New commer OCV/DCV question

[Glabutz]

Hi,

 

I'm a newcommer here, and discovered the Hero system a few days ago, fo I was interrested in the Terran Empire, well critized in french rpg press.

 

I have a question that may have allready been asked, or that you'll find quite dork.

 

I have issues with OCV/DCV.

 

Mostly, I don't uderstand :

 

1. Why do they exist ?

The combat skills don't work the same way than the other skills, and I find it strange. I don't understand the need to use a "TAC0" like system (ok, this is not a nice thing to say, I appologize)

 

2. How do you "use" your combat skills ?

for 2 levels, you can do extra damages. Does it mean that you're OCV is lowered by the number of skill level you use ?

[Steve Long]

Well, they exist because that's how the system has determined a character's ability to hit a target (or avoid being hit) for over 20 years, and it works really well. Why does D&D have levels, or Deadlands have a shootin' skill? They're all just design decisions inherent in the system.

 

Combat Skill Levels have a wide variety of uses -- increasing OCV, increasing DCV, increasing damage, for example. If you use one to increase damage, it does not decrease your OCV -- you simply can't use it simultaneously to increase your OCV.

 

Since some other Hero fans may have further advice, I've copied this to "HERO System Discussion" so they can reply.

 

Glad to hear Terran Empire has been favorably received in France, and I hope you enjoy 5E!

[Supreme]

I can sort of understand the question. GURPS after all has one set of rolls determined the same way. You pay for a skill, be it stealth, singing, or broadsword. An attack is simply a successful roll with that skill, made the same as all the others. Unfortunately, GURPS -in order to allow for characters who are harder to hit- allows the defender to make defensive rolls. Up to three of them for each attack, IIRC. With HERO a characters ability to hit well, and a defenders ability to avoid being hit, are all contained within one roll.

[Guest Keneton]

When you get to know OCV/DCV, you will grow to like it. It is not truely comparable to TACO (or THACO) as these systems are linear. D20 is completely linear. Hero uses a bell curve. You roll 3d6 not 1d20 for example. This curve makes results more consistent. Skills use the same system per se except that the target number is sort of a success amount. For example making a skill roll by 3 is much like having an OCV 3 less than an opponents DCV. In this case both require a skill roll of 8-.

 

I hope this makes things more plain.

 

In regards to skill levels, these work as phase to phase adjustments to your OCV or DCV when used with an applicable attack form. For example a 5 point level with HTH could be used with a HTH attack, but not for or against a ranged attack. You place these levesl during your phase, generally when you commit to an attack, but there are occasions where levesl are placed prior but we do not want to confuse you yet!)

 

Levels can also be used to increase damage (DC's) as you noted, but this is not taken from you base CV. Base CV is adjsuted by numerous factors such as being prone or stunned, or preforming a sweep to name a few.

 

ecouter et repeter "Hero system is good!":D

[Glabutz]

Well, my question seemed quite stupid, bt it is true that i'am used to system that use the same rules all along, wether it may be fiht or just normal skills.

 

Difference between the combat system and the "normal" system trow me back in my past (AD&D 1rst Ed rules for HTH were different from the "normal" melee fight.

 

So, since it looks like HS is one of the first game I found in which the designer tries and can explain his choices, that there was one.

 

I have an ansewer and I'm happy wuth it now

 

But, then, I need some clarifications : Every one has a base OCV/DCV that is Dex/3 + Bs/Ms coming from the situation, the combat option you may choose.

.

Then you have your weapon/melee level, which you can use to :

- raise your OCV or

- raise your damage or

- raise you DCV

 

With a 5 skill level, you mai : have a +1 OCV, then a +1 DC and a +2 DCV.

 

Am I right ?

 

Then, you don't need or don't have any dodge skill ?

 

Or is it possible to developp a dodge skill ?

 

Yes, I am really new in it, even if I try to get everything I can for this game at the moment...

 

Last question : is there any supplement that exist/may be developped for cyberware/ Cyberpunk, or all of it is in the Space Hero book ?

[Trebuchet]

Originally posted by Glabutz

Then you have your weapon/melee level, which you can use to :

- raise your OCV or

- raise your damage or

- raise you DCV

 

With a 5 skill level, you mai : have a +1 OCV, then a +1 DC and a +2 DCV.

 

Am I right ?

