Shapeshifting

[Sean Waters]

This house believes that the power 'Shapeshift' is too expensive. Discuss.

 

The basic reason is that it is a power with no direct effect on combat, except for the odd surprise attack bonus.

 

It is a power that has enormous potential to imbalance a game, but that will depend on the role playing: a GM can always rules that a lot of places have pheremonal detectors, and the player can't shift smell. The point is the usefulness of the power is in the application by the player which is not properly quantifyable across games. The power should be a warning or stop power, but cost less to purchase.

 

Compare images: a similar cost and far more application - in fact it could be used as a de facto shapeshift in addition to its other utility.

 

Compare invisibilty: more expensive, but only 10 points in most situations, with massive combat effect and equally great potential to imbalance a game.

 

Shapeshift is basically a SFX you pay for in most cases. You could make the power cheaper and the more difficult to run bits (like imitation) more expensive or more difficult to use (requires physical contact and extra time, for example).

[Vondy]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I won't enter into the cost effectiveness debate - as many of the factors involved are completely subjective. I'm inclined to believe its over priced (I also believe claristience purchased for each sense can be prohibitive and result in diminished returns as well), but that's more my sense of it based on my subjective experience. As such, I'll limit myself to presenting an alternative:

 

If we're talking about the ability to say "I can assume the form of any human" you could just purchase transformation (cosmetic), cumulative (+1/2), self only (-1/2), human forms (-0?). Other lims such as "must tough target to duplicate" or "cannot assume forms of people they have not seen" could be added for flavor as well. If you wanted the change to be essentially instant you could just buy a lot of dice (cheaply) and drop the cumulative, but I think having fewer dice and cumulative is a good simulation of a character who needs a few seconds or a moment to readjust their physical structure. Some people would argue the ability to change sex is a major transformation, but I'd let it slide in my game as cosmetic (maybe minor) - because its largely an SFX power dependent on circumstances and role play.

[Lightray]

Shapeshift is basically a SFX you pay for in most cases. You could make the power cheaper and the more difficult to run bits (like imitation) more expensive or more difficult to use (requires physical contact and extra time' date=' for example).[/quote']

Well, if the shapeshifting is a SFX, then I don't make the character buy it. If the character can grow wings, claws, etc. then he doesn't need Shapeshift -- he's already got the powers he needs.

 

Shapeshift is only for "I want to look like that" effects. This -- like Clairsentience, Clinging, and a few other powers -- is clearly a non-combat power. But in non-combat situations, like espionage adventures, it can be overwhelming.

 

I think the main problem with the cost is that it is a Sense-based Power. So if someone can become a cellular double of other people, he needs Sight, Hearing, Smell/Taste, Radio, Unusual, etc. This seems excessive, so I just tell them to define three Sense groups (like their SFX) and use those. So they're covered for not being detected by radar or spatial awareness, even though they don't have the Radio or Unusual groups.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Personally I'm pretty comfortable with the cost and sense-based structure for Shape Shift. In most heroic campaigns there won't often be a need to buy coverage for all the Sense Groups, unless the GM chooses to make such SS-busters more common in his game. The way it breaks down also seems logical to me and consistent with other elements of the system, and I like its flexibility. Of course YMMV, as it should.

 

One thing to keep in mind, though: If comparing Shape Shift to Images or Invisibility, note that SS has no Perception Roll associated with it to see through it. The Shift is perfect unless someone has a Discriminatory sense that your SS doesn't cover.

[Rapier]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

This house believes that the power 'Shapeshift' is too expensive. Discuss.

 

The basic reason is that it is a power with no direct effect on combat, except for the odd surprise attack bonus.

 

It is a power that has enormous potential to imbalance a game, but that will depend on the role playing: a GM can always rules that a lot of places have pheremonal detectors, and the player can't shift smell. The point is the usefulness of the power is in the application by the player which is not properly quantifyable across games. The power should be a warning or stop power, but cost less to purchase.

 

Compare images: a similar cost and far more application - in fact it could be used as a de facto shapeshift in addition to its other utility.

 

Compare invisibilty: more expensive, but only 10 points in most situations, with massive combat effect and equally great potential to imbalance a game.

