archermoo Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? so as we wait patiently for the pdfs to become available online somewhere' date=' what were the significant changes to adjustment powers?[/quote'] The PDFs are available from the Hero Store currently. Separately, as a bundle of PDFs, and as a bundle with both books and both PDFs. At this point the books are still a preorder, waiting for them to get to the US and clear customs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobGreenwade Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? One thing I am intrigued by is what has happened to 'Heal Limbs' and 'Resurrection' - do they remain with healing or have they migrated? They're available for both Healing and Regeneration.Is there an elegant way to model my character who heals at the normal rate (in terms of recovering lost BODY), but regrows lost body parts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archermoo Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Is there an elegant way to model my character who heals at the normal rate (in terms of recovering lost BODY)' date=' but regrows lost body parts?[/quote'] I'd let you buy the "Regen Lost Limb" adder without actually buying any levels of Regen to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? did the total that you could give from Aid go away? in 5th ed you where limited to the max number that the dice could generate(1d6 maxed at 6pts 10d6 maxed at 60 pts trying to convert characters in Hero Designer(today's update)and not finding where to add to that max that was in HD for 5th ed will cross post to HD forums I will be getting 6th ed when it hits my FLGS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFleischmann Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Cheaper isn't always more conceptually apropos. Of course not. Cost has nothing to do with concept. Cost should equate to utility. And if 16 points worth of Regeneration is less useful than +2 rPD/rED/rPowD/rFD and +4 BODY for 16 points, that's a problem. How much Healing, Reduced Reset Time, Self Only can you get for 16 points? 3d6, Self Only is only 10, and you can always add Extre Time to make it even cheaper. Nothing wrong with the "concept" of Regeneration. It just needs to have the correct cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? did the total that you could give from Aid go away? in 5th ed you where limited to the max number that the dice could generate(1d6 maxed at 6pts 10d6 maxed at 60 pts trying to convert characters in Hero Designer(today's update)and not finding where to add to that max that was in HD for 5th ed will cross post to HD forums I will be getting 6th ed when it hits my FLGS I'm honestly not even sure where Increased Maximum Effect is covered, I couldn't find it on a really quick search of the books, and it's definitely not a core 6E Adder. So yes, it's effectively gone until it's reintroduced somewhere and Dan feels the need to re-add it to the 6E Ruleset in HD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Nothing wrong with the "concept" of Regeneration. It just needs to have the correct cost. The correct cost is influenced by genre and what design options are open/correct/allowed. In heroic games it tends to be worth more than in superheroic games due to limitations on design and, to some extension, genre conventions. Even a small amount of regeneration in some settings can prove potent in terms of how it impacts narrative and scenario design, even if it doesn't have a huge impace on individual combats. Additionally, comparing body and defense costs to regeneration doesn't provide a direct corollary to regeneration in terms of utility. The only real corollary is healing and recovery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? did the total that you could give from Aid go away? in 5th ed you where limited to the max number that the dice could generate(1d6 maxed at 6pts 10d6 maxed at 60 pts trying to convert characters in Hero Designer(today's update)and not finding where to add to that max that was in HD for 5th ed will cross post to HD forums I will be getting 6th ed when it hits my FLGS Alright, I found all the relevant rules - Increased Maximum Effect (5ER p106 under Maximum Effect) has been removed completely. Per 6E1 p136: you want more Effect, buy more Dice. After some consideration, I like the change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest steamteck Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Alright, I found all the relevant rules - Increased Maximum Effect (5ER p106 under Maximum Effect) has been removed completely. Per 6E1 p136: you want more Effect, buy more Dice. After some consideration, I like the change. My gut reaction is not me. It makes it more difficult to model some slow effect but high yield abilities seems to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? I always felt it was far too cheap to buy a very high maximum by using that plus a low number of dice. It also severely messed with Active Points IMO. My instinct is to either allow Cumulative to double the level bought, or add a Limitation that says only XD6 can be used at once. It also makes sense with the way some Adjustment Powers were changed. Absorption is no longer Roll D6 Based, leaving only Aid and Healing in the Positive Roll D6 aspect. Healing has it's own rules for maximum, leaving Aid. Which makes the rule almost completely superfluous. Perhaps the APG will re-introduce the idea for Aid, but only Aid would make sense at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjcurrie Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? I always felt it was far too cheap to buy a very high maximum by using that plus a low number of dice. It also severely messed with Active Points IMO. My instinct is to either allow Cumulative to double the level bought, or add a Limitation that says only XD6 can be used at once. It also makes sense with the way some Adjustment Powers were changed. Absorption is no longer Roll D6 Based, leaving only Aid and Healing in the Positive Roll D6 aspect. Healing has it's own rules for maximum, leaving Aid. Which makes the rule almost completely superfluous. Perhaps the APG will re-introduce the idea for Aid, but only Aid would make sense at this point. Can't you buy extra dice of Aid with the Limitation that they only increase the maximum but are not actually rollled? