Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

What about an RKA' date=' NND Does BOD. That gets past armor, and Hero doesn't have the same issue with hit point inflation, so an attack that gets 20 - 40 BOD through on average is likely to be fatal to pretty much anything. You can limit it to do no STUN and reduce the cost that way, if desired.[/quote']

 

Actually, Hugh, that's a phenomenal build for that spell.

 

20 Disintegration: Killing Attack - Ranged 2d6+1, Does BODY (+1), Attack Versus Limited Defense (Power Defense; +1 1/2) (122 Active Points); 1 Charge (-2), Requires A Transmutation Roll (-1/2), Spell (Transmutation; -1/2), OIF Expendable (Easy to obtain new Focus; A lodestone and a pinch of dust. ; -1/2), No STUN (-1/2), Limited Range (Medium Range (25"); -1/4), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), Beam (-1/4)

 

Went from NND to AVLD (slightly cheaper & I thought Power Defense should apply in this setting). Everything else I kept; this would be a 7th Level Compliant version; while it doesn't look like much on the surface, a few CSLs and a Haymaker could get it up to 4d6 1/2, or an average of 15 BODY or so, which should kill, oh. Just about anyone, even if they aren't entirely disintegrated in one shot. If I push it outside of the 'compliant' range (upwards of 120 AP) then certainly, it could annihilate almost anything.

 

Scary stuff. Thanks, Hugh!

[Bygoneyrs]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Hey for myself I liked D&D v3.5 d20 system, but decided after Traveller Hero and

PAH came out, that I refused to be bothered with v4 for D&D and since all my

three campaigns now oficially can use Hero System...I will redesign and rebuild

them all using Hero!

 

Penn

[eternal_sage]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

i've currently converting Warlords of the Accordlands (with lots of thanks to Killer Shrike and Thia, since about half the work was already done for me) and Eberron, since otherwise my group has no use for 20 sided dice.

 

its turning out really well (plus giving me the impeteus to fix a few things that have always bothered me about them, Talenta Plains, i'm looking at you!). after thats done i got nothing but nWoD and SR4th left.

[Alibear]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Hero works for me.

[mallet]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Hero is pretty much the best system for me. My players would be a lot happier if there was a way of "prettying-up" the character sheets & power builds. I mean just look at this from a few posts up:

 

20 Disintegration: Killing Attack - Ranged 2d6+1, Does BODY (+1), Attack Versus Limited Defense (Power Defense; +1 1/2) (122 Active Points); 1 Charge (-2), Requires A Transmutation Roll (-1/2), Spell (Transmutation; -1/2), OIF Expendable (Easy to obtain new Focus; A lodestone and a pinch of dust. ; -1/2), No STUN (-1/2), Limited Range (Medium Range (25"); -1/4), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), Beam (-1/4)

 

That's a hell of a lot of crunch for one spell. Now imagine putting 20 of those on a character sheet.

 

Now if there was a nice, easy, way of condensing all of that, that would still get the important information across (and could be printed out on HeroDesigner). My Players would be a lot happier and so would I.

[Querysphinx]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

The thing I love about Champions is that while building an obnoxious disintegration spell may be difficult and take up half a page. Actually using it is usually pretty easy. And all the information you need to play the character is right there on the sheet.

 

(Okay. I admit I had one player who resorted to a rolodex to keep track of all his spells, but he was, shall we say, enthusiastic about creating them.)

 

In D&D (The last time I played it was called AD&D) all you have on your character sheet is the word "Disintegrate" the actual rules for the thing were locked up in the player's handbook.

[Ocelot]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

... My players would be a lot happier if there was a way of "prettying-up" the character sheets & power builds. I mean just look at this from a few posts up:

 

20 Disintegration: [EDIT: blah blah blah]

 

That's a hell of a lot of crunch for one spell. Now imagine putting 20 of those on a character sheet.

 

Now if there was a nice, easy, way of condensing all of that, that would still get the important information across (and could be printed out on HeroDesigner). My Players would be a lot happier and so would I.

 

(Okay. I admit I had one player who resorted to a rolodex to keep track of all his spells, but he was, shall we say, enthusiastic about creating them.)

