MisterBaldy Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 I am starting work on my High Plains Hero campaign...which is going to be my setting for Western Hero. I am planning on setting the game in Texas (a few years prior to attack on The Alamo). I am also trying to capture the "Gritty Western" feel of such movies as Catlow, A Fistful Of Dollars, etc. What I am looking for is any information for the Hero System, or for that matter historical information (especially website-based) and such to aid me in the work I am trying to do. I have access to the following "gaming materials" right now... Western Hero GURPS: Old West Boot Hill RPG (by TSR) Any additional help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfjack Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 Re: High Plains Hero You got it! I played in a PBeM once, playing a character that was a half-Indian lawman (and Indian lawmakers did exist - see links below) by the name of Elijah Lighthorse. One of the best PBeM's I was ever in. I love playing in a Western environment! As part of my research, I looked at everything from saddle parts to horse breeds to Indian history. Here's some of the links I gathered: Mustangs: http://www.mustang-horses.org/ Old West Slang: http://www.freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~poindexterfamily/OldWestSlang.html Pintos: http://www.pinto-horses.org/ Saddle parts: http://www.sugarcreeksaddlery.com/parts.htm The PBEM Game itself: http://home.earthlink.net/%7Ecaledre/index.html A ranch: http://%20www.dz-ranch.com/ Horse Sense, a Writer's Guide to Horses: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~poindexterfamily/M7HorseSense.html Indian Police: http://www.coax.net/people/lwf/fip_pt1.htm Let me know if these work for you. I may be able to dig up some more! Best... Lee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Obvious Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 Re: High Plains Hero Your local library probably has some reference books intended for writers, but are easily applicable to gaming. I am currently reading through Everyday Life in the 1800s: A Guide for Writers, Students & Historians, and it is an excellent source for slang, clothing (including what was fashionable when), money, food, medicine, travel...all kinds of nice details. I've also seen some writer's guides that dealt more specifically to the Wild West and to Native American life, as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savinien Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Hey, MISTER! Baldy! You still working on this? I'm intrigued and wouldn't mind brainstorming if you're interested... Anyone else playing a western hero campaign? If so, is it more cinematic, or realistic? Do you allow gun-fu? Are characters heroic, or higher in starting points? I'd like to see some discussion on the merits of either. Do you think it is 'in genre' to make called headshots in the Western genre? Where do you limit combat skill or penalty skill levels, or do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuestionMan Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Deadlands by Alderac Entertainment Group Gunslingers by Gold Rush Games Cheers QM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savinien Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Deadlands by Alderac Entertainment Group Gunslingers by Gold Rush Games Cheers QM Thanks... Anyone actually want to DISCUSS these things as opposed to steering me towards books I either already have, or don't? Wanted to see what Herodom might have to say about it, wax philosophical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Deadlands by Alderac Entertainment Group Deadlands is actually by Pinnacle Entertainment Group (now known as Great White Games). PEG was associated with AEG for a while, but even then DL didn't come out under the AEG imprint AFAIK. Great game. I loved getting to write for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuestionMan Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero What was the topic of discussion and its goal? Western RPGs Hero System 5th Edition, Revised "Western Hero" Product Release Genre Book or Campaign Setting Iron Mongery - Pepper Boxes to Sharpes Rifles Campaigns vs. Adventures Cross Genre Western RPGs Deadlands Steampunk Victorian Samurai & Six Guns Periods of Western RPGs Colonial Expansion American War of Independence Mexican-American War Civil War Wild Wild West Please be sepcific and then I can contribute more than just sending to the information. Cheers QM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savinien Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Hey, MISTER! Baldy! You still working on this? I'm intrigued and wouldn't mind brainstorming if you're interested... Anyone else playing a western hero campaign? If so, is it more cinematic, or realistic? Do you allow gun-fu? Are characters heroic, or higher in starting points? I'd like to see some discussion on the merits of either. Do you think it is 'in genre' to make called headshots in the Western genre? Where do you limit combat skill or penalty skill levels, or do you? Please see bolded points of discussion/questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuestionMan Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Cinematic vs. Realistic Western Hero Campaigns I think needs a Poll, but I would always want it to be Cinematic. I would allow everyone the use of Martial Arts Style like; Gun Fu, Way of the Gun, etc... I have no problem with PC's making Called Shots. Penalty Skill levels vs. Hit Locations sound like a great way of maintaining Game Balance. Especially if you apply other Modifiers (Range, Movement, Cover, etc...) I would definitely try for good game balance, but then again and I would certainly want the PC's to stay in character and in the mood. Cheers