Christopher R Taylor Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 Summoning works for Omega Beams in another sense: you can outrun them in theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted January 30 Author Report Share Posted January 30 3 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said: Summoning works for Omega Beams in another sense: you can outrun them in theory. That just means they missed. Something that doesn't happen often, but has happened. It really comes down to matter of preference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 Quote That just means they missed. Something that doesn't happen often, but has happened Well, what I mean is this. Some very, VERY fast characters in the comics have outrun the beams for several pages at times, staying just ahead. Lord Liaden 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted January 31 Report Share Posted January 31 On 1/27/2024 at 7:07 AM, Chris Goodwin said: With the +4 to hit: if you hit exactly or by 1, it hits on the third pass, at +2 Segments, if you hit by 2 or 3 it's the second pass, at +1 Segment, and if you hit by 4 or more it's the first pass, on the Segment it's fired. I like the idea of this but, due to the bell curve, I was concerned that the maths would change drastically depending on the starting point. If you hit on an 8 or less your chance to hit is 25%, your chance of hitting once in four efforts would be just shy of 70%. 12 or less is about 74%. If you hit on a 5 or less, your chance to hit is 5%. Your chance of hitting once in four efforts is 19%. 9 or less is 37%. So it does skew chances as you get to the extremes but it probably works well enough to be playable and has the HUGE advantage of being ridiculously simple. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauntlet Posted January 31 Report Share Posted January 31 On 1/26/2024 at 11:07 PM, Chris Goodwin said: I thought I'd expand my reasoning a bit. Let's assume for the sake of easy math that the initial attack hits on 10-, or 50%. Which means it has a 50% to miss. Two attempts gives it a 25% chance to miss, or 75% chance to hit. Three gives a 12.5% chance to miss, or 87.5% chance to hit. I'm reasonably certain both my math and my reasoning are correct. Going back to the dice probability chart for 3d6, 12- is a 74.07% chance to hit (approximating 75%), and 14- is 90.74%, close enough to 87.5%. Because we're working on 3d6 and not percentiles, we can call +2 per pass "good enough". We can buy +4 OCV with a single attack for +8 base points. I'm assuming each attempt is a separate "pass" taking +1 Segment of Extra Time. -1/2 is an Extra Segment, or -3/4 is an Extra Phase. Let's assume -1/2 for a variable amount of extra Segments that could be 0, 1, or 2; it could as easily be -1/4 if it seems too much. With the +4 to hit: if you hit exactly or by 1, it hits on the third pass, at +2 Segments, if you hit by 2 or 3 it's the second pass, at +1 Segment, and if you hit by 4 or more it's the first pass, on the Segment it's fired. In addition, the other problem with having it just attack over and over again for a few phases as it doesn't put in consideration all the things the target might do. What if the target decides to middle deflect, is the missile's OCV based on the phase it is attacking on, if that is so then why would it have an increased OCV just because it is attacking a second or third time? Also, what happens if for some reason the target is no longer able to be hit after the initial attack? Christopher R Taylor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Goodwin Posted January 31 Report Share Posted January 31 2 hours ago, Gauntlet said: In addition, the other problem with having it just attack over and over again for a few phases as it doesn't put in consideration all the things the target might do. What if the target decides to middle deflect, is the missile's OCV based on the phase it is attacking on, if that is so then why would it have an increased OCV just because it is attacking a second or third time? Also, what happens if for some reason the target is no longer able to be hit after the initial attack? The target can deflect or otherwise deal with the attack during the delay period. This is covered by the Physical Manifestation Limitation, although a particular GM might want to use Can Be Deflected (-1/4) instead of or in addition to this. If the target can't be hit after the initial pass, then it hits the ground or wall or otherwise stops attacking. The additional OCV probably shouldn't be applied against the target's Block or Deflection attempts. On 1/27/2024 at 4:20 AM, Hugh Neilson said: You are also applying a limitation to 2-point skill levels, which RAW does not permit. I just checked, and it's a "with GM permission" deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 1 Report Share Posted February 1 20 hours ago, Gauntlet said: What if the target decides to middle deflect, is the missile's OCV based on the phase it is attacking on, if that is so then why would it have an increased OCV just because it is attacking a second or third time? Also, what happens if for some reason the target is no longer able to be hit after the initial attack? It does not actually have an increased OCV, it has an increased chance to hit because you are considering three hits in one roll. If you shoot at something three times you have a better chance of recording one hit than if you shoot at it just once. That is simple statistics. Personally I would give someone the chance to block the attacks using the "core OCV" as the measure of success