 

Correct, but not simultaneously. Of course, if you have several 5 point combat levels you may assign them as you see fit each Phase. My character with two levels in Hand-to-Hand combat often splits them +1 OCV/+1 DCV.

 

Then, you don't need or don't have any dodge skill ?

 

Or is it possible to developp a dodge skill ?

 

There is a free basic Dodge maneuver which gives a +3 bonus to Defensive Combat Value, and which any character may use. Characters with martial arts may purchase the superior Martial Dodge manuever which provides a +5 to DCV.

 

Last question : is there any supplement that exist/may be developped for cyberware/ Cyberpunk, or all of it is in the Space Hero book ?

 

So far there is no specific campaign book which covers cyberpunk, but there is plenty of cyberpunk information in Star Hero. Star Hero is really "Science Fiction Hero".

 

And welcome to Hero.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Glabutz

Difference between the combat system and the "normal" system trow me back in my past (AD&D 1rst Ed rules for HTH were different from the "normal" melee fight.

 

Hero System is a /very/ old school game. And I mean that in a good way. 5th Edition is leagues ahead of the versions that were floating around in 1985, but alot of the internal assumptions are still there. There are rules for everything, which in my opinion is a refreshing change from more modern systems that handwave everything.

 

But, then, I need some clarifications : Every one has a base OCV/DCV that is Dex/3 + Bs/Ms coming from the situation, the combat option you may choose.

 

Correct. The standard and optional maneuvers on page 254 of the 5th Edition book (Which everyone on the forum calls FREd, long story) are the heart of your combat choices every action. The martial abilites are better, but cost points to be able to perform.

Once you get used to calculating OCV/DCV it comes very quickly. Once you get used to using these maneuvers you can get very detailed combats.

 

Then you have your weapon/melee level, which you can use to :

- raise your OCV or

- raise your damage or

- raise you DCV

 

With a 5 skill level, you mai : have a +1 OCV, then a +1 DC and a +2 DCV.

 

Am I right ?

 

If in your example you mean you have 5 skill levels then you are correct. There is some confusion because I'm not sure if you might mean a 5 /point/ skill level (which is how Trebuchet is reading it). Skill levels come in several point costs. The more expensive ones can be applied to more combat situations. This is broken down on p36.

 

Then, you don't need or don't have any dodge skill ?

 

Or is it possible to developp a dodge skill ?

 

Dodge is listed as one of the basic maneuvers on p254. None of the PCs in my current game would still be alive without it. Martial Dodge is even better, but it costs points for a character to buy the ability to perform it.

 

It should be pointed out that the number of skill levels a character has varies alot by genre. Martial arts heavy game hae chracters that have a half dozen skill levels each, but most of the published super powererd characters have 0-4 each. By buying your dex up and making liberal use of the basic maneuvers you can get buy without any skill levels at all.

 

There is a long-running and semi-contentious debate on these boards about which characters are better/more realistic/more appropriate: the ones with 30+ dexes and few skill levels or the ones with 15-25 dexes and lots of skill levels.

 

One of the things about Hero is that while there are guidelines by genre, in your game you can set the standard wherever you want. So if you like skill levels and want everyone to have a bunch, then as long as the characers in your game have the right number of skill levels relative to each other the whole thing still works. You just have to adjust prepublished characters to bring them into line with your game standards.

 

Last question : is there any supplement that exist/may be developped for cyberware/ Cyberpunk, or all of it is in the Space Hero book ?

 

There was a cyber hero for the 4th edition, but the fan consensus doesn't seem very positive. Some cyberwear rules are in Star Hero.

Another 4th Ed supplament that might be good is Dark Champions. It's all about violent, gun toting vigilantes with super powers fighting it out in crime-ridden back alleys. Substitute cyberwear for super powers and this might cover alot of the ground you are looking for. This one is out of print, but is due to be updated to 5th edition sometime next year.

Of course the beauty of Hero is that once you get the hang of it you can probably make up your own cyberwear rules without much difficulty.

[Glabutz]

If in your example you mean you have 5 skill levels then you are correct. There is some confusion because I'm not sure if you might mean a 5 /point/ skill level (which is how Trebuchet is reading it)

 

Yes, I wanted to say "5 skill levels", and not skill levels for 5 points.

 

I still havan't tried the sysem yet, and should do so in a few days. I'm just worried about understanding the rules so my players won't be mad at the change (we're playing with Silhouette (DP9's) system, that no one like )

 

One more stuid question : Can you always use your fighting skill levels to increase your DCV.

