Sociotard Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I've always wondered about this little feature in scifi film and literature. The robots are always immortal. If left to their own devices and supplied with power they will always live on. Now, why is that? Honestly, they're just computers with limbs, and computers aren't immortal. It's not even just obsolescence, they just stop working eventually. This and that get corroded by air, those bits and bobs slowly decay due to heat, and eventually the whole thing just quits. Then the fact that the computer is now obsolete prevents you from finding suitable replacement parts, and it's no longer good for anything. I mean, PC's have been in homes since the 1980's, and I don't know any of my peers with a computer as old as they are. A few with cars as old as they are, but no PC's. Granted, there's always one in a thousand that for one reason or another survives (I've known guys with commodores that still work) but those are exceptions. And yet the convention lives on. Data was immortal, as were R2D2, Marvin, and the kid from A.I. Do you make robots mortal in your campaigns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? I would - if a PC ever was one. My brothers doing lots of elec tech study and has many warning about metal migration (at the microscopic levels of computer chip wiring the passage of electrons actually does cause wear - it's similar to electoplating). As for Data - theoretically I believe his "we aren't ripping of Asimov"-brain, was optical, and was less likely to wear. Plus they have magic-level tech, so could always keep him fit as a fiddle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyrath Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Well, if a robot has a vital component break, it can be turned off until a replacement arrives (or is cobbled together out of materials at hand). It's not quite so easy to do that with a human being... Robots can also be upgraded piecemeal. obsolete parts can be swapped out for new up-to-date components. Even the personality and memory can be uploaded from the old RAM into the new. Remember Jenkins in Clifford Simak's CITY. Jenkin's birthday present was a lulu. A brand new robot body. This is my grandfather's ax. This is my grandfather's ax. My father replaced the ax-head. I replaced the ax-handle. This is my grandfather's ax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sociotard Posted November 4, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? They said Data's brain was positronic, whatever that means, other than magic. Good point about the possiblity of eventual part replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Positronic was Asimov's magic brain technology for robots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Anomaly Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Granted' date=' there's always one in a thousand that for one reason or another survives (I've known guys with commodores that still work) but those are exceptions.[/quote'] My c64 still works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithcurtis Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Computers wear out, but the data does not. I have files on my HD that go back four computers at least. As long as you can keep moving whatever makes the robot unique (forgoing the question of cybernetic souls and silicon heaven), I see no problem with reasonable immortality. Just keep replacing the hardware. As for maintaining storage, I have heard that holographic storage (in crystal?) is supposed to be amazingly long-lived. Keith "But then where do all the pocket calculators go?" Curtis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrojas Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? for a good example, Bycentenial Man starring Robin Williams paints a pretty good method by wich robots could live for ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karmakaze Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Ah, so it's really that AI's are immortal, and we assume that it will be transferrable as repairs are needed or upgrades become available... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancer Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Computers wear out, but the data does not. I have files on my HD that go back four computers at least. As long as you can keep moving whatever makes the robot unique (forgoing the question of cybernetic souls and silicon heaven), I see no problem with reasonable immortality. Just keep replacing the hardware. As for maintaining storage, I have heard that holographic storage (in crystal?) is supposed to be amazingly long-lived. Keith "But then where do all the pocket calculators go?" Curtis Just don't let the data get lost by having your only copy be on a not-quite-permanent obsolete medium. I am aware of several things on, for example, 1600 bpi half-inch magtape that were never migrated forward, mostly through negligence. Maybe the data are still readable, if you rebuild a reader... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithcurtis Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Excuse my tirade for a second Irojas. Bicentennial Man by Isaac Asimov. Book preceeded the movie by decades. Sorry, it's just personal tic. It's like saying "Elves are good fantasy characters. Orlando Bloom in Lord of the Rings demonstrates this." Tirade off. Keith "No offense meant" Curtis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrojas Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Sorry keith, perhaps i didnt express myself correctly... what i meant to imply is, in the movie, we see the character of Robin Williams going from upgrade to upgrade across generations, allowing him to live indefinitely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Seeman Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Bear in mind that the computers we use these days are built to breakdown. Much like the lightbulb, it is possible to develop one that never ever burns out. But if they made THOSE available to the public then we'd never have to replace any of our lightbulbs, or computers, and therefore the industries would suffer greatly. And that's my conspiracy theory for the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
