Question from a new GM

[Glupii]

Our Hero expert had to stop playing for a while so I am left to try and keep the game going and I will be the first to admit, the holes in my knowledge of the Hero rules are plentiful and vast. So I come here to ask the experts.

 

I have a character in my game that needs to buy flight but make it usable by others, sort of like when green lantern picks up everyone in his green bubble and flies with them. How do I set up that power? I read the usable by others advantage and it didn't seem to address this, it was like they had to pay the endurance for it, not the initial character. This doesn't seem to fit. Thoughts?

[sinanju]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Our Hero expert had to stop playing for a while so I am left to try and keep the game going and I will be the first to admit, the holes in my knowledge of the Hero rules are plentiful and vast. So I come here to ask the experts.

 

I have a character in my game that needs to buy flight but make it usable by others, sort of like when green lantern picks up everyone in his green bubble and flies with them. How do I set up that power? I read the usable by others advantage and it didn't seem to address this, it was like they had to pay the endurance for it, not the initial character. This doesn't seem to fit. Thoughts?

 

How about Area-Effect TK (with enough strength to hold them all). They gather around, he generates his bubble of energy around them and they all go zooming off together, with him in control--since HE'S flying, he's just carrying them along.

[Ghost Archer]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

One of my players had much the same idea. Her power is gravity control. The problem with TK is that a character with a STR greater than the STR of the TK, can get out. So . . .

 

Gravity Cancellation: Flight 5", Ranged (+1/2), No Normal Defense (Flight or Gravitic Powers; +1), Usable As Attack (x65,536 maximum weight per inanimate target; ; +5); Vertical Movement Only (-1/2)

 

In her case she can only move something, all be it a very HEAVY something, up or down, just to counteract gravity. In one scenario, she was on a date with her brick boy-friend, sailing down the Seine on one of those cruise boats when the boat was taken over by terrorists. They blew the bottom out of the boat at one point and she used her powers to keep it from sinking. Trouble was she couldn't move it away from the river. Her boy-friend grabbed the anchor chain and leaped to shore then pulled it in. Paris police were a little upset about the boat blocking traffic for a while but they saved quite a few lives. Not bad for a first date.

[Glupii]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Valuable info, but I think a little different than what he is looking for. He is looking to make a giant paper airplane that can carry several passengers. I guess the TK would work since it is not a cage of any kind. It is quite voluntary.

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Could go a different angle and make the paper airplane a vehicle or summoned "creature".

[Dr. Anomaly]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Our Hero expert had to stop playing for a while so I am left to try and keep the game going and I will be the first to admit, the holes in my knowledge of the Hero rules are plentiful and vast. So I come here to ask the experts.

 

I have a character in my game that needs to buy flight but make it usable by others, sort of like when green lantern picks up everyone in his green bubble and flies with them. How do I set up that power? I read the usable by others advantage and it didn't seem to address this, it was like they had to pay the endurance for it, not the initial character. This doesn't seem to fit. Thoughts?

Just use the example of the "Gift of Flight" spell, which you've already seen, and put Reduced END (0 END) as part of the "gift". It will still cost the original character END to create/start the flight for others, but it won't cost the others any END to use it themselves.

[Glupii]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Just use the example of the "Gift of Flight" spell' date=' which you've already seen, and put Reduced END (0 END) as part of the "gift". It will still cost the original character END to create/start the flight for others, but it won't cost the others any END to use it themselves.[/quote']

 

OK I plead ignorance here, what is the "Gift of Flight"? Where is it? In a book or another post? Unfortunatly I do not have my books with me here at work so if it is in one of those I will have to wait until I get home to check them out unless someone has them posted somewhere.

 

Thanks for the help. And if ever my questions seem too basic, I appologize ahead of time. I am a old d20/D&D player trying his best to convert over to Hero. And you know what they say about old dogs . . .

 

ARF!

[Dr. Anomaly]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

OK I plead ignorance here, what is the "Gift of Flight"? Where is it? In a book or another post? Unfortunatly I do not have my books with me here at work so if it is in one of those I will have to wait until I get home to check them out unless someone has them posted somewhere.