 

Shapeshift is basically a SFX you pay for in most cases. You could make the power cheaper and the more difficult to run bits (like imitation) more expensive or more difficult to use (requires physical contact and extra time, for example).

Cost effective arguments are always so "heated." They also always come down to subjective experience. I personally, don't believe that ShapeShift is too expensive.

 

I also think you are doing yourself, your players and Hero a disservice to try and quantify everything in terms of Combat Effectiveness. If your games are primarily arena combat or somehow center around dishing out the smackdown, then yes, Shapeshift doesn't give you much bang for your buck. Actually, let me stop and apologise for the sentence above. I didn't mean to imply you are some kind of schlub. There is nothing wrong, at all, with running a primarily combat game. My games have quite a bit of roleplaying and sometimes we can go a couple games without any combat.

 

Shapeshift is a completely separate power from images or anything else. Images can make you look like Dan Rather. However, an observant person (or depending on SFX, a mechanical device like a camera) or anyone with any kind of time to do an examination (say during interaction at a dinner party) can see that you are not, in fact, Dan Rather.

 

While, a Transform could produce the effect (changing from Male/Female or changing your outward shape to another human), I would not allow it since you are using Transform to duplicate another power (Shapeshift).

 

Shapeshift would actually allow you to become, outwardly, Dan Rather (depending on how it was purchased, you could even pass a thorough inspection including bloodwork and fingerprints). This is a very powerful ability. I have a character in my current Hero campaign that has Shapeshift and he is always the point man when lurking around warehouses or things (usually in the shape of a guard or scientist etc). He is a VITAL member of the team and has saved the team and made things much easier on a number of occassions.

 

I guess, I more strictly enforce the intent of the power. I would not allow someone to buy Images (Touch, Hearing, Sight) Self-Only (only to appear as another human). I would demand that they, instead, buy Shapeshift (unless there was a REALLY REALLY good reason why Images was the right power for the concept).

[Vondy]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

 

While, a Transform could produce the effect (changing from Male/Female or changing your outward shape to another human), I would not allow it since you are using Transform to duplicate another power (Shapeshift).

 

 

My feeling has always been, though it doesn't really bother me, that because transform exists, and has broader applications than shapeshift due to greater abstraction, that shapeshift is actually redundant within the system. Its a nice shorthand for something you can do by tailoring another - more abstract - power, but then, the cost-benefit ratio should be comprable to what you can get in terms of effect with a transform tailored to function as shapeshift. If regeneration was removed and made a part of the greater (more abstract) healing power, why shouldn't shapeshift be handled the same way? I'm pretty much just thinking out loud here, but it seems, if we're going streamline some powers, why not others?

[Sean Waters]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I'd need to check this but I'm pretty sure you'll find you can not use transform on yourself. That prevents you doing that quick fix.

 

Images presents an 'image' that can be detected as 'false' by a PER roll. So does shapeshift, even with the 'imitation' adder, and it is ranged, can fill a hex, etc ect for basically the same cost as shapeshift. You can hardly say to someone who has images that they can not create an image of Dan Rather over themselves if they can do so over there (points to corner).

 

Completely with you on the 'combat is not the be all, let alone the end all' point, but I was using the comparison to invisibilty - also an espionage game killer. It is only slightly more expensive and DOES have huge combat benefits. It is also a sense affecting power built on a similar pricing structure. Recently played a game against some 'Super Skrull' clones. Boy, is invisibilty a huge advantage.

[zornwil]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I don't have the books in front of me, but I don't think Shape Shift was over-priced in 4th and IIRC in 5th the changes mainly revolve around buying additional senses as compared to how it was done before, but the cost difference from 4th to 5th overall, for a broad Shape Shift ability, is not that greatly increased (I might be wrong). I disagree with the direction in 5th from a points discussion but not in terms of the ideas they gave. I think for the price, SS should be more open-ended than the stricter definition of being apparent to 3 senses only and so on.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Early in the thread it was mentioned that Shapeshift was not as combat effective as Invisibility. Combat-wise this is true. Shapeshift if used properly with other skills and possibly powers can be used in a variety of non-combat ways, like to frame heroes quite effectively. See the X-Men movies for good examples.

 

It has also been stated that the construction method for Shapeshift is a bit redundant. This idea has merit.