QM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadmaster Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Anyone else playing a western hero campaign? I've been in one, had fun but unfortunately the GM was primarily a Champions player which caused the demise of the game, Champions genre conventions don't translate into westerns well. The end came when the bad guys set up the classic High noon meet you in the street gun fight, but were actually setting up an ambush. We had a pretty good idea that was coming from prior encounters, but when we made plans to counter the ambush the GM got angry and accused us of using non-game knowledge and refused to let us set up one PC on a roof top with a rifle (a rather common staple of the western genre), as a result the PC's were all gunned down like dogs when gunmen opened up from roof tops on either side of the street. Really was a pathetic end to what had been a rather fun game. Unfortunately that experience soured many on the genre. If so, is it more cinematic, or realistic? I prefer something in the middle, no gunning down a dozen baddies with 6 shots but on the other hand I don't really want pure realism either, PCs dying from infections after that fight is not that fun. Movies like Silvarado, The Outlaw Josey Wales, The Professionals, Wyatt Earp, or Tombstone, are good examples of what I'd like to play in. Do you allow gun-fu? Depends on what you mean by gun fu? In limited examples yes, I think it is part of the genre. So shooting off a hangmans noose or shooting a coin in mid air sure I would consider that, but where it starts to fringe on swashbuckling moves no. Are characters heroic, or higher in starting points? I think the 50+50 or 75+75 is about right I'd like to see some discussion on the merits of either. I just like the very competent but not superhuman level of playing, sorry its not deeper han that. Do you think it is 'in genre' to make called headshots in the Western genre? Called shots are only appropriate in limited situations, shooting a hand to take a prisoner in alive would be one, head shots have their place but I wouldn't encourage regular use of them. Where do you limit combat skill or penalty skill levels, or do you? 4-6 levels seems about right, a little higher might be appropriate for specific character types though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roter Baron Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero I think a "straight" cinematic setting (high-action, optimistic, high point-level, but not crossing into other genres like werewolves, zombies, steam-punk) is best if you have only 1 to 3 player (4 at most), because I'd guess that they turn out to be more or less variations of the "Silent Stranger"-type pf gunman. Good,if there are only a few players becaus eup to three of these tough-as-nails-desperadoes don't steal each others thunder AND you can virtually shower them with low-powered badguy. Would be basically a Dark Champions campaign - if not in theme then in feel. I'd prefer a low power, realistic campaign in which a showdown is something that is the high-end of an adventure and in which a drawn colf means that you are going to die if you are not ducking or faster. There you also have the chance to integrate more characters with different concepts and because an OCv of 5 would mean "experienced with a gun" you have points for other skills but have to think before because you don't have any points left for something not directly corresponding to your concept (as miner, trapper, Indian scout, cowboy etc.). And a gunslinger would be A GUNSLINGER - good with the gun and not good for anything else (in concept). I ran a campaign 10 years ago - was fun. Unfortunately I ran out of ideas. But my players liked it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Just OOC, what measures (if any) are you going to take to reduce lethality? The genre doesn't allow much in the way of resistant defenses, after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThothAmon Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Anyone else playing a western hero campaign? Played. If so, is it more cinematic, or realistic? Cinematic. Do you allow gun-fu? No ranged martial arts but plenty of trickshots etc. Are characters heroic, or higher in starting points? 75 + 75. Special 'talents' allowed on a per-character basis. Do you think it is 'in genre' to make called headshots in the Western genre? Yes, if the character is a hardened killer MWNN type. Everybody may want to be the badass gunslinger but there can only be a very few. Where do you limit combat skill or penalty skill levels, or do you? Let the points do the limiting. Psychopathic characters with 8 skill levels in Pistols are the province of the GM. Player characters are much more rounded. If you can't fight, you are in trouble; if you have no skills, you are dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmadanNaBriona Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Just OOC' date=' what measures (if any) are you going to take to reduce lethality? The genre doesn't allow much in the way of resistant defenses, after all.