More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

[dmjalund]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

you have the bad guys sithing in their pants

[austenandrews]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Oh' date=' I forgot to mention I tied and gagged Lucas and threw him in the closet. So, he want be able to pull a good guy win out his colon.[/quote']

What "good guy win?" That would go for any of the Sith, too. In a standup fight, the big dogs would beat a Predator.

 

Of course the Predator could snipe them by surprise from hiding like a big stinky lamer, as he did in the movies. That might stand a chance against some Jedi masters.

[Badger]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

What "good guy win?" That would go for any of the Sith, too. In a standup fight, the big dogs would beat a Predator.

 

Of course the Predator could snipe them by surprise from hiding like a big stinky lamer, as he did in the movies. That might stand a chance against some Jedi masters.

 

Like I said, I couldnt risk an Ewok win. And you know if Lucas was involved the Predator would get taken down by an Ewok.

 

Anyway, the Sith would have whooped the Jedi easy if they hadnt done that lame @$$ rule of 2 bullcrap.

[dmjalund]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

unless the predator can mask his presence in the force, he will have a hard time surprising o Jedi, no matter how he does it (well almost)

[austenandrews]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Anyway' date=' the Sith would have whooped the Jedi easy if they hadnt done that lame @$$ rule of 2 bullcrap. [/quote']

I agree the rule of two is dumb. However had Palps not kept everything secret, the Jedi would have creamed them out of sheer numbers. And the more Sith you have, the less secrecy you have.

[The Weapon]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

To be fair' date=' Predators generally avoid attacking unarmed opponents as being an insufficient challenge. On more than one occasion a single alien has been shown taking on multiple heavily armed humans, and sometimes being wounded in a fight. As for Jedi, only the most powerful and experienced of them have taken on Sith Lords in direct battle, with mixed results.[/quote']

 

Yeah, their victims are armed, with slugthrowers. Technologically that's like a modern marine in Kevlar with assault rifle, night vision googles and grenade launcher going up against guys with matchlocks. And the predators had mixed results too, that's the pathetic thing.

[Vulcan]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Like I said, I couldnt risk an Ewok win. And you know if Lucas was involved the Predator would get taken down by an Ewok.

 

Anyway, the Sith would have whooped the Jedi easy if they hadnt done that lame @$$ rule of 2 bullcrap.

 

According to alternate sources, the rule of 2 comes from an era where there were thousands of Sith fighting the Jedi - in theory. In practice they spent almost as much time fighting each other for supremacy in the Sith ranks that the Jedi nearly always had the upper hand.

[Old Man]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Judging by the prequels, the rule of 2 isn't helping with that.

[Nolgroth]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Luke could have taken that sucker out before he ever touched a lightsabre.

The same Luke that got owned by the abominable snowman on Hoth?

[The Weapon]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

The same Luke that got owned by the abominable snowman on Hoth?

 

Yep, because as usual in the Star Wars universe creatures without technology are some of the biggest threats. It doesn't make a whole lot of sense but it's still a noticeable Star Wars trope. How a snowman was able to nullify even an apprentice Jedi's precog ability I don't know but he did. Anything that can do that, be stealthy enough to get close and hit like a sledgehammer is more of a threat than a Predator. Note that this happened before he became a Jedi.

 

All luke would have needed is something to show up the Predator on a scope and it's one shot, dead to the the head. Hell if the Predator misses Luke could probably shoot off it's gun just by aiming at the origin point. He's a damn good shot.

[The Weapon]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

According to alternate sources' date=' the rule of 2 comes from an era where there were thousands of Sith fighting the Jedi - in theory. In practice they spent almost as much time fighting each other for supremacy in the Sith ranks that the Jedi nearly always had the upper hand.[/quote']

 

Yoda is the one who says, "always there is two, a master and an apprentice". Whether he means that when an apprentice becomes a master he immediately gets an apprentice or whether he even knows why they always encounter 2 isn't clear. I think the reason Sith lords don't take on 2 apprentices is that there's too much chance of being ganged up on.

 

Here's an interesting fanfic about finding a new Sith Apprentice.

 

http://praxeology.net/SithLord.htm

[Nolgroth]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Yep, because as usual in the Star Wars universe creatures without technology are some of the biggest threats. It doesn't make a whole lot of sense but it's still a noticeable Star Wars trope. How a snowman was able to nullify even an apprentice Jedi's precog ability I don't know but he did. Anything that can do that, be stealthy enough to get close and hit like a sledgehammer is more of a threat than a Predator. Note that this happened before he became a Jedi.