 

 

 

• Images and #Change Environment : : Invisibility, Shapeshift and even *Darkness
  
• Damage Reduction : : Desolidification (at least in stopping ALL damage)
  
• Mind Control and/or Telepathy : : Minor/Major Transform
  
• AVLD : : NND (yes, I know these are just 'Advantages' but they do fit with the argument)
  

On the left we have powers that have a gradual effect and never provide 100% effect (# in a broader sense at least). On the right we have powers that all provide absolute effects that are only countered if you have something akin to a rare NND defense to the particular effect. *I also think it seems a bit arbritary that the rules specifically state that Images cannot create Darkness types of effects.

[Vondy]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I'd need to check this but I'm pretty sure you'll find you can not use transform on yourself. That prevents you doing that quick fix.

 

Regeneration, as currently written violates the basic tenets of healing, but is presented as an exception to the general rule. Conceptually Shapeshift is simply a narrow "Self Only" transform presented as a separate power. I continue to fail to see why it exists on its own at all. And if the GM okays it there's no reason not to do it, even if, technically, transform isn't self-targeting (which seems pretty arbitrary to me).

[Lord Liaden]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I'd need to check this but I'm pretty sure you'll find you can not use transform on yourself. That prevents you doing that quick fix.

 

That is the official ruling. Of course people are free to change that for their own games.

 

Images presents an 'image' that can be detected as 'false' by a PER roll. So does shapeshift' date=' even with the 'imitation' adder, and it is ranged, can fill a hex, etc ect for basically the same cost as shapeshift. You can hardly say to someone who has images that they can not create an image of Dan Rather over themselves if they can do so over there (points to corner).[/quote']

 

Certainly Images can be used on the possessor of the Power; I've seen official builds that do this. As I indicated in my previous post, though, as far as I can tell from the rulebook and the FAQ there is no perception roll to "see through" Shape Shift, except in the case of using Disguise (when it's a standard Skill vs. Skill contest), or the Imitation Adder (and then implicitly only for people who know the character well, and then at a significant penalty). That's a big edge that SS has over Images.

[TheEmerged]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I like the current system with Shapeshift -- but feel it needs one fix. There should be a base cost to affect not only the Touch Sense but all "ranged touch" powers like Radar and Sonar as well.

[zornwil]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I like the current system with Shapeshift -- but feel it needs one fix. There should be a base cost to affect not only the Touch Sense but all "ranged touch" powers like Radar and Sonar as well.

Let me introduce you to 4th edition...

 

(okay, sorry, I'll get that snarkiness under control someday...)

[Sean Waters]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Regeneration' date=' as currently written violates the basic tenets of healing, but is presented as an exception to the general rule. Conceptually Shapeshift is simply a narrow "Self Only" transform presented as a separate power. I continue to fail to see why it exists on its own at all. And if the GM okays it there's no reason not to do it, even if, technically, transform isn't self-targeting (which seems pretty arbitrary to me).[/quote']

 

With you in principle, but, and I have checked now, it does say specifically that you can not be the/a target. Good argument that it is too expensive, though...

[Sean Waters]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Let me introduce you to 4th edition...

 

(okay, sorry, I'll get that snarkiness under control someday...)

 

 

No, but that is it: it got more expensive for no good reason I can see.

[JeffreyWKramer]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I think it works fine. If you compare the game system to the comics it was developed to emulate, you will notice that shapeshifting is a fairly unusual power. Having it be relatively expensive maintains the relative rarity.

 

Beyond that, if your games revolve around mysteries, RP and intrigue, Shapeshift is a fantastically useful and very powerful ability, so as such, it should be fairly expensive, IMHO.

 

Look at it this way - unlike Disguise or Images, there is not a PER roll to notice the Shapeshift (as LL noted already), unless you have a sense power that it does not cover. Thus, it is something like an NND version of Images bought to a 18-. Compared to that, the cost isn't too bad at all.

[zornwil]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I think it works fine. If you compare the game system to the comics it was developed to emulate, you will notice that shapeshifting is a fairly unusual power. Having it be relatively expensive maintains the relative rarity.

 

Beyond that, if your games revolve around mysteries, RP and intrigue, Shapeshift is a fantastically useful and very powerful ability, so as such, it should be fairly expensive, IMHO.

