What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

[BishopofB&W]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

The whole American-centredness of most comic universes is the one thing that gets tiring very quickly.

 

Is it realistic that every Green Lantern from Earth has been American? I know about the marketing issues but imagine how interesting a storyline would be if a GL ring fell into the hands of an Iraqui or a Chinese person. Thankfully the Champions Universe has a Spaniard as their Starguard.

 

Why does every Alien who crashes on Earth land in the USA (not even other parts of the North American landmass such as Mexico or Canada).

 

 

Darn kids, always messing with the crop circles!. I swear this is the last time I cruise through here on autopilot!

[Enforcer84]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Count me among the angst haters. Not that it couldn't be done well but it isn't, ever.

Another thing I hate is taking obvious "Homages" and making them simply dirty reflections of each other. One of the first thing to turn me off of Authority and to a lesser extent, Planetary, was the sheer number of hollow copies of the Justice League.

Squadron Supreme managed to do it in style, but most fall flatter than a pancake.

[ArmlessTigerMan]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Amen. How many times can Warren Ellis kill Superman? He don't like Supes! We get it already!

One exception to crappy homages was Alan Moore's run on Supreme. Obviously, it wasn't meant to be dark, but he was able to show his affection for the source material and poke fun at it at the same time.

[Magmarock]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Man, am I ever envious of you guys who got to play the "Mutants w/ registration acts" games. My regular gaming group, like most of you, have disliked that concept for so long that we never, ever get to play it. And I happen to love the idea! Being born with powers (and mutations) makes more sense than most of the conveluted origins out there. I don't think it's lazy, I think it's genious. Bitch all you want, but Stan is the Man!

 

What campaign concept I am tired of is the city-based hero group. Mostly stuck in the same city for the entire run of the campaign. Too powerful for the street-level thugs and plots, and not good (powerful/rich/advanced) enough to go dimension hopping or to outerspace. There are only so many bank and/or museum robberies one can take, you know?

 

My group just started an international campaign. UNIT 1, for the United Nations. Not one of us are playing an American hero, either. In fact, in our game, the UN (and the UNIT 1 team) are asked to stay out of the US as they feel that their national heroes, along with PRIMUS, can handle any and all situations that may arise there. My PC is from Kuwait. Others are from France, Germany, and South Africa. It is my turn to take the reins as GM, starting this weekend. I'm pretty excited about not being confined to city or state, for once. I have the world and therefore I planned one large-scale plot, peppered with smaller ones, of course. Whoot!

 

Another one I didn't like was the most recent campaign we had: Villains turned hero. That didn't go over well at all. It was set in Millenium City and the Champions always arrived to try and arrest us on our outstanding warrants. What a bummer. Even having Dr. Silverback (alias Professor Grey) as out benefactor didn't help us. So much for the 'Grey Guardians'. What a dismal failure.

 

And the last thing I'll mention is not a campaign concept, but a character concept that drives me batty: the fantasy hero. I'm not talking about powerful, present-day mages or magic based villains such as the Black Paladin, I am talking about the low powered, alternate dimensional, Conan/Xena/Tarzan rip-offs. What a bore. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.....

Let's keep the fantasy heros in the fantasy games, eh?

 

Mags

[Fenixcrest]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

I like the concept of mutants, and I like the concept of mutant prejudice as an occasional plot/roleplaying hook. However, I despise Mutant Registration Act stuff.

 

My supers worlds tend to be a kind of weird hash-up of everything else. For example, in my game there are X-Men. On the other end of the country, mostly, but they're there. There's also a Justice League. A really, really disfunctional Justice League. Think Captain Mexico, the man with the iron sombrero, and Starbucks Gal, the most well-recognized corporately sponsored superheroine in the southwest USA.

 

I don't like Iron Age/Dark Champions type games; they just irk me. I think it's because I like my NPC's too much to see them get shot in the head by an angsty PC with a rifle. I prefer my vigilante justice with a sugar coating, thank you very much.

[Trebuchet]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

My group just started an international campaign. UNIT 1' date=' for the United Nations. Not one of us are playing an American hero, either. In fact, in our game, the UN (and the UNIT 1 team) are asked to stay out of the US as they feel that their national heroes, along with PRIMUS, can handle any and all situations that may arise there. My PC is from Kuwait. Others are from France, Germany, and South Africa. It is my turn to take the reins as GM, starting this weekend. I'm pretty excited about not being confined to city or state, for once. I have the world and therefore I planned one large-scale plot, peppered with smaller ones, of course. Whoot![/quote']Our campaign is international; and that was deliberate from the get-go in 1992 when we started it.