 

Exemple : Player has 5 skill levels and uses a gun, while a NPC tries to stab him with a knife. Can the player use 2 or 3 skill levels to increase his DCV ?

 

And i havan't say it yet, but I'm really glad to see what kind of comunity you are. I feel welcomed even if my questions seems stupid and that it looks like I haven't read the FREd (is that right ?) enough yet.

To this moment, you'e one of the two nicest RPG community I have ever met.

 

Great books, great people, a priori great system. I'm happy to be here.

[Trebuchet]

Originally posted by Glabutz

And i havan't say it yet, but I'm really glad to see what kind of comunity you are. I feel welcomed even if my questions seems stupid and that it looks like I haven't read the FREd (is that right ?) enough yet.

To this moment, you'e one of the two nicest RPG community I have ever met.

 

Great books, great people, a priori great system. I'm happy to be here.

 

Hey, where else can you go to ask questions where the game designer himself will answer your questions? Steve Long and the guys from HERO are the best.!

[Glabutz]

Hey, where else can you go to ask questions where the game designer himself will answer your questions?

 

Sometime on HM mailing list...

 

That's the second one

 

[Lord Liaden]

Welcome to the HERO community, Glabutz! You're in for a lot of fun.

 

Don't hesitate to ask questions here; we were all newbies once, and all of us are eager to help a new comrade (and show off how much we know). For example:

 

Originally posted by Glabutz

Last question : is there any supplement that exist/may be developped for cyberware/ Cyberpunk, or all of it is in the Space Hero book ?

 

If you click on the "Free Stuff" link at the top of this page, then click on "HERO System Documents", you'll find "The HERO System Genre by Genre". This is a free 41-page PDF file which you can download. It describes several different genres of games, their main conventions and how to do them in HERO terms, one or two sample characters for each genre, and sample powers/ spells/ equipment etc. There's a section on Cyberpunk gaming, with a sample character and some prebuilt cyberware. If you're familiar with the cyberpunk genre, this plus the Fifth Edition rulebook (FREd) should be enough to start your campaign, although you'll have to build your world yourself.

 

There is more material available in Star HERO, plus the now out-of-print Cyber HERO genre book for the previous (4th) edition of the game system. If you have any interest in Japanese manga and anime, Michael Surbrook has written an excellent manga-style cyberpunk sourcebook for the HERO System, called Kazei 5, for sale as a downloadable electronic book in Hero Games's Online Store (the link for that is at the top of this page, too). There would probably be a lot of material there that you could use.

 

Hope you find something useful in all of that.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Glabutz [/i]

Yes, I wanted to say "5 skill levels", and not skill levels for 5 points.

 

I still havan't tried the sysem yet, and should do so in a few days. I'm just worried about understanding the rules so my players won't be mad at the change (we're playing with Silhouette (DP9's) system, that no one like )

 

If you are jumping in with both feet (we all did once), may I suggest you start simple. There are so many options avalible that you run the risk of bringig combat to a complete halt every action trying to figure out what to do. Hero can do almost anything, but that doesn't mean you should try in in your first game!

I would reccomend a few things:

-The first charcters you use should avoid buying abilites marked with "magnifier" or "stop sign" icons in FREd (and yes you are using that right). These are useful and good abilites, but can either be unusually complicated, or unusually powerful unless you know what you are doing.

-Run a combat or two not using any skill levels or maneuvers. Just get everyone used to calculating hit rolls and using their special abilities.

-When you are ready to use maneuvers, start with the basic ones and add optional maneuvers a couple at a time.

-Make sure charcters don't have speeds that are more than 1 point apart from each other at first. (another topic I know) This can overly penalize slow characters until you get a feel for balance.

 

 

One more stuid question : Can you always use your fighting skill levels to increase your DCV.

 

Exemple : Player has 5 skill levels and uses a gun, while a NPC tries to stab him with a knife. Can the player use 2 or 3 skill levels to increase his DCV ?

 

If your skill levels apply, you can use them at any time. If you have skill levels that apply to guns only or ranged combat then they will not help you against knife weilding enemies.

On the other hand, if you haveclose combat skill levels, or skill levels that apply to all combat, or skills in knife fighting (even if you don't have a knife, knowing how to fight with one helps you avoid them) then you can apply these.

