Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

[MitchellS]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Right' date=' but I don't see an [i']oil slick[/i], swinging, and sonic attack being in the same tight group, other than saying "but, GM, they both come in arrow form." Like I said, I find it munchkiny, but YMMV.

I don't find it munchkiny. He's shooting an arrow not an oil slick. What happens when it impacts has no bearing on how it got to the impact point.

[Kirby]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

OK' date=' it is pet peve time.[/color']

 

El Dorado: Brazil?

El Sauriano: Brazil?

What the #^@&?

Brazil is the 5th largest country in the world in both area and population. It is the world's 9th largest economy. Would it kill you guys to do ten seconds of research to find out that the language spoken there is Portuguese, not Spanish.

And what is up with El Dorado anyway? El Dorado is a Columbian/Spanish myth, not Brazilian/Portuguese. If you want a place of lost treasure why not go with Salamanca do Jarau, the hidden cave of treasure. If you just want a name from myth/fokelore there are a number of options.

 

Grumble, grumble, grumble...

Oh, man, that is just too funny! (In a sad way, of course.) I guess hoping there would be a capoeira-using NPC is out of the question?

[Kirby]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I don't find it munchkiny. He's shooting an arrow not an oil slick. What happens when it impacts has no bearing on how it got to the impact point.

Well, congratulations to you. I didn't say you had to find it munchkiny. I said I did. As in my opinion. (Why is it so hard for some to accept others' opinions? )

[MitchellS]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Well' date=' congratulations to you. I didn't say [b']you[/b] had to find it munchkiny. I said I did. As in my opinion. (Why is it so hard for some to accept others' opinions? )

I think you should drink a little less coffee this late in the evening brother. You said YMMV, I was just agreeing with you.

[Kirby]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I think you should drink a little less coffee this late in the evening brother. You said YMMV' date=' I was just agreeing with you.[/quote']

Ah, see, I didn't realize the opposite view was agreeing, since you didn't mention a qualifier on YMMV.

[st barbara]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

OK' date=' it is pet peve time.[/color']

 

El Dorado: Brazil?

El Sauriano: Brazil?

What the #^@&?

Brazil is the 5th largest country in the world in both area and population. It is the world's 9th largest economy. Would it kill you guys to do ten seconds of research to find out that the language spoken there is Portuguese, not Spanish.

And what is up with El Dorado anyway? El Dorado is a Columbian/Spanish myth, not Brazilian/Portuguese. If you want a place of lost treasure why not go with Salamanca do Jarau, the hidden cave of treasure. If you just want a name from myth/fokelore there are a number of options.

 

Grumble, grumble, grumble...

Colombian ! Oh damn ! I put my version of "El Dorado" (Actually I used "El Guerrero Dorado", trying to mean "The Golden Warrior") in Peru !

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

This is what was in the playtest. The book hasn't arrived at my FLGS yet for me to verify.

 

Heroes:

 

El Dorado: Brazil

 

 

Villains:

 

El Sauriano: Brazil

 

Here is a good reason to don't buy this book. What Steve made was a great geographic mistake. Brazil is a country which DON'T SPEAK SPANISH! What he made was a big mistake. What he did for the brazilians means the same call the korean guy at the next corner mini mart Chinese or Japanese, or say "Canadians are washed out americans". I even said I could help him with Brazil and Latin America part in a past e-mail, exactly to avoid this kind of thing.

[Steve Long]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I didn't make any such mistake. I'm well aware that Portuguese is spoken in Brazil. But that doesn't mean that every Brazilian superhuman has a Portuguese name, any more than every American superhuman has one in English.

 

El Dorado is a name based on a common myth, chosen by a character who fights crime throughout South America, not just in Brazil. Changing the name would deprive it of its impact for the vast majority of readers. His personal name (given him by Brazilian parents) and the name of his company (founded and registered in Brazil) are both Portuguese.

 

El Sauriano is from Argentina, not Brazil. There's no mention of Brazil in his background; his name should be in Spanish.

 

Characters specifically associated with Brazil, such as some heroes mentioned on CWW 101 and Os Predatores on CWW 102, have Portuguese names.

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

OK' date=' it is pet peve time.[/color']

 

El Dorado: Brazil?

El Sauriano: Brazil?

What the #^@&?