 

Look at it this way - unlike Disguise or Images, there is not a PER roll to notice the Shapeshift (as LL noted already), unless you have a sense power that it does not cover. Thus, it is something like an NND version of Images bought to a 18-. Compared to that, the cost isn't too bad at all.

Ugh, you evil bastard, you just tripped me up. I have long argued that the rules should emulate the heroic fiction genre in points values as well as other aspects, particularly in arguing against Gary's (in my view nearly monomaniacal) focus on utility. Now I have to think about this...as well as go back and review the 4th vs 5th costs again.

[JeffreyWKramer]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Ugh' date=' you evil bastard, you just tripped me up. I have long argued that the rules should emulate the heroic fiction genre in points values as well as other aspects, particularly in arguing against Gary's (in my view nearly monomaniacal) focus on utility. Now I have to think about this...as well as go back and review the 4th vs 5th costs again.[/quote']

 

Heh! I'll look forward to your review of the relevant data, which I generally find informative. I've given this one some thought recently, though, as I'm playing a character with a certain degree of Shapeshifting, and have been thinking a lot about the cost/utility ratio and duplication of genre. LL's point made some things gel for me, so all in all, this has been a pretty interesting thread.

[zornwil]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Heh! I'll look forward to your review of the relevant data' date=' which I generally find informative. I've given this one some thought recently, though, as I'm playing a character with a certain degree of Shapeshifting, and have been thinking a lot about the cost/utility ratio and duplication of genre. LL's point made some things gel for me, so all in all, this has been a pretty interesting thread.[/quote']

We have a shapeshifter but we started the game pre-5th and I've treated it as "ain't broke, don't fix it". I'll likely maintain that from a pragmatic standpoint but your post definitely makes me think more on it. Anyway, just adding that we do have a shapeshifter just as a "for the record" comment.

[PhilFleischmann]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Do I really want to get involved in another Shape Shifting debate?

 

My interpretation is to allow SS to have some real effects beyond simply having an altered appearance to one or more senses, especially in light of its increased cost.

 

Examples:

Shaping yourself into a ladder, so that your buddies can climb you.

Shaping yourself into a man-sized airplaine, so the team brick can throw you as a balanced, aerodynamic object.

Squeezing yourself through openings narrower than a normal person could get through (like the bars of a jail cell).

 

AFAIK, there is no power that allows you to do the second of the above examples.

 

This requires some thought on the part of the GM as to what should be allowed with SS, and what requires a separate power purchase. Speaking for myself, I would not allow Shape Shift to provide:

 

Significant Attack Powers (Shaping my fingers into razor-sharp claws)

Major Movement Powers (+10" running, turning myself into a cheetah, or a rapidly flowing liquid blob, etc.)

Squeezing through *very* narrow openings (such as under most doors, or through keyholes)

 

If a character gets points by taking a disadvantage, the GM should make sure the character is actually disadvantaged in play.

If a character saves points by taking a limitation, the GM should make sure the power actually gets limited in play.

And for the same reasons, if a character pays points for a power, the GM should make sure that the power is useful in play.

 

"Sometimes a Power receives minor benefits and drawbacks because of its special effects. These minor modifiers don't change the cost of the Power, .... For example, a character with fire powers can keep his friends warm if they're trapped in a freezer. While the character could buy this (as Life Support...), the effect is so minor that the GM should allow him to do it without paying Character Points for it - it's an 'indirect benefit' of his chosen special effect." -- FREd, p70

 

Because the Shape Shift power is so expensive, I see it as providing a good deal of "indirect benefits."

[JeffreyWKramer]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

I'd say #2 is special effect for Gliding, myself.

 

Most people I know treat Shapeshifting at the level where a person can assume virtually any shape as an actual change in physical form, and treat most of what you describe as a simple matter of special effects, just like a guy with fire powers doesn't have to buy a power to start a piece of paper on fire. This is particularly appropriate when the character has purchased other powers to back up the concept, such as Shrinking, Stretching, Growth, etc.

 

So, yeah, if you spend enough points to take a variety of forms, I'd say Shapeshift has a lot of little "indirect benefits."

[TheEmerged]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

RE: "Let me introduce you to 4th Edition."

 

/snarkiness on

 

That's the edition where it wasn't clear whether "full" shapeshifting cost 30 or 40 points, right?