If, for example, you have 2 levels in ranged combat and two levels with knives, you can use both at the same time, adding two to your ocv for shooting enemies across the room while adding 2 to your dcv vs. knife-weilding enemies.

 

Don't get too carried away with all combat skill levels, they are really useful, but if you buy a character with too many they will always hit while being unhittable in return. And in most genres, ovarall combat mastery is rare. Most charcters will have skills with their preferred weapons, or ranged combat, or close combat, but not in everything.

[Tom Carman]

Originally posted by Jhamin

I would reccomend a few things:

-The first charcters you use should avoid buying abilites marked with "magnifier" or "stop sign" icons in FREd (and yes you are using that right).

You may be asking yourself "what 'magnifier' icon?" You're not seeing it because it isn't there: FREd uses an exclamation-point-in-triangle icon as a caution sign. In the 4th edition book, an icon of a magnifying glass was used to indicate "look closely before you allow this".

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Tom Carman

You may be asking yourself "what 'magnifier' icon?" You're not seeing it because it isn't there: FREd uses an exclamation-point-in-triangle icon as a caution sign. In the 4th edition book, an icon of a magnifying glass was used to indicate "look closely before you allow this".

 

Doh!

 

As you can see. Even the vets manage to get confused.

[Old Man]

I would second the recommendation that you start slow and low.

 

Grab the Skilled Normals or Competent Normals templates from p224 FREd and do a fist fight or knife fight. Just so everybody can get the hang of things.

 

After that you have to decide what genre you wish to play you campaign in. It all flows from there. You can always pop in here on the boards and ask for advice on ANYTHING.

[Glabutz]

After that you have to decide what genre you wish to play you campaign in. It all flows from there. You can always pop in here on the boards and ask for advice on ANYTHING.

 

Thanks a lot.

 

I come to Hero Games first because of Terran Empire (i'm so bored of the Space Op universe you can find, and I wanted something open and classical) and second because I'm fond of RPG systems.

 

Now, I would like to take the time I needed to fully understand and test Hero System's rules.

 

But in fact, I'm lost in a Fading Suns campaign, that we started 3 scenarii ago, with the Silhouette system. We didn't want to play D&D in the stars, so we gave the D20 away, and the whole system with... But now, we are all ok, the DP9 system looks fun, but is not for me.

 

So, we decided to move to Action! System, which we all knew.

 

And then, I bought Hero System.

 

After reading FREd, and lurking throughout Space Hero + Terran Empire, I feel I can do something with it. So, before we do our first "Fading suns action!", I decided to move to HS. Last move.

 

But we are playing next saturday, and I have to convert the PCs, some NPCs and understand the OCV/DCV thing, before I might explain it to the others.

 

 

I see the good point there : I'll be ready for my Terran Empire game

 

Nevertheless, I'm trying to adapt the Character sheet so it could be in french and it could help the players with the OCV/DCV.

 

Shall I put in a box :

Base OCV

Base DCV

 

HTH CSL

HTH Offensive only CSL

Range attack CSL

Range attack Offensive only CSL

General CSL

 

Modified OCV

Modified DCV

 

And then a box for WF

 

Will it be right ?

Or should I break the HTH and Range OCV/DCV in smaller groups ?

[Old Man]

You can explain OCV/DCV like this:

(11+OCV) - DCV = what you need to roll or less on 3d6

Example: OCV 6 vs DCV 4

(11+6) - 4 = 13 or less on 3d6 to hit. Pretty simple.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by putting the CSLs in boxes but if it helps your players then go ahead and do it. Personally I would put WF first because if they don't have the WF for the weapon they are using it is a -3 OCV penalty.

[Glabutz]

My problem is more about what you can do with CSL.

 

I bought the GM Screen, and I have the table, so I'll just ask their OCV and the dice roll they've done. Then, I'll tell them if it is a success or not.

 

I don't understand the CSL :

 

For 2 points, you have a+1 OCV for an attack (which means one that is listed in the common list (disarm, brace, move by) with a weapon, or kisk, punch... or attack with a sword or attack with a melee weapon ?)

 

For 3 points, you may have +1 in 3 manoeuvers r a tight group of attacks (meaning whatever you do as manoeuver when you attack a +1 OCV with that kind of attack, lke sword, or +1 in Disarm, Move by and move throught with a sword...). Can't you use it for a +1 DCV against that type of attack ?

