Ranxerox

...as will become obvious when the other six are found.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/lincoln-project-resurfaces-kellyanne-conway-tweet-calling-306-electoral-votes-historic/ar-BB1aZOpf?ocid=msedgdhp

You can often find them at dollar stores and save yourself 4 bucks.

No kidding.
 
But aside from the turnaround argument... all Trump does is push to change popular opinion.  This is a huge problem.  If you want tangible action on anything that isn't a naked power grab, this Presidency isn't the one to see it on.
 
But we need action now, on a lot of things.
 
I'm still not convinced the Electors won't flip their states anyway at the mere implication of what he's said.  I want to be hopeful, but.
 
(edit add) If anything, this administration has proven to me that 'good' won't win, and more specifically that the naked opportunity to take power is more valuable to these people than the shared stability of this country.
 
I've never seen an event like this in my lifetime.  A lot of people are hopeful, because they feel he speaks for them.  But his actions speak a hell of a lot louder to me than words, and that middle class tax cut is going to expire soon... and much of the changes he made can be interpreted as 'changing' the government, sure, but given his pattern of firings and replacements, it resembles make the government work for -me- a hell of a lot more. 😕
 
I don't think I'll live long enough to see the US get fixed from this damage, even if the repairs begin tomorrow.

Same here, considering I've had my hopes dashed at the last minute way too often.
 
In 2016, I went into such a rut after the election since I spent a lot of campaigning for Hillary Clinton. I started campaigning for Joe Biden relatively late for that reason. I got the same feeling I had four years ago on November 3, after Trump seemed to be leading in all the battleground states. Even after Biden pulled ahead, I wasn't able to relax until today. I was cautiously optimistic, but I didn't dare become hopeful. Now it feels like my work has paid off.
 
Not everything paid off, though. I worked mainly with the Texas Democrats, writing letters and sending texts. I personally sent over 3,000 text messages that last week. I knew that turning Texas blue was a long shot, but it's still disappointing to fall short.

I'm claiming the obvious joke.
 
"Mr Trump, you're fired!"

I'm claiming the obvious joke.
 
"Mr Trump, you're fired!"

I'm claiming the obvious joke.
 
"Mr Trump, you're fired!"

I'm claiming the obvious joke.
 
"Mr Trump, you're fired!"

I'm claiming the obvious joke.
 
"Mr Trump, you're fired!"

Hubby is now sporting a fever, despite precautions
 
MetroHealth is currently overwhelmed by calls right now so he can't schedule a test that way.

If it isn't too bad stay home, but don't be stoic.
 
Earlier in the pandemic, someone here (Old Man?) posted a chart of the differences in the treatments of people who survived serious Covid encounters and those who didn't.  The course of treatments were almost identical, but the survivors got the more aggressive treatments one day sooner.  Yep, that was it.  The doctors reaching for the big guns one day earlier in a significant number of cases made the difference between life and death.  How, we treat Covid has changed considerably in the months since that chart came out, but I would not be surprised if basic take away remains unchanged.  If things start to go south, do not hesitate to seek and demand aggressive treatment.  It can make a world of difference.

If it isn't too bad stay home, but don't be stoic.
 
Earlier in the pandemic, someone here (Old Man?) posted a chart of the differences in the treatments of people who survived serious Covid encounters and those who didn't.  The course of treatments were almost identical, but the survivors got the more aggressive treatments one day sooner.  Yep, that was it.  The doctors reaching for the big guns one day earlier in a significant number of cases made the difference between life and death.  How, we treat Covid has changed considerably in the months since that chart came out, but I would not be surprised if basic take away remains unchanged.  If things start to go south, do not hesitate to seek and demand aggressive treatment.  It can make a world of difference.

If it isn't too bad stay home, but don't be stoic.
 
Earlier in the pandemic, someone here (Old Man?) posted a chart of the differences in the treatments of people who survived serious Covid encounters and those who didn't.  The course of treatments were almost identical, but the survivors got the more aggressive treatments one day sooner.  Yep, that was it.  The doctors reaching for the big guns one day earlier in a significant number of cases made the difference between life and death.  How, we treat Covid has changed considerably in the months since that chart came out, but I would not be surprised if basic take away remains unchanged.  If things start to go south, do not hesitate to seek and demand aggressive treatment.  It can make a world of difference.

I'm not.  It took 244 years, but we've finally gotten from "I cannot tell a lie" to "I ended the pandemic that I literally caught two weeks ago and by the way it's a hoax".
 
And flabbergasting is half the reason he's gotten this far--the failure of imagination on the part of his victims, who were flabbergasted when he stiffed them on a contract, who were flabbergasted when he openly and repreatedly lied, and who will be flabbergasted when he loses the election and holds on to power anyway.  That's what we get for having trust and moral compasses.

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

No, the heart of the Ukraine scandal was Trump and Giuliani.  They made it very clear that what was important to them was that Ukraine announce that they were investigating the Bidens, and that they were willing to withhold approved aid until they got the announcement.  It was the announcement that was important to them, not evidence of wrong doing or exoneration.  The important thing was to score the political hit.
 
Speaking of exonerating evidence, Joe Biden has been exonerated of wrong doing in Ukraine by multiple parties.  This includes a Republican led Senate investigation that concluded just last month. Link 
 
So if the Senate Republicans found him innocent in an election year, you can best believe that Biden is a pure as the driven snow on where the Ukraine is concerned.
 
As for the new "evidence" of "Hunter Biden's" laptop, Fox news wanted nothing to do with it and the laptop because they viewed it overly suspect.  Indeed the New York Post writer who wrote up the story had his name removed from the byline because he did not view his own story as being credible.  Giuliani is known to be a target of Russian intelligence efforts.  Everything about the story stinks like 5 day old five day old halibut.
 
So no this not about Biden or his son.  This is about grifters, and gullible people who are choosing to believe them

As you say, ScottishFox, we don't have numbers for suicide, overdose, and alcohol-related deaths for 2020. That argument is being driven by assumptions and anecdotes with no hard evidence to back it up. And is often being pushed by corporate interests who want laborers back at work to boost their profits. Not that I believe for a moment that's your motivation. But it's highly questionable to base public policy on a "bet." After all, many of our early bets for COVID-19 proved faulty.
 
But Old Man makes a salient point. You don't become obese from bumping into an overweight person. You don't become alcoholic from meeting someone who drinks. That's comparing apples and rocks. But everyone we encounter is a potential virus spreader.
 
I am, however, growing fatigued by the argument against restrictions focusing on deaths. That's not the only significant consequence of being sick from coronavirus. Many who have "recovered" from COVID are still suffering serious health conditions months later, and they may turn out to be permanent. You can't earn a living if you're chronically ill, let alone dead.