WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

[Shaft]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Er, as the thing is dripping in gasoline, how well would a PRE attack work? It's in combat, so that loses a few dice, but I'd be displaying my fire powers by flaring up and making it clear that I'm prepared to unleash a big one (implied violence) and making it clear that if the thing doesn't back off and put the hostages down, I'll take it out. My soliloquoy would be something like "My fireblast hurt you before- think what they'll do now that you're dripping in gasoline! If you hurt those hostages, there'll be nothing stopping me from napalming you!" Then I'd hold my action and cover him until he did something.

[Zed-F]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

That's certainly a valid tack to try. The alien is a boss monster, so he does have an impressive PRE to start with, but a good roll might cause it to hesitate long enough for the brick and the stretchy dude to do something about getting those hostages out of there.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

It doesn't seem like the alien/bug thing can fly. In that case, I gain altitude comfortably out of his reach and assumed throwing range and wait for rocky guy and stretchy guy to get those civllians clear.

 

After dealing with the monster I give the stretchy guy hotfoots for a week for being a noob.

[Fireleaper]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Avatar of the sun: (essentially a human torch variant), option 1: if he forgets that civilians are not as strong as supers will blast monster, option 2: if remembers that civilians are not as strong as supers might assume that they will never get hurt by gasoline will delay to allow others to free hostages and shoot, option 3: will remember what all that earth culture that the other PC's try to drill into him and look for an alternative.

 

Orca: Will dodge until hostages are free and then shoot, or if monster is about to eat hostages shoot and/or punch and/or Move Through him (flaming aura is so useful to ignite gasoline), might recommend that we lure monster into a petrol station next time.

[Lord Mhoram]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

All my characters would use this Fire users End/stun drain / NND attack (heat stroke/dehydration)* to take down the alien, and not indanger anyone. Then get the hostages hit with the NND to a hospital.

 

 

* Any fire based character worth his flame is going to have some sort of attack like this. If not - that is what the Power skill is for.

[Sundog]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Terminus would take the shot. Collateral damage is always a risk in engaging an enemy; better to possibly lose a couple of people now than dozens later if this guy gets away.

[Whitewings]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Faye happens to know enough chemistry to know that contrary to popular belief, gasoline doesn't ignite easily, and is very hard to make explode. So she'd hit the bug with the equivalent of a welding torch: A hot, short, very tightly focussed jet to ignite the gasoline on its back. With any luck at all, the bug will drop the hostages when it starts to feel the pain burning.

[nexus]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

AFAIK, gasoline makes a poor explosive* but a fine accelerant when applied in thin layers or soaked into something so the bug and the hostages would probably go up like torches in a few seconds, at least before it let them go since its taken some hits up until this point and hasn't gone down.

 

EDIT: With the exception of when vaporized or highly compressed but I'm hazy on this.

[Whitewings]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

AFAIK' date=' gasoline makes a poor explosive but a fine accelerant when applied in thin layers or soaked into something so the bug and the hostages would probably go up like torches in a few seconds, at least before it let them go since its taken some hits up until this point and hasn't gone down.[/quote']

 

A good point. In that case, I think Faye would be stymied, since she's this thing about hurting innocents. Though the PRE attack idea is pretty good, and wolud appeal to her showboat tendencies.

[David Johnston]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

I think you've asked the wrong question. The right question is "DTGMFU?". I think he did. Why are bystanders standing around in arms reach of the Purple People Eater as he brawls with the Thing? Why is someone who is winning the fight taking hostages or alternatively why is someone who is involved in a fight taking meals? Even if the Thing's attacks are ineffective at actually doing damage, they should still be distracting.

[Kevin Schultz]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Option 3: deny the premise. It never would have gotten this far, as option 4 (below) would have been used much earlier.

 

Option 4: Use Tactics and Teamwork (the skills). Have everyone make their teamwork roll (this is the FF, right?), and hit him at once. That'll overcome the alien's DR, thereby stunning him. Then get the civilians out of the way, and do it again until he's unconcious.

