Enforcer84 Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Val Char Cost Roll Notes 11 STR 1 11- Lift 114.9kg; 2d6 [1] 14 DEX 12 12- OCV: 5/DCV: 5 13 CON 6 12- 10 BODY 0 11- 35 INT 25 16- PER Roll 16- 15 EGO 10 12- ECV: 5 13 PRE 3 12- PRE Attack: 2 1/2d6 12 COM 1 11- 3 PD 1 Total: 3 PD (0 rPD) 3 ED 0 Total: 3 ED (0 rED) 4 SPD 16 Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12 5 REC 0 26 END 0 23 STUN 0 Total Characteristic Cost: 78 Movement: Running: 7"/14" Leaping: 2"/4" Swimming: 3"/6" Self Defense Training Maneuver OCV DCV Notes 4 Martial Block +2 +2 Block, Abort 4 Martial Disarm -1 +1 Disarm; 21 STR to Disarm 3 Martial Throw +0 +1 2d6 +v/5, Target Falls Talents Ubermind 3 1) Absolute Range Sense 3 2) Absolute Time Sense 5 3) Eidetic Memory 3 4) Lightning Calculator 4 5) Speed Reading (x10) Skills 8 +1 with All Combat 3 Analyze: Technology 16- 3 Combat Piloting 12- 3 Computer Programming 16- 5 Cramming 3 Cryptography 16- 3 Deduction 16- 3 Demolitions 16- 3 Electronics 16- 3 Inventor 16- 3 Mechanics 16- 3 Paramedics 16- 3 Scholar 2 1) KS: Computer Interfaces (3 Active Points) 16- 2 2) KS: Computer Security (3 Active Points) 16- 2 3) KS: Sunfire (Career and Biography) (3 Active Points) 16- 2 4) KS: The Scientific World (3 Active Points) 16- 2 5) KS: The Superhuman World (3 Active Points) 16- 3 Scientist 2 1) SS: AI Technology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 2) SS: Aeronautical Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 3) SS: Aerospace Enginering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 4) SS: Astrophysics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 5) SS: Battlesuit Engineering and Design 16- (3 Active Points) 2 6) SS: Biochemistry 16- (3 Active Points) 2 7) SS: Biology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 8) SS: Chemical Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 9) SS: Communications Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 10) SS: Forensic Pathology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 11) SS: Gravitics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 12) SS: Kinetics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 13) SS: Magnetics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 14) SS: Mathematics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 15) SS: Microelectronics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 16) SS: Neural Interface Technology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 17) SS: Physics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 18) SS: Quantum Physics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 19) SS: Robotics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 20) SS: Sonics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 21) SS: Structural Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 22) SS: Tachyon Physics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 23) SS: Teleportation Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 24) SS: Thermodynamics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 25) SS: Weapons System Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 3 Systems Operation 16- 2 TF: Mecha, Grav Vehicles/Hovercraft Alright here's my delima. Does he have too many skills? I've considered dropping half of his specialties (still leaving 13 of them, but which ones?) Hiro is an expert at inventing new technologies. He's created androids and battlesuits. My characters already head towards point creep but my gadgeteers are monsters. any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadodel Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Make the character twins....split up the skills accordingly. No one knows that there are two, it's their secret. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comic Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Raise his Int by 3-5 points, for +1 to Int-based rolls (17-). Combine some of those KS's and SS's that are closely related, and let the GM assign a -1 penalty for specific subsets (eg Computer Interfaces and Computer Security). Where combining skills isn't appropriate, reduce some of the skills to 8- familiarities, and use the related skills as complementary rolls (eg. KS Sunfire 8-, and KS Superhuman World 17-). You'll still have the equivalent of 11- rolls for those instances (higher where two or more complementary skills apply). You could, by doing this, dump Scholar entirely, and still save points for largely the same effect. (Who really needs more than an 11- KS on a particular person? That's a bit creepy, knowing 62% of everything there is to know about them as it is. What do you do, go through their trash? ) Dump the 8 pt combat level for +3 Dex.. Since he lacks psychic senses, an ECV of 5 isn't going to benefit much from that +1 CSL the few times it would apply, while +1 OCV and DCV with everything else is worth it, and saves 2 pts. If he's that smart, oughtn't he have the initiative more than a Dex 14 person? Use Life Sciences to replace the following block saves 6 pts: 2 6) SS: Biochemistry 16- (3 Active Points) 2 7) SS: Biology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 10) SS: Forensic Pathology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 16) SS: Neural Interface Technology 16- (3 Active Points) Plus it gives 17- on some types of rolls, and rolls at a penalty on anything similarly related. How is SS: Weapons Systems Engineering different from Weaponsmith? I'm counting 10-20 points in skill cost reduction this way, and a more well-rounded genius who cross-fertilizes ideas from one field or one part of a field into others, gaining synergies. Maybe make a few of those talents latent (1 pt), and buy them up later? If there are enough 8- KS's/SS's to justify (I don't think there will be), spend 5 pts on Cramming, and 1 pt: Perk, Extensive Library. Since you've asked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teflon Billy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Val Char Cost Roll Notes 11 STR 1 11- Lift 114.9kg; 2d6 [1] 14 DEX 12 12- OCV: 5/DCV: 5 13 CON 6 12- 10 BODY 0 11- 35 INT 25 16- PER Roll 16- 15 EGO 10 12- ECV: 5 13 PRE 3 12- PRE Attack: 2 1/2d6 12 COM 1 11- 3 PD 1 Total: 3 PD (0 rPD) 3 ED 0 Total: 3 ED (0 rED) 4 SPD 16 Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12 5 REC 0 26 END 0 23 STUN 0 Total Characteristic Cost: 78 Movement: Running: 7"/14" Leaping: 2"/4" Swimming: 3"/6" Self Defense Training Maneuver OCV DCV Notes 4 Martial Block +2 +2 Block, Abort 4 Martial Disarm -1 +1 Disarm; 21 STR to Disarm 3 Martial Throw +0 +1 2d6 +v/5, Target Falls Talents Ubermind 3 1) Absolute Range Sense 3 2) Absolute Time Sense 5 3) Eidetic Memory 3 4) Lightning Calculator 4 5) Speed Reading (x10) Skills 8 +1 with All Combat 3 Analyze: Technology 16- 3 Combat Piloting 12- 3 Computer Programming 16- 5 Cramming 3 Cryptography 16- 3 Deduction 16- 3 Demolitions 16- 3 Electronics 16- 3 Inventor 16- 3 Mechanics 16- 3 Paramedics 16- 3 Scholar 2 1) KS: Computer Interfaces (3 Active Points) 16- 2 2) KS: Computer Security (3 Active Points) 16- 2 3) KS: Sunfire (Career and Biography) (3 Active Points) 16- 2 4) KS: The Scientific World (3 Active Points) 16- 2 5) KS: The Superhuman World (3 Active Points) 16- 3 Scientist 2 1) SS: AI Technology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 2) SS: Aeronautical Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 3) SS: Aerospace Enginering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 4) SS: Astrophysics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 5) SS: Battlesuit Engineering and Design 16- (3 Active Points) 2 6) SS: Biochemistry 16- (3 Active Points) 2 7) SS: Biology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 8) SS: Chemical Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 9) SS: Communications Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 10) SS: Forensic Pathology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 11) SS: Gravitics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 12) SS: Kinetics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 13) SS: Magnetics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 14) SS: Mathematics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 15) SS: Microelectronics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 16) SS: Neural Interface Technology 16- (3 Active Points) 2 17) SS: Physics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 18) SS: Quantum Physics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 19) SS: Robotics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 20) SS: Sonics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 21) SS: Structural Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 22) SS: Tachyon Physics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 23) SS: Teleportation Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 2 24) SS: Thermodynamics 16- (3 Active Points) 2 25) SS: Weapons System Engineering 16- (3 Active Points) 3 Systems Operation 16- 2 TF: Mecha, Grav Vehicles/Hovercraft Alright here's my delima. Does he have too many skills? I've considered dropping half of his specialties (still leaving 13 of them, but which ones?) Hiro is an expert at inventing new technologies. He's created androids and battlesuits. My characters already head towards point creep but my gadgeteers are monsters. any suggestions? I'd use Skill Multipliers from the Ultimate Skill (Simon's got them added into HD, I believe), that'll knock the price down on his skills. TB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clonus Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Alright here's my delima. Does he have too many skills? I've considered dropping half of his specialties (still leaving 13 of them, but which ones?) Hiro is an expert at inventing new technologies. He's created androids and battlesuits. My characters already head towards point creep but my gadgeteers are monsters. any suggestions? Personally, I prefer with these omnicompetent genii to just give them general categories like "Physics", and crank those categories up to the point where the minuses are manageable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teflon Billy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Personally' date=' I prefer with these omnicompetent genii to just give them general categories like "Physics", and crank those categories up to the point where the minuses are manageable.