APE Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? They bought the optional extended liftime warrenty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psm Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Actually, what surprises me is that in sci stories that take place in the future that humans aren't immortal. If there are scientist smart enough to create machines with sentient thought then there should be scientist smart enough to stop the aging process. Plus, I can tell you right now there would be a bigger push for that than making your iPod tell you, that you have horrible taste in music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrojas Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Crashlander series of books, Humans inmortals in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyrath Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Actually' date=' what surprises me is that in sci stories that take place in the future that humans aren't immortal. [/quote'] I remember an Alan E. Nourse short story where they were trying to stop people from being immortal. The nightmare was: Imagine Strom Thurmond. Immortal. Politics and other areas with people in power quickly become hide-bound and fossilized. Forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KA. Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? As others have said or implied, I think that the fact that robots are built, rather than born, makes them functionally immortal. Think of your car. A part breaks, you replace the part, the car goes on. Assuming that your car had a 'personality' stored in some type of memory, and that memory could be backed up, restored, transferred, etc., then your car could go on forever. Now imagine that your car has free will, and the ability to repair itself (extensible arms or something). It would go on forever, as long as the parts are available. KA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inu Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? I dunno about data being immortal... what about crashes? Random errors to data storage media? A few wrongs bits of data written could crash the whole system. Or jostling it around too much might physically corrupt things. Current data storage is prone to that kind of thing, even if it's just a tiny chance. By the time you get up to magic-tech like Data, sure, you've got something akin to the human braind - multiple levels of redundancy and the ability to re-wire itself so that it could, theoretically, lose half its mass without losing much in the way of function. (which is nothing to do with the 10% fallacy) Basically, robots are immortal for the same reason that they're always super-strong: most sci-fi writers simply don't think. They go 'hey, mechanical limbs, they'd have to be really strong!' and so we end up with domestic servant-bots that are capable of crushing skulls with their bare hands. Or, worse, capable of leaping around like freakin' ninjas and high-kicking people. At least it's not as bad as people with cyberarms lifting cars. That's always funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithcurtis Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Sorry keith, perhaps i didnt express myself correctly... what i meant to imply is, in the movie, we see the character of Robin Williams going from upgrade to upgrade across generations, allowing him to live indefinitely. Sorry Irojas, I didn't want to seem to be picking on you. I just felt that although Mr. Williams may have been excellent and the movie may have been fantastic (I don't know; it's still on my to see list), the story and the concept should be credited to the creator. Keith "due credit" Curtis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithcurtis Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Inu, you've got it. Robots in sci fi are often super-men for no particular reason. Why overengineer to that point? C-3PO is in this respect a far more realistic robot (oddly enough). He has all the combat ability of a concussed girl scout, but he can translate like a walking Rosetta Stone. Why R2-D2 forgets he can fly, I don't know. Perhaps he's been talking too long to Daffy Duck. Keith "I wonder if that silly duck will remember..." Curtis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Obvious Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Maybe R2D2 can't fly any more, because he's getting worn out. Or maybe he's old and senile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psm Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Or perhaps the special effects budget didn't allow for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Squirrel Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? Bear in mind that the computers we use these days are built to breakdown. Much like the lightbulb, it is possible to develop one that never ever burns out. But if they made THOSE available to the public then we'd never have to replace any of our lightbulbs, or computers, and therefore the industries would suffer greatly. And that's my conspiracy theory for the day. It is like that with jean pants. It used to be you could buy a pair of jeans and it would last eight to ten years. Now a pair of jeans starts falling apart after a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithcurtis Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Re: Why are robots always immortal? And they shrink, too. Why the jeans I wore ten years ago wouldn't come close to... Never mind. Seriously, robots shouldn't be immortal. Hasn't anyone read John Campbell's Twilight? All those robots keeping all those fantastic cities running perfectly, repairing themselves, keeping all the lights going, the music playing, the plants watered... for no one. or Bradbury's "And there Shall Come Soft Rains" or Asimov's "The Last Question" Keith "OK, there might be some merit to keeping the last one immortal" Curtis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.