Finding Invisible Woman

[Bengalelf]

First off, I would like to thank everyone who answered my Entangle Abuse thread. You gave me some good ideas. So good that I would like to ask another question. My wife is playing an egoist that can go invisible. She has bought invisible to sight, hearing, mental, touch, and Radar.

I really don't mind it because her defenses are only 10/10. I would like some ideas on how to see her to attack her. Besides the old Wolverine smell her. I have enclosed a hdc. copy of her character as I did with Treeant.

My problem is that she likes to hang back behind the party and cast ego blast. A very good tactic, but very hard to find her. There are always at least five hexes from her to a villain. I have done the old explosion, but I was wondering what other ideas people have....

[Vigil]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Sure. Here's a suggestion. Give one of your villains a favorite of mine "Detect Invisible Objects" . It can be defined as any sort of sense you like but it's purpose is to do exactly what you've described and that's find invisble things that otherwise can't be found.

 

Other options: Danger Sense bought as a sense (hyper intuition?) with the "local area" adder would do it. If an NPC with this kind of DI made their roll by half they'd be able to attack her at their full OCV value so maybe give the NPC a 20- base roll to make things interesting.

 

Mind Scan works also since it's not targeting her byphysical PER it's targeting her by ECV and, inherently, you don't have to see one to find them via Mind Scan. Again given enough of a multiple you can use Mind Scan to attack the PCs. For an even nastier surprise have some NPC buy a powerful Mind Scan with some other punchy Mentalist abilities and then buy the "One Way Link" (+1) advantage.

 

Then when your done kicking the snot out of your wife's PC...buy her flowers or its couch time for you.

 

Take the word of one who knows.

 

 

Vigil

[Iuz the Evil]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

'Special Sense Group' powers are good for this as well. Things like N-Ray Vision, Spatial Awareness with wierd 'sfx' (Air Elementalists who sense the displacement of atmosphere, Dark Mystics who sense 'life force', that kind of stuff).

 

Ego Damage shield and plenty of Mental Defense on the big, stupid looking brick type (he's dumb, but has 'Iron Will') is another fun trick to bust out once in a campaign or so on the team Mentalist. Usually good for a chuckle by the player too, if they've got a sense of humor about it (and assuming the GM doesn't go crazy with this trick).

[McCoy]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Don't have HD on his machine. Does the ego blast have invisible power effect? If not, when she fires it, I think anyone with mental awareness would be able to at least pick out the hex it came from.

 

Humm, if I understand the Sx, she's not "really" invisible, but her power blocks other people's perception of her, correct? A Cap-like character with lots of skill levels would be able to pick out the hex they can't look into.

 

A power stunt I probably would allow, if one character has flash and his teammates has flash defense, the teammates would hold action, he sets off his flash at his best guess where she is, if the teammates have enough flash defense to not be blinded themselves and make a PER roll, they fire at the base of the sourceless shadow.

[pinecone]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

The old invisable mentalist trick...The most "reasonable" counter is danger sense, countermeasures are things like a small AE entangle (mentalists are usually puny) tempararaly flooding a floor and looking for holes in the water, tossing a fine powder into the air and coating everything. A nasty counter to mental powers in general is blinding the mentalist. Line of sight is not so hot with no sight...Flash and Darkness work fine for that. Images as an attack can work for paint getting splatted onto her, after that you'l have to get real esoteric...her invisability is too good, it leaves you with too few options to counter it, though if her defenses are light a team of trained attack dogs could be real amusing... or even a "pointer" and a good shotgun might do the trick...

[Curufea]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Infrared isn't that uncommon a sense, military enemies may use it to find her. Plus you could use area affect attacks on the group - grenades and so forth.

[CraterMaker]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

I have a Villian Magician with a "Reveal the Unseen" spell, Dispel Invisibility Area Effect.. And I'm not too familiar with all the versions of Defence Manuever, but I think at the higher levels it gives some options versus Invisable characters.

 

As was mentioned above, if her Ego Blast is not bought as Invisible Power Effect then mental senses will detect the attack, allowing targeting against the invisible character with the normal penalties for attacking invisible people.

 

-CraterMaker

[Bloodstone]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Ok, reading over her character sheet, you should really define the SFX of her powers more.

