EC and MP?

[Diamond Spear]

Would you, as a GM, allow a character to have both an EC and an MP, both having the same special effect, where the MP consists of the characters attack powers and the EC contains the non-attack powers? Or would that go too far in trying to squeeze the most efficient point cost out of a character?

[Vondy]

Re: EC and MP?

 

I would look very carefully at each framework, but I don't have a problem with what you are describing as a concept.

[Sean Waters]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Well so long as they don't add to or boost each other and make conceptual sense I am not aware of any prohibition on that kind of build. I take it you would be putting you attack powers int he MP and defences and movement in the EC? Well of course, Sean, it says so in the original post. Twit.

 

Given that they run off the same SFX I might ask you to limit the frameworks so that they are affected by adjustment powers that affect the other. probably only worth a -1/4, and then probably only on the smaller one.

[CraterMaker]

Re: EC and MP?

 

At one time, that was the standard for characters in our game..

 

... so no, no problem. Makes sense, really, if you think about it.

 

-CraterMaker

[name_tamer]

Re: EC and MP?

 

It's not really responsive to your question ("What would you, as GM, do?") but what you're describing appears to be standard procedure for officially-published 5E Champions characters. See (for example) the writeups for Witchcraft, Icicle/Snowblind and Talisman in Champions, and Gravitar, Menton, Eclipse, Feuermacher, Mentalla, Thunderbolt I, and Firewing (among others, I imagine) in CKC (although Sapphire and Pulsar, in Champions, and Maelstrom, in 5ER, each buy their flight and force field "naked", and could shave some points by putting them in an EC).

[GreyGuardian]

Re: EC and MP?

 

I often build characters with multiple power frameworks. Sometimes same special effect sometimes not.

[Rapier]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Not a problem at all.

 

It's a fairly normal build in my games as well as the published characters, as has been mentioned.

 

It's never been approached or suggested to give one framework a limitation since it can be drained at the same time as the other framework. I think that's going a little too far. Frameworks are already a huge price break, and I don't see this as really being any kind of limitation. There is no limitation on a flame EB for "Drained as a Flame Attack" so I don't believe a framework should get one.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: EC and MP?

 

 

It's never been approached or suggested to give one framework a limitation since it can be drained at the same time as the other framework. I think that's going a little too far. Frameworks are already a huge price break, and I don't see this as really being any kind of limitation. There is no limitation on a flame EB for "Drained as a Flame Attack" so I don't believe a framework should get one.

 

To carry the thought to the next step...

The "drain one, drain all" aspect of an EC in its current iteration seems to be intended to represent a single power that as many different applications. While I don't lke the rule, as I feel it overly restricts the possible applications of an EC, I can see that the intent was supposed to be balance related. If you wanted to do a character with an EC of miscelaneous powers and a MP of attacks that al stemmed from not only the same SFX, but also the same "power", I could see adding a limit to the MP to mimic the EC characteristic of being drained together. The Human Torch would probably be a classic example of this idea. That said... I still probably wouldn't do it for MY character, but then again, I have issues with a lot of the applications of Adjustment powers when used against a single Power rather than SFX. Drain Any One Fire Power I can wrap my head around. Drain EB, not so much.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Would you' date=' as a GM, allow a character to have both an EC and an MP, both having the same special effect, where the MP consists of the characters attack powers and the EC contains the non-attack powers? Or would that go too far in trying to squeeze the most efficient point cost out of a character?[/quote']

 

Not only would I allow it, I would encourage it. Many of the characters on my site have multiple frameworks.

[Klytus]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Would you' date=' as a GM, allow a character to have both an EC and an MP, both having the same special effect, where the MP consists of the characters attack powers and the EC contains the non-attack powers? Or would that go too far in trying to squeeze the most efficient point cost out of a character?[/quote']

 

A problem with it? This is standard for almost every energy projector I've ever seen. The MP is for all the attacks, while the EC is for things like flight, force field, and other appropriate powers.

[Edsel]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Generally concept and rational are the main driving points as to whether or not I will allow a character to bend rules in this manner. The second consideration is whether or not the character will imbalance the game. Based on the previous posts in this thread that almost constitutes a "me too!"

[gojira]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Pretty much ditto everyone else, and especially name_tamer (repped, btw).

 

EC and Multipowers are perfectly ok in the same SFX. It's often done and there's no reason to not allow a player to save points where reasonable. If Dr. Tech Know wants to buy his Amazing Tech Know Beam Gun as a Multipower, and his Special Protective Tech Know Suit as an EC, that's absolutely fine. As long as they don't Aid, aren't Linked, don't have Linked or otherwise boosted Slots, etc., it's fine and not abusive.

 

If you're the GM, just adjust point totals on the opponents and go with it. The GM is under no obligation to make things fair points-wise, just a fun challenge. If you're a player, expect that the GM will adjust your enemies, but figure too that any published enemy characters will be built efficeintly also, so you might as well use the MP/EC combo.

[pinecone]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Would you' date=' as a GM, allow a character to have both an EC and an MP, both having the same special effect, where the MP consists of the characters attack powers and the EC contains the non-attack powers? Or would that go too far in trying to squeeze the most efficient point cost out of a character?[/quote']

 

Sure I see it all the time, I even use it myself from time to time...

[Wolfgar]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Nothing wrong with it as a base concept, really.

[Dust Raven]

Re: EC and MP?

 

Would you' date=' as a GM, allow a character to have both an EC and an MP, both having the same special effect, where the MP consists of the characters attack powers and the EC contains the non-attack powers? Or would that go too far in trying to squeeze the most efficient point cost out of a character?[/quote']

Allowed, encouraged and demonstrated in published characters. I just remind players that to so about the rules surrounding each Framework and that the limitations involving each will come into play during the game.