 

For 5 points, it is more generic, and you have +1 with a group of WF, or you can use it for a +1 DCV (but hten, only against the attacks you know ?)

 

8 points is fine since it is generic

 

And then, how do you record it on your character's sheets ?

[Blue]

Originally posted by Glabutz

My problem is more about what you can do with CSL.

 

For 2 points, you have a+1 OCV for an attack (which means one that is listed in the common list (disarm, brace, move by) with a weapon, or kisk, punch... or attack with a sword or attack with a melee weapon ?)

 

For 3 points, you may have +1 in 3 manoeuvers r a tight group of attacks (meaning whatever you do as manoeuver when you attack a +1 OCV with that kind of attack, lke sword, or +1 in Disarm, Move by and move throught with a sword...). Can't you use it for a +1 DCV against that type of attack ?

 

For 5 points, it is more generic, and you have +1 with a group of WF, or you can use it for a +1 DCV (but hten, only against the attacks you know ?)

 

8 points is fine since it is generic

 

And then, how do you record it on your character's sheets ?

 

Ah!

I've always had a tendancy to write the base OCV and DCV based on DEX into those spots (I'd add in any appropriate figures if I had a permanent size change). The "adjusted OCV and DCV" spaces that appear on some character sheets are for the more temporary modifications. If you always used the level you purchased for OCV then it might be ok to list it there, but generally I've always used those adjusted spots for temporary effects like shrinking, growth, and other OCV/DCV modifying effects. I think it used to be on the old-school sheets that they had spots for OCV/DCV, no "adjusted" figure, but a space to list your levels so you could do it at a glance. Now you have to refer to the SKILS portion of the sheet just before your attack.

 

"I'm going to attack with my energy blast" (Checks character sheet, sees 2 levels specifically with the EB), "I'll put one level in OCV and one in DCV".

 

I'm sure there are other things I can't think of off the top of my head that you might put into he "adj. OCV" and "adj. DCV" slots. If so, someone here will pipe in any second with them.

[Glabutz]

Ok, I've get that, thanks a lot.

 

That's one point for me, I guess

 

But how do the 3 first "levels" (2,3 and 5)OCV levels work ?

 

I'm not comfortable with the "for an attack", "+1 in 3 manoeuvers r a tight group of attacks" and the 5 points CSL Bonus.

[sbarron]

Hopefully a good example will help. Say you have a sword master with a 20 Dex, 3 levels with swords and 2 Hand-to-Hand levels. On your character sheet:

 

9 +3 w/ Swords

10 +2 w/ H-to-H

 

The levels with swords are 3 point levels, with swords being the tight group. The hand-to-hand are 5 point levels. the 9 and 10 listed above are the cost of these levels.

 

Our character above has a base OCV and DCV of 7 (20 Dex/3). When using the sword, he now has all the above levels to move around between his OCV and DCV. So he could have a 12 OCV and 7 DCV, 10 OCV and 9 DCV, 7 OCV and 12 DCV, or any combination utilizing the 5 levels.

 

These levels will be in addition to any other modifiers for the combat maneuver that the character happens to be doing. (Martial block provides an additional +2 OCV and +2 DCV for example.)

 

For any levels that the character puts in DCV, they will only be effective vs. hand-to-hand attacks. These levels will not increase his DCV vs. ranged attacks. The only levels that can be used as DCV vs. ranged attacks are 5 pt DCV levels (bought exclusively for DCV purposes) and the 8 pt All Combat levels.

 

In a herioc campaign (which you will be playing for Terran Empire), the swordmaster could also take 2 of the above levels and use them to increase the damage of his attack by 1 damage class. So if he could normally do 1 1/2 d6 with his sword, he could use two levels to make it 2d6.

 

If he were to attack someone with an axe, then he could only use the two H-t-h levels. Unless, of course, someone attacked him with a sword, then he could use his sword levels with DCV. I'll try to explain this below.

 

To answer some of you specific questions about the differing combat skill levels:

 

2 pt levels. Provide +1 OCV with weapon or attack of choice. So if our swordman above had +1 OCV w/ swords, then evey time he attacked with a sword, regardless of the maneuver he might be using, he would get a +1 OCV. Any additional mods from the maneurver would be included for determining OCV and DCV, however.