[/quote']I'd agree. I always felt that the Official write-ups get way too far into the weeds when it comes to science/engineering skills. Physics, Math, Chemistry, Biology by themselves are sufficiently specific but broad to cover it IMO. TB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperPheemy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... If your GM is sufficiently Silver Age or Four Color, you might get away with Comic Book Science! as a skill. Sort of that Reed Richards/ Hank Pym/ Victor Von Doom/ Ray Palmer type of "I'm a Scientist!" character. That also leaves points open for bigger gadget pools, or laboratories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstone Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Ultimate Skill p50 Universal Scientist 16- 20 pts and call it a day. That saves you 30+ points that you can then spend on getting a higher rolls on the really important Science Skills or on other stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinecone Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Ultimate Skill p50 Universal Scientist 16- 20 pts and call it a day. That saves you 30+ points that you can then spend on getting a higher rolls on the really important Science Skills or on other stuff. I agree, a few points of +X with all SS, or the like will go far as well (or good old Overall's...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Ultimate Skill p50 Universal Scientist 16- 20 pts and call it a day. That saves you 30+ points that you can then spend on getting a higher rolls on the really important Science Skills or on other stuff. I was going to say the same thing Works great for the Reed Richards sorts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... IIRC, Ultimate Skill breaks the sciences into 6 broad catagories, a good scientist character probably only needs 4-5 of them. Then a few bonuses, and Penalty Skill levels and you are set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted January 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... What Penalty skill levels do you mean? Time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... What Penalty skill levels do you mean? Time? I'm not sure what to call them, I would call them "Step" Basicaly if you have Biology as a skill and need to use Zooology, a subskill of biology you take a -2 penalty or what ever, the PSL would be to counter those Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyrm Ouroboros Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... I'd use Skill Multipliers from the Ultimate Skill (Simon's got them added into HD, I believe), that'll knock the price down on his skills. TB Hrm. Skill Multipliers? Are you meaning Skill Enhancers (which the character already has) or Skill Levels?? In any case, I've handled this in two different ways. --- The first is 'Universal X', where 'X' is any one of the Skill Enhancers -- Linguist/Translator, Scientist, Scholar, Traveler, Jack of All Trades. 20 points for that base INT roll, +1 to the roll per 1 point. Your basic 'Universal Translator', in other words, but for all the other types of background skills. One character I've posted on the board has three of them -- Translator, Scholar, and Scientist -- to represent her extraordinary ability to grasp and process logical data. Your supergenius may not have Universal Translator or Universal Scholar, but I can't see him NOT having Universal Scientist with anything less than a 20- roll. --- The second way to do it requires you going to your GM and explaining your problem to him, including the fact that he's a dead man as soon as combat starts, then proposing a Background Skill VPP. Remember, 'cannot be placed in a VPP' is followed by 'without GM permission -- so get permission!! Such a VPP might be something along these lines: Variable Power Pool (Skill Pool), 10 base + 10 control cost, Cosmic (+2) (25 Active Points); Limited Class Of Powers Available (Background Skills, -1/2): Real Cost 20. With 10 pool points, your supergenius might have three background skills at INT rolls up at any one time -- or be able to focus and have a skill at 23-. Or, talking it over with your GM, you might agree on a skill cap -- 18-, say, using up 5 points in the pool. When going this route, it's wise to find a point for you and the GM to agree on a suitable minimal point cost for the VPP, and a suitable maximum skill roll on skills WITHIN the VPP -- as well as what should not go into it. Languages might be one thing he might not allow. Then, in addition, the GM may be well within his rights to further restrict your other powers' Active Point maximums, considering you're getting such a price break on a vast number of skills. --- Some other stuff you may consider -- 'SPD, Only for Intellectual Things', or something along those lines. I've always found it problematical that a supergenius can't 'think' at x10,000 normal speeds ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comic Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... I'm not sure a 20 pt. 