 

All luke would have needed is something to show up the Predator on a scope and it's one shot, dead to the the head. Hell if the Predator misses Luke could probably shoot off it's gun just by aiming at the origin point. He's a damn good shot.

First of all, I am not arguing too much about the Jedi thing. The prequels just showed the Jedi as monumentally arrogant and unmindful of potential threats. In the post-Empire/New Republic era maybe the Jedi are smarter.

 

Second, in any comparison between two dissimilar sub-genres/settings, you have to take into account the tropes from both settings. If the comparison was slanted so that Lucasland was the basis for all the decisions, then yeah, the Jedi wouldn't even need to get up from their bowls of Arrogance Toasties in the morning. I simply took the concept that the comparison was more or less down the middle, where the stealth kill trope would have as much validity as the instant danger sense, react so fast the body would fly apart, cutting the Predator apart with an energy weapon that has an enormous power requirement and no obvious source of that power. Taken separately, each genre has its own characteristics. Taken together, there has to be some blending of the two.

 

Third, I was responding to your specific comment that pre-Jedi Luke could take out a Predator. I will argue that he was surprised by a beast with natural camouflage. A creature with a much more sophisticated hunting technique would probably be even harder to detect. Not arguing with Luke's precision. He used to bullseye Womprats in Beggars Canyon back home.

 

Again, it depends on the interpretation. In the prequels, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Mace Windu and Yoda would certainly be the ones to look to for superiority against the Predatory species. Most of the rest of the Jedi council got owned without even really knowing what hit 'em. I cannot believe that they would stand any better chance against an intelligent and brutal hunter species. Luke, by the beginning of Return of the Jedi would probably class with the big guys from the prequels. If you account for things like the post trilogy books and video games, you can bet that he would be a very hard target for the Predator species. They might even consider him a sort of "Holy Grail" that only the best hunters would seek.

 

I still stand by my comment that the average Jedi would fall prey to the average Predator. At the very least, it would be interested to play in a game that balanced the two setting's tropes against each other. If for no other reason, than the satisfaction of slicing and dicing a Predator apart with my character's lightsaber. 'Cuz you know the PC is never average.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

It would appear that there are superior Predators as well, with greater skill and experience than the average. The two AVP films imply this; in the first one a human-spawned xenomorph was a serious threat one-on-one to the three Predators (implicitly youngsters out to prove themselves), while the solo hunter in the sequel film -- who appeared to be a special operative "cleaning up" the mess left by the previous hunting party -- routinely manhandled several xenomorphs at once.

[Vulcan]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

The same Luke that got owned by the abominable snowman on Hoth?

 

The same Luke who had only the barest beginingns of Jedi training? Even by the end of that movie he was only half-trained.

 

Luke didn't really come into his full power until the intermission between V and VI. So if the predator strikes while they are on Hoth, or Ord Mandell before that, he'd have a good chance of bagging Luke... not that there'd be much challenge in it. On Dagobah, the predator would have to get to him... with Yoda and his precog allowing him to keep Luke well away from the predator without Luke ever realizing there was danger out there.

[austenandrews]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

On Dagobah' date=' the predator would have to get to him... with Yoda and his precog allowing him to keep Luke well away from the predator without Luke ever realizing there was danger out there. [/quote']

I wouldn't want to be a Predator screwing around on Dagobah.

[Nolgroth]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Luke could have taken that sucker out before he ever touched a lightsabre.

The same Luke that got owned by the abominable snowman on Hoth?

The same Luke who had only the barest beginingns of Jedi training? Even by the end of that movie he was only half-trained.

 

Just clarifying the comment I was responding too.

[RexMundi]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Would be easier to decide if it was battle of the Jedi Cosplayers, vs Predator Cosplayers.

 

~Rex

[austenandrews]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Depends on whether the Jedi guys have actual sticks to fight with, and whether the Predator guys are actually seven feet tall.

[Old Man]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

I think the Predator furries are more likely to have actual blades on them, so I'd put my money on them.

[dmjalund]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

I think the Predator furries are more likely to have actual blades on them' date=' so I'd put my money on them.[/quote']Predators aren't furry

[Ragitsu]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

How about a Predator versus a veteran soldier type Wookie? For more fun, set the battle on Kashyyk.