Brazil is the 5th largest country in the world in both area and population. It is the world's 9th largest economy. Would it kill you guys to do ten seconds of research to find out that the language spoken there is Portuguese, not Spanish.

And what is up with El Dorado anyway? El Dorado is a Columbian/Spanish myth, not Brazilian/Portuguese. If you want a place of lost treasure why not go with Salamanca do Jarau, the hidden cave of treasure. If you just want a name from myth/fokelore there are a number of options.

 

Grumble, grumble, grumble...

 

 

Indeed. Brazilian Folklore is pretty rich is super types wannabes. Do you want a typical anti hero or vigilant type who plays capoeira, go check Rio de Janeiro's urban mithology and take one of several "wiseguys" who lived at Lapa and their fights against the cops. Some of them had mithologic fights aginst even 10 cops in a single fight (and god bless the Capoeira) without mess with the suit.

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Characters specifically associated with Brazil, such as some heroes mentioned on CWW 101 and Os Predatores on CWW 102, have Portuguese names.

 

Just a lil nitpicking Steve, it is Os PredaDores and not Os Predatores. (unless the team uses a pretty common economic trick here, the so called Pre-dated checks)

[Steve Long]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

My bad for working from memory -- actually the word used in the book is Depredatores, which according to my dictionary is a valid choice for what I want. In any event it's sufficient for gaming purposes.

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

My bad for working from memory -- actually the word used in the book is Depredatores' date=' which according to my dictionary is a valid choice for what I want. In any event it's sufficient for gaming purposes.[/quote']

 

apologizes accept.

 

By the way, I am working at Tropical Terror and the Latin America region books proposals. Wait for the proposes at your desk next year.

[Blade]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Actually the part I liked the best was the "thumbnail" drawing of Rashindar on page 61, where he looks more "Native American" Indian, than "Home of Ghandi and the Taj Mahal" Indian (feathers, beads, warpaint, etc).

 

That being said, a previous poster had a comment about the absence of Rashindar's six arms. I think that the drawing on pg 65 shows definite hints of the other four arms and the write up mentions illusions to hide them being common tricks of Rashindar.

 

Overall I was very impressed with the write-ups and most of the art, good mix of original concepts with comic-book classics (had to have a Nazi with powered armor--Great villian, one of my favorites).

 

I did find it interesting that many of the heroes, particularly bricks, who were built on close to "starting character" point levels have absolutely devastating offensive capabilities (as compared to the published 350 point Champions). For example: Corrente: 15d6 strike, Fist of Allah: 14d6, Anvil: 19d6, Brigade: 15d6. I was wondering, for all the GMs out there, How many of you would allow a beginning level character (under 400 points) to have this kind of offense? Either in straight up STR, or STR plus HA or Martial Arts? Particularly Anvil seems to be very powerful for the number of points he is built on. I love the character (super-fanboy to the rescue!..Ooops...Sorry 'bout that...), but a 382 point hero (no glaring weaknesses either) that has a fair chance, solo, against Grond? Wow.

[MitchellS]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

That being said' date=' a previous poster had a comment about the absence of Rashindar's six arms. I think that the drawing on pg 65 shows definite hints of the other four arms and the write up mentions illusions to hide them being common tricks of Rashindar.[/quote']

If a character has a defining characteristics like 6 arms then it should be shown within the character portrait, IMO.

 

I did find it interesting that many of the heroes, particularly bricks, who were built on close to "starting character" point levels have absolutely devastating offensive capabilities (as compared to the published 350 point Champions). For example: Corrente: 15d6 strike, Fist of Allah: 14d6, Anvil: 19d6, Brigade: 15d6. I was wondering, for all the GMs out there, How many of you would allow a beginning level character (under 400 points) to have this kind of offense? Either in straight up STR, or STR plus HA or Martial Arts? Particularly Anvil seems to be very powerful for the number of points he is built on. I love the character (super-fanboy to the rescue!..Ooops...Sorry 'bout that...), but a 382 point hero (no glaring weaknesses either) that has a fair chance, solo, against Grond? Wow.

Well 5Er recommends up to 14d6 attacks for a 350 point "starting" character so most of the NPCs are not that far away from that total. Anvil is the exception to the norm, and personally I like exceptions. Trying to make everyone fit into the same character design mold is a bad thing, IMO. As for Grond, while a lot of people do hold him up as the beacon for might within the CU we found the character to be very weak in actual combat and there are many other CU NPCs who can rip him a new one without much trouble.