 

Thanks for the help. And if ever my questions seem too basic, I appologize ahead of time. I am a old d20/D&D player trying his best to convert over to Hero. And you know what they say about old dogs . . .

 

ARF!

Sorry for not mentioning the source; mea culpa. When you said you'd read the "Usable On Others" Advantage description, I just assumed you'd seen it. It's on page 177, right-hand column of the 5th Edition rule book. I don't know what the page number would be for 5th Edition Revised, since I don't have it yet.

[Dr. Anomaly]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Here's a version of it, modified so the person using the flight doesn't pay any END:

 

Base Power: Flight 10", 0 END (+½) (30 Active Points)

 

That 30 points becomes the Base Cost for the Usable On Others Power.

 

Gift of Flight: Usable On Other (+¼) (37 Active Points); OAF Magic Wand (-1), Gestures (-¼), Incantations (-¼), Requires a Magic Roll (-½). Total Cost: 12 points (after applying the Advantages and Limitations to a 30 point Power)

 

The person who can grant the 10" 0 END Flight to others pays 12 points for this ability. He must have his wand, gesture, incant, and make his Skill Roll in order to grant the Power to someone else. (And it costs him 4 END to grant the Power to another person.) Once he's granted it to someone else, though, they can use it at their will, it costs them 0 END (because that Advantage was included in the cost) and they aren't subject to the limitations of needing a wand, to gesture & incant, or make a Magic roll.

 

As you can see, the person who can grant the Flight ability is only paying points for the costs of the Advantages & Limitations of being able to grant the Flight, not for the Flight itself...quite a bargain!

 

Also the character should not be able to grant that flight ability to himself, because it's far too cheap to do it this way instead of just buying it straight. Plus, it's Usable On Others, not self.

 

Of course if the magic wand, gestures, etc. aren't appropriate for the character you're thinking about, just replaces those limitations with ones more suitable, and adjust the cost accordingly.

[Glupii]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Excellant! This is going in the right direction, I can feel it. But I am not sure where the 4 points of End comes from that the character gets for granting it to others?

 

Also what would you think of a limitation on the granted power that they have no control since they have to go where ever the Main Hero guides the plane to?

[Dr. Anomaly]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Excellant! This is going in the right direction, I can feel it. But I am not sure where the 4 points of End comes from that the character gets for granting it to others?

 

Also what would you think of a limitation on the granted power that they have no control since they have to go where ever the Main Hero guides the plane to?

It costs the grantor 4 points of END to grant the Flight to someone else since the "grant" ability is a 37 Active Point power. END cost is figured at 1 END per 10 Active Points, so 37/10 = 3.7 = 4 END.

 

As for the "No Control" thing...hmmm...

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

I've usually done this kind of mass flight in a manner similar to:

 

Flight, Useable Against Others, Area Effect, with the defense against the UAA being Density Increase or Phys Lim: Extra Mass, or simply not wanting to go along. There's nothing that says you can't use a UAA power on yourself (as far as I know), so you just target yourself with the power, fly, and take everybody else with you.

[Guest C--]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Buy a Force Wall. Have everyone stand on it. Pick it up with your TK (or Str, or whatever) and fly away.

[Agent333]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Buy a Force Wall. Have everyone stand on it. Pick it up with your TK (or Str' date=' or whatever) and fly away. [/quote']

 

Beat me to it!

[Mister E]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Buy a Force Wall. Have everyone stand on it. Pick it up with your TK (or Str' date=' or whatever) and fly away. [/quote']

 

This might sound silly, but you can't stand on a Force Wall, or an Entangle barrier. However, you can use Transform to create objects to stand on. And I'm pretty sure you can't use Telekinesis to pick yourself up, or carry other people along, while you fly.