'Universal' is needed. I mean, how many gameable general sciences are there? Behavioral Sciences (Anthropology, Economics, Game Theory, Psychology, etc.) Chemistry, Life Sciences, Mathematics, Physics Sure, there are oddball sciences that don't fit these (or maybe any) general sciences, but you'd need more than eight such sciences to justify 'Universal', and it seems too broad to throw in the behavioral sciences with the life sciences and the physical sciences and mathematics, even for a Reed Richards. Let's face it, Richards is a pretty terrible psychologist.. economist.. anthropologist.. game theoretician. He's horrible with human behavior. Just ask his wife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teflon Billy Posted January 23, 2008 Report Share Posted January 23, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Hrm. Skill Multipliers? Are you meaning Skill Enhancers (which the character already has) or Skill Levels?? In any case, I've handled this in two different ways. No, I meant Skill Multipliers, just like I said. They are a concept introduced in the Ultimate Skill. TB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan D. Hurricanes Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 Re: Supergenius... I'm disappointed. I expected to see a coyote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted January 25, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: Supergenius... I'm not sure what to call them, I would call them "Step" Basicaly if you have Biology as a skill and need to use Zooology, a subskill of biology you take a -2 penalty or what ever, the PSL would be to counter those Gotcha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted January 25, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: Supergenius... I'm disappointed. I expected to see a coyote. You know what's weird? When I saw that you'd answered this thread and looked at the title I thought; a Wile E Cyote comment was coming! I swear! Yer right, I totally dropped the ball on this thread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan D. Hurricanes Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: Supergenius... You know what's weird? When I saw that you'd answered this thread and looked at the title I thought; a Wile E Cyote comment was coming! I swear! Dang, so I'm getting predictable, huh? Hmmm... Predict this! ...I got nothin'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyrm Ouroboros Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: Supergenius... I'm not sure a 20 pt. 'Universal' is needed. I mean, how many gameable general sciences are there? Behavioral Sciences (Anthropology, Economics, Game Theory, Psychology, etc.) Chemistry, Life Sciences, Mathematics, Physics Sure, there are oddball sciences that don't fit these (or maybe any) general sciences, but you'd need more than eight such sciences to justify 'Universal', and it seems too broad to throw in the behavioral sciences with the life sciences and the physical sciences and mathematics, even for a Reed Richards. Let's face it, Richards is a pretty terrible psychologist.. economist.. anthropologist.. game theoretician. He's horrible with human behavior. Just ask his wife. Not disagreeing, but to go from 'Physics', which is at the high school level at best, to 'High-Energy Particle Physics' pushing the comic book theoretical limit, is a huge jump -- with huge penalties. -10? -15? 'Life Sciences' to 'Genetic Manipulation for Power Imbuing'? -20?? You're looking at point costs that you'd might as well take 'Universal Scientist, 35-' because it'll cost less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teflon Billy Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Not disagreeing' date=' but to go from 'Physics', which is at the high school level at best, to 'High-Energy Particle Physics' pushing the [i']comic book[/i] theoretical limit, is a huge jump -- with huge penalties. -10? -15? 'Life Sciences' to 'Genetic Manipulation for Power Imbuing'? -20?? You're looking at point costs that you'd might as well take 'Universal Scientist, 35-' because it'll cost less.You get your PhD in "Physics", "Applied Physics", and maybe "Astrophysics" Your area of research may be more tailored than that, but you do in fact study just "physics" in grad school: E&M, Mechanics, Quantum, Stat-Mech, Thermo. At least any good grad school. What you can do with that general base is going to come down to your: Skill Levels, Overall Skill Level in the subject, professional skills, and knowledge skills. Your skill penalties are waaaaaaaaay too harsh, a -2 or -3 is more inline. You really should take a look at the Ultimate Skill, a -10 is listed as quite literally "impossible". Are you saying that a person with a 15- in Physics, access to a college research library, and a character concept of being an all around scientific genius is more than twice impossible at doing theoretical work in rubber science physics? I