Would you allow this mental power?

[Vestnik]

I'm building a character who senses the emotions of those around him.

 

Would you require this construction:

 

xd6 Telepathy, Area of Effect (Radius; +1), 0 END Cost (+1/2) (x Active Points), No Range (-1/2), Always On (-1/2), Only to Receive (-1/2), Emotions Only (-1/2)

 

Or this construction:

 

Detect Emotions (Mental Sense Group), Ranged, 360 Degrees, Functions as a Sense, Discriminatory (x Active Points), Mental Defense Applies (-1/2) (I'm not sure how this last Limitation would work)

 

?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

The second is a Detect; you could build a Limitation around the power itself, "Mental Defense Applies, each point of MD acts as a -1 penalty to the roll" or some such, or 2:1 or whatever makes you happy. I'm more inclined to go with the first one, although "only to receive" assumes that emotions are being 'broadcast.' So I would actually remove that, personally, and just build it as "Surface Thoughts" and then limit it again, "Only to Sense Emotions."

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

The second is a Detect; you could build a Limitation around the power itself' date=' "Mental Defense Applies, each point of MD acts as a -1 penalty to the roll" or some such, or 2:1 or whatever makes you happy. I'm more inclined to go with the first one, although "only to receive" assumes that emotions are being 'broadcast.' So I would actually remove that, personally, and just build it as "Surface Thoughts" and then limit it again, "Only to Sense Emotions."[/quote']

 

I thought "only to receive" was usual terminology for "can't send thoughts" (or emotions in this case)?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

I thought "only to receive" was usual terminology for "can't send thoughts" (or emotions in this case)?

 

IDHMBIFOM, so you may very well be right, but from my recollection, something needs to be sent. Sort of the difference between passive/active. I suppose I'm saying that my understanding (again, no text, so I may be completely off base) is that "only to receive" still requires someone to be sending something, and it's entirely possible that we are all constantly 'emitting' thoughts and this character is just picking up on them. Which, again, makes total and complete sense.

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Hmmm, I'm not liking this Telepathy option. It seems way too expensive for what it does.

 

4d6 Telepathy vs. Human, Alien and Animal Classes Of Minds, Area of Effect (8” radius;

+1 ¼), 0 END Cost (+1/2)

 

That's 96 Active Points! A 19d6 Energy Blast!

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Hmmm, I'm not liking this Telepathy option. It seems way too expensive for what it does.

 

4d6 Telepathy vs. Human, Alien and Animal Classes Of Minds, Area of Effect (8” radius;

+1 ¼), 0 END Cost (+1/2)

 

That's 96 Active Points! A 19d6 Energy Blast!

 

I think that's why I was leaning towards Detect: Emotions. Much cleaner, cheaper and more efficient. You can also dress it up however you like, and in this case the two builds are not equally valid; Detect seems to be the way to go. Much like Analyze: Motive for the d20 skill Sense Motive, you could also go with Analyze: Emotions if you really felt like, so long as the GM honks as he drives his Fiat by.

 

Excuse me. I'm asleep. Clearly I didn't know the math, because I very clearly said "Go with the first one" which is Telepathy, and that don't work. Not being intentionally contrary. Just half asleep.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

I'd definitely allow the second one, but the Mental Defense applies limitation would need to be defined before hand.

 

The first one there probably needs some more advantages before I would allow it to do what you want it to do, although you could probably get away with a well worded Trigger.

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Thanks guys. I think the second option is better (as well as being a heck of a lot cheaper!).

 

How does one determine the range on a ranged sense? Is it assumed to be line-of-sight?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Thanks guys. I think the second option is better (as well as being a heck of a lot cheaper!).

 

How does one determine the range on a ranged sense? Is it assumed to be line-of-sight?

 

Common Sense. Since you're perceiving "emotions" I would submit that it's a matter of the strength of the emotion. For example, I'd be hard to detect under normal circumstances, because I keep a lot of that locked up; you could say I have a "human" level of Mental Defense in this case, because I got good at it.

 

However, you put me near my brother, you'll pick up on a whole range of emotions very quickly and very powerfully. Near one of my co-workers, a whole nother set, but much more negative. So it's a matter of circumstance and what you could reasonably perceive. "Line of Sight" is likely much too far, since I would argue that Common & Dramatic sense play into it. i.e., knowing how someone is feeling is a matter of: Look, Voice Intonation, Body Language, Pacing of Speech, and so on. Were I to build it on the Heroic level, I may even slap Extra Time on it (Must observe target for one full phase, or longer).