and each successful block would knock one off the "effective OCV" to roll to hit. The special effects are that it is buzzing about taking time to attack again and again. I think that the final question is part of why the additional OCV is limited - the target has an opportunity to dive for cover and potentially reach some kind of protective place where the attack cannot hit. If the target plans to run to cover but would only get there by the time of the third attack, then the attackers roll needs to get a result that hits before the target gets to cover. It makes things slightly more bureaucratic but potentially more exciting too. Chris Goodwin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauntlet Posted February 1 Report Share Posted February 1 3 hours ago, Doc Democracy said: It does not actually have an increased OCV, it has an increased chance to hit because you are considering three hits in one roll. If you shoot at something three times you have a better chance of recording one hit than if you shoot at it just once. That is simple statistics. Personally I would give someone the chance to block the attacks using the "core OCV" as the measure of success and each successful block would knock one off the "effective OCV" to roll to hit. The special effects are that it is buzzing about taking time to attack again and again. I think that the final question is part of why the additional OCV is limited - the target has an opportunity to dive for cover and potentially reach some kind of protective place where the attack cannot hit. If the target plans to run to cover but would only get there by the time of the third attack, then the attackers roll needs to get a result that hits before the target gets to cover. It makes things slightly more bureaucratic but potentially more exciting too. But if the attack can make multiple attacks against the target, should the target get multiple missile deflection rolls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 I would allow it, with each one removing a +1 and if it goes down to +0, then you manage to end the homing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 5 minutes ago, Doc Democracy said: I would allow it, with each one removing a +1 and if it goes down to +0, then you manage to end the homing. Tried to edit to make this more comprehensive and the system objected to the whole thing. 🙂 Duke Bushido 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Bushido Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 Try hyphenation: Mis-hits. Or just "missed hits." Or "misses." Either way, thanks for the chuckle this morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 It was only after I did the last post that I spotted what the problem might have been - the error message though asks me to remove the "highlighted words" and the whole thing is highlighted....! Huge hit to my self-esteem that the system thought all my prose was offensive!!! Duke Bushido 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Doc Democracy said: Huge hit to my self-esteem that the system thought all my prose was offensive!!! It could have just asked us... Edited February 2 by Lord Liaden Rails and Duke Bushido 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Democracy Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 OMG - so many attacks just before the weekend! I may have to retire to my country estate to recover from the trauma... 😄 Duke Bushido 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolf Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 (edited) If the first missile deflection is successful, the attack should be stopped and should not get further attempts. A homing attack is still only a single attack. Personally I would not allow a power to roll multiple times to see if it hits. This is going to slow down the game way too much. Autofire does get multiple rolls to hit a single target, neither should a homing attack. Giving the attack an increased OCV or making it using an area of effect accurate advantage is how this should be one. Playability should be the determining factor on how to build this type of power. Edited February 2 by LoneWolf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted February 2 Report Share Posted February 2 (edited) 11 hours ago, Doc Democracy said: OMG - so many attacks just before the weekend! I may have to retire to my country estate to recover from the trauma... 😄 Sounds a tad insecure that you interpreted my comment as an attack... Edited February 3 by Lord Liaden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Bushido Posted February 5 Report Share Posted February 5 (edited) Ninja-Bear: Gone through all of 1e, 2e, and all but four books of 3e-- now this includes various write-ups from gaming magazines that I have managed to keep track of, third-party material (like the dual- and triple- statted adventures from other systems that includes Champions write-ups-- And So far, no dice except for Atlas Unleashed. The most common use for Stretching so far has been 1 or 2 inches to represent a long weapon or a prehensile tail. I dont know that I have ever noticed that. Worse yet! I have found like ten Aquaman clones! In what twisted universe is a fish guy cooler than a plastic man?! Edited February 5 by Duke Bushido Christopher R Taylor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Bushido Posted February 5 Report Share Posted February 5 Pretty sure I just put that in the wrong thread.... Let me see if I can fix that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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