 

In D&D (The last time I played it was called AD&D) all you have on your character sheet is the word "Disintegrate" the actual rules for the thing were locked up in the player's handbook.

 

This is actually how I roll. Since I create most of the spells for my campaigns, I just have a list, and character sheets list the spells they have. There's a reference sheet for what the spells do in HERO terms, in case the characters REALLY need to know, but since my play-style is more verbal than miniature based, all you really need is a name and some familiarization.

 

YMMV.

[Hyper-Man]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Hero is pretty much the best system for me. My players would be a lot happier if there was a way of "prettying-up" the character sheets & power builds. I mean just look at this from a few posts up:

 

20 Disintegration: Killing Attack - Ranged 2d6+1, Does BODY (+1), Attack Versus Limited Defense (Power Defense; +1 1/2) (122 Active Points); 1 Charge (-2), Requires A Transmutation Roll (-1/2), Spell (Transmutation; -1/2), OIF Expendable (Easy to obtain new Focus; A lodestone and a pinch of dust. ; -1/2), No STUN (-1/2), Limited Range (Medium Range (25"); -1/4), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), Beam (-1/4)

 

That's a hell of a lot of crunch for one spell. Now imagine putting 20 of those on a character sheet.

 

Now if there was a nice, easy, way of condensing all of that, that would still get the important information across (and could be printed out on HeroDesigner). My Players would be a lot happier and so would I.

 

I am pretty sure there at least a couple of different 'rules lite' export formats out there that do just that. You could then put a 'plain english' explanation of the spell in the 'Notes' section.

[eternal_sage]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

I am pretty sure there at least a couple of different 'rules lite' export formats out there that do just that. You could then put a 'plain english' explanation of the spell in the 'Notes' section.

 

thats exactly the way i do it, actually. i just write up the spells and print off the "tome of spells" that contains the actual rules if we need them. my asian game worked really well that way, as does the Star Wars game i run, which has no "HERO-ese" on the sheet at all. its all plain english, and it really helps keep it simple and moving along.

 

and all the rules are not on the sheet full of HERO-ese either, as the rules for duplication (for instance) still have to be looked up if you don't recall how they work, or exactly what this or that adder/lim/advantage does. so its clutter for the sake of clutter, in my opinion. the gears don't have to show just so you know they work, they can work just fine without the end user knowing why.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

I have been using Hero with my group who are not Hero people and more comfortable with D20 (I know!) and so I have an export format for Hero Designer that produces characters in a more D20 like format. I have changed aspects of the mechanics to accommodate this and to reduce the variety of numbers in the game.

 

Been some work to add material to the notes of powers but well worth it for the response it got from the players.

 

Will see if I can get an example up here later but the skin is attached for HD experimenters.

 

 

Doc

[Knightgoblin]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Doc Democracy, that looks pretty cool. So do you have or can you do a more M & M Simpson's four color character sheet looking one? .....I know thats a mouth full. I might stand a chance on converting some of my friends to HERO this way.

Flashy colors help for a good sale sometimes.

[Doc Democracy]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Doc Democracy, that looks pretty cool. So do you have or can you do a more M & M Simpson's four color character sheet looking one? .....I know thats a mouth full. I might stand a chance on converting some of my friends to HERO this way.

Flashy colors help for a good sale sometimes.

 

It was Shem Whistler who used to frequent the boards who did this. I think that I would have to be committing to running to a Hero superheroes game to commit the time.

 

If I can dig out the time I will see what I can do (or whether Shem would be willing to do it for me! )

 

No promises thought - real life is causing major time suckage at the moment...

 

 

Doc

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

The thing I love about Champions is that while building an obnoxious disintegration spell may be difficult and take up half a page. Actually using it is usually pretty easy. And all the information you need to play the character is right there on the sheet.

 

This is my argument exactly (and repp'd for it). When someone cast anything I hadn't freaking memorized, I spent five minutes looking it up, and another five minutes (in many cases) adjudicating it, not counting the extra couple of minutes determining saving throws with all the bonuses flying around. It's not that the math is hard; it's that it wasn't centralized. You look at the "crunch" in my Disintegration Spell, you know precisely what it does, without having to leaf through two paragraphs of text. I can just glance'n'go, as it were.