 

Beyond the obvious advantages of heroes from a half dozen different nations, a globe-trotting campaign provides wonderful backdrops for scenarios. We've fought in a Turkish palace and on Easter Island; a lost Mayan city and the deck of an aircraft carrier berthed in San Diego Naval Station, the heart of an erupting African volcano and the streets of London; the Mongolian desert and the Alaskan wilderness; the abandoned tractor works of Stalingrad and a Norwegian nuclear power plant, the French Riviera and the Caribbean; a sunken Russian nuclear sub at the bottom of the Aegean Sea and the cobblestoned streets of old Vienna; and many others.

 

No more boring bank heists and patrols; we're a big picture kind of team. All it takes is a multilingual team and a fast jet. And soon we'll be off into space to save the whole world from total destruction. Watch out, all you evil aliens! Here comes MidGuard!

[Susano]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Count me among the angst haters. Not that it couldn't be done well but it isn't, ever.

Another thing I hate is taking obvious "Homages" and making them simply dirty reflections of each other. One of the first thing to turn me off of Authority and to a lesser extent, Planetary, was the sheer number of hollow copies of the Justice League.

Squadron Supreme managed to do it in style, but most fall flatter than a pancake.

 

Interesting. I liked THE AUTHORITY when it had Jenny Sparks and her driving "we can/should make the world a better place" philosophy behind it. Now I ignore it, as it is utter overblown crap (much like all the X-books). OTOH, I really, really like PLANETARY. I think it's a very cool look at a different sort of world with superhumans. It's like a darker version of Astro City, with analogs of all sorts of comics characters from all over.

[Doug McCrae]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

I am talking about the low powered, alternate dimensional, Conan/Xena/Tarzan rip-offs. What a bore. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.....

Let's keep the fantasy heros in the fantasy games, eh?

Like Ka-Zar, Lord of the Savage Land?

[Doug McCrae]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Amen. How many times can Warren Ellis kill Superman? He don't like Supes! We get it already!

I've always felt that the best 50s and 60s Superman stories were the 'imaginary stories' where Superman dies. It's like the death of Balder in Norse mythology. Alan Moore did a brilliant version in the mid 80s - Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow? Admittedly these have always shown fantastic love and affection for the character. I'm always deeply moved by the funeral scenes where the world's greatest remaining super champions are in attendance - the JLA carrying the coffin, a tearful Supergirl delivering the eulogy - brilliant stuff.

 

I guess it's a bit less dignified when Warren Ellis kills him, huh?

[Doug McCrae]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Are you saying superteams should only consist of heroes from one nation and that they should limit their activities to their homeland?

The sort of thing I meant is the multinational team where you've got a Jap, an African, a Kyrgystani, a Frenchman, and swarms and swarms of Brits/Irish. I'm sick of it. That sort of thing was ground breaking in the 70s; a view of a different, better world when the Cold War was still on. It may have seemed like reality in the early 90s with the UN coalition of Gulf War 1. Nowadays it's a) hackneyed, and nothing like the real world.

 

Or that only Americans should have superpowers?

Dunno. I've never thought about it before. It's an interesting idea though - the superhero is a quintessentially American concept after all.

[Brandi]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

The sort of thing I meant is the multinational team where you've got a Jap' date=' an African, a Kyrgystani, a Frenchman, and swarms and swarms of Brits/Irish. I'm sick of it. That sort of thing was ground breaking in the 70s; a view of a different, better world when the Cold War was still on. It may have seemed like reality in the early 90s with the UN coalition of Gulf War 1. Nowadays it's a) hackneyed, and nothing like the real world.[/quote']

 

OTOH, in the wake of the European Union, I could see attempts to form such a superteam being done. Admittedly, such a team might be as fraught with bickering and internal indecision as the EU has been in its early formation...

[Metaphysician]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

OTOH' date=' in the wake of the European Union, I could see attempts to form such a superteam being done. Admittedly, such a team might be as fraught with bickering and internal indecision as the EU has been in its early formation...[/quote']

 

Might??

 

I can easily see a campaign wherein the actual heroes in such a group end up fugitives due to violating this that or the other regulation one too many times while trying to actually fulfill their purpose as a team of superheroes.