 

Option 5: We're the FF - we have healing technology. So, Set the guy on fire, and put the burn victims into bacta tanks.

[Zed-F]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

I think you've asked the wrong question. The right question is "DTGMFU?". I think he did. Why are bystanders standing around in arms reach of the Purple People Eater as he brawls with the Thing? Why is someone who is winning the fight taking hostages or alternatively why is someone who is involved in a fight taking meals? Even if the Thing's attacks are ineffective at actually doing damage' date=' they should still be distracting.[/quote']

 

The Purple People Eater is a lot faster than any SPD 2 Run 6" bystander, if he wants to catch up with one to grab him or her, he can. (Not to say that the PCs can't keep pace with him if he does.) And he is taking meals because they heal him; that's part of his boss-level toughness factor.

 

Option 4: Use Tactics and Teamwork (the skills). Have everyone make their teamwork roll (this is the FF, right?), and hit him at once. That'll overcome the alien's DR, thereby stunning him. Then get the civilians out of the way, and do it again until he's unconcious.

 

That would be a good way to deal with the situation, and for the FF, should work (depending on whether the mind-swapped character has the relevant skills, natch.) Teamwork is generally a good way to deal with any boss-level critter. Unfortunately the characters in my game had not yet purchased teamwork, but this encounter has certainly motivated them to do so, which was part of the point.

 

Option 5: We're the FF - we have healing technology. So, Set the guy on fire, and put the burn victims into bacta tanks.

 

If you're in a setting where cheap and easy healing is available, go for it.

 

 

As for my characters:

Soulbarb would take the shot. She would have nightmares afterward about it, but she wouldn't hesitate.

 

Sylph would hesitate, and ultimately not be able to bring herself to do it. She would try to find an alternative such as some of those mentioned above (power skill, alternate attack, dodge until the civilians are clear, etc.) instead.

[Pariah]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

I am admittedly a newbie here, but after reading several of these WWYCD scenarios, I'm convinced that the correct answer for most (or all) of them is pretty much the same:

 

Yell "IT'S A TRAP!"

 

/akbar

[Pariah]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

The snarkier, more cynical side of me has this answer, though:

 

Blow the thing. Strike at maximum power. Make it a point to ignite the gas. Take out the whole city block, if that's what it takes to kill the thing.

 

It's not my universe.

 

It's not my character.

 

It's not my Rep that gets screwed if civilians die.

 

It's not my DNPC's that fry if they happen to be too close when the big bang hits.

 

Given all of that, WTH do I care if we lose a few civilians in the course of saving the city?

[OddHat]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

I am admittedly a newbie here, but after reading several of these WWYCD scenarios, I'm convinced that the correct answer for most (or all) of them is pretty much the same:

 

Yell "IT'S A TRAP!"

 

Most of mine are just scenarios I plan to use in a game. They're useful if you want ideas on what actions the PCs might take, and as a sort of mini-online RP excercise.

[nexus]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Most of mine are just scenarios I plan to use in a game. They're useful if you want ideas on what actions the PCs might take' date=' and as a sort of mini-online RP excercise.[/quote']

 

Same here or I have used in the past to see how different characters might have done them.

[Kevin Schultz]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

That would be a good way to deal with the situation, and for the FF, should work (depending on whether the mind-swapped character has the relevant skills, natch.) Teamwork is generally a good way to deal with any boss-level critter. Unfortunately the characters in my game had not yet purchased teamwork, but this encounter has certainly motivated them to do so, which was part of the point.

 

For all that I post here, I've really only actually PLAYED Champions for 1 FtF session, plus a handful of PbEM rounds. Thus, most of my superhero play experience comes from CoH - and in there, teamwork and mathematically analyzing the most effective powers to use against a given opponent is the assumed default. Thus, when I first saw the Teamwork skill, I said to myself the following:

 

1. To stun someone, you need to do Def+CON damage to them in one hit.

2. To one-shot someone, you need to do Def+STUN damage to them in one hit.

3. Campaign DC caps exist to keep #1 and #2 from happening on a regular basis.

4. The Teamwork skill allows you to add all your damage together in a single hit, thus making #1 almost guarenteed, and making #2 much more likely.

