Cassandra's Corner

[Zen Archer]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Could be both.

 

I doubt they just get to do it whenever they want to, either. It's got to be approved by the upper echelons, if the idea didn't come from them in the first place.

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

A few minor changes in costumes are understandable from time to time, but there have been a few truly awful decisions.

 

1, Wonder Woman in pants.

 

2, Black Canary in a tracksuit with huge lapels and a headband.

 

3, Power Girl in a yellow and white body suit, or a red white and blue body suit.

 

Clearly in these cases the original costumes were superior, and probably done at the behest of Darkseid.

[RexMundi]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Don't forget, the Legion of Super Heroes all going for Waist Cut Jackets, and Lotsa Lotsa Lotsa Pockets.

 

~Rex

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Supergirl

 

Val Char Cost

50*/15 STR 33

18 DEX 24

25*/15 CON 26

12 BODY 4

13 INT 3

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

16 COM 3

17*/5 PD 6

17*/5 ED 10

5*/4 SPD 20

15*/6 RED 0

50*/30 END 0

50*/28 STUN 0

Total Characteristics Cost: 136 Points

 

*Does Not Work During Red Solar Radiation Exposure (-1/4)*

 

Cost Skills

3 Acting 12-

2 AK: Metropolis 11-

6 Combat Luck +3 rPD +3 rED

2 PS: Actress 11-

2 Rep: Maid of Steel 11-

Total Skills Cost: 15 Points

 

Cost Powers

12 Damage Resistance 15 rPD 15 rED*

24 Multipower (30 Points)*

2 u) EB 6d6 [Heat Vision]

2 u) STR +20, No END (+1/2) [strongest Woman in the DC Universe]

2 u) Telekinesis 20 STR [super-Breath]

2 u) Tunneling 6" DEF 6

15 ES: N-Ray Sight [Lead], PER +1, Telescopic Hearing +2, Telescopic Sight +2*

5 ES: RPT, OAF: Radio (-1)

20 Flight 10", Variable Advantages (+1/2), Megascale or Use Underwater or 1/2 END Only (-1/4)*

6 Healing: Regeneration 1 BODY/Turn*

9 LS: Extended Breathing [1 END/Minute], High Pressure, High Radiation, Intense Cold, Intense Heat, Low Pressure/Vacuum*

Total Powers Cost: 99 Points

 

*Does Not Work During Red Solar Radiation Exposure (-1/4)

 

Total Cost: 250 Points

 

150+ Disadvantages

10 DNPC: Lena Thorul (Unaware Slightly Less Powerful) 8-

10 Hunted: Brainiac (As Powerful) 8-

20 PsyL: Code of the Hero (Very Common/Strong)

20 PsyL: Code versus Killing (Common/Total)

10 SocL: Secret Identity [Kara Zor-El/Linda Lee Danvers] (Occasionally/Major)

20 Suscept: Green Kryptonite Radiation, 3d6 STUN/Turn (Uncommon)

10 Vuln: Magic, 1 1/2x STUN (Common)

Total Disadvantages Cost: 250 Points

 

 

This is Supergirl during the late silver age as she was in Superman Family Comics. Lena Thorul is a psychic FBI agent who happens to be the sister of Lex Luthor, although she doesn't know it. Luthor does, and has helped Supergirl protect Lena from time to time. She has more DEX but less STR then Superman. For the purposes of the Multiform below, this is her true form. Her secret identity is Linda Danvers, who is an actress living in Metropolis and starring as Margo Hatten on the Galaxy Broadcasting System Soap Opera "Secret Hearts".

 

 

 

Supergirl (Kara Zor-El)

 

Val Char Cost

50*/15 STR 33

18 DEX 24

25*/15 CON 26

12 BODY 4

13 INT 3

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

16 COM 3

17*/5 PD 6

17*/5 ED 10

5*/4 SPD 20

15*/6 REC 0

50*/30 END 0

50*/28 STUN 0

Total Characteristics Cost: 136 Points

 

*Does Not Work During Red Solar Radiation Exposure (-1/4)

 

Cost Skills

6 Combat Luck +3 rPD +3 rEd

Total Skills Cost: 6 Points

 