[Tim]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

As to the Mutant problem. I don't mind the origin, but I make a distinction. If a person dislikes Mutants, they more than likely will also dislike Mutates.

 

A Mutate is a person who gained their powers thru accidents. Spiderman, FF, She-Hulk, etc. are Mutates. As Mutates are changed, usually on the cellular level, and if the powers are inate, there is no physical difference between a mutant and Mutate, I usually have the haters hate both.

[Guest WhammeWhamme]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

The sort of thing I meant is the multinational team where you've got a Jap, an African, a Kyrgystani, a Frenchman, and swarms and swarms of Brits/Irish. I'm sick of it. That sort of thing was ground breaking in the 70s; a view of a different, better world when the Cold War was still on. It may have seemed like reality in the early 90s with the UN coalition of Gulf War 1. Nowadays it's a) hackneyed, and nothing like the real world.

 

Dunno. I've never thought about it before. It's an interesting idea though - the superhero is a quintessentially American concept after all.

 

A group of idealistic individuals from diverse backgrounds working together is far more likely than their _countries_ doing so. Some kind of 'international alliance of supeheroes' is possible; essentially, they're disregarding the politicians. That angle could be interesting. (If it's been done before, I wouldn't know about it.)

[Enforcer84]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Interesting. I liked THE AUTHORITY when it had Jenny Sparks and her driving "we can/should make the world a better place" philosophy behind it. Now I ignore it' date=' as it is utter overblown crap (much like all the X-books). OTOH, I really, really like PLANETARY. I think it's a very cool look at a different sort of world with superhumans. It's like a darker version of Astro City, with analogs of all sorts of comics characters from all over.[/quote']

Well I loved The Authority, I thought they did it okay right up until Ellis left and Millar stepped in and thought it would be cute to have the Authority rip the entire Marvel Universe a new one.

And I adored Planetary, I like well done homages, Axel Brass and his team were cool. The Four are great villains (even though I've only ever seen three of them...) and their takes on other comic book mainstays were great.

 

Authority/Planetary Team up? Guh.

Basically, Image really took the idea of familiar but different heroes to new levels of crap.

I haven't read Alan Moore's Supreme, but I want to. Rob Leifield's Supreme? No. No thank you.

Ellis did a fine job and it seemed that even though he looked at them through a slightly cracked mirror, he seemed to enjoy enough of the superhero genre to make quality books. The Authority after Issue 12 is not fit to wipe my bum. Sadly Planetary hasn't come out in a long long while has it?

 

Like I said, I thought that the Squadron Supreme limited series was great, the one shot was good too. But simply making "Superdooperman" so you can have some bad ass rip out his throat in one panel isn't doinig anything unique with the Superman Archetype.

[Susano]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Ellis did a fine job and it seemed that even though he looked at them through a slightly cracked mirror, he seemed to enjoy enough of the superhero genre to make quality books. The Authority after Issue 12 is not fit to wipe my bum. Sadly Planetary hasn't come out in a long long while has it?

 

Yup. PLANETARY is back out. It is released every other month, and is up to issue 19. We even get the secret origin of Jakita Wagner.

[freakboy6117]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

another really good wildstorm series was THE ESTABLISHMENT but I'm not suprised it didn't do well in the states it was wonderfully britcentric. the non stop british pop culture refrences probably explain why it only made it to issue 13. it was an amazing book for me proper british superheros. and i just wish teh american audience coudl have enjoyed it on teh same level i did but theres no way there going to spot dan dare and refreces to british kids tv.

[MarkusDark]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Mutants being hunted - anti mutant groups picketing this or that.

[bcholmes]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Interesting. I liked THE AUTHORITY when it had Jenny Sparks and her driving "we can/should make the world a better place" philosophy behind it. Now I ignore it' date=' as it is utter overblown crap (much like all the X-books). OTOH, I really, really like PLANETARY. I think it's a very cool look at a different sort of world with superhumans. It's like a darker version of Astro City, with analogs of all sorts of comics characters from all over.[/quote']

 

Hey! That's exactly my take on it, too.