[st barbara]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I suppose it is to be expected that the book would have a capoerista (er however it is spelt) in Brazil. I did that too; a character called "Danca Il Sombra" (Supposed to translate as "Shadow Dancer") who can also "duplicate" himself by animating his shadow !

[Blade]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

If a character has a defining characteristics like 6 arms then it should be shown within the character portrait' date=' IMO. [/quote']

 

I would like to have seen the six arms also, but I think that the drawing reflects the character write-up fairly well.

 

Well 5Er recommends up to 14d6 attacks for a 350 point "starting" character so most of the NPCs are not that far away from that total. Anvil is the exception to the norm' date=' and personally I like exceptions. Trying to make everyone fit into the same character design mold is a bad thing, IMO. As for Grond, while a lot of people do hold him up as the beacon for might within the CU we found the character to be very weak in actual combat and there are many other CU NPCs who can rip him a new one without much trouble.[/quote']

 

I'm all for variation, just wondered how many would allow that much variation in a PC. Admittedly, most of my Champions experience was 4e, with characters starting at 250 points, so many of the published characters trip my "OMG" reflex, but if 10-14 DC with 20-25 DEF is considered the norm, then I would think a GM would have to consider carefully a PC with 19 DC attacks and 41 PD. Just asking the question, and I'm sure the answer for a specific character would depend on the player, write-up specifics, etc. I don't think Grond is the supreme combat machine, but he's pretty tough, and I was surprised to see a character described as inexperienced who looked like a match, one-on-one.

[MitchellS]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I'm all for variation' date=' just wondered how many would allow that much variation in a PC. Admittedly, most of my Champions experience was 4e, with characters starting at 250 points, so many of the published characters trip my "OMG" reflex, but if 10-14 DC with 20-25 DEF is considered the norm, then I would think a GM would have to consider carefully a PC with 19 DC attacks and 41 PD.[/quote']

The main thing to keep in mind though is that Anvil is not a PC he is an NPC. It's sort of like comparing Colossus to Nightcrawler. They can both be 350 point PCs but they have very different power levels.

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I suppose it is to be expected that the book would have a capoerista (er however it is spelt) in Brazil. I did that too; a character called "Danca Il Sombra" (Supposed to translate as "Shadow Dancer") who can also "duplicate" himself by animating his shadow !

 

The right name could be Dançarino (or Dançarina if the character is female) das Solmbras.

 

I liked the concept, it is pretty good to the "real" nature of capoeira. Capoeira was for over a century considered an illegal martial arts, the main reason is because the way it was fought. Capoeira wasn't a martial arts associated to long fights, a good fighter misguide the enemy and deliver some fast attacks, so he can escape or finish the combat as soon as possible. And sometimes some of the fighters said to the cops they never touched the enemy, but his shadow did, so if you had to jail something you had to jail the shadow.

[st barbara]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Well while my translations from English to Portugese may be pretty awful it's nice to know that I got the idea of the character right !(Even if it was by accident )

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Well while my translations from English to Portugese may be pretty awful it's nice to know that I got the idea of the character right !(Even if it was by accident )

 

Yeah. But once you see Capoeira being played by the Mestres you must wonder if they are fighting or the fight are being set by their shadows

[Bartman]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I didn't make any such mistake. I'm well aware that Portuguese is spoken in Brazil. But that doesn't mean that every Brazilian superhuman has a Portuguese name, any more than every American superhuman has one in English.

 

El Dorado is a name based on a common myth, chosen by a character who fights crime throughout South America, not just in Brazil. Changing the name would deprive it of its impact for the vast majority of readers. His personal name (given him by Brazilian parents) and the name of his company (founded and registered in Brazil) are both Portuguese.

 

El Sauriano is from Argentina, not Brazil. There's no mention of Brazil in his background; his name should be in Spanish.

 

Characters specifically associated with Brazil, such as some heroes mentioned on CWW 101 and Os Predatores on CWW 102, have Portuguese names.

 

Alright, I can accept that. At the time a wrote my earlier post I was only working off of the list that MitchellS had posted. I have actually picked up the book now and most of my complaints have gone away. I'm sorry to have gone off half cocked. But it is a pet peve of mine. For such a large and significant nation, I'm consistantly suprised by how many Americans think Brazilians speak Spanish. None the less I apologize for accusing you of having made that assumption.

