How to do X2 Effect (SPOILER)

[LadyChaos]

SPOILER WARNING ... I'm referring to something that happened in X2, so if you haven't seen the movie and don't want to be spoiled stop now!

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Okay, I think that should be enough spaces.

 

How would you right up Jean's ability to hold off Scott's energy blast? How can TK grab something that is essentially light? That makes no sense to me. I can see it with water, since it's physical, but Cyclops' blast stymies me.

[Archon]

IMHO, that was just the special effect of either a force field or force wall. Nothing special to it.

[Monolith]

Well, I am not sure that Cyclop's eye beams are light. They hit with physical force and can be used to move objects at low intensity, so in game tersm I would rule them as affected PD, not ED. As far as the movie goes, it could either be a SFX of Missile Deflection or even a form of Force Wall.

[Publius]

I thought they were always described as Force-Beams as well... but it has been a while since reading the X-comics for me. It may thus simply be the synergy of the SFX involved that allowed her to do that: TK Shield v. Forcebeam.

[JohnathanChance]

Cyclops eyebeams have always had a concussive force to them, when he was younger he fine tuned his control by playing pool...without the cue stick...

[Old Man]

Cyclops used his eye-beams on "wide" to safely levitate a thrown refrigerator to the ground in X-Men #46. No, it really doesn't make sense.

 

I should point out that all EBs do knockback in Hero, not just the physical ones. I'd count Jean's keen beam scene as a force wall, or perhaps missile deflection.

 

Speaking of Jean, (extreme spoiler alert!),

 

 

why did she have to leave the plane at the end of the movie? She'd already demonstrated that she didn't need LOS to pop a rocket.

[Killer Shrike]

Jean has a Force Field, SFX: TK

 

TK can be confusing to new players because it is both the name of a Power and a term used to define the 'Mind over Matter' Special Effect.

 

Most 'Telekinetic' characters will have the actual power Telekinesis AND other powers like Force Field (TK Shield), Force Wall (TK Wall), Flight (TK Flight), and Energy Blast (TK Punch).

 

Multipowers or Elemental Controls serve TK based characters well.

 

 

As a side note, Cyclops does indeed project 'concussive force'. His eyeblasts, thanx to the wonders of Comic Book Science, were not lasers but rather just ranged force. EB vs PD. He has even used it at times to slow a fall. He also used to bouce it off of non-reflective objects, like a ball.

 

Now, why this force does not rip the glasses/visor from his head, or why his neck doesnt get broken when he shoots a blast at someone due to action/reaction is best explained away in HERO's terms as Personal Immunity

 

Back in the day, characters didnt have Killing Attacks, and that included cutting eye-beams due to the Comics Code, so you end up with 'energy projectors' that effect the world more like water cannons.

 

Of course, on the other hand when he needs it to, Cyclops has been able to use his beams to weld, cut through metal, things like that.

 

Not to start the Cyclops debate again, but I would hazard a guess that he would have a Multipower with 2 or 3 variations on EB and an RKA slot only usable on Inanimate objects.

[Tech]

Originally posted by Old Man

Speaking of Jean, (extreme spoiler alert!),

 

 

why did she have to leave the plane at the end of the movie? She'd already demonstrated that she didn't need LOS to pop a rocket.

 

Hoping not to get offtopic but I'm guessing they set it up so if they wanted to do the Phoenix saga, they could. The possible hint is the fire in her eyes.

 

As to blocking it, I agree with the others than it's Missile Deflection or Force Wall. However, I'd add that there might be some sort of limitation thrown in there to reflect that as she shoved the energy backwards (and Cyclops really cut loose at that point), both of them got blown backwards. Mutual cancellation.

 

Hm, mutual cancellation... it could also mean that she used Dispel or Suppress vs EB with a limitation of some sort that she took some of the damage, hence the knockback.

[Pattern Ghost]

Originally posted by Old Man

 

Speaking of Jean, (extreme spoiler alert!),

 

 

why did she have to leave the plane at the end of the movie? She'd already demonstrated that she didn't need LOS to pop a rocket.

