Children of the Hydra build

[MrAgdesh]

Regarding the Children of the Hydra in the movie Jason and the Argonauts (1963).

 

I thought that this was an easy build - Summon up to 7 (8x) 135pt Skeletons (6E Bestiary), 7 Charges, Slavishly Loyal, Must be Summoned on natural earth (-1/4)

 

But with the way that Charges interact with Summon then not quite. In the movie, each Charge is a tooth, and the number of teeth that you hurl to the ground creates a skeleton. But Charges allow you to bring forth the maximum number of creatures summonable with each charge. This would result in 49 skeletons (of which you may have at most 7 at one time, but that's still too many).

 

If I build it as a single Summon of one skeleton and then try to repeat it with the remaining 6 charges that’s not technically legit as;

 

“Generally the most beings a character can have Summoned at one time with a specific Summon-based power equals the maximum number of beings he can Summon at once, regardless of how many times he uses the Summon.” 6E1 pg 289.

 

Of course, the GM’s option on the same page allows for a character to reuse his Summon without restriction, so is it just a case of that, or is there some well-worded Limitation that I’m missing for the Charges?

 

 

[Ndreare]

Perhaps you could use autofire or boostable charges to represent what you want?

[Grailknight]

Your first build is fine.  It's all in how you define your focus and in this case you can just say the focus is teeth rather than tooth. I'd even let you have an additional +1/4 for those occasions where you had less than 7 teeth available.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Pistols are built around charges.  For example a colt 44-40 revolver has 6 "charges" of bullets.  You can only use it 6 times, that's the limitation, but it doesn't shoot all 6 charges at once.

[HeroGM]

7 charges, with 7 'clips' if you want to be able to summon more than 7 at a time

[MrAgdesh]

15 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Pistols are built around charges.  For example a colt 44-40 revolver has 6 "charges" of bullets.  You can only use it 6 times, that's the limitation, but it doesn't shoot all 6 charges at once.

Yeah, but that's how charges interact with an Instant Attack (RKA) power. Summon is also Instant but not an attack and has has an effect that lingers (the Summoned being). If I want up to 7 skeletons at once (as there are in the film) and I take 7 charges then I could, as written, summon a total of 49 skeletons with a max of 7 at one time. 

 

I want each charge to represent 1 skeleton but the ability to summon several of them at once, with the charges Never Recovering. I'm wondering if Ndeare's Autofire might be the answer. Or the 'At the GM's option' being a handwave.

[HeroGM]

Or the option of doing the summon as 1 charge with the person carrying multiple charges as in a fantasy game similar to potions, scrolls, etc.

[MrAgdesh]

1 minute ago, HeroGM said:

Or the option of doing the summon as 1 charge with the person carrying multiple charges as in a fantasy game similar to potions, scrolls, etc.

There is a GM option that allows for unrestricted amounts of Summoning (where you repeatedly Summon 1 being at a time) but I feel that having all 7 skeletons ready to attack together, rather than just 1, is a definite advantage so it should be paid for. I'm leaning toward Autofire where each Charge Summons 1 Skeleton. 

 

[HeroGM]

Or since they show up away from everyone normally (throwing range) have it that it takes a phase or so (extra time) to grow and attack.

[MrAgdesh]

3 minutes ago, HeroGM said:

Or since they show up away from everyone normally (throwing range) have it that it takes a phase or so (extra time) to grow and attack.

Well, Summon is a full phase to use and the Summoned beings are Stunned and disoriented for their own first phase so I figure that's about right anyway. 

[LoneWolf]

An expendable focus would be a better way to do it.   Buy the summon with the maximum number you can have and define the focus as being one tooth per skeleton summoned.   

[Christopher R Taylor]

I mean, you build a bullet with a continuing charge on it, it still doesn't empty the magazine when you pull the trigger once.  Look closely at special effects and how they work in the game.

[Lord Liaden]

Instead of Charges, perhaps you could use the Expendable Focus Limitation since you're using up Hydra teeth to create the skeletons; and declare that the number of skeletons you Summon at any time depends on the number of teeth you use. If you want to be able to use fewer than all teeth at once, that would justify a reduction to the Limitation value.

[Hey I Can Chan]

Buy the same Summon (1 skeleton) Power with 1 Charge 7 times. Then when you want to Summon more than one skeleton with a lone Attack Action use a Combined Attack (6E2 74). You may even be able to use the 5-Point Doubling Rule (6E2 181).

[Tech]

The movie shows the skeletons this way: the evil king spreads out the teeth, a few at a time and then waits (as does Jason and his men). Finally, one at a time, the skeletons show up while Jason and his men are startled (and waiting). So, if it's to be done like the movie, it was not 7-at-once.