don't think so. TB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted January 25, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Dang, so I'm getting predictable, huh? Hmmm... Predict this! ...I got nothin'. I didn't see that coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyrm Ouroboros Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Your skill penalties are waaaaaaaaay too harsh' date=' a -2 or -3 is more inline. You really should take a look at the Ultimate Skill, a -10 is listed as quite literally "impossible". Are you saying that a person with a 15- in Physics, access to a college research library, and a character concept of being an all around scientific genius is more than twice impossible at doing theoretical work in rubber science physics? I don't think so.[/quote'] I do. The base Physics skill is 'if I throw this ball against that ball, what's gonna happen?' I don't deny that 'in grad school' an astrophysicist doesn't utilize this information, doesn't study this information -- but we aren't talking about the guy who has SS: Astrophysics, are we? We're talking about the other way around. Or are you saying that the seventh grader who's got 'social sciences' at 13- is hereby a psychologist? I'd call going from that 'general skill' to 'something so specialized it takes you ten years to learn it to the point where you're going to start advancing the knowledge base through new research' as being frelling impossible. College research library? +4 to the roll, maybe more. Scientific genius concept? Best have his roll at INT roll +3, +4, or more, because he knows what he's talking about -- he knows WHERE he has to look. Now take a +2 worth of extra time, and you have that +10 covered when doing research for high energy particle physics, don't you? And if it's rubber science -- well, he'd best have that research library a bit further advanced. This is what I'm talking about, though. You're wanting to have a general science skill, the use of which makes doing advancing researching in a current specialized science a 'virtually impossible' task without very advanced equipment (college research library, boosts bought in the skill due to background) workable, and apply it to tasks that would be impossible for someone who HAS bought those advanced skills, i.e. to a 'rubber' science. You're going to need lots of skill points. General skills are for general knowledge. General knowledge is what the man on the street has, or the kid in 7th grade, rolling marbles down slopes into other marbles. Hyperspecialized skills are for hyperspecialized knowledge -- you know, the stuff that Mr. Fantastic does inside his super-fantastic science lab. Getting to hyperspecialized knowledge from general skill means huge penalties; show the man on the street an equation from some astrophysicist's lab and ask him to solve it in relation to the earth and the sun and he's gonna say, 'huh?!?' Hell, I can't even put one of those equations into this post. The point is, you're going from 'general knowledge' (Ball A will roll away if Ball B hits it) to specialized knowledge, not the reverse. This takes penalties -- major penalties. Otherwise what's the point of the specialized skills at all? It's just a +2 or +3 to your general knowledge roll Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comic Posted January 29, 2008 Report Share Posted January 29, 2008 Re: Supergenius... Ah. I see where we differ in definitions. To you, "Physics" means the subject with the label "Physics" on the textbook, as learned in high school? To me, that Physics would be an 8- familiarity with Physics, or possibly a subset of an 11- skill with All High School Studies; that subset would have a penalty of -1 to -3, depending how difficult and atypical of high school. Success for knowing what would happen if a ball were thrown at a wall would only require this skill, and would have a substantial bonus to the roll, perhaps +8 or so. Because it's not a hard thing to figure out, if you've done well in high school physics. Physics 14-.. That's like Albert Einstein, Isaac Newton, Enrico Fermi. Sure, they have sub-specialties, but they better know their Physics too, and if they do, they can either make the sub-specialty rolls at some nominal penalty, or they can buy the specialized skill, and benefit from a complementary Physics roll. Because Physics is the umbrella all of the Physics (Astro, Particle, Nuclear, Superstring, Mechanics, Quantum Mechanics, etc.) are gathered under. It's the broad topic, but it can be deeply known, and in doing so, as the roll of the broad category rises, so too do the rolls possible in the narrow categories usable at some nominal penalty. -10 to -15 penalty on Physics would be suited to doing overpressure meteorological calculations applied to a non-Newtonian space on a planet with an unknown atmospheric composition while in combat.. hung over.. injured.. while the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders jello-wrestle in your lap, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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