Duplication with Trigger and the appropriate limitations. Would have to check the rules on Duplication and see what happens when the main character is knocked out, though. (Not a power I use much at all.)

The GOO one has a serious flaw: No freaking setting. It just launches into dialogue about events taking place that haven't been shown, in a place that hasn't been described. That'd be fine, but the dialogue fails to get the job done in that regard. The HERO one was written a bit better, but pulling a dragon out of the hat without any preamble was a bit lame. Both companies need to bring up the level of writing on these things.

The avatar of.... smackdown! And toads. Same guy.

It doesn't have to if people leave their attitudes and personal accusations at the door. That tends to be a problem with gamers. Everyone involved in a debate is usually highly intelligent, and convinced that they're 200% in the right in their opinions. I think one of the biggest problems here is in identifying which argument everyone is in.

OK, I'll clean it up.

Politeness? A little late to take the high road after you've chosen to respond initially by using the word "crap" to describe another member's post and made the comment that. "This is a roleplaying game, NOT A COMBAT GAME! " both of which are insulting. Let me make this clear: Had you questioned the concept in a less insulting manner, you would have gotten a response that was a [heck] of a lot more polite and would have explained what you so obviously missed. Aside from the fact that you went off half-cocked with the "crap" comment, you also have no [fornicating] idea how I play any game, and the "NOT A COMBAT GAME!" yelling is absurd and childish, especially since that wasn't the point of the [fornicating] comment in the first place. If your concept is that you have all of the effects of a high dex and you turn in a character sheet that's a major pain in the [posterior] to read, then that gets in the way of gameplay. You seem to think that the word "gameplay" means "combat." I was referring to the concept that a clean character sheet lets you get on with the business of roleplaying. If the concept is that the character has uncanny accuracy, but not whole body coordination above the norm, then CLS are appropriate. We basically agree on this point, but you decided to reply with an attitude that would only end up costing you some teeth in a face to face conversation. So, again, pull your [fornicating] head out of your [posterior]and leave your snide attitude at the door.

You know what crap is? Pulling a single line out of a post and going of on a little diatribe. He's a fictional character, get over yourself. The point of the post, had you bothered to read the whole thing, was that Cap could very well have anything between 20s and 30s for his stats. The point of that comment in particular was that if you're going to buy everything that DEX does up to a certain level, you're better off buyinig the DEX. I suggest you pull your head out of your [posterior] and get over your attitude.

Yeah, and all Cap fights are hordes of Hydra agents... Here's the deal: Cap has: One of the best initiatives in the Marvel Universe One of the highest CVs in the Marvel Universe A boatload of DEX-Based skills at high levels If I got a character sheet with a bunch of DEX-Fudges like Lightning Reflexes, CSLs, and Levels with DEX Skills, I'd hand it back and tell the player just to buy the stupid DEX. He also has: Mediocre defenses without blocking/deflecting with his shield A huge habit of using that shield against superhuman attacks, including ranged and strength based. The ability to run through vast hordes of agents, and take them down. The ability to make an offensive attack a panel after doing a bunch of deflections. That's SPEED, folks. If he has a 4 Speed, he'll run out of actions to abort to WAY too soon, and NEVER go on the offense. He cannot sweep agents who aren't standing adjacent to each other. He could sweep and move, though. A SPD of 6 is totally reasonable, and a heck of a lot easier to read on a sheet, and to adjudicate than a buttload of special attacks and PSLs cluttering up the place. Cap's performance is best modelled by a high DEX and at LEAST a 6 SPD. The "concept is king" argument doesn't wash when it gets in the way of gameplay. If you think the NCM rules are what to go by instead of the NPCs, I suggest you read them, b/c taking NCM is an OPTION. You don't have to take the disadvantage. What would be the point in taking NCM for 20 pts of Disads if you're going to spend over 20 pts buying abilities (STR, some DEX, and CON were noted earlier as buy ups) over NCM anyway? NCM should either be a campaign rule or not be used, and has no real place in a supers game. Also, if you want to use the NCM discussion and tables as a basis of argument, try reading the Champions Genre book and seeing what it has to say on the subject. I'll save you the effort. From page 57: Let's parse that, shall we? Upper limits of Legendary are 30 for primaries and DEF 15, SPD 6-7, REC 11-13, END and STUN 60, and higher than NCM movement. "Few humans reach this lofty plateau.." Stever Rogers was given a drug and radiation therapy specifically to reach this plateau. He is the freaking poster child for this plateau. "heroes and superheroes" I think Cap qualifies there. "Only truly exceptional individuals..." Again, he's the poster child for truly exceptional. "...is the upper limit of normal human attainment." CONCEPT CONCEPT CONCEPT.... that IS Cap's concept, in the nutshell. The NCM = 20 and SPD 4 argument is a moot point dealing with Cap or any other superhero. If you're bored and want to throw away WAY more points than you net from taking NCM when building him, that's fine, but he's not capped at 20/4, or even 23/5. Now, if you want to build a low-speed Cap, there is a whole sidebar on lowering the NCM threshold, and since Cap exceeds that threshold to the maximum attainable by normals -- the maximum a normal can buy over NCM -- you'd want to adjust that NCM threshold. Cap is the benchmark, though, and if you impose NCM on him, he's going to end up buying over in any event. There's threshold, then there's max you can buy over, which is Cap-land.