[Badger]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

According to alternate sources' date=' the rule of 2 comes from an era where there were thousands of Sith fighting the Jedi - in theory. In practice they spent almost as much time fighting each other for supremacy in the Sith ranks that the Jedi nearly always had the upper hand.[/quote']

 

Which is dumb. Take out the Jedi, then worry about who gets to take over.

 

I'd imagine the Sith would be more pragmatic than that even despite their greed for power. More of a writer's prerogative. If I was playing it completely impersonal rather than making a good story/good fun for the players. I would probably have made the Sith more patient for their ambitions and have them more concerned in overcoming the Jedi, then worry about power grabs. Just fun speculating though.

[Badger]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

First of all, I am not arguing too much about the Jedi thing. The prequels just showed the Jedi as monumentally arrogant and unmindful of potential threats. In the post-Empire/New Republic era maybe the Jedi are smarter.

 

Second, in any comparison between two dissimilar sub-genres/settings, you have to take into account the tropes from both settings. If the comparison was slanted so that Lucasland was the basis for all the decisions, then yeah, the Jedi wouldn't even need to get up from their bowls of Arrogance Toasties in the morning. I simply took the concept that the comparison was more or less down the middle, where the stealth kill trope would have as much validity as the instant danger sense, react so fast the body would fly apart, cutting the Predator apart with an energy weapon that has an enormous power requirement and no obvious source of that power. Taken separately, each genre has its own characteristics. Taken together, there has to be some blending of the two.

 

Third, I was responding to your specific comment that pre-Jedi Luke could take out a Predator. I will argue that he was surprised by a beast with natural camouflage. A creature with a much more sophisticated hunting technique would probably be even harder to detect. Not arguing with Luke's precision. He used to bullseye Womprats in Beggars Canyon back home.

 

Again, it depends on the interpretation. In the prequels, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Mace Windu and Yoda would certainly be the ones to look to for superiority against the Predatory species. Most of the rest of the Jedi council got owned without even really knowing what hit 'em. I cannot believe that they would stand any better chance against an intelligent and brutal hunter species. Luke, by the beginning of Return of the Jedi would probably class with the big guys from the prequels. If you account for things like the post trilogy books and video games, you can bet that he would be a very hard target for the Predator species. They might even consider him a sort of "Holy Grail" that only the best hunters would seek.

 

I still stand by my comment that the average Jedi would fall prey to the average Predator. At the very least, it would be interested to play in a game that balanced the two setting's tropes against each other. If for no other reason, than the satisfaction of slicing and dicing a Predator apart with my character's lightsaber. 'Cuz you know the PC is never average.

 

Yeah, but I want to be the Predator who skins a Jedi.

[Yansuf]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Yeah' date=' but I want to be the Predator who skins a Jedi.[/quote']

 

Why?

The trophy cannot be distinguished from any other member of its species, so how do your peers know it was a Jedi?

Although I suppose that you could put the light saber up with it.

[Vulcan]

Re: More cross-genre goodiness: The Predator vs. a Jedi

 

Which is dumb. Take out the Jedi, then worry about who gets to take over.

 

I'd imagine the Sith would be more pragmatic than that even despite their greed for power. More of a writer's prerogative. If I was playing it completely impersonal rather than making a good story/good fun for the players. I would probably have made the Sith more patient for their ambitions and have them more concerned in overcoming the Jedi, then worry about power grabs. Just fun speculating though.

 

Yeah, it's dumb. It's also very human. For a living example, look at the U.S. government in (in)action. They're too busy fighting over power to actually accomplish anything worth doing. [/Rant]

 

Before the Rule of 2, the Sith were the anti-Jedi. They went around causing chaos, conquering planets, and generally being nasty. Sure, some of them were trying subtle manipulations and gathering of power, but most of them were... thugs with power. And the Jedi, being well aware of the Sith, were able to stay in the game of stopping them. So in open warfare, there was no victory for the Sith.

 

Once the Rule of 2 came about (and don't kid yourself into thinking that meant there were only two Sith period. There was the Master - the mastermind, supreme until his apprentice took him down; the Apprentice - the working agent looking for that step up; and the support staff - the little people, trainees, Sith Alchemists who couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag, that sort.), there was ONE will directing things. And this will wanted things to go underground and take the subtle approach. Undermine authority, make the Jedi look like interfering busybodies, and just in general make the galaxy think the Sith were extinct.

 

And guess what? It worked just fine. Darth Siddeous conquered the galaxy... to thunderous applause.