How to do this Celtic myth power?

[Static UK]

Another “How would you do this?†question for you to ponder on!

 

In my supers campaign I have a bunch of Celtic myth based characters, with some Celtic myth style abilities. There is one ability I am having difficulty modelling, the Gesa (it has several variant spellings). The Gesa can take several forms, and are usually good or bad for the character. Bad Gesa can usually be easily modelled by using disadvantages (Psychological or Social Limitations, or Vulnerabilities) due to their form, ie, ‘Must never drink alone’, ‘Must never start a fight’, ‘Must always wear blue’, ‘Must always eat outside', ‘Must always give shelter to anyone that asks for it’, etc,. These can frequently be used by the GM to good effect against the character (for example, an enemy may approach the character and ask for shelter, and he must give it!).

 

Good Gesa are sometimes not so easy to model. Particularly ‘Death’ Gesa. Some characters have a peculiar defence, such as, ‘Cannot die during daylight hours’, ‘Cannot be killed in battle’, ‘Can only be slain under a full moon’, ‘Will die on a Thursday, out in the open, during a thunderstorm, by a man carrying a gold spear!’ Frequently, characters in Celtic myths do not know their own Death Gesa, so do not act to take advantage of them, whereas some do know their own Gesa, and act in a paranoid manner when it looks like it is beginning to come to pass!

I am going to award one of the PC’s with a Celtic Gesa, bestowed upon him by the Celtic Gods due to services rendered, and I’d like some help in modelling it and costing it.

 

His Gesa is as follows: “He can not be slain indoors in a place he is residing.â€

 

Basically he cannot be killed in his own home, plus I’m hoping he won’t realise it too quickly, but it includes any place that he will be sleeping in, ie, a hotel room (but not anywhere else in the hotel), a hospital ward which he is using, a tent, a caravan, a friends house that he is sleeping over at, etc,.

I have considered:

1) Regeneration, only to work in the circumstances that are relevant, and only to restore him from ‘death’ to 1 BODY,

2) Resistant Damage Reduction 75% for PD and ED, only to work in the circumstances that are relevant, but may not necessarily prevent death (no Invulnerability power or 100% DR!)

3) Extra BODY, only to avoid death, again only to work in the circumstances that are relevant, but may not necessarily prevent death, just how much extra BODY is needed to survive Dr. Destroyers latest weapon of mass destruction?

 

I am currently favouring option ‘1’, does anyone have any alternate, or better suggestions?

 

Thanks for your help. :-)

[James Gillen]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

Luck, given that this is dealing with Fate and Destiny (plus which it allows the circumstances to be GM's call).

 

JG

[CourtFool]

How to do this Boston Celtics myth power?

 

I think your best bet is Healing - Resurrection since he could still take damage and be knocked unconscious.

 

You could also do

 

111 +100 BODY (200 Active Points) No Figured Characteristics (-½), Only Indoors in a Place He Is Residing (-2) (57 Real Points) plus 75% Resistant PD Damage Reduction (60 Active Points) BODY Only (½), Only Indoors in a Place He Is Residing (-2) (27 Real Points) plus 75% Resistant ED Damage Reduction (60 Active Points) BODY Only (½), Only Indoors in a Place He Is Residing (-2) (27 Real Points)

 

or

 

60 Desolidification Affects Physical World (+2), Invisible Power Effects (All Sense Groups, +1), Inherent (+¼), Persistent (+½), Reduced Endurance (0 END, +½) (210 Active Points) Cannot Pass Through Solid Objects (-½), Only Indoors in a Place He Is Residing (-2)

[Guest WhammeWhamme]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

10 Perk: Pre-Destined Death

[Susano]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

One way to do it would to give the character a large amount of either Armor or Damage Resistance, plus 75% Damage Reduction, with a Limitation of "Not versus X Attack." Thus, if the character has the Gesa of "Cannot Be Killed By Arrows" Then the character needs around 12-18 DEF Armor and DR that works "Only Versus Arrows." This might be a -1 Lim, as it means the character can be killed by axes, knives, spears, swords, a sling stone, and so on. If he can only be killed by a naked man holding a 20' spear of gold in a hailstorm... well, there's no limitation there, our guy is effectively unkillable (at least, until that one guy arrives at that one time!).

 

PS: An upcoming DH article will have a Celtic Myth character of mine. He come in at around 450 points of Celtic whup-ass.

[Sean Waters]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

First off, do you want the character to be unaffected by fatal attacks or just to, somehow, 'miraculously' survice them?