5. Therefore, the most cost-effective powers in the game is the Teamwork skill.

 

Thus, I'm always surprised by GMs who comment that their players don't actually use it.

[nexus]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

\ hit, thus making #1 almost guarenteed, and making #2 much more likely.

5. Therefore, the most cost-effective powers in the game is the Teamwork skill.

.

 

Number 1 depends on how much damage gets through the target's defenses,since its added together after they are applied. Faster charactes also have ot hold action to act in conjunction with slower character which can to a drawback in some situations. Not saying its not a good tactic but its not applicable to all situations. Also there are RP reasons for not getting it, perhaps the character hasn't fought in group combat or might just not play well with others.

[Lord Mhoram]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

The snarkier' date=' more cynical side of me has this answer, though:[/quote']

 

Yeah that is snarky and cynical, but that is what I expect from ya.

 

Don't worry there are other WWYCD that are more reasonable rather than forced/railroaded moral choice questions.

[nexus]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Which WWYCDs have been so offensive lately?

[Metaphysician]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Which WWYCDs have been so offensive lately?

 

Aside from this one, looking at the most recent page worth of WWYCDs showing up on the search engine. . .

 

A Question of Faith: not the worst railroad, but it is one of the recurring set of WWYCDs involving human sacrafice.

 

A Bomb for Two Cities: railroad in the sense that you magically are required to choose between mutation or mass death, despite a large number of obvious ways to avoid the former.

 

Fully admitted, most of the recent WWYCDs have been decent, or at least not inherently offensive ( railroading or sheer horror ). This particular one just managed to encapsulate everything that makes a bad WWYCD ( railroading, forced moral dillema, scenario where every option is repugnant ), in an especially concentrated and egregious form.

[nexus]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Aside from this one, looking at the most recent page worth of WWYCDs showing up on the search engine. . .

 

A Question of Faith: not the worst railroad, but it is one of the recurring set of WWYCDs involving human sacrafice.

 

As the author of that one I have to ask: how is it a "railroad" at all? The character can react in any fashion they wish, including stoping the ritual and exterminating the preistess to a man if they wish. Easily. That is a choice that will have a negative consquence for the world they're on but many of the posters felt that was their just desserts. There are a number of ways to stop the rite and solve the problem and save a planetary population. They have time to do so, its not "Do this or die!" situation. It just doesn't involve an obvious choice (Punch the big bad guy until it stop moviing) and there are shades of gray involved so not to everyone's tastes I can see.

[Metaphysician]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Its not a railroad, specifically. I just really don't like scenarios involving human sacrafice as a moral dilemma. . . and that one is probably the best of the bunch. Blame the Omelas thread, and the several "cosmic jerk offers bennies in exchange for doing something ruthless" threads, you get caught in the collateral damage.

[nexus]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Its not a railroad' date=' specifically. I just really don't like scenarios involving human sacrafice as a moral dilemma...[/quote']

 

I can understand that totally. Its not a scenario for everyone's tastes.

[Great Beyond]

Re: WWYCD: Fuel for the fire

 

Well, Natasha, who is used to being mostly invunerable and the toughest SOB on the block, would take the direct approach. She can't set the monster on fire for fear of the folks in the way, so she'd give the monster something else to chew on - and zip right into it's mouth. These things tend to be a lot less armored when youre inside it blasting away. As for getting out again - well, one thing at a time.

 

If it were the much more squishy and considerably less indestructable Great Beyond, I'd probably wander away from the table and go play on the computer. Frankly these binary yes/no situations dont fly well with me. "Kill the folks clutched in the hand or thousands die!" I prefer my moral choices to be a litte more open ended and allow creative thought.