Here's a really quick shot at the character, sans Disads. (Heh, feel free to ignore, I was a bit bored and decided to build him.) Took about fifteen minutes or so, mostly time spent copying, using the skill sets in Champions 5th, and the suggestions from this thread: 20 STR 10 26 DEX 48 25 CON 30 12 BDY 04 13 INT 03 11 EGO 02 18 PRE 08 12 COM 01 10 PD 06 20 ED 15 6 SPD 26 15 REC 12 50 END 00 35 STN 00 --------- CHAR: 163 --------- POWERS 37 Multipower: Pistol, 75 pt. Reserve, OAF (-1) u4 10d6 EB vs ED, No Range Penalty (-1/2) u4 3d6+1 RKA vs. ED, No Range Penalty (-1/2) 15 Multipower: Sword, 30 pt. Reserve, OAF (-1) u1 +6d6 Hand Attack vs. ED, Hand to Hand Attack (-1/2) u1 2d6 HKA vs ED 25 Rapid Regeneration: Armor +10PD/+10ED, Hardened (-1/4) --------- 87 POWERS TOTAL SKILLS (Acrobat Set and Gunman Set, modified) 20 Martial Arts, Classic Comic Book (Combined Ranged Levels and MA pts) 32 +4 Levels w/All Combat (Combined 5 pt levels, netted 3 spare pts) 05 Acrobatics 15- (lowered 2pts, dropped redundant) 05 Breakfall 15- (lowered 2pts, dropped redundant) 03 Contortionist 14- 03 Stealth 14- (free choice, from net 3 from CSL combining) 03 Paramedics 12- (free choice, from background skill allotment) 05 Fast Draw 15- 02 WF: Small Arms 03 Weaponsmith 12- 03 Streetwise 13- (free choice, from background skill allotment) 03 Tactics 12- (free choice, from background skill allotment) 02 AK: Campaign City 11- (free choice, from background skill allotment) 02 KS: Superhuman World 11- (free choice, from background skill allotment) 03 Teamwork 14- (free choice, from background skill allotment) 06 +3" Running (9" total)(bought w/spare pts) ---------------- 100 SKILLS TOTAL DISADVANTAGES: Pick 150 pts. For Characteristics, I mostly went by Tom's recommendations based on your description, but boosted the Energy Defense since he's charged with energy. I boosted the REC to 15 as I mentioned For powers, I used the multis for the weapons and did the armor-as-regeneration schtick. For skills, I took the Acrobatics skill set, the Gunman skill set from Champions 5th and mashed them together. Some levels in PER modifiers might be handy, but I decided to put more in skills and some running. (Note, odd numbers in movement powers are handy, b/c you get the round off on the half move.) You might want Rapid Fire skills as well. With 100 pts alloted, there's plenty of room to play around.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the 38 DEX figure was pretty much just plucked out of the air to prove a point about the effectiveness of DEX...I seriously doubt if anyone involved thinks Cap has a DEX that high. I have a pretty simple way to figure Marvel DEX values: Spiderman is X Cap is Spiderman - 2 CV worth of DEX Most of the really good Martial Artists are Cap -1 or -2 CV Other physically capable types are below that Slow bricks are below that (slow bricks seem to be more the exception than the rule in comics, esp. in DC) Elite combat humans are probably at or below the slow brick level. Note, Spidey probably doesn't have the same CV as Cap, most of his is probably natural, without much MA, just some skill levels from "learning the hard way." Cap would still be more effective in H2H, though he'd have it rough trying to tag a dodging Spider. So, let's say Spidey has a 35 DEX. That's pretty darn spiffy. That'd put Cap at 30. Let's say Spidey is at 30. That'd put cap at about 24. Let's go Low DEX and put Spidey at 26 That'd put Cap around 20. Of course, all you do by setting your Spidey Factor (SF) is determine how much above the normal schmucks with the 10 to 14 DEXes your heroes are. SF gives a good idea of how "norm-proof" characters will generally be. I think a good level of SF is SF 32, with a Cap at around 26-27. It gives a decent range of DEX options and it lets normals be a bit of a threat, especially en masse.