 

If he had bought +1 OCV with blocks, then whenever he performed a block, he would get +1 to his OCV. He would get this +1 OCV regardless of the weapon that he used, whether he had the appropriate familiarity with it, or whether he just blocked with his bare hands.

 

3 pt levels. You can buy it for a tight group like swords, pistols, axes, rifles, etc. You can also buy it for 3 maneuvers (Disarm, Move-by and move-through, to use your example). So long as you are using the weapon that you bought the levels for, you get the levels regardless of the Maneuver you are doing. The same is true for the 3 maneuver levels. Regardless of the weapon you may or may not use, so long as you are doing the maneuver you bought the level for, you get the levels.

 

The 3 pt levels are the first you can also use for DCV. If you are using a sword, and you have a 3 pt level with swords, you can use this level in DCV vs. any H-t-H attack. This is because you are using your swordsmanship to make it harder for you opponent to hit you. This is only good vs. H-t-H attacks.

 

In the event you are using a pistol, you could not use these sword levels to increase your DCV vs. H-t-H attacks in general. However, if someone were to attack you with a sword (and only a sword), then you could use your sword levels in DCV against that attack. This is because your skill with swords provides you with the knowledge to avoid getting hit by swords (you know how fast they move, their range, angle of attack, etc.)

 

5 pt levels are more generic. They can be purchased for a large group of attacks (US soldiers weapons, All Hand-to-Hand attacks, all ranged attacks, etc) or as +1 DCV. If you buy a 5 pt +1 DCV level, then this level is good against all attacks (including ranged). But all it is useful for is DCV.

 

If you buy +1 w/ H-t-H, then you get that level any time you are engaged in H-t-H fighting, for either OCV or DCV, regardless of the weapon you are using, etc. However, this level cannot be used for DCV against ranged attacks. If you are using a gun, and are attacked by a H-t-H attack, then just like the sword example above, you can use your knowledge of H-t-H combat to get +1 DCV versus all H-t-H attacks against you.

 

For ranged attacks levels (+1 w/ pistols, +1 with all ranged, etc), you cannot use these levels for DCV.

 

The 8 pt All combat levels can be used for anything, all the time. They can provide DCV vs. all attacks, OCV for all Attacks, and can be combined with other levels to increase damage.

 

Damn, that's a lot of typing. I hope this helps.

[Glabutz]

Damn, that's a lot of typing. I hope this helps.

 

Yes, a lot, really.

 

I think I got the point.

 

Ready to play next saturday

[sbarron]

Excellent! Be sure to stop back in and let us know how it goes.

[Glabutz]

Excellent! Be sure to stop back in and let us know how it goes.

 

Hi all.

 

I've ran my first Hero Game yesterday, and should ay that I'm quite happy with it, even if my feeling is "I must read all again and again".

 

OCV/DCV are quite hard to handle at first time. The differences in Dex give real and terrible OCV/DCV difference.

 

It was the first use of it, so a lot of questions were asked and I asked many of them, like :

 

1. Beginning charactr's OCV is quite low. What hapen with a 3 OCV charater trying to stike an opponant when he has -2 OCV (distance shot, for exemple). It is nt in the table

 

2. The armor surprised me a lot, and I think I didn't understand it. Well, in a Space Hero campaign, fire arms or lasers are useless. The 2D6 Ka are not enough to get trough the 12 or 15 DP/EP that normal armor hace. But, on the other hand, armors are quite useless against beam weapons that does 6d6 RKA... I must read again FREd and the armor rules

 

3. I NEED the spatial toolkit ! It is quite difficult to use, when you start, the weapons given in the Space Op. Does a power sword make a 3D RKA or a 5D RKA ?

Does beam weapons have a OCV bonus ?...

I was quite loss with all this... That is the consequennce of freedom, usually...

 

4. When you use a mental power, or an Ego attack, you have always to make a ECV roll, and then you roll the dice to see if you overthrow your opponent's Ego. Right ?

Then , should you do as if Ego was a kind of body points (then you can do several mind attacks to beat your opponant) ?

 

But it was a good game, and the rules are quite fine, once I'll have understood all the things I need.

 

But :

 

1. The GM toolkit need improvement : it would be nice to have the FREd's page reference on the booklet, so when you need a little mor einformation, you can find it quicker.

 

2. Few table miss, and I'd rather have those in it than the hexes pages. exemple : base force and Ego damages,

 

3. The GM screen is quite hard to use, because of the way it is made. Truly, it is really a neat thing to have a five panel screen, but it is hard to read things on all five panels...