[/quote'] I just answered this in another thread... Crosspost time.... I was looking at the High Plains Hero thread and pondering the question of firearms lethality in a Western Hero campaign... Historically, headshots weren't all that common, 'cause folks usually aimed for the chest, precisely because a large, heavy, soft lead ball fired from a black powder pistol doesn't have a whole mess of penetrating power. If you look at some of the period photographs of dead criminals, post shootout, you'll see most of them literally RIDDLED with bullets. This could be considered a campaign or weapon specific use of the "real black powder weapon" limitation to reflect low velcocity attacks... say, at a range further than DC x the number of Hands the weapon uses (to reflect the increased power associated with longer barrels in black power guns) in inches attacks are considered Reduced Penetration, and, just as you suggest, certain locations have 1-2 rPD on an activation roll. I'd actually just redo the location chart to show the integral armor and its associated Activation roll... I'd go with much lower activation rolls to represent deflection... A solid straight-on hit to the skull might still do full BODY, even if the shot fails to penetrate. I'd go with something like this... 2rPD: Upper/Rear Skull (Activation 14-,locations 3-4), Shoulderblades (only from rear, activation 12-, location 9) 1rPD: Front skull/jaw(activation 11-, location 5), Ribcage (Locations 10-11, Act.13- & Location 13, Act. 11- bacause some vital organs are very protected and some very exposed) Combined with 1-2 rPD heavy clothing (canvas, denim & leather), aforementioned reduced pen past pointblank range, and building the guns appropriately (most period heavier guns would only MAYBE gain a DC above the average.... but they would increase the STUN Mod), and you'd have a pretty good ability to replicate Western "History" OK, so that was a bit genre specific... but I think the idea does have merit. Added complexity, as always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadmaster Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Just OOC' date=' what measures (if any) are you going to take to reduce lethality? The genre doesn't allow much in the way of resistant defenses, after all.[/quote'] Well for one thing attacks will be weaker, the biggest badest handgun likely to be encountered is the .44 Walker Dragoon which would most likely be a 1 1/2d6 +1 Stn attack, that was a fairly rare and very large pistol, most would be 1d6 to 1d6+1 and +0 or +1 stn. Rifles would be a bit higher but are also far less common in the genre, or at least they are less common where characters feel compelled to stand in the open. Personally I would think encouraging PCs to take lots of body, and then getting them to dodge alot would help. Also staying away from the optional rules for making combat more dangerous, and you would see a fairly large decrease in the leathality without it feeling like you were removing the danger. Of course most of the genre supports the whole quick and the dead type mentality so PC's better be fast or at least not adverse to cheating when called for (the old derringer up the sleeve). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savinien Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Just OOC' date=' what measures (if any) are you going to take to reduce lethality? The genre doesn't allow much in the way of resistant defenses, after all.[/quote'] For us... We want it to be lethal as I think we're leaning towards more grit than cinematic. If smokewagons get pulled... someone is going to get hurt. 1 level of Combat Luck is allowed, but not stackable with cover, nor anything else, for that matter. So, lethality is an issue, and also what brought me to the question of CSLs and the question of genre for headshot. I think I agree. How often in any of the genre mediums do you see the protagonist aim for the head? I can think of twice in Young Guns and they were sort of 'out of combat' situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mastermind Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero Thank you all for your feedback. I will be running the Old West Game of which Savinen speaks. Setting: Denver, circa 1868 One of the themes I will be tackling is how the Denverites tackle survival after the Platte River Gold Rush of 1858 starts to peeter out. And of course the snub by Union Pacific to go through Chyenne intstead of Denver. I would like cinematic, but dark as well. Cinematic Grit? I think its possible. Pale Rider comes to mind. REH's Western Tales are also a good model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Patriot Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero My best advice for finding out information of what life was like back then is to go online to the historical society's webpage for the area you're interested in using. They'll have better information then what you can get anywhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero This thread has caused me to make at least five characters in my head already. And they will never see the light of game. Tragic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuestionMan Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero This thread has caused me to make at least five characters in my head already. And they will never see the light of game. Tragic. Then you better POST them here. Perhaps some one will adopt them into their game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savinien Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero This thread has caused me to make at least five characters in my head already. And they will never see the light of game. Tragic. There are openings for the game at Hero Central... But, you may be required to renounce your Ascended brethren, Tyrant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susano Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero For your consideration, I offer The Man With No Name.... http://surbrook.devermore.net/adaptionsmovie/man.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuestionMan Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero For your consideration, I offer The Man With No Name.... http://surbrook.devermore.net/adaptionsmovie/man.html You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Susano again. Damn you......... QM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susano Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 Re: High Plains Hero You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Susano again. Damn you......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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