First, I've seen players totally abuse Pych Lim: Fearless. If it grants an advantage, it shouldn't net disadvantage points. Second, you need to define how fear effects work within the campaign. Using mental attacks or PRE attacks both work, but running both is probably going to be a little inconsistant. I like the idea of PRE Drains for fear attacks. It's a lot more elegant (shorter power writeup, no custom lims) than a single command Mind Control "Fear" would be. Of course, if other emotion control powers are common, then mental attacks are probably the way to go. In the case of PRE-based, the aforementioned PRE, Defense Only (-1) is an old standby. Power Defense only vs. Fear effects (-1 maybe) is good against PRE Drains. Mental Defense, only vs. Fear effects is good for the mental side of things, as is 75> Mental Damage Reduction, only vs. Fear Effects. (20 pts gets you either +40 MD vs. Fear or 75% Damage Reduction vs. Fear) Either approach works out to about the same cost for the characters.

I really like Tom's suggestions, but there's anotheralternative for doing Regeneration. The description makes the regeneration sound like more of a secondary schtick. Here's one way to buy it: Instant Regeneration: Armor +6PD/+6ED, Hardened (+14) 22 pts. Special effect is that the wound happens, but it's healed almost instantly. High Recovery: A REC of 15 ( would cost 12 pts with a 20 STR and 23-25 CON) will let you heal 1 BODY every two days. It also helps you recover faster from STUN damage in combat. With these options, you can ignore some smaller wounds, which heal even in combat, and you heal other BODY damage really quickly. You'd also bounce back into the fight pretty fast. For skills, if you have Champions for Fifth Edition, there are several combat-oriented 50 point skills packages to chose from, which should work well, perhaps with a little tweaking. Martial Block and Martial Dodge are your friend. So is Martial Throw, Takedown, or Legsweep. Pick the damaging attacks to suit your concept. A successful block sets you up to attack first next phase, Martial Dodge adds a great DCV bonus for only 4 pts, and any of the maneuvers that take your opponent off his feet put him at half DCV and make him burn a half phase to stand back up unless he has breakfall or some of the movement power adders. Speaking of which, Breakfall is probably your friend. You really don't want to be on the ground (and at half DCV) with low defenses. As to the point total, that's up to the GM if it's for a game. If it's just for the sake of practicing character construction, then 350 is a safe bet, as that's the "standard" power level and there are many PC and official writeups of NPCs at that level for you to use as a basis of comparison. You can probably fit this character into 350 quite comfortably. One more idea: No Range Penalty advantage is your friend if you want to hit consistantly, though it's a bit pricey. (PSLs may work out cheaper, depending on the size of the attack.)