But i won't complaint, since the screen is more than useful !

[caris]

Originally posted by Glabutz

Hi all.

 

I've ran my first Hero Game yesterday, and should ay that I'm quite happy with it, even if my feeling is "I must read all again and again".

 

OCV/DCV are quite hard to handle at first time. The differences in Dex give real and terrible OCV/DCV difference.

 

It was the first use of it, so a lot of questions were asked and I asked many of them, like :

 

1. Beginning charactr's OCV is quite low. What hapen with a 3 OCV charater trying to stike an opponant when he has -2 OCV (distance shot, for exemple). It is nt in the table

 

The table is just a handy reference to pre-calculate attack rolls. The book gives you the formula the table is based on (Attack Roll=11+OCV-DCV). I don’t own the GM’s Toolkit, so I don’t know if the formula is included on the GM screen. If it doesn’t you might want to consider writing it near the “to hit table†for when you have numbers outside the table. Also you will notice the numbers on the table shift by one for each change in OCV or DCV by one. If the DCV is on the table, find the roll for 3 OCV vs. that DCV and reduce the number by 2 to a minimum of 3. Personally, I find the alternate formula (11+OCV-3D6 Roll = DCV or less hit) more useful in play.

 

2. The armor surprised me a lot, and I think I didn't understand it. Well, in a Space Hero campaign, fire arms or lasers are useless. The 2D6 Ka are not enough to get trough the 12 or 15 DP/EP that normal armor hace. But, on the other hand, armors are quite useless against beam weapons that does 6d6 RKA... I must read again FREd and the armor rules

 

I don’t own Star Hero, yet, but I’m looking at my roommate’s copy. They are showing a lot of different styles of armor and weapons, and not every combination is going to work well together. The 6D6 RKA beam weapon is meant for vehicle combat, and not as an anti-personnel weapon. The armor you used is supposed to be full body armor like Bobba Fet wore, it shouldn't stop a ship's gun. Part of the discrepancy is to keep PCs from dying or being maimed too quickly. You might consider moving from the laser weapons to the blaster. The combat will still not be very lethal, but more stun should be get through. Also the equipment in Star Hero is examples, you can re-design it to meet the needs of your campaign, either bump up the weapons, or reduce the armor.

 

3. I NEED the spatial toolkit ! It is quite difficult to use, when you start, the weapons given in the Space Op. Does a power sword make a 3D RKA or a 5D RKA ?

Does beam weapons have a OCV bonus ?...

I was quite loss with all this... That is the consequennce of freedom, usually...

 

According to the rules for damage shield (5ed p 163), when you attack with the power sword it does 3D6 KA, since the damage shield part of the sword only has a +1/2 advantage for damage shield. If you use the weapon to successfully block an attack it would do 2D6 KA to whatever it blocked.

 

None of the ship beam weapons that I looked at included an OCV bonus inherent to the weapon, but I think they are intended to work with some sort of targeting system, built into the ship, either using sensors or computers.

 

4. When you use a mental power, or an Ego attack, you have always to make a ECV roll, and then you roll the dice to see if you overthrow your opponent's Ego. Right ?

Then , should you do as if Ego was a kind of body points (then you can do several mind attacks to beat your opponant) ?

 

You make an ECV vs. ECV attack roll. It is like a OCV vs. DCV roll. Ego attack takes away from your stun. The other mental powers need to reach a certainly level over the targets EGO. It is usually an all or nothing effect for powers other than Ego attack. Mental Illusion, Mind Control, Telepathy, etc. can only stack with themselves over multiple attacks if they have the advantage Cumulative on them (5ed p 78-82).

 

But it was a good game, and the rules are quite fine, once I'll have understood all the things I need.

 

Glad you had fun. You might want to copy your suggestion for improving the Toolkit to the company questions threads.

 

But :

 

1. The GM toolkit need improvement : it would be nice to have the FREd's page reference on the booklet, so when you need a little mor einformation, you can find it quicker.

 

2. Few table miss, and I'd rather have those in it than the hexes pages. exemple : base force and Ego damages,

 

3. The GM screen is quite hard to use, because of the way it is made. Truly, it is really a neat thing to have a five panel screen, but it is hard to read things on all five panels...

But i won't complaint, since the screen is more than useful !