6th Edition Question: New Powers?

[ghost-angel]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

the suggested book numbers are Legendary CVs of 8-10 and Superhuman of 11+

 

I like your numbers better though.

[Hierax]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

The thing with CVs is they really depend on CSLs.

[Vondy]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

the suggested book numbers are Legendary CVs of 8-10 and Superhuman of 11+

 

I like your numbers better though.

 

Have the characteristic bases been posted somewhere?

[megaplayboy]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

The thing with CVs is they really depend on CSLs.

 

yeah, that was the second half of my question. It seems reasonable to assume that, for most purposes, a "normal human" in a campaign where stat maxima exist shouldn't be able to use CSLs to attain CV levels that would be considered "superhuman" in that setting(at least not without paying double for them). So, if you have a base OCV of, say, 6, you shouldn't be able to add more than 4 CSLs without having to start paying more for the extra CV.

 

Just my opinion, anyway.

[Chris Goodwin]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Have the characteristic bases been posted somewhere?

 

3 for CVs, everything else is as it was in 5e (or, for the formerly figured, the base values if you had 10's in all of the primaries).

[Vondy]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

3 for CVs' date=' everything else is as it was in 5e (or, for the formerly figured, the base values if you had 10's in all of the primaries).[/quote']

 

Thanks.

[PhilFleischmann]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Regeneration seems way too expensive at the faster levels. 16 points for 1 BODY per turn?!? That's more than it costed in 4th!

 

For only 3 points, you can buy +1 rPD and +1 rED, which prevents you from taking that 1 BODY per *attack* in the first place. And for another 3 points, you can buy a point each of Resistant Flash and Power Defense, in case you're worried about exotic attacks that do killing damage. For the remaining 10 points, you could buy 3d6 Healing, Self Only. A much better use of 16 points.

 

Or assuming your combats don't last longer than 16 turns, you're better off just buying +16 BODY.

 

It seems fine at the low end, though.

 

Different topic:

 

For starting points, I would have preferred 300+100, rather than 325+75. Not just for the round numbers, but it's less of a radical change to go from 150 points of Disadvantages to only 75 points of Complications. Not a huge deal, though.

 

Another topic:

 

Damage Negation seems like nothing more than regular defenses with less randomness. Where's the fun in reducing the amount of dice you get to roll? I buy my powers so I can roll handfuls of dice, not to defeat anyone! Seriously though, this could be an interesting power, depending on the details.

 

One last topic:

 

Some of those recommended NCM limits seem a bit high to me. A normal person can leap 10 meters? It seems to me the CV limits should have been based on what they'd have been if they were still "figured" - i.e., 7 each. But not a big deal.

[Dr. MID-Nite]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Regeneration seems way too expensive at the faster levels. 16 points for 1 BODY per turn?!? That's more than it costed in 4th!

 

For only 3 points, you can buy +1 rPD and +1 rED, which prevents you from taking that 1 BODY per *attack* in the first place. And for another 3 points, you can buy a point each of Resistant Flash and Power Defense, in case you're worried about exotic attacks that do killing damage. For the remaining 10 points, you could buy 3d6 Healing, Self Only. A much better use of 16 points.

 

Or assuming your combats don't last longer than 16 turns, you're better off just buying +16 BODY.

 

It seems fine at the low end, though.

 

Different topic:

 

For starting points, I would have preferred 300+100, rather than 325+75. Not just for the round numbers, but it's less of a radical change to go from 150 points of Disadvantages to only 75 points of Complications. Not a huge deal, though.

 

Another topic:

 

Damage Negation seems like nothing more than regular defenses with less randomness. Where's the fun in reducing the amount of dice you get to roll? I buy my powers so I can roll handfuls of dice, not to defeat anyone! Seriously though, this could be an interesting power, depending on the details.

 

One last topic:

 

Some of those recommended NCM limits seem a bit high to me. A normal person can leap 10 meters? It seems to me the CV limits should have been based on what they'd have been if they were still "figured" - i.e., 7 each. But not a big deal.