 

/snarkiness off

 

I realize you were probably joking, but even having played substantially under 4th I find that I prefer the system under 5th. I feel however that it's impractical to expect a character to buy every sense that functions as a "ranged touch" separately, especially given the wide variety of potential Unusual Senses that could be applicable.

[zornwil]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

RE: "Let me introduce you to 4th Edition."

 

/snarkiness on

 

That's the edition where it wasn't clear whether "full" shapeshifting cost 30 or 40 points, right?

 

/snarkiness off

 

I realize you were probably joking, but even having played substantially under 4th I find that I prefer the system under 5th. I feel however that it's impractical to expect a character to buy every sense that functions as a "ranged touch" separately, especially given the wide variety of potential Unusual Senses that could be applicable.

Oh, I know, as I have stated, 5th generally is a move in the right direction. And you're certainly entitled to your snarkiness, I was half-serious and half-joking. I was rereading 4th as a result of this discussion, and I see what you mean about he confusion on 30 vs 40. And in earlier Champions (Champions III when introduced) it was 35 points for any shape change, just as a point of interest.

 

I am not well-versed in 5th on Shape Shift, so be gentle in correcting me if I get this wrong, but my impression is that a Shape Shift in 5th, any shape, to cover Sight Group (targeting), Touch Group (nontargeting), Radio (for Radar, targeting), and Hearing Group (nontargeting, typically), making it roughly analagous to a 4th Shape Shift which should have presumably followed the 3 visible senses rule as to the senses it manifested with by default (even if that is a bit of an inversion) but seems to have been mostly interpreted as common sense senses (i.e., radar and sonar get lumped in as "sight" for that purpose) would cost 41 points whereas 4th was 30 points and 3rd was 35 points.

 

As Jeffrey points out, even aside from a utility argument, there's a genre-reflection argument. But as I think about it, I don't think that means SS should be valued too highly. Why? Because typically (as has been brought up), SS is accompanied by many other abilities, either Power Skill-related abilites or whole other powers, such as the seeping shifter who effectively goes desolid through anything with a small crack in it. So I think we have to be very careful here and remember that the genre examples include many other powers and Shape Shift, strickly speaking, is really an enabler to these other abilities.

 

Given that, and given we saw Shape Shift migrate from 35 to 30 to 41, at least for the basic "do any shape" version, and we have people now grumbling at the increased cost to buy full Shape Shift, I suspect somewhere between 30 and 40, very broadly speaking is at least in the ballpark. Desol is 40; Shape Shift seems a similarly good deal and more or less as common in the comics as a regular schtick, but again I speak VERY broadly, and in terms of Fantasy I don't know though tend to suspect they're VERY roughly similar. Anyway, these very flexible personal powers at about 40 points and that seems a good "entry" price (notwithstanding simpler shape shifts exist and would be cheaper). It would seem logical that 40 would buy all basic/common senses except for a "giveaway" one or two (mental and unusual or such) for balance purposes

 

That just gives us a ballpark for cost...

 

...as to 5th's construction, purchasing by sense group as opposed to following a 3 visible senses rule for either what makes it visible as a power or how it manifests as a power gets awkward, as others have noted - why would Radar not work as if in the Sight group, for example, why buy the Hearing group just to cover that? Of course this has been noted already.

 

I must admit, though, that I happily ran Shape Shift at the Champions III version for a long time (well into 4th, up until probably 5 years ago) and didn't notice the change to 30.

 

My feeling is that unless I missed something the cost change isn't that great but the nuance of various senses makes this new version more difficult to properly manage. It drives the cost up where that really doesn't seem warranted - does anyone care that radar slips by freely, for example, or active sonar, given it works against sight?

 

OTOH, certainly, the use of senses as a basis creates greater granularity, although it begs the question of Images (as I think Killer Shrike? has mentioned, if I have the right person, in advocating the use of Images period) and the base power as aforementined begs self-Transform as well. But I would like to set those aside at least for the moment and stay with the "mainstream" intepretation of Shape Shift as its own unique power.

 

And using Senses, one can really nail down the specific game mechanics precisely. That can't be bad, even if perhaps overkill.