Cost Powers

12 Damage Resistance 15 rPD 15 rED*

75 VPP 48 Points, No Skill Roll (+1), Half Phase (+1/2), Multiform Only (-1)*

6 Flight 3", Variable Advantages (+1/2), [Megascale, Use Underwater, or 1/2 END Only (-1/4)]*

6 Healing: Regeneration 1 BODY/Turn*

9 LS: Extened Breathing [1 END/Minute], High Pressure, High Radiation, Intense Cold, Intense Heat, Low Pressure/Vacuum*

Total Powers Cost: 108 Points

 

Total Cost: 250 Points

 

Total Cost: 250 Points

 

150+ Disadvantages

10 DNPC: Lena Thorul (Unaware Slightly Less Powerful) 8-

10 Hunted: Brainiac (As Powerful) 8-

20 PsyL: Code of the Hero (Very Common/Strong)

20 PsyL: Code versus Killing (Common/Total)

10 SocL: Secret Identity [Kara Zor-El/Linda Lee Danvers] (Occasionally/Major)

20 Suscept: Green Kryptonite Radiation, 3d6 STUN/Turn (Uncommon)

10 Vuln: Magic, 1 1/2x STUN (Common)

Total Disdvantages Cost: 250 Points

 

 

This version allow Supergirl to access different versions of herself with various powers and skills.

 

 

For example is she needs to travel in time Supergirl would multiform to a version with Extra-Dimensional Movement [Time Travel].

[Christopher]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

ThorUl. LuThor.

Nice silver age anagram.

[Zen Archer]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

ThorUl. LuThor.

Nice silver age anagram.

 

Its biggest plus, IMO, is that it's something young readers could figure out on their own and feel good about.

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

On Smallville it was revealed at the end that Tess Mercer (Cassidy Freeman) was really Lutessa Lena Luthor, sister of Lex. Naturally he killed her.

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Question, does Power Girl have all the same powers as Supergirl?

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]43808[/ATTACH]

 

Batgirl, Wonder Woman, and Supergirl

[bigbywolfe]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

WW's pose is fairly standard, but what the heck are Batgirl and Supergirl doing?

[Zen Archer]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Question' date=' does Power Girl have all the same powers as Supergirl?[/quote']

 

They've both been altered so many times it's hard to keep track, but I'm pretty sure Power Girl has shown all the classic Kryptonian powers at one time or another.

[Balabanto]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

I have never seen something like this happend in the books or comics. What I have seen happening:

When you are captured by Cyborg Master/Dr. Genetic Experimentation you wake up in your cell where he tells you his plan to "augment" you.

If one DNCP was captured along, then the villain takes that one away while ordering his minions to "prepare the procedure". Otherwise he goes to "prepare the procedure" for the PC's.

Then they have a moment to escape, get thier egar back (if it was even taken!) and rescue the DNCP/stop the evil professor.

 

The few times the character was already experimented upon/the others couldn't stop the professor in time, this was just an in-story radiation accident. Something the (single) affected player had planned and wanted.

 

Really?

 

Spider-Man "Wanted" six arms?

 

Really?

 

The Avengers "wanted" to keep a man alive so that the earth wouldn't explode?

 

Really?

 

Howard the Duck?

 

Really?

 

Infinity Gauntlet?

 

Really?

 

Jean Grey "wanted" to become Dark Phoenix?

 

Really?

[Enforcer84]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Really?

 

Spider-Man "Wanted" six arms?

 

Really?

 

The Avengers "wanted" to keep a man alive so that the earth wouldn't explode?

 

Really?

 

Howard the Duck?

 

Really?

 

Infinity Gauntlet?

 

Really?

 

Jean Grey "wanted" to become Dark Phoenix?

 

Really?

 

Not Player Characters. Fictional characters. Big difference.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Not Player Characters. Fictional characters. Big difference.

The post he responded to had made a claim about the "source material", ie "fictional characters" and that is what he was responding to.

[Enforcer84]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

The post he responded to had made a claim about the "source material"' date=' ie "fictional characters" and that is what he was responding to.[/quote']

Ah. my bad.

 

No wait. Balabanto said the Players should be expected to be crapped upon by the gm if they're captured because that's the source material.

 

But the source material doesn't have die mechanics and it isn't a cooperative story telling - so saying "this is what happens in comics" isn't necessarily appropriate.

 

So his examples again, aren't valid. They are, oddly enough, examples of temporary power subplots. There is no player to "want" the changes there is a writer who does the whole thing. No players involved. If Balabanto wants to write a story whole cloth with no players involved he should do so. Just not expect it to be a game.

 

But then