 

Also, what sort of campaign is it and what sort of points are you using? In a 'straight' fantasy campaign you could have (depending on the type of magic attack you might expect) a reasonable total of armour and power defence (and, possibly, life support) limited to only work in dwelling place.

 

Unfortunately, this being the HERO system, there's always a way around defences: I'd go for resurrection regeneration with sfx that you just stand there looking dazed after a 'fatal' attack, until you are well enough to carry on (or whatever).

 

Even that might not cover all the bases...what would happen (for example) if someone tried to teleport the character from their home into outer space: a fatal attack, but the actual dying happens elsewhere...

[Sean Waters]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

For a really interesting variant, how about a triggered summon?

 

Not yourself (that approach has been discredited) but some powerful supernatural entity that keeps you alive/resurrects you/protects you when things get hairy.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

The Healing: Resurrection seems the easiest option. You could go with a resurrection kludge used in older editions, being Summon - the character himself (back from the grave), Triggered by the character's death. Wth an auto-resetting trigger, and limited by where he dies, this could solve the problem.

 

I think the bigger question, as others have pointed out, is precisely how the ability will work. Can the character be KO'd, down to -100 BOD without this ability, but still hale, hearty and ready to fight? Or would he be comatose, possibly take hours, days or weeks to recover, but eventually get back up again? Very different abilities would be needed to simulate the former, than to simulate the latter.

 

I do like the idea of Luck, limited to prevention of death (-2) in a place where he is residing (say -1). As James Gillen points out, this leaves the results entirely in the GM's court. WhammeWhamme's perk has a certain appeal as well - it's simple to assess, straightforward and requires no special costing out.

 

I also think you need to assess the mechanics. Must the character be in the place he is residing to be protected? If so, it's pretty easy to remove him. ["Well, he would have survived, but the paramedics moved him to an ambulance" ] Maybe "Cannot die from any attack initiated against him in a place where he resides"? That would solve Sean's Teleport dilemma. That particular possibility indicates Luck, rather than Healing, would be most appropriate. {"luckily, a passing spacecraft...). That, or a VPP with no control over the powers gains, and the powers act only to prevent death in a place of residence (which can take Luck as a last-ditch attempt), but that's a pretty point-heavy approach.

[Half Baked]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

I'd go with lots of Luck (Only when in place he is residing, -1 to -2) as it models fate/destiny more accurately. Such prophecies about a person are common in myths and legends and they are not about being able to survive infinite amounts of damage. Rather, the character somehow avoids dying for any number of reasons. Maybe they miraculously dodge the fatal blow. Perhaps a god actually intervenes. However, they are almost always a double edged sword. The character rarely benefits from their geas. Their beloved may leap in the way of the fatal blow. The house maybe blown away by a terrible storm, leaving them vulnerable. The geas does not have to be a good thing and rarely is.

 

You might want to add the Side Effects limitation to model all the terrible things that might happen to ensure the geas remains true ;-)

[Static UK]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

As mentioned in the original post it is a Supers campaign. It uses the Standard Superhero template/ points etc,.

 

The character can still be hurt be hurt, just not killed. At the point were he would reach death (-22 BODY in his characters case), everyone would consider him to be dead (modern technology may be able to determine that he is still alive, and certain sensory powers, such as detect Life/ Bio-signs/ Read Aura and the like, certainly will). Interestingly, I have no idea what would happen if the character was fed through a meat grinder, disintegrated, or some other destructive event (such things never seemed to happen in the Celtic legends!), but as I'm the GM, I'll be sure to make sure it doesn't happen to him! I suppose I could always add the Regrow Limbs option too. :-)

 

So, currently, I am still leaning towards the Regeneration/ Ressurection option for the ability. Using the Damage Reduction implies that he cannot be hurt, which isn't true, but it would slow down the rate at which he was hurt. And I'm not sure how the Luck power would work in this case. The character is still hurt, he just fails to die for some reason. I suppose if I wanted the power to work so that he is invincible in combat in under the required circumstance these methods may work, but he is still vulnerable to the damage.

 

Needless to say I'm looking forward to the HERO Systems Celtic Myth books that are sheduled for the not too distant future, and see what I can use in my supers campaign!

 

Thanks for you inputs so far. Any more ideas?

[Sean Waters]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

I think the only way in a supers campaign (I'm sorry, I missed that in the original post) is to go with resurrection in some form: anything else and some sneaky bugger will find a way around it. To be safe, you'd best make it inherent and buy scads of power defence to prevent transformations.

 

If you're the GM, though, I'd be inclined to simply arrange things so that the character never dies at home. Depends how overt you want the Celtic Magic to be.

