Freebooter Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 So I am picking up the GM hat for the first time and I need a little...okay, a lot of help. Settling down to research material for the campaing I have gone over The Ultimate X-Men and re-watched a few Episodes of X-Men Evolution. I figure these are the two best places to go for the feel of the campaign I am making. The players are going to be in the 250 point range as that is the level of power I am used to dealing with and I was wondering if anyone had, or could whip up a set of stats for a Sentinel type robot that could be a challenge for a group of 4 at that range of power. I was thinking at most they'd face three of them at once, so I don't want the robots to be overwhelming, but I do want them to be a challenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots I would suggest basing their capabilities on this interpretation of a "baseline" Sentinel model: http://www.angelfire.com/scifi2/mathew/cssentinel4.html Note that this writeup is based on 4E HERO, so there are a few minor design differences from 5E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jhamin Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Well, the first thing is to define exactly what they can do. Fly, pretty easy Fire energy blasts, we will talk about this in a second Detect Mutants, buy as a detect sense Really big, but don't change size, a physical limit reflecting this. You only buy Growth if you change size Strong, Tough, See below Other, individual Sentinals have had tentacle entangles, force fields, missiles, and spears. You can decide to give all Sentinals a suite of powers like this, but from time to time it is mentioned that the Sentinals modify themselves to better fight specific mutants. I would reflect this by giving them a gadget pool reflecting their individual anti-mutant modifications. Now here is where it gets hard to pin down. The Sentinals vary widely in power from appearence to appearence. In some encounters, the whole X-team piles on and manages to wear it down while it puts them through the wringer, often one shotting team members. In others, the X-Teams down Sentinal after Sentinal with one or two hits each but worry about getting worn down by the Sentinals! You are basically going to want to decide where on the scale you want your robots to be. If you want to have the team wear them down, make sure that their armor is set at a point where the player's best attacks do about 2 body after defences. Set body according to how long you want the fight to last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Really big, but don't change size, a physical limit reflecting this. You only buy Growth if you change size. Growth, Always On. That way you get the inherent limitations of being the size of a building. Fairly easy to be hit and all. Also fast and quick as opposed to just doing a PhysLim and having to buy down your DCV and whatnot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkwleisemann Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Growth, Always On isn't an acceptable build under standard 5E rules, something to keep in mind. If you don't care, then dandy, but it's right there on 118 of my pre-revised book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Schultz Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Yeah, but they're NPC's - ultimately, going through the exercise of writing one of 'em up is really just to get the numbers for how much damage they do, how hard they are to hit, and (roughly) how much of a challenge they pose to a group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots First off, my pre-FrEd isn't handy. I'm not driving 20 miles to get it. Growth, 0 End, Persistant, Always On. As a GM I regularly use builds that the book says "don't do" if it does what I want, in a manner that I can use to progress the story that is being told. Having gone through the sections on Growth, Advantages and Limitations in FrEd, I'm not seeing anything that says that it can't/shouldn't be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Guys, the Growth subject is a valid one, probably worthy of its own thread; but that probably isn't helping Freebooter with his request. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cypar7 Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots First, I really respect those who wish to do the research, and the put the effort into the game that it deserves. But why try to reinvent the wheel, just pull out the Conquerors, Killers and Crooks and use one of the fine robots in that tome. Tweak it the way you want. Don't own it, dust off Star Hero or the Bestiary and adapt one of those. Bruce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Obvious Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Isn't the Minuteman writeup in Champions Universe? It's basically a Sentinel. Same idea, anyway, even if powers don't match 100%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Steel Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots The minuteman robot hunts all superbeings not just mutants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirViss Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots The minuteman robot hunts all superbeings not just mutants. While this is true, they do concentrate on mutants. The IHA dislikes superhumans in general, but view mutants as a danger to the human race's dominance of the world. Anyway, whatever they hunt, they are still a good place to start to build a (Marvel) Sentinel robot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrosshairCollie Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Growth, 0 End, Persistant, Always On. As a GM I regularly use builds that the book says "don't do" if it does what I want, in a manner that I can use to progress the story that is being told. Having gone through the sections on Growth, Advantages and Limitations in FrEd, I'm not seeing anything that says that it can't/shouldn't be done. 1. Don't forget Inherent. 