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Common Sense. Since you're perceiving "emotions" I would submit that it's a matter of the strength of the emotion. For example, I'd be hard to detect under normal circumstances, because I keep a lot of that locked up; you could say I have a "human" level of Mental Defense in this case, because I got good at it.

 

However, you put me near my brother, you'll pick up on a whole range of emotions very quickly and very powerfully. Near one of my co-workers, a whole nother set, but much more negative. So it's a matter of circumstance and what you could reasonably perceive. "Line of Sight" is likely much too far, since I would argue that Common & Dramatic sense play into it. i.e., knowing how someone is feeling is a matter of: Look, Voice Intonation, Body Language, Pacing of Speech, and so on. Were I to build it on the Heroic level, I may even slap Extra Time on it (Must observe target for one full phase, or longer).

 

Oooh, very nice thoughts. Thanks.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Oooh' date=' very nice thoughts. Thanks.[/quote']

 

Not a problem. Were I not operating on borrowed time I'd have posted that sooner.

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

How about the following. The idea is that he reads his opponent's emotional state and thus is able to anticipate what the opponent's actions would be:

 

8 +2 with All Combat (16 Active Points), Only vs. Opponents with Minds and

Emotions (-1/2), Requires a Detect Emotions PER Roll (-1/2)

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

How about the following. The idea is that he reads his opponent's emotional state and thus is able to anticipate what the opponent's actions would be:

 

8 +2 with All Combat (16 Active Points), Only vs. Opponents with Minds and

Emotions (-1/2), Requires a Detect Emotions PER Roll (-1/2)

 

For my campaign you'd have some trouble justifying it, since everything short of an automaton has some sort of mind or emotion. I would likely suggest to you, my player, the following:

 

Only familiar minds (i.e., an 'alien' mind, such as Fae, Demon or Alien wouldn't count)

Only 'humans' & 'intelligent monsters,' on the argument that an animal doesn't really 'think' in combat terms. It's thinking of survival, so I don't know that for my purposes I would say that you're justified in taking a +2 in all combat against an alligator. It's a gator. It's probably hungry.

 

A human, however, will have a plan of some kind, most of the time, an objective, and a fighting style that you can 'feel' through subtle emotional shifts "I have him," "I need to fall back," "I'm afraid" "I'm triumphant!" "Oh, crap, I'm dying" and so on. Animals only get two: "ATTACK!" and "RUN!"

 

But again, that comes from the realism side of the argument. It's a perfectly legal construction, but wouldn't quite pass muster in my game.

[Bloodstone]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

How does one determine the range on a ranged sense? Is it assumed to be line-of-sight?

 

Not exactly no. It's left up to Dramatic Sense.

 

Ranged senses suffer the Range Modifier of course, so there is a practical limit just based on the penalties and bonuses.

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

For my campaign you'd have some trouble justifying it, since everything short of an automaton has some sort of mind or emotion. I would likely suggest to you, my player, the following:

 

Only familiar minds (i.e., an 'alien' mind, such as Fae, Demon or Alien wouldn't count)

Only 'humans' & 'intelligent monsters,' on the argument that an animal doesn't really 'think' in combat terms. It's thinking of survival, so I don't know that for my purposes I would say that you're justified in taking a +2 in all combat against an alligator. It's a gator. It's probably hungry.

 

A human, however, will have a plan of some kind, most of the time, an objective, and a fighting style that you can 'feel' through subtle emotional shifts "I have him," "I need to fall back," "I'm afraid" "I'm triumphant!" "Oh, crap, I'm dying" and so on. Animals only get two: "ATTACK!" and "RUN!"

 

But again, that comes from the realism side of the argument. It's a perfectly legal construction, but wouldn't quite pass muster in my game.

 

Hmm, I think it would depend on the intellectual sophistication of the animal. I think dogs can handle nervousness, confidence, etc. I suppose you're broadly right though. I think I'll nix it.

[Comic]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

The second build raises so many questions, so many of them complicated and difficult to resolve consistently that it proves for me the rule about two equally valid builds.