 

I had an NPC charater once, only 'power' was that he was immortal. He'd been around a long time and had some pretty impressive skill totals when he was not drunk, but the game called for him to keep turning up at opportune moments, know some relvant stuff and, basically, despite the lack of superpowers, would never, ever be beaten in a fight; he just had too much experience.

 

Whenever he got attacked, he'd find some way to win. He'd dodge, roll with punch, block, and find some way to throw the scrapper off the building, lure the flier into crashing into a wall, or convince the brick that it just wan't worth all the effort.

 

To be perfectly honest with you, and given that I KNEW the character was never going to lose a fight, I didn't even bother writing up a character sheet. I just used dramatic description and fake dice rolls and no one caught on.

 

If the character is an NPC, I would recommend this approach.

 

If the character is a PC, I'd pick a number you feel is realistic (say 10 to 50 points depending on frequency), and stick on the character sheet - basically treat it as a sort of expensive, specialised life support:

 

35 Gesa: character cannot be killed at home

 

The trouble with modelling it with other powers is that some monkey will find a way around it, or something unexpected happens. Hero does not do absolutes well, but does do them, and Life Support is the example that springs to mind. If the power is just the way you 'feel' it should happen, at a reasonable and appropriate cost, then everyone should be happy.

[Dust Raven]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

Sounds like a job for extra BODY, only to prevent death, only in a place character resides. Then just buy a LOT of it! I figure in a supers game, both of those Limitation are a -2, so for 16 points you can have +40 BODY that only applies when at Negative BODY to keep the character from actually dying. To top it off, a small Healing (Regen) that only applies when at negative BODY and only applies versus damage taken while in his place of residence. This will allow him to take massive amounts of damage and even be unconscious, but within a few minutes he'll be just fine (still injured, but fine). You'll never need the Ressurection Adder, since the charcter never actually dies. A 1 BODY/Turn regen-healing effect would cost (Only At Negative BODY and Only In Place Of Residence are both -2) 3 points, for a total of 19 points for this particular Gesa. More if you want him to heal faster or have more BODY vs dying. These will vary depending on the type of amount of damage being dished out in your campaign.

[gojira]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

Just my two bucks (inflation) that I like the Perk idea best, with Luck being a close second.

 

I think the easiest way for the GM to implement this (the Perk or Luck) is just by fiat. Attacked in your home? The GM just rules that you don't die. A police officer arrives on the scene and resuscitates you. You are taken to the hospital and you're ok. Seriously messed up, but ok.

 

You don't need a power, per se. In fact I think a lot of the constructs above are easy for a player to abuse and unbalancing. All you need is a GM who's a good story teller.

[Static UK]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

Sean, you have all but turned my mind around with the Life Support idea! I never thought of that one. :-) If total immunity to biological and Chemical poisons is worth 10+10= 20 points, then I think that is a good starting point. Although, I may model it as a Regeneration power with all the necessary limitations, then just call it Life Support, I don't envisage it costing many points, due to the restictiveness of the ability, after all not many super battles actually take place in the characters home... (unless he starts sleeping in the teams base! ;-) ) Now, is life support automatically inherant? I'll check my rulebook tonight. :-)

 

Fortunately the player in question isn't one for rule bending, so he is unlikely to try and work it to his advantage anymore than any one would knowing that they are safe from death in their own home. He also has a comedic streak, so I can imagine him trying to work out how many teleport jumps it would take him to reach home when he is severely hurt.

 

Thanks everyone for their ideas.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

Hmm. I was thinking of a Desolid - triggered by a blow that would cause the death of the character. The down side of this is that an affect desolid attack would circumvent it but it would provide the last gasp death prevention.

 

I might - as Sean suggested - see how much this power - or another that you liked cost and then buy a Perk for that cost.

 

 

Doc

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

I ran a Epic Celtic Myth campaign for FH a few years back, and I handled Geasa mainly using the Luck model, as it seemed to fit with the thematic style of the myths in question. Howeveer, it really depends on the flavor you're going for. Some of the more outlandish sources allow for more "super"-ish death geis...the stading there with a bunch of arrows sticking out of you style. The main reason for my chiming in is on the other side... bad geasa (bans) can be modeled really well as Susceptibility, with Unluck replacing the damage. In every case from the sources, breaking a personal geis leads to the dire dice of destiny landing on the hero with both sixes down, often with fatal results. Neither Psyches nor Physicals seem to have the same effect. Some of the more moderate lesser geasa could be handled as social limitations, but its a case by case basis. The celts had a fairly complex heirarchy of behavoir based on geasa, and some trumped others.