 

For example, looking at her powers I have no idea how her entangle is supposed to work at all, as it lacks so much as a name. Does she hold things with bands of pure mental force? Does she shut down people minds? Does she need to wrap chains or similar objects around her targets in order to restrain them? The same problem crops up with her invisibility. It's not well defined, so I can't say for certain how you would go about countering it.

 

As mentalist, I would assume it is supposed to be a telepathic "ignore my presence" sort of invisibility. If so, then it might not work against machines, animals or aliens because they have a differnt class of mnds (her telepathy has no class listed, so I assume it's Human). It also might not work against a taget whose mind she is unaware of.

 

None of her attacks have IPE, so mentalists will be able to percive her when she uses Ego Blast, Telepathy or Mind Control. In fact, her TK and Entangle are not built BOECV so ANYONE can percive her if she uses them.

 

Also, she lacks any actual Stealth type skills, so she may do some things "wrong" while invisible that a keen observer would still notice. Tracks in the sand and that sort of thing.

 

You said she only has 10/10 Defenses. In fact she has 22/25 when her force field is up, which should be nearly all the time since it is 0 End. So I would feel no remorse laying on some AoE attacks, since she should be able to take them.

 

If you really want to be evil, you could introduce a villian that uses the same or similar tactics. She has no Mental Defense and she only has 20 Stun, so a 6d6 Ego Attack is going to be a one hit KO on an average roll.

 

Oh, and I just noticed she is a mutant that is detectable on mutant scanners. Time to introduce some Sentinels and/or high tech mutant haters.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Well, allowing it on so many senses and sense groups makes it tough to penetrate. I'd normally require such a character to limit the Invisibility in some way (perhaps a certain level of Mental Defense blocks it, or the character cannot move quickly, or mus concentrate, while using it). Since I don't have HD here, maybe you can tell me whether her Invisibility has been purchased No Firnge. if not, that's how you detect her.

 

Mental senses to detect her attacks and extrapolate the source have been suggested. Any physical attacks (like Entangle) are visible, so that also allows extrapolating to source. With that taken care of, areas ofeffect are the best way to target her. She only has 10/10 defenses, so she'll take the hit. If stunned, she becomes visible.

 

You said she only has 10/10 Defenses. In fact she has 22/25 when her force field is up' date=' which should be nearly all the time since it is 0 End. [/quote']

 

Unless the Field has invisible power effects, it will be visible even if she isn't, so it looks like she has to choose between enhanced prtectiopn from damage and limited ability to be perceived.

 

You mention she likes to hang back. How good is her movement? Note that movement powers are visible. If the fight moves away from her, can she keep up? At sdome point, maintaining a line of sight for her mental powers will become problematic.

 

You might consider searching the boards for "mentalist sniper", by the way. This is a common issue, and a mentalist who can fire away while immune to counteratack is widely viewed as amongst the most abusive of technically legal character constructs. My favorite example is the guy with Tunnelling (close hole), N Ray Vision and mental attacks.

[RomanMetal]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Another idea: Use the movies as a guide. Drop paint to her as an area attack, if the paint hits her she's visible!

 

Yet another one: She may not emit sound, but does that means that she can step on something that will make a sound if steped on, like glass or broken wood, and don't emit any sound anyway?

[J. Chamberlin]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

We have a ghost character in our group that uses a Special Sense Group perception power called "Lifesight". Basically, if you are a living thing with a heartbeat, he can see you (ever see "The Chronicles of Riddick"?).

Unfortunatley for him, he also had to buy "Deathsight" and Spatial Awareness so he could sense everything else without a heartbeat, but thats his problem. As far as detecting her goes, maybe try something like that.

 

j

[Cancer]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

A trick that works for protecting places (like evil villain fortresses) against characters with high-end Invisibility powers is have air in the entry routes weakly doped with a mildly radioactive gas, or perhaps dusty with (again) a weakly radioactive substance. Nothing that will trigger defenses against radiation damage, show up as a poison, or anything like that. This isn't all that useful for finding invisible types in a fight, but for handling the ninja-type ultra-stealth intruders doing spying, burglary, or perhaps assassination, it's an inobvious but effective way of doing the burglar alarm function.

 

Especially if you ingest it in any way, that low-level radioactivity will show up easily to pretty standard radiation counters. And it takes quite a while to get it all out of your system. The underlings staffing the inner parts of the fortress either live there full-time, or have to spend a week in the cooling-off area before returning to their duty stations.

 

So when the secret ninja assassin penetrates into the sensitive parts, then the counters pick up the presence of an intruder easily.