 

"Okay, this is... what'd I build that at? 2d6+1 AVLD Power Defense Does BODY? Okie doke. Do you have Power Defense?"

 

"ER..."

 

"Okay, he begins to cast a spell. He appears to be making a heavy effort, as well." (NPC has dedicated 6 Magic CSLs to become an extra 3 DC, and is Haymakering the attack, +2 DC, for a net of +5 DC killing, to a total of 12, or 4d6; all of this takes me about 2 seconds to figure out).

 

"Phase 4 ends, on Phase 5 a thin beam of green light springs from his hand and..."

 

"EFF THAT. I abort to Dive for Cover."

 

Who needs saving throws when you have Aborts?

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Well HERO is the ultimate gamer's toolkit, says so on the cover. So really the question, is a Gamer's toolkit = System?

[ghost-angel]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Well HERO is the ultimate gamer's toolkit' date=' says so on the cover. So really the question, is a Gamer's toolkit = System?[/quote']

 

It is a System - it is NOT a Game.

 

Most RPGs are both System & Game under one cover: rules + setting or genre.

 

The book just says "Here, have rules. Decide on a genre, and setting. We don't care what it is."

[Mr_Yuck]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

It is for me and those I game with.

I have retired all my other gaming material and now play only HERO.

[TSandman]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

And caps at 40d6. *boggle*

 

Now how the eff am I going to model that? A massive RKA AVLD Power Defense? A Transform? I know!

 

XDM!

 

Sory for being late to the Party....

 

... but for "Overpowered", you might take a look at McWOD (Monty Cook's World of Darkness)

 

Where an unopposed* LVL 20 mage can, with some forethought disintegrate a 800' radius AoE everywhere on earth, doing to everything in it 20D12 of Fire Damage, 20 D12 of Electrical Damage, 20 D12 of Sonic Damage and 20 D12 of Component (Mana) Damage.

 

Ok, you need to stock up on Mana for a day (the system won't let you stock more anyway) and you are *EXHAUSTED* afterwards... but Who cares!

 

The Sonic attack alone is, by their own scale at the "Krakatoa" level..

 

... Did I forget to mention that it's a VAMPIRIC Attack?

 

... And that's by rolling a "10" on a D20

 

 

Could you model that?

 

I think that even Galactic Champion would be afraid

 

 

* Opposed as in "Nobody to do counter-magic"

[ghost-angel]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

Sory for being late to the Party....

 

... but for "Overpowered", you might take a look at McWOD (Monty Cook's World of Darkness)

 

Where an unopposed* LVL 20 mage can, with some forethought disintegrate a 800' radius AoE everywhere on earth, doing to everything in it 20D12 of Fire Damage, 20 D12 of Electrical Damage, 20 D12 of Sonic Damage and 20 D12 of Component (Mana) Damage.

 

Ok, you need to stock up on Mana for a day (the system won't let you stock more anyway) and you are *EXHAUSTED* afterwards... but Who cares!

 

The Sonic attack alone is, by their own scale at the "Krakatoa" level..

 

... Did I forget to mention that it's a VAMPIRIC Attack?

 

... And that's by rolling a "10" on a D20

 

 

Could you model that?

 

I think that even Galactic Champion would be afraid

 

 

* Opposed as in "Nobody to do counter-magic"

 

F You And The Horse You Rode In On RKA; 40D6; Area Of Effect; Megaradius 1" = 1000km; Extra Time: 1 Day; No Range; Personal Immunity.

 

(it's about as stupidly unbalanced if not exactly right)

[TSandman]

Re: Is the Hero the Ultimate System?

 

F You And The Horse You Rode In On RKA; 40D6; Area Of Effect; Megaradius 1" = 1000km; Extra Time: 1 Day; No Range; Personal Immunity.

 

(it's about as stupidly unbalanced if not exactly right)

 

 

And about as usefull for PCs