 

RE: Damage Negation....well...for my part..I prefer it over damage reduction..less math involved...and for low level attacks..it saves me the time of having to roll dice at all....bullets vs. an obvious invulnerable sort...fire vs. the Human Torch..etc. the hard part is balancing Negation with the defenses you plan to give to the character in question....as Negation has the potential to be abusive...no doubt.

[nexus]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Does Damage Negation replace Damage Reduction?

[Jhamin]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Regeneration seems way too expensive at the faster levels. 16 points for 1 BODY per turn?!? That's more than it costed in 4th!

 

I was always pretty sure that it was undercosted in 4th.

 

I would also argue that body is body. Raising your resistant PD/ED may be cheaper, but it doesn't help against Does Body NNDs or other exotic attacks. It also doesn't help when you are up against the campaign limits for your defenses but still want to be tougher. Being able to recover 1 body a turn regardless of the source is a *big* deal in a game where your buddies are healing 1 body a week. I'm seeing lots of Fantasy Hero barbarians taking this at the 1body/day level.

 

 

 

So, with all the talk of Damage Negation, is Damage Reduction unchanged? I am hoping Negation complements rather than replaces it....

[rjcurrie]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Some of those recommended NCM limits seem a bit high to me. A normal person can leap 10 meters? It seems to me the CV limits should have been based on what they'd have been if they were still "figured" - i.e.' date=' 7 each. But not a big deal.[/quote']

 

The Leaping maximum hasn't changed. It was 5" which was 10m in 5E.

[rjcurrie]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

So' date=' with all the talk of Damage Negation, is Damage Reduction unchanged? I am hoping Negation complements rather than replaces it....[/quote']

 

Damage Reduction is unchanged.

[schir1964]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

That's flash. Darkness is 'obstruct sense'.

 

Mostly because vision isn't normally listed as a power. It also has some cost issues -- you'd need quite a lot of drain to do anything, at which point the blindness would last the entire combat.

 

Because darkness doesn't blind people -- it prevents them from seeing into or through an area. This is equivalent to being blind for people inside the area, but it's not equivalent for people outside the area.

 

...and there has been some confusion over how normal vision is 'built' and costed. It would certainly be a far less subtle tool.

 

A nice point. I suppose even an AoE constant flash would not prevent people seeing into and through the AoE if they were outside it. (Although there is some support fromt eh 'suppress' power that suggests that combination of modifiers can make powers work slightly differently.)

So based on this, a more correct name for this power would be "Block Sense" with two modes of operation: Personal and Area Effect.

 

The question then is to model the minor mechanical differences as modifiers: Duration and Lingering Effect.

 

I'll start a new thread to explore the possibilities.

 

- Christopher Mullins

[Beast]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

my bad

deleted

confused it with Phil's post of 4 body per month

[prestidigitator]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

if Regeneration starts at 2pts per month

you might as well buy Recovery as you get the same thing plus it also recovers End and Stun incombat

so it looks to be over costed by 1 level

it should start at the week level

 

Really? 'Cause...

 

Regeneration is 2 points per 1 BODY per 1 Week' date=' 4 points per 1 BODY per Day, ... 16 points per 1 BODY per Turn.[/quote']

 

BTW, that's like +4 Rec (so equivalent cost to 1 point per +2 Rec). So I guess the base level of Regeneration is equivalent to Rec with Only to Recover Body (-1).

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

I was always pretty sure that it was undercosted in 4th.

 

I would also argue that body is body. Raising your resistant PD/ED may be cheaper, but it doesn't help against Does Body NNDs or other exotic attacks. It also doesn't help when you are up against the campaign limits for your defenses but still want to be tougher. Being able to recover 1 body a turn regardless of the source is a *big* deal in a game where your buddies are healing 1 body a week. I'm seeing lots of Fantasy Hero barbarians taking this at the 1body/day level.