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFleischmann Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? The correct cost is influenced by genre and what design options are open/correct/allowed. In heroic games it tends to be worth more than in superheroic games due to limitations on design and' date=' to some extension, genre conventions.[/quote'] But is it worth more than a comparable amount of extra DEF, BODY, and.or Healing? Even a small amount of regeneration... ...is irrelevent to my point. As I already said, I have no problem with the cost of "a small amount of Regeneration." At the per week or per day level, it's just fine. Additionally, comparing body and defense costs to regeneration doesn't provide a direct corollary to regeneration in terms of utility. The only real corollary is healing and recovery. Is seems to correlate quite well to me. Regenerating guy spends 16 points on 1 BODY Regen/turn. Defensive guy spends 15 points on 5 PD/5 ED armor. Enemy has 2d6 HKA (up to 4d6 w/STR, but lets say it's only 2d6 total). RG and DG both take a hit. RG takes 7 BODY and gets it all back in 7 turns. DG takes 2 BODY and gets it back in a few weeks. RG and DG both take 2 hits. RG takes 14 BODY and gets it all back in 14 turns. DG takes 4 BODY and gets it back in about a month. RG and DG both take 4 hits. RG takes 28 BODY and gets it all back in 28 turns. DG takes 8 BODY and gets it all back in about 2 months. DG will survive. RG probably won't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Can't you buy extra dice of Aid with the Limitation that they only increase the maximum but are not actually rollled? That's what I would do, yes. I'd call that a -1 Limitation myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psistrike Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Cumulative [page 328 of 6thV1 PDF] does state this: 2x the amount of points that can be added for each additional +1/4. This means for +1/4 you can increase the maximum accumulated from equal to the max you can roll with the dice to twice than, +1/2 to 4x that, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? However, 6E1 pg142 states you shouldn't apply Cumulative to positive Adjustment Powers. So there's that catch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? DG will survive. RG probably won't. Which has nothing to do with what the powers actually do on a mechanical level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psistrike Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? However' date=' 6E1 pg142 states you shouldn't apply Cumulative to positive Adjustment Powers. So there's that catch.[/quote'] Darn, only skimmed through the book so far and didn't notice that. Only now starting to read through the 1st book, front to back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Cumulative is already in Aid in different form that form of Cumulative cannot be taken unless of course Dan missed something(unlikely) Does it give an example using Aid specifically? that would be the debate ender the character I was grandfathering has a few muse type songs that added combat and noncombat skill levels that were a slow build(1d6+1 to a max of 16 and 24 points now would need to be 20 and 30 pts) could also aid any stat/power up to 13pts that got lowered to 12 pts(now a 2d6 aid) the new area effect advantages all combined did lower the cost a good bit and even added more area for less advantage Cumulative [page 328 of 6thV1 PDF] does state this: 2x the amount of points that can be added for each additional +1/4. This means for +1/4 you can increase the maximum accumulated from equal to the max you can roll with the dice to twice than' date=' +1/2 to 4x that, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghost-angel Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? add a Limitation to your Aids: Only Half the Dice can be Rolled to determine Effect each use -1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? does not really help in a MP I can get 1 level which is still a big help I could go to a smaller type of CSL but the muse power was ment to be generic so it could help the whole team at once instead of having to help H t H vs the Ranged and yes this is Piety from the game we are both in GA I'm just seeing what a 6th ed conversion would look like I'm still playing her in 5th ed revised in 5th Piety is 261 pts in 6th Piety is 332 pts both her skill level muse songs now only add 1 level(10 pts) the fall off range for both her sound attacks went up to 20m(10 hexes)from 8 add a Limitation to your Aids: Only Half the Dice can be Rolled to determine Effect each use -1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kdansky Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Well, you (ab)used something that was pretty much borked in 5E, and with the switch to 6E, such characters have a hard time. I had a BBB Shapeshifter/Speed Aider which got quite difficult to rebuild in 5ER with less than nearly twice his original points. Solution? Change concept slightly and build the powers differently (limited characteristics instead of self only aid in my case). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tesuji Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? That's what I would do' date=' yes. I'd call that a -1 Limitation myself.[/quote'] or apply the 6e equivalent of gradual effect as well. either way there is now only one way to buy NET EFFECT not several and thats a good thing from consistency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megaplayboy Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? All I will say, after downloading and printing the PDFs, is: That is one weighty tome. This ruleset will take weeks if not months to mentally process/grok. And then the APG comes out. Oy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFleischmann Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? Which has nothing to do with what the powers actually do on a mechanical level. Right. It has to do with how useful they are. And how useful they are should determine their cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFleischmann Posted August 20, 2009 Report Share Posted August 20, 2009 Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers? However' date=' 6E1 pg142 states you shouldn't apply Cumulative to positive Adjustment Powers. So there's that catch.[/quote'] Waitaminute! Are you saying that negative Adjustment Powers are no longer cumulative? A 4d6 Drain can never remove more than 24 points no matter how many times you hit someone with it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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