 

There were two explanations offered in the X-2 thread, both of which make sense:

 

1. She can't pick herself up by her bootstraps and fly. Since she lifted the jet to clear it from the onrushing water while it was powering up, she had to be outside, b/c she couldn't lift it with herself in it.

 

2. The Phoenix Force told her to. She looks like she's having some internal conflict right before she decides to do it..or is that showing communication with the Phoenix Force? Maybe she made a deal, her life/body for her friends?

 

Also interesting to note that although the characters discussed it, nobody brought it up as being a limitation of her powers, other than the mention of her previously feeling inhibited in cutting loose with her powers. So, it may be that she was able to cut loose, but didn't feel she had enough control to do so in the confined space of the plane.

 

I'd guess that she's definately going to become the Phoenix (and hopefully Dark Phoenix for some real fun), and that the explanation will be (based on the voiceover at the end) that she's further mutated, spontaneously evolved. Maybe have her in a TK coccoon at the bottom of the lake. Of course, that explanation will make it slightly tougher to de-power her later, but that bridge can be burned when they get to it.

[Pattern Ghost]

On the deflection, I'd go with a force wall, maybe with feedback for the KB effect.

[Killer Shrike]

Force Wall would collapse and some would get through, or she wouldnt take any KB.

 

If she was holding an action and Dexed off to a simultaneous resolution, and was using FF to stop the attack (Passive) and attacked Cyke back with a TK Push as her action, then they both could take knockback from each others attacks.

 

But whatever.

 

 

 

Alternately, there are rules in NinjaHERO to do opposed attack powers, ie using 1 attack power to block another attack power, like Egg and Lo Pan in Big Trouble in Little China A---------[]--B, with opposed rolls to 'push' the impact point one way or t'other A----[]-------B; A-[]----------B; [A]-----------B

 

Dont have the book with me, but that might very well cover it

[KA.]

Originally posted by Pattern Ghost

-snip-

I'd guess that she's definately going to become the Phoenix (and hopefully Dark Phoenix for some real fun)

-snip-

I don't care if we see her as Dark Phoenix, I want to see her as The Black Queen!

 

KA

[Publius]

Originally posted by KA.

I don't care if we see her as Dark Phoenix, I want to see her as The Black Queen!:DKA

Second!

[LadyChaos]

Thanks everyone! It's been a long time since I read X-Men, so I'd forgotten about Cyclops' eye beams being concussive ... or else I thought that it was the effect that was that way, not the beams, so still nothing physical to grab.

 

I totally forgot about force wall! Once I thought of straight TK grabbing something insubstantial my mind froze.

 

I think they're definitely heading for the Phoenix saga. The light beneath the water at the end had a vaguely phoenix shape. In fact, I half expected to see her rise from the water as Phoenix.

[SuperBlue]

While I'm kinda not happy they didn't stick with the Cosmic Radiation turning her into Pheonix, I think it's cool that they set it up so she already had that potential, just she never used it until the flood.

[SirViss]

Well, Phoenix could be still be some kind of entity that will provide the extra boost. She could have come into contact with it when she used Cerebro to locate the bad guys in the first movie.

 

After all she was floored by the feedback of contacting all those extra minds. Maybe one of those minds wasn't remotly human and has contacted her...

[Peregrine]

Originally posted by LadyChaos

Thanks everyone! It's been a long time since I read X-Men, so I'd forgotten about Cyclops' eye beams being concussive ... or else I thought that it was the effect that was that way, not the beams, so still nothing physical to grab.

 

I totally forgot about force wall! Once I thought of straight TK grabbing something insubstantial my mind froze.

 

Well, there is a power construct for energy TK. You define the TK with the limitation Affects Only (e.g. Affects Fire Only) and you get the ability to manipulate the chosen energy type.

 

But, yeah, Jean stopping Scott's EB was a Force Field or Force Wall; based on the visual FX I'd say the latter.

 

Edited because I gave the construct for TK affecting gases as energy TK. Bad form, me.