 

I find it rather expensive, although I agree it will see some action in fantasy games. The character who recovers quickly, but not so quickly you can watch as his wounds knit closed, seems likely to be more common now.

 

At the same time, the price of both REC and BOD have been halved, but the price of recovering 1 BOD per turn has doubled, so that's a relative quadrupling of the cost of that ability.

 

Is it worth it? That depends on the game. If BOD damage is rare and time between combats is lengthy, it's not going to be worth it. That probably describes many Supers games. But in games where BOD damage is more common, and the time between combats is limited, the ability will be well worth its cost. That probably covers a lot of fantasy and pulp games, for example.

 

Perhaps the "heals as fast as you can wound him" character is better designed with Healing and reduced reuse time than with Regeneration.

[Sean Waters]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Healing BODY 1d6, Decreased Re-use Duration (6 Hours; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2), Continuous (+1) (32 Active Points); Self Only (-1/2)

That's 21 points. You can add other limitations to bring the cost down but you could do that with regeneration too (like extra time to activate). Regeneration seems to be cheaper at first blush.

 

I'm not against Regeneration having a relatively high cost, but it is a design decision. The other option would be to have a very low cost (say 4 points per body per turn) and make it a semi-viable defence. I might have been inclined to go that way, personally: a character who can heal almost as quick as you can cut sounds cool....mind you you can probably do 'instant regeneration' with damage negation, so no biggie.

 

One thing I am intrigued by is what has happened to 'Heal Limbs' and 'Resurrection' - do they remain with healing or have they migrated?

[ghost-angel]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

I don't have the PDFs with me (forgot to load them onto my flash drive) but I believe they exist in both places. I'll have to double check when I get home.

[Jhamin]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

I'm not against Regeneration having a relatively high cost' date=' but it is a design decision. The other option would be to have a very low cost (say 4 points per body per turn) and make it a semi-viable defense.[/quote']

 

I can see the logic in that. Personally, I feel that for a universal system the choice they made was likely the correct one. Cheap regeneration is appropriate for some genres, but it is really undercosted for a lot of other others.

 

As you point out, when healing is so fast as to be instant it can be simulated other ways. Fast healing is really probably the better use for this power, and in a game where players actually lose body & don't have weeks of rest between fights, 10-15 points to get body back faster is well worth it.

[nexus]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Perhaps the "heals as fast as you can wound him" character is better designed with Healing and reduced reuse time than with Regeneration.

 

Or Defenses with Instant Healing as the sfx

[rjcurrie]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

One thing I am intrigued by is what has happened to 'Heal Limbs' and 'Resurrection' - do they remain with healing or have they migrated?

 

They're available for both Healing and Regeneration.

[PhilFleischmann]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

I was always pretty sure that it was undercosted in 4th.

Well, I was always pretty sure it was too expensive in 4th.

 

I would also argue that body is body. Raising your resistant PD/ED may be cheaper, but it doesn't help against Does Body NNDs or other exotic attacks. It also doesn't help when you are up against the campaign limits for your defenses but still want to be tougher. Being able to recover 1 body a turn regardless of the source is a *big* deal in a game where your buddies are healing 1 body a week. I'm seeing lots of Fantasy Hero barbarians taking this at the 1body/day level.

Yes, at the 1 BODY/day level, it's a fine buy. And how many "Does BODY NNDs" are you going to encounter in a Fantasy HERO game?

 

Apart from those, it's much cheaper and more effective to just buy more DEF - and not have taken the damage in the first place, rather than have to heal it back later.

 

Is the average FH character going to take more than 16 BODY damage in a day/adventure? If not, you're also probably better off buying extra BODY instead.

[Vondy]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

Cheaper isn't always more conceptually apropos.

[tesuji]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

so as we wait patiently for the pdfs to become available online somewhere, what were the significant changes to adjustment powers?

[Simon]

Re: 6th Edition Question: New Powers?

 

so as we wait patiently for the pdfs to become available online somewhere' date=' what were the significant changes to adjustment powers?[/quote']

Err....they are available for download (online store).