 

That said, I still find the idea of a Brazilian intentionally taking a Spanish alter-ego rather far-fetched. Most of the Brazilians I know are intensly proud of their language and culture. A Spanish named/themed hero in Brazil would be like a German named hero in France, someone not likely to ever be fully accepted and embraced. I understand your reasoning above, American audience and all that. I just personally wish, if you had to have an El Dorado, that you had made him Columbian or Peruvian. And that the only Brazilian hero ever published by Hero Games actually had a Portuguese hero name.

[eavatar]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

That said, I still find the idea of a Brazilian intentionally taking a Spanish alter-ego rather far-fetched. Most of the Brazilians I know are intensly proud of their language and culture. A Spanish named/themed hero in Brazil would be like a German named hero in France, someone not likely to ever be fully accepted and embraced. I understand your reasoning above, American audience and all that. I just personally wish, if you had to have an El Dorado, that you had made him Columbian or Peruvian. And that the only Brazilian hero ever published by Hero Games actually had a Portuguese hero name.

 

I really miss Jaguar, he was a plausible brazilian, we even could say from which state he came from. But now the spanish vs portuguese, hte partial informations which we get from the books/posters and complementing that the constant mistakes set by americans about Brazil is something which can be frustating for the few brazilian fans of Hero. Usually a brazilian on internet have to explain a lot about the country to the americans. More even if the american thinks he can speak spanish with us thinking we speak spanish like the other latin americans.

 

And trust me, this kind of mistakes helps to build the anti american feelings. One classic case related to the american negligency happened with President Reagan when he was in a tour at Latin America, the people here still remember this mistake because it was a HUGE diplomatic mistake set by President Reagan - he said "Nobody stop Bolivia" during a lunch set in Brasilia, at presence of a general-president which was losing the control over the country to give room for democracy and the lunch theme was exactly the kind of aid which USA could give to us during the whole democratic transition process.

[Starlord]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

I really miss Jaguar, he was a plausible brazilian, we even could say from which state he came from. But now the spanish vs portuguese, hte partial informations which we get from the books/posters and complementing that the constant mistakes set by americans about Brazil is something which can be frustating for the few brazilian fans of Hero. Usually a brazilian on internet have to explain a lot about the country to the americans. More even if the american thinks he can speak spanish with us thinking we speak spanish like the other latin americans.

 

And trust me, this kind of mistakes helps to build the anti american feelings. One classic case related to the american negligency happened with President Reagan when he was in a tour at Latin America, the people here still remember this mistake because it was a HUGE diplomatic mistake set by President Reagan - he said "Nobody stop Bolivia" during a lunch set in Brasilia, at presence of a general-president which was losing the control over the country to give room for democracy and the lunch theme was exactly the kind of aid which USA could give to us during the whole democratic transition process.

 

The problems you discuss are typical of human beings, not Americans. Perhaps a mistake was made. My goodness, if this builds anti-American feelings within a person, then that is OBVIOUSLY the unfortunate problem of that person. For example, it would be like me feeling anti-Brazilian sentiment over the many English grammatical mistakes you've made in your posts in this thread. I'm sure they could be just as easily corrected as any mistakes Mr. Long might have made, yet nobody felt like invading you over them or anything.

[Supreme Serpent]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

Maybe in the CU Brazil was colonized by Spain.

[Greg]

Re: Just Picked Up Champions Worldwide

 

President Reagan - he said "Nobody stop Bolivia" during a lunch set in Brasilia' date=' at presence of a general-president which was losing the control over the country to give room for democracy and the lunch theme was exactly the kind of aid which USA could give to us during the whole democratic transition process.[/quote']

 

So we were there giving aid, but we're bad guys because of a brain fart?

 

Back on topic (sorry didn't mean to go all NGD on the thread) I'm simulataneously reading the thread on RPG.net on CW and somebody mentioned that a common pitfall for these types of books is the tendency to flavor characters with local color. Australian superheroes with crocodiles or Canadian hockey players or what have you. I've seen the book, but haven't sat down with it yet. What kind of things does the book do to make a character distinctive to a particular region? Or is there anything? My concern about getting the book is that I could take any other CU character and just give them a foreign sounding name.