 

Of course an alternative is to declare that Shape Shift affects "all" Senses by default, with the exception of 3 Visible Senses, those sense being the method to detect there is a Shape Shift (and/or according to SFX the true form, if such exists). But, boy, is this tricky if we compare to source material - most often it is rather tricky ways in which a Shifter is determined. Often Infrared can do it (they might have a slightly different body temperature), or bio-detection (unless they have Cellular), or a close touch (as in there might be a slightly notable excretion or such).

 

I think buying up Sense Groups makes less sense than defining the groups or individual senses through which it can be detected. I think it is easier to indicate that Shape Shift can be detected through 2 groups and at least one individual sense in a one of the already-used groups. If we take that as a default, we can simplify the cost greatly while preserving mechancis but we may introduce other complications as players try to take more or less senses through which their PCs are detectable.

 

In general Senses versus Shape Shift can be a morass in terms of SFX - how, for example, would High Range Radio Hearing be brought to bear against a humanoid Shape Shifter? But should all Shape Shifters typically purchase the Radio Group (which would have to be targeting, given the inclusion of Radar, further complicating the cost which is almost surely inflated IMHO at that point against both utility and genre). Or do we have to redefine Sense Groups in alignment with Shape Shift's practical uses? That's even worse - especially if we have to create a specialized "Shape Shift versus Senses" grouping!

 

So the basic problem I continue to see re 5th Shape Shift is that it complicates that which was eminently resolvable by SFX and well-defined powers. All things considered, I can see bumping up the cost to even 40 for the basic any-shape Shape Shift power. But I can't see the granularity of the per-Sense costing as opposed to how it was in the past, which leaves me in a bit of a conundrum still. My inclination is simply to cost Shape Shift slightly upward but continue to do in the fashion of 4th in terms of functionality.

 

And in closing, upon reflection, Desolid continues to have (as other such unusual powers) the caveat "...the character must define the special effects of a reasonably common group of attacks which will affect him while he's Desolidified." I posit that simply adding this approach to Shape Shift "fixes everything", as in "The character must define the special effects of a reasonably common group of senses which will 'see through' his Shape Shift, failing purchasing Invisible Power Effects. In the case of purchasing IPE, the character must still have at least some singular, even if esoteric 'achille's heel'."

 

Thoughts? As I step into the minefield...

[Sean Waters]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

Imitation shapeshifting still allows a PER roll for people who know the character well at -3. This would cost 9 points in images (-3 to PER roll). You automatically get to copystuff with an INT roll. Shapeshift is not 'perfect', but I accept that there are disadvantages to images. Can you accept that this is (more than) balanced by it's increased utility. Range: you can throw your voice, or make it appear that a team mate is doing a sneak attack - then do one yourself. The power can emulate darkness in some ways, especially effective if you buy personal immunity: put a wall in front of you then punch through it. Lots of other stuff: you can look like Dan Rather a significant part of the time. Who's going to spot that you are fake,and if they do, isn't that goingt o convince them you are the original?

 

Invisibility is a great espionage tool, more useful in some situations, less so in others than shapeshift. That is pretty rare in comics (characters you can not see are not interesting to watch). It is similarly priced and has far greater effect in combat.

 

The other well made point is that the price reflects comic book reality/rareness. I would be persuaded if this carried through to other powers, but dare I point at transform? Not a very common power in comics. Cheap for what it does. In fact if you had two characters with 5 points of cosmetic transform in the party you could have them make each other look exactly like Dan Rather. For this reason I can not accept that it is the design philosophy to keep shapeshifters rare. You can do that in any event by not building/allowing them very often, you don't need a rules mechanic.

 

Finally whilst I agree that they are great for role playing certain scenarios, you only really get to do that a great deal if you are playing solo. A group won't want to wait around whilst Proteus infiltrates VIPER, uncovers the plot and sets demolition charges around the doomsday device, so, in practice, you are only going to get to use the powers in limited ways, like fooling a guard to get the rest of the group in.

[Sean Waters]

Re: Shapeshifting

 

What zornwill said.

 

People have been implying that shapeshift is 'the real deal'. If you buy it just against sight, it is an illusion (albeit a good one) thrown over your usual shape. You don't actually shift shape, you fool other peoples senses into thinking you are a different shape, which is why it has no 'real world effect'.