And yeah, the spelling gets wonky. I just kinda picked a source for my gaelic and kept with it.

[Vanguard00]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

I might not be as knowledgeable about my Celtic mythology as some, but I don't know that I've ever heard of a 'good geas' in any of the stories I've read. It sounds more like prophecy, which can always be subverted. For it to be a 'geas' like you've described there would have to be negative consequences for breaking such a geas, and I can't think of a single thing bad about not dying where one sleeps.

 

I'd simply contrive ways to keep the character alive if/when he's ever attacked in his own home (last-minute saves, doctor on hand, etc), but it's not a 'geas' in the traditional sense.

[prestidigitator]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

How about a Power with a Trigger that is fed off of some Precognitive Clairsentience, so the Trigger can take effect whenever an attack would have killed the character? At that point, you could Trigger just about anything that could save him/her. You could even use a VPP for the job, but Desolidification (still affected by attacks that cover the whole dwelling or some such) would work well, or my favorite for the occaision: Extra Dimensional Movement.

 

P.S. - Oh, BTW, you could actually buy it through the home (Base) itself to save some points. It actually makes sense in this case.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

I might not be as knowledgeable about my Celtic mythology as some, but I don't know that I've ever heard of a 'good geas' in any of the stories I've read. It sounds more like prophecy, which can always be subverted. For it to be a 'geas' like you've described there would have to be negative consequences for breaking such a geas, and I can't think of a single thing bad about not dying where one sleeps.

 

I'd simply contrive ways to keep the character alive if/when he's ever attacked in his own home (last-minute saves, doctor on hand, etc), but it's not a 'geas' in the traditional sense.

 

Basically, I agree with you, at least on the surface.. so I decided to look it up

 

*busts out Gaelic dictionary*

 

geas, ges n. f. spell, taboo, charm E. Ir. geis, ban, tabu

 

GURPS Celtic Myth really addressed the idea of "good" geasa, such as the Death Geas (You will die by the hand of a woman type thing). Its easy to get messed up thinking only in terms of Bans... all geasa in the source materials are prophecy, in effect. A childs Geasa were revealed by the druids shortly after birth, and as life went on, others could be earned, accepted freely (I swear I will NEVER drink whiskey again ) laid upon one by another, or otherwise gained. These will have varing degrees of effect on a characters life. Good sources for examples of how they can play in a game can be found in most of Morgan Llywelyn's books (Red Branch and Finn MacCool get top marks, as well as Last Prince of Ireland, tho its long past the Epic age) as well as an excellent if somewhat obscure novel by Risa Aratyr called Hunter of the Light which deals with geasa as a ongoing plot device (this is a book I consider almost a must read for a epic celtic campaign) While I can't really think of any point in the source materials to point specifically at the term geas to imply a good prophecy, it seems a reasonable application of the word. Could be a translation issue from way back, in fact... English has words for charm, spell, prophecy and the llike, but we didn't get taboo into our lexicon till much later (its an islander word, after all).

heh..my train of thought is derailing... this is good enough for now...I'm gonna keep pondering.

[Static UK]

Re: How to do this Celtic myth power?

 

Thanks, AmadanNaBriona, I too have used the GURPS Celtic Myth book for a lot of inspiration for some characters. I also have a few other RPG books, such as an old AD&D 'historical Earth' sourcebook, and White Wolf's British based sourcebook for fearie folk. I've read one of Morgan Llywelyn's books, and I loved it, but I will have to look up Risa Aratyr's Hunter of the Light, it sounds interesting too.

 

With regard to the modelling of the Gesa, I want other characters to see his character be hurt, and to bleed, and if enough damage is done, he will appear to be dead to all but those with special life sign detection sensory abilities. The character is not immune to the damage, he just doesn't die. Paramedic rolls will not be able to help bring him back to life. Basically, the character dies, and then the Gesa kicks in it's 'blessing' (ie the Life Support/ Regeneration takes effect). However, I do believe that some of the ideas mentioned above will be useful for modelling other Death Gesa'a, as not all of these Gesa work in the same way, AmadanNaBriona has already mentioned the arrows sticking out of the body look.

 

Gesa are not necessarily a curse either. It is something that you are, usually, born with, but as has already been mentioned, you can be 'cursed' with one by somebody else, or even take one voluntarilly. The variety of bad Gesa, can be modelled in many different ways, but Social Lim is a favourite because for many they have anti-social effects. Some of these Gesa have to be modelled by more than one disadvantage to cover the options.

 

I'm looking forward to the Celtic themed HERO releases to see how they deal with the weirdness that is Celtic myth.