2. Did you look under Size powers? I know it's in 5th Edition somewhere that the Size powers are only for changing size ... though in looking at it, I'm choosing to override that rule, myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots No. There's a note buried in the growth section referring to pgs 125-27 or in the Appendix on page 573. Apparently there is also a similar one for density. Apparently someone that wrote the book didn't like the old method of doing it and decided 5th needed to have templates for size rather than using that build. I haven't done any point cost analysis to find out if there is any major bonus or onus to doing it either way. None of my player characters have bothered with size changers in the last 10 years and mine haven't shown up since I procurred 5th/FrEd. A lot of my characters haven't been fully converted up to 5th. Real life and the game being on hiatus for the foreseeable future. Seems that the Growth build is cleaner than the templates, to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrosshairCollie Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots No. There's a note buried in the growth section referring to pgs 125-27 or in the Appendix on page 573. Apparently there is also a similar one for density. Apparently someone that wrote the book didn't like the old method of doing it and decided 5th needed to have templates for size rather than using that build. I haven't done any point cost analysis to find out if there is any major bonus or onus to doing it either way. None of my player characters have bothered with size changers in the last 10 years and mine haven't shown up since I procurred 5th/FrEd. A lot of my characters haven't been fully converted up to 5th. Real life and the game being on hiatus for the foreseeable future. Seems that the Growth build is cleaner than the templates, to me. I can see both sides of it, myself. You're not really Grown, you just 'are' big, so you just buy the appropriate baseline statistics. It's kind of like just buying STR instead of a STR Aid when you're 'just strong', rather than 'getting strong', I suppose. That said, I hate having to look up the size templates whenever I make a character in HD, and I figure Growth, Inherent, Always On covers it just as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jhamin Posted June 22, 2006 Report Share Posted June 22, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots The real problem with persistant always on growth isn't so much the 50 foot robots or the 12 foot brick, it is with things like horses. If growth is the only way to make thing big, then giraffes and moose are suddenly more expensive than SWAT team officers. It gets even wonkier if you flip it around and look at shrinking. It is probably fine that Puck from Alpha Flight paid a few points for persistant shrinking, but when an infant costs more than his parents because he had to buy all his shrinking you know things aren't right. Then contemplate that fact that said infant gets cheaper as he grows up because he "loses his powers" as he gets bigger. I personally find the template system is just plain easier. Sure it's a second to look up the template, but after it it applied the character is easier to read, easier to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted June 22, 2006 Report Share Posted June 22, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots They don't get cheaper. The point value on the parents from the disad goes up as they tend to get into more trouble and they cost more money. It inherently balances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted June 22, 2006 Report Share Posted June 22, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots For those curious (all methods are based on growing to 50' tall) 5th edition method (1): Strait from the book (removing non growth abilities such as running, PRE, & ED) 62 points in abilities - 10 points in disads =52 points 5th edition method (2): No figured characteristics on str 52 points in abilities -10 points for disads =42 points 4th edition method (1): Growth with 0 end, persistant, always on, inherent, characteristics bought up to match strength 78 points 4th edition method (2): just the growth power, bought as above (No extra characteristics 45 points So the 5th edition way is cheaper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted June 22, 2006 Report Share Posted June 22, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Here is a giant robot I just wrote up, it will need to be seasoned for your players, but is a good starting point for you to go with Player: Giant Robot Model A-1 Val Char Cost 40 STR 30 20 DEX 30 0 CON -20 20 BODY 20 15 INT 5 0 EGO 0 20 PRE 10 10 COM 0 10 PD 21 10 ED 30 6 SPD 30 8 REC 0 0 END 0 6" RUN 0 0" SWIM -2 8" LEAP 0 Characteristics Cost: 154 Cost Power Robot Form 60 1) Automaton (Takes No STUN) 20 2) Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (20 Active Points) applied to STR 6 3) Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (6 Active Points) applied to Running 4 4) Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (4 Active Points) applied to Leaping 30 5) Damage Resistance (10 PD/10 ED) 50 6) Total Life Support (Including longevity) (50 Active Points) 40 Jet propulsion: Flight 10", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Variable Advantage (+1/4 Advantages; +1/2) (40 Active Points) [Notes: Variable Advantage is normaly used for various forms of Megascale (1"=10 m, 1" =100m, 1"=1km), hard to dispell, & usable underwater] 90 Weapon Systems: Multipower, 90-point reserve 9u 1) Energy Blasts: EB 12d6 (vs. ED), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points) 7u 2) Missile Launcher I: RKA 4d6 (vs. ED), Explosion (+1/2) (90 Active Points); 12 Charges (-1/4) 4u 3) Missile Launcher II: Entangle 4d6, 5 DEF, AOE (5" Radius; +1) (90 Active Points); 4 Charges (-1) 9u 4) Multi beam : EB 7d6 (vs. ED), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Variable Advantage (+1/2 Advantages; +1) (87 Active Points) Powers Cost: 329 Total Character Cost: 483 Pts. Disadvantage 15 Phys. Lim.: Machine Intelegence (Frequently, Greatly Impairing) 10 Phys. Lim.: 25' tall (-4 DCV, -4 to being spotted) (Frequently, Slightly Impairing) Disadvantage Points: 25 Base Points: 25 Experience Required: 403 Total Experience Available: 0 Experience Unspent: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted June 22, 2006 Report Share Posted June 22, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Sorry did not read the first post that well, the above robot is ment to be a singular challange for your group of 4, with out seeing what they can do it is a guestimation. a group of 4 should be able to take out 2 of the A-1's 60% of the time I figure, with good tactics being applied Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alverant Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots JmOz Small small suggestions 1) Add megaranged senses to go with the flight 2) Trade the 0END advantages for a 200 END/10 REC power plant 3) Sell off REC, otherwise they heal themselves BODY damage at a rate of 2 a week. 4) Remove/Reduce Longevitiy because even robot parts wear out eventually (use to buy megaranged sight) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted June 24, 2006 Report Share Posted June 24, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots JmOz Small small suggestions 1) Add megaranged senses to go with the flight 2) Trade the 0END advantages for a 200 END/10 REC power plant 3) Sell off REC, otherwise they heal themselves BODY damage at a rate of 2 a week. 4) Remove/Reduce Longevitiy because even robot parts wear out eventually (use to buy megaranged sight) All good sugestions, but it was just a quick thing I made up to help the original poster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted June 24, 2006 Report Share Posted June 24, 2006 Re: Sentinel Robots Here's a rough working idea I was playing with ... Val Char Cost Roll Notes 55 STR 45 20- Lift 51.2tons; 11d6 [5] 12 DEX 6 11- OCV: 4/DCV: 4 20 CON 20 13- 19 BODY 18 13- 12 INT 2 11- PER Roll 11- 0 EGO 0 9- ECV: 0 25 PRE 15 14- PRE Attack: 5d6 8 COM -1 11- 4+10 PD 0 Total: 4/14 PD (0/10 rPD) 4+10 ED 9 Total: 4/14 ED (0/10 rED) 4 SPD 18 Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12 15 REC 0 40 END 0 Total Characteristic Cost: 157 Movement: Running: 24"/48" Flight: 25"/200" Swimming: 2"/4" Cost Powers END 80 Adaptable Weapon System: Variable Power Pool (Nemesis Pool), 60 base + 20 control cost, (90 Active Points); all slots Must Follow a Power Detection roll (-½) 40 Booster Jets: Multipower, 40-point reserve 4u 1) Afterburners: Flight 10", MegaScale (1" = 1,000 km; +1) (40 Active Points) 4 4u 2) Cruise: Flight 15", x8 Noncombat (40 Active Points) 4 10 Closed Radio Circut: Radio Perception/Transmission (Radio Group) 25 Core Battery: Endurance Reserve (100 END, 15 REC) (25 Active Points) 60 Hard to Kill: Automaton (Takes No STUN) 45 Power Detection: Detect Power A Large Class Of Things 14- (Unusual Group), Discriminatory, Analyze, Increased Arc Of Perception (360 Degrees), Sense, Targeting, Tracking 20 Reach: Stretching 4" 2 45 Robotic Shell: Life Support (Eating: Character does not eat; Immunity All terrestrial poisons and chemical warfare agents; Immunity: All terrestrial diseases and biowarfare agents; Safe Environment: Zero Gravity; Safe in High Pressure; Safe in High Radiation; Safe in Intense Cold; Safe in Intense Heat; Safe in Low Pressure/Vacuum; Self-Contained Breathing; Sleeping: Character only has to sleep 8 hours per year) 90 Shell Plating: Armor (10 PD/10 ED) 54 Sturdy: Knockback Resistance -9" 5 UV Receptors: Ultraviolet Perception (Sight Group) Skills 24 Combat Programming: +3 with All Combat 16 Team Tactical Program: +3 with All Combat (24 Active Points); Requires A Teamwork Roll (-½) 11 Analyze: Power 15- 7 KS: Known Metahumans 16- 7 Teamwork 13- Total Powers & Skill Cost: 547 Total Cost: 704 200+ Disadvantages 25 Distinctive Features: Big, Honking Robot! (Not Concealable; Extreme Reaction; Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses) 20 Hunted: Primus 8- (As Pow, NCI, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find, Harshly Punish) 25 Hunted: UNTIL 11- (As Pow, NCI, PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find, Harshly Punish) 15 Physical Limitation: Huge (Frequently, Greatly Impairing) 20 Psychological Limitation: Subject to Orders (Common, Total) 20 Psychological Limitation: Hunts Metahumans (Common, Total) 15 Reputation: Bloodthirsty Hunters, 11- (Extreme) 10 Vulnerability: 1 ½ x BODY Magnetics (Common) 354 Hunter Bonus Total Disadvantage Points: 704 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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