First, that series of pics is a well-known hoax. The animal in the first photo had eaten a small pig. The animal which was cut open is a posed shot. Second, a 4 meter snake is in no way large enough to swallow an adult human. That's 13'. Here's a pic of a 12' burmese python, first one, with the kids holding it. Look at the head. Even unhinging its jaws, the snake could in no way get the shoulders of even one of the kids in the pic down its throat, nor would it try if it killed one. EDIT: As a matter of fact, the snake in the bottom pic on this page is a 12' burm and its head is right next to the guy's hand who's holding it, and it's not even as big as the hand. That snake probably eats medium rabbits, at best. http://home.earthlink.net/~chriscorps/RALLC/monthly.htm The following is a picture of Baby, the world's largest snake. It's a 27 foot, over 400 pound Burmese python. It's not big enough to eat even the kid in the pic with it. Again, humans aren't shaped like food. http://ahau.nidus.net/ss/home.html The next pic is Fluffy, probably the largest reticulated python in captivity. Again, even with the forced perspective in the pic, it's clear the snake isn't big enough to eat Bob Clark in the background. (Bob Clark is the preeminent breeder of giant constrictors, and his site http://www.bobclark.com is chock full of info on reptiles of all kinds.) http://12.210.130.56/GalleryOne/fluffy01.jpg Thing is... snakes are just one very big, flexible tube o' muscle. Every one of the snakes in the above pictures could easily kill the strongest adult human without a whole lot of effort. In fact, any of the heavy-bodied constrictors can be a serious threat once they surpass about eight feet or so. If you assume a fantasy snake to have similar proportions to the burmese python, which is the second heaviest, and probably the largest-headed of the giant constrictors, you'd have to go up to about 40or 50 feet to get one that's a man eater. I've seen plenty of 12' plus burmese pythons and anacondas, and none of them is anywhere near large enough to swallow an adult human, or most kids for that matter.

I agree with Lucious and Starlord. That's why I leave it at "annoyed." Some good thoughts there, but the presentation is lacking. At the moment, I'm leaning less toward inadvertant, though. Someone who's obviously as intelligent as tesuji should have gotten a clue on that after so many comments about his percieved attitude.

Hmm.. I don't think a 4 meter (about 13') snake can swallow someone whole. Their heads aren't big enough.

You know, sometimes tesuji annoys the heck out of me. Ok, a lot of the time. BUT, he does have a point. I'm sitting here trying to figure out how even the worst players could get their 300 pt party trashed by 175 pt robots. I know I can figure out how to build a 175 pt robot, especially with the automaton rules, that can whup a balanced 300 pt PC, but the question in my mind is: Why should I? I'm thinking that the combat result is probably due more to lopsided character design, or to the GM exploiting more of the combat rules than the players, than it is to the players wanting to just walk in and smash stuff. A 300 point PC should be able to just walk in and smash 175 point stuff. My 350 pt PCs can very easily smash my 250 pt agents in the game I'm running now, and none of them are really combat monsters or especially complex rules-exploiting designs. I suspect that what we're talking about here is not so much tactics as scenario design. I would venture to guess that the GM set up a complex, perhaps subtle situation, that required roleplaying, planning, etc. to solve. Tactics has nothing to do with this. (If this is the case.) Anyway, I think we'd need to see the characters in question, and a blow by blow of the scenario to figure out what didn't work here. (Not who's wrong, but what can be changed to make things work out better. Assigning blame is a pretty petty thing to do in an activity that's supposed to be fun and recreational.) What I would suggest for new GMs trying to demo the game for their group is to build some pretty vanilla characters for the team -- at least in terms of power constructs -- and then use some generic thugs/agents for the first encounter. Use none of the optional combat rules. If running supers, leave out certain character types such as mentalists, or any other class of character that relies on anything other than vanilla rules. Next encounter should be a fight against a somewhat weaker group of villains, designed using the same vanilla approach. They can be made weaker in numbers, by slightly lower defenses, or by an average lower SPD, or lower CVs, or some combination of things, just as long as the PCs have an advantage. Then, cut the scenario off at that point and review what happened. Look up any rules questions that weren't immediately resolvable in play, and so on. Make it clear that this is just a warm-up session, not in continuity, and that the players will be able to make any changes they might find handy. As the game progresses -- if everyone is still interested -- slowly add in layers of complexity. Throw a telepath at them, a single tough opponent that can challenge the whole team, add in optional combat stuff, such as knockback, etc.

I tend to think of him as more bouncy in the early years, and less killing attack-y. More killing attack-y recently, less bouncy. Of course, I'd just give him a big EB and some skill levels so he could make the most out of spreading, bouncing, and sweeping with it, which would be way cheaper. But I'm lazy that way.

I thought Aquaman's strength diminished as he dried off too? Not a huge Aquaman fan, though, so not sure on that one.

Does anyone know exactly what happened in the Thor/Spidey/Mongoose brawl? All I remember is the thing with Thor holding up the support for the building.

Hmm... I've been reading along, and it seems more like player to player animosity than character driven. Then again, this group might enjoy a more adversarial approach, which can be fun every now and then.