Dr Divago Posted April 8, 2004 Report Share Posted April 8, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes 1. How do we measure a "cubic hex"? A hex is a unit of ground measurement, and thus only two-dimensional. So, what's the best approach?: a. Measure the volume of a "cubic" hex that's essentially a two-meter tall hexagonal column I think this is simplest way... c. Converting a cubic meter into a "cubic hex" I like this, men: i dont' want to troll but, i like You use Metric Decimal units! (i HATE conversion from meter to feet or to Kg to lbs and vice versa... and i came froma country where metric decimal units are used so... you know... i think "Hero is better" even for this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Posted April 8, 2004 Report Share Posted April 8, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Thanx for all the help' date=' guys! I've gone ahead and made my chart with both a "cubic foot" and "cubic hex" columns, which will hopefully satisfy everyone, and I've provided some handy conversion formulae to boot. [/quote'] Ehm, just don't forget the "cubic metre" column. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigitalGolem Posted April 9, 2004 Report Share Posted April 9, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes As an aside, the 7m3 volume also makes for very simple conversions to/from the 14m3 "displacement tons" used in certain other games as a unit of volume for spacecraft and other vehicles. Two Hero hexes = one dton works for me! Thanx heaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vorsch Posted April 9, 2004 Report Share Posted April 9, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes 3 x 3 x1.5 , low berth, shared, Traveller now that takes me back even before hero and DnD. Volume of 7.5 works better cos is a round number when scaled up. Water 7.5t/hex ( wood ) Dirt 15t/hex ( ) stone 30t/hex ( ) steel 60/hex ( most metals ) Osmium 120t/hex ( highest density substance known, gold platinum silver) As a game wher str is only ever bought in 5pt multiples ( supers ) all in between values are irrelevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Steve, I think the right answer has most to do with what use you thought this new "unit of measurement" (the cubic hex) would have to the gamers. I'm not sure I understand how it would really be used. b. Measure the volume of a sphere two meters in diameter My first reaction was that this was the most "logical" definition - it allows the convenience of hexagonal movement in 3-space - picturing stacked marbles instead of the stacked coins that form a 2-d hex grid. But as JayH points out, this would leave gaps, and if you measured the volume of a large area of these hexes as if they were spheres, your total would be off by larger and larger numbers. It's also not clear to me that an arrangement of 3-d hexes arranged as spheres would be easy to use for 3-d movement, which eliminates the only value hexes have over squares. Probably, such a unit of measurement should just be the same shape that's used to regulate movement in 3-space. d. Forget about "cubic hexes" and just use "cubic meters" or some other form of real-world measurement I guess until I understand how someone would make use of a "cubic hex" I'd just choose this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Thanx for all the help' date=' guys! I've gone ahead and made my chart with both a "cubic foot" and "cubic hex" columns, which will hopefully satisfy everyone, and I've provided some handy conversion formulae to boot. [/quote'] NOOOO!!! Not cubic feet - cubic meters. Hero gamers are smart and understand the benefits of the metric system. You know, I never could figure out why the folks who are the most uncomfortable doing math are the ones most resistant to using the metric system. I met one exception. He knew he was bad at math, so he preferred metric: "Heck, even *I* can multiply by ten!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted April 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes I chose cubic feet because the book already has a metric measurement -- just divide the cubic hex by seven to get cubic meters. OTOH, lots of reference materials list things in cubic feet, making it a handy secondary bit of information to have on the table. Since the table has both, and various conversion formulae to boot, I see no valid grounds for complaint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitz Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes I live in a country which uses metric units. While I'm old enough to be able to visualise cubic feet quite easily, most of the younger people I know can't, and seven is a terrible number to divide mentally. I really think you should include a cubic metre column. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawksmoor Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes While I use hexes as a convient unit of measure on a hex - mat' date=' I do not describe an explosition as having the nice regular sides will all the angles that a hex would have.[/quote'] True, but to use a d20ism, If an explosion does not fully cover a hex then it does not effect it, despite touching and in some cases intruding into a hex as represented by a template. My rule is the template must cover at least 1/2 to 3/4 of a hex before it is to be counted in the AE. Hawksmoor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy Gnome Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Thanx for all the help' date=' guys! I've gone ahead and made my chart with both a "cubic foot" and "cubic hex" columns, which will hopefully satisfy everyone, and I've provided some handy conversion formulae to boot. [/quote'] Not cubic hexes, cylindrical hexes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Limmer Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Not cubic hexes' date=' cylindrical hexes. [/quote']Actually, they're hexagonal prisms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sociotard Posted April 11, 2004 Report Share Posted April 11, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Actually' date=' they're hexagonal prisms. [/quote'] I would have said Hexagonal Extrusions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkdguy Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Time to put my 2 cents in: I prefer the hexagonal prism; it makes everything even. One slight correction about the area of a regular hexagon: Area = (square root of three * half the length of one side) * the perimeter of the hexagon To get the volume, just multiply this area by the height of the prism. Feet, meters, I don't care. I'm fine with it either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_azrad Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Actually' date=' they're hexagonal prisms. [/quote'] I think I was the first to refer to them as cylinders; but Doug is right, they are prisms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobGreenwade Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes True, but to use a d20ism, If an explosion does not fully cover a hex then it does not effect it, despite touching and in some cases intruding into a hex as represented by a template. My rule is the template must cover at least 1/2 to 3/4 of a hex before it is to be counted in the AE. Hawksmoor This is a very nice exposition on how an explosion can affect its environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkdguy Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Yes, they are properly called prism, but let's not quibble about that detail. As long as we're on the same page (and I think we are), all we need to worry about is defining the height of the prism. As for determining damage for an effect that covers less than a hex, how about allowing a decreased effect (smaller DC) at the fringes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFleischmann Posted April 12, 2004 Report Share Posted April 12, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Steve, I remember the thread you refer to as I was one of the very active posters on it. The discussion started with an argument over whether AE Radius was a circle or a sphere. It seems you've already decided, but I would vastly prefer cubic meters (1m x 1m x1m) over hexagonal prisms 2 meters high and 1.155 m on a side (which is the shape of your "cubic hex"). Cubic meters are easily converted into anything you want. If you want "cubic hexes" you can multiply by 6.928 (or 7 if you don't mind being off a little). If you wan cubic inches, you can multiply by 8. On that old thread, I talked about a shape called a rhombic dodecahedron, which is the space-filling shape you get when you stack up marbles and include the gaps between them. I like to call them "dodes" for short, just like we say "hexes" instead of "hexagons." To convert cubic meters to dodes, you multiply by 5.656. (Though I doubt even I would need to do this. I use dodes all the time for 3-d movement, but I probably wouldn't need to for the masses of objects.) So add me to the list of those who prefer option (d). It's annoying when a decision is made without my opinion just because I haven't had a chance to look at the boards in a week or two. And why bother with cubic feet? Nothing in the game is described in feet. You might as well include cubic furlongs, or cubic cubits! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFleischmann Posted April 14, 2004 Report Share Posted April 14, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Did I kill this thread? I didn't mean to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorpCommander Posted April 14, 2004 Report Share Posted April 14, 2004 Re: OK, Math And Science Experts: Cubic Hexes Personally, I see the thought process behind listing in clubic hexes. The table of body/def for materials is in cubic hexes. However this is usually too much volume for most things where it's mattered in my game. Usually its only a few centimeters of wood between the party and the next room. Occationally a similar amount of stone. In some cases large amounts of stone and earth present themselves. However I am not running champions so we'll have to see how useful this is. I think with some simple calculator time it can be quite useful. --Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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