[loraxxx]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

another really good wildstorm series was THE ESTABLISHMENT but I'm not suprised it didn't do well in the states it was wonderfully britcentric. the non stop british pop culture refrences probably explain why it only made it to issue 13. it was an amazing book for me proper british superheros. and i just wish teh american audience coudl have enjoyed it on teh same level i did but theres no way there going to spot dan dare and refreces to british kids tv.

unless you were raised in DETROIT, which is right across the river from CANADA, and were able to watch alot of CBC and TVOntario--which included tons of BRITISH imports (any other TOM GRATTAN'S WAR fans out there....?)

 

yeah--i also dug THE ESTABLISHMENT--liked it ALOT more than THE MONARCHY--but i didn't make the "DAN DARE" connection until you mentioned it....

[loraxxx]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

Maybe I didn't make myself clear but there's a big difference between other nations publishing their own comics with or withour superheroes, and the way that the Marvel and DC universes are so US-centric.

 

DC and Marvel's approach to other nations' superhumans within their universe just isn't realistic in my opinion (and yes I know that flying men, aliens and men who dress as winged rodents aren't realistic either).

 

did you read the series of stories DC did about 4-5 years ago featuring super powered heroes from other parts of the world? it introduced the characters in team-ups with the more mainstream DC characters.....

 

....also, it was revealed in JLA around the same time that for the most part, THE MARTIAN MANHUNTER acts as the "superman of the southern hemisphere," since there are a dearth of paranormals there, and garners a great deal more respect from peoples in that region of the world. i think he even goes so far as to maintain several of his numerous secret id's there as well....

 

WONDER WOMAN also has taken a more international focus as of late, using her status as amazonian ambassador to the UN to address problems around the world....

 

it was recently revealed the the original CAPTAIN MARVEL'S semi-reformed foe TETH(BLACK) ADAM was of middle-eastern descent, when he returned to oust a dictatorship in his homeland and ran afoul of the JSA in order to do it....

 

both SUPERMAN and BATMAN have had to recently deal with conflicts with "capes" from JAPAN, including the most recent incarnation of TOYMAN, a 13 year-old prodigy that builds giant-sized versions of all those cool japanese-import-robot toys, like SHOGUN WARRIORS and ZOIDS....

 

there have been a few others that i can't currently recall over at DC--one of the most famous BATMAN stories of the SILVER AGE featured the "BATMEN FROM AROUND THE WORLD", and featured 'batman and robin-esque' heroes such as THE KNIGHT AND THE SQUIRE in the UK, and EL GAUCHO (i forget his sidekicks name) in south america....

 

over at MARVEL there have been international heroes since WWII, many introduced in the pages of THE INVADERS (remember UNION JACK and SPITFIRE?) they recently updated the characters in the CITIZEN V AND THE V-BATTALLION miniseries, that chronicled their exploits dealing with threats to WORLD peace....

 

and not taking into account RETCON-ing, there have also been international heros and villans at MARVEL since the 60's (old-fogies like myself will remember the RED GUARDIAN, and his team THE SUPREME SOVIET, and IRONMAN mainstays TITANIUM MAN and THE CRIMSON DYNAMO--as well as the heroes that were introduced in the CONTEST OF CHAMPIONS miniseries, X-CALIBER--OH YEAH, and some guy nobody ever heard of named THE BLACK PANTHER), and MARVEL even had a whole line of british imprints (MARVEL UK) that featured CAPTAIN BRITAIN as the predominant character....

 

and since the 60's mutants have been international (BANSHEE, STORM, SUNFIRE, BLACK TOM, THE SCARLET WITCH AND QUICKSILVER, MAGNETO!!)--so much so that they did a recent series of stories where the govs. of the world held a conference to discuss the mutant problem....

 

 

i'll admit that they don't make a lot of appearances, compared to SPIDEY, BATS, SUPES, and WOLVERINE, but both DC Aand MARVEL have a long standing practice of creating and publishing super-heroes from around the world....

[Metaphysician]

Re: What superhero world concept are you tired of seeing?

 

As to the Mutant problem. I don't mind the origin, but I make a distinction. If a person dislikes Mutants, they more than likely will also dislike Mutates.

 

A Mutate is a person who gained their powers thru accidents. Spiderman, FF, She-Hulk, etc. are Mutates. As Mutates are changed, usually on the cellular level, and if the powers are inate, there is no physical difference between a mutant and Mutate, I usually have the haters hate both.

 

This always seemed to me the most sensical way to do it, with a possible exemption for superheroes created through deliberate induced mutation. IOW, people who may be genetically identical to other mutants/mutates, but are seen by the public as "Products of Science."