 

This is my idea:

 

Basically, you are enabling a number of people to voluntarily fly along with you, on your "giant paper airplane." Which is pretty cool! Gliding might seem more realistic, but Flight is more thematically enchanting. The Flying Carpet found in the "Ultimate Vehicle" has a SPD of 4, and 30" of Flight. That equals 120" per Turn. Assuming your Player's character has a SPD of 5, I think 24" of Flight would be good. The neat thing about the "Usable On Others" advantage, is that it is naturally No Range... which means that anyone that wants to use it, has to stay within one hex of you, (like they are standing on the Giant Paper Airplane with you). Usable Simultaneously means your passangers can jump off any time they want to. Where as, Usable As Attack leaves them at your mercy. I would just buy the power to 0 END cost, to simplify the whole thing, making it "effortless" to create and control. The bummer with this, it that you can't "Push" the power, anymore.

 

(There really does need to be a version of Usable On Others, where the primary character with the Power, pays for all the END...)

 

There is a cool new Power Limitation on pg. 100 of the "UNTIL Superpowers Database," called Physical Manifestation (-1/4). Here is the write-up:

 

Physical Manifestation (-1/4)

This Limitation signifies a power that, while not built as a Focus or the like, has some physical embodiment that other characters can attack. Examples include a Flight bought to simulate riding a column of force or skating along an ice-slide.

 

When a character applies this Limitation to the power, he must difine the exact nature of the physical manifestation; this requires the GM's approval and may involve applying other Limitations to the power. Treat the manifestation like a Breakable Focus for purposes of determining its DEF and BODY; it has a DCV equal to the character's base DCV (i.e. is calculated from DEX, with no other modifiers).

 

And here is my idea of how to build a giant paper airplane that can carry up to 4 other people:

 

Giant Paper Airplane: Flight 24", Usable On Others (Usable Simultaneously, +1/2), 4x Targets (+1/2), Reduced Endurance (0 END, +1/2)(120 Active Points); Physical Manifestation (giant paper airplane, -1/4). Total cost: 96 points.

 

This is kind of steep, at 96 points, but this would be my dream version of this power.

 

An option, would be to assume that it takes effort for everyone to hang onto the airplane, (which is reasonable), and that they need to hold on with one hand, (making Extra Limbs actually useful):

 

Giant Paper Airplane: Flight 24", Usable On Others (Usable Simultaneously, +1/2), 4x Targets (+1/2)(96 Active Points); Physical Manifestation (giant paper airplane, -1/4), Gestures (characters must hold on with one hand Continuously, -1/2). Total cost: 55 points.

 

 

To lower the costs even more, you could slow it down, and reduce the number of passengers. This is might actually be a good thing, because it gives the player's character room to grow, with future Experience Points.

 

Now, just as a thought... is the character making a "force" giant paper airplane... or is he actually making a giant paper airplane out of "paper", using mysterious Origami-like "Paper-TK" powers? The powers I have made so far, using the new Physical Manifestation Limitation, would be for the "force" version, or something like it, where the materials of available paper are not required. But, if he needs to have loads of paper in the vacinaty in order to pull this stunt off, then this power should have the Focus Limitation instead... unless, of course, you want to be able to create your own paper out of thin air... then you are back to using Physical Manifestation.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

This might sound silly, but you can't stand on a Force Wall...

 

Odd, since the rules for a Horizontal force wall are found on p180-181 of 5er...

[JmOz]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Giant paper airplane...cool

 

Summon 100% loyal

 

Build the thing as a vehicle

[MitchellS]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

If the character is creating an airplane that everyone gets in and then it flies, I'd go with summon airplane [because there are a lot of effects that go with an airplane like life support]. If the character just forms something like an airplane around the others then I'd go with the area effect telekinesis or the force wall. Each each person gets their own small airplane then I'd go with flight, ubo [because ubo doesn't mean everyone needs to stay together].

[Mister E]

Re: Question from a new GM

 

Odd' date=' since the rules for a Horizontal force wall are found on p180-181 of 5er...[/quote']

 

I stand corrected. Sorry, I don't have the new book, yet. I was going off the statement in the old book, pg.109, "Character's cannot use Entangles to create objects other than barriers (such as bridges, or stairs); to do that, use Transform." ... and pg. 117, "However, moving Force Walls have 0 STR - they cannot be used for pushing people aside or performing Move Throughs." As you can see, it would have been easy for me to make the mistaken assumptions I did.

 

I'm so ashamed...