[Guest Major Tom]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

Well, if the other side's got a gadgeteer (and they happen to think of it), he or

she could put together an ammonia sniffer gun. Since human beings give off

detectable traces of ammonia when they sweat, this would be one way to

spot an otherwise unseen enemy. Hook it up to the targeting systems of a

battlesuit trooper (if there's one in the group) and that's all she wrote.

 

 

The idea for this came from the movie Assassination, in which the First

Lady had been marked for assassination, and the Secret Service was trying

to figure out how they could spot a hidden hit squad before they could kill

her. The chief agent of her protection detail suggested that helicopters with

ammonia sniffers could be used to spot any human presence anywhere along

the First Lady's route even if it was concealed.

 

Major Tom

Long Life Through Superior Firepower

[Kirby]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

My wife is playing an egoist that can go invisible. She has bought invisible to sight, hearing, mental, touch, and Radar.

I really don't mind it because her defenses are only 10/10. I would like some ideas on how to see her to attack her.

For a correction, she has higher defenses than 10/10. Her PD is 22/20 and her ED is 25/20 (having a 0 END 20/20 Force Field).

While you've covered smell, other methods include, Mystical detection, Danger Sense (where appropriate), Detect (both Invisible & Mutants at the minimum) and Spatial Awareness. Remember that she didn't purchase the "No Fringe" so there is a tell-tale sign for those looking in her direction, especially if she moves. Plus, anyone attacked by her through Ego powers will know where she's at, as well as anyone with Mental Awareness. Since she can't be heard while invisible, her Mind Link should clue in any mentalist (as well as those with Mental Awareness).

 

My problem is that she likes to hang back behind the party and cast ego blast. A very good tactic' date=' but very hard to find her. There are always at least five hexes from her to a villain. I have done the old explosion, but I was wondering what other ideas people have....[/quote']

If any of your villains have a Batman-like detective, (even though unlikely) they should be able to see evidence of her passing (there was a good comic once where Batman & Superman were tracking an invisible person, Superman used his super-hearing while Batman saw the impressions in the grass made by the villain's feet).

 

A more likely detector would be a mentalist villain who does a simple Mind Scan. I think a likely scenario would deal with Genocide using mutant-detecting scanners to find her (since she is hunted by them) as well as other mutants. VIPER may start using the same once they realize there is a "missing" member, if they aren't aware of her already. I see a justification for either organization using AE/Explosion attacks, including entangles.

 

As an aside: My personal opinion is that with her Invisibility covering such a wide range and being at 0 END, that her power level of 20/20 for the FF is too high (though it's nice she doesn't have it hardened). Obviously, you may see it differently with what attacks/defenses are in your own campaign, but I bring it up since you were under the impression it was only 10/10.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

As an aside: My personal opinion is that with her Invisibility covering such a wide range and being at 0 END' date=' that her power level of 20/20 for the FF is too high (though it's nice she doesn't have it hardened). Obviously, you may see it differently with what attacks/defenses are in your own campaign, but I bring it up since you were under the impression it was only 10/10.[/quote']

 

I would agree only if the Force Field is similarly iunvisible. Otherwise, it is mutually exclusive from being invisible (her FF is still visible to three sense groups).

 

If it is fully Invisible, that's a lot of points!

[Kirby]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

I would agree only if the Force Field is similarly iunvisible. Otherwise, it is mutually exclusive from being invisible (her FF is still visible to three sense groups).

 

If it is fully Invisible, that's a lot of points!

You know, I was under the impression that the FF would be invisible as well; however, I just read up on it in FREd and I believe you are correct, that the Force Field would show.

 

Now, as GM, I would inform the player of this and say we'd have to take it into account henceforth, but wouldn't penalize her for past happenstance. Also, I'd request she get rid of the Invisibility to Touch Group aspect, but that's me.

 

If the player wanted to have the invisibile power affects (and still keep the power at 60 active points), I would allow her to change the FF to 15/15, but costs END, or have her change it to 13/14 (or 14/13) with 1/2 END.

[TheEmerged]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

A classic invisibility hoser -- "Detect Use of Superpowers". Be warned that this one can create campaign issues if it is widely available.

[Tim]

Re: Finding Invisible Woman

 

I haven't read anything, but in line with the special senses; Daredevil's radar sense should be able to "see" and invisible opponent. She is still solid after all and can bounce radar and sound waves.