 

Of course, you could just go with 'Mind Scan' with the -1/4 Limitation "Does Not Work on Emotionless Minds", and the -1/4 "Must be Centered on Source" if you really intend it to be restricted to a bubble around the character with the power. The special effect is that you're sensing emotions. The Telepathy is then much, much less expensive, since it doesn't require AoE.

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

The second build raises so many questions, so many of them complicated and difficult to resolve consistently that it proves for me the rule about two equally valid builds.

 

Of course, you could just go with 'Mind Scan' with the -1/4 Limitation "Does Not Work on Emotionless Minds", and the -1/4 "Must be Centered on Source" if you really intend it to be restricted to a bubble around the character with the power. The special effect is that you're sensing emotions. The Telepathy is then much, much less expensive, since it doesn't require AoE.

 

Doesn't Mind Scan work on one mind at a time?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Doesn't Mind Scan work on one mind at a time?

 

That would warrant an AOE, then.

[Vestnik]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Hmmm, Mind Scan, Uncontrolled, Area Effect, Always On? Does that make any sense conceptually?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

Hmmm' date=' Mind Scan, Uncontrolled, Area Effect, Always On? Does that make any sense conceptually?[/quote']

 

Er... 'Uncontrolled' means you've spent a butt load of END on it and it's already powered. You most likely want it to be 'Persistent.' What most people think of when they say 'uncontrolled' is 'no conscious control.'

[pinecone]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

I'm building a character who senses the emotions of those around him.

 

Would you require this construction:

 

xd6 Telepathy, Area of Effect (Radius; +1), 0 END Cost (+1/2) (x Active Points), No Range (-1/2), Always On (-1/2), Only to Receive (-1/2), Emotions Only (-1/2)

 

Or this construction:

 

Detect Emotions (Mental Sense Group), Ranged, 360 Degrees, Functions as a Sense, Discriminatory (x Active Points), Mental Defense Applies (-1/2) (I'm not sure how this last Limitation would work)

 

?

Either one...but what is the disadd for always on? sure it's on the list, but how does it actually limit you?

Hmmm I'd give a -1 Per for every 3 pts of mental def.......Question: do you not sense things with no emotions? Or do you sense the absence?

[Kenn]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

I think the Detect is the better build then the telepathy. There may need to be some tweaks (like how much Mental Defense impacts the perception roll how much), but it's cleaner and less messy, and fewer dice than the Telepathy route. As a GM I'd also make it clear that there'd be situational modifiers. Just as a GM can say, "the room is poorly lit, all visual perception checks are at -4" he can say "Captain Halmades regularly reigns in his emotions, your roll is at -4."

 

I would not allow the combat levels based on this sense. Knowing that I'm angry at you, might tell you that I'm going to attack you. It isn't going to tell you that I'm going to try to punch you, draw a gun, or kick you in the "13". I could see using this ability to justify purchasing some Danger Sense (limited to immediate danger from beings with emotions, -1/4), though.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

For those of you with the USPD, look up the Aura Sense power. That's pretty much Detect Emotions in a nutshell.

 

I have a character with a very similar power construct in my Champs game right now, and we sat down and worked out just what such a power would detect and how. She can figure out what emotion a target is primarily feeling, though (obviously) not what has spawned said emotion. Hers is bought 'Human class of minds only' and 'blocked by Mental Defense', as a side note.

[Pensativa]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

She also can't shut it off, which is why she prefers the company of people WITH mental defense.

[BNakagawa]

Re: Would you allow this mental power?

 

I'm having a little trouble figuring out how being able to detect emotions leads to increased abilities in combat.

 

I can see how it might alert you to the presence of someone with immanent hostilities on their mind, but once combat has been started, isn't it pretty obvious that the person trying to insert a sharp piece of metal in you has fairly malevolent emotions towards you?

 

Knowing that Mike Tyson is four feet away from you and feeling intense anger is useful, but I don't know how it's going to help me not get pummeled.

 

Now, on the other hand, if the power worked in the opposite direction, and you could make your opponent feel an emotion you generated, as opposed to you being able to detect theirs, I could see that having an effect on combat. A demoralized opponent is less likely to be operating at peak efficiency. A sympathetic opponent might feel hostile towards you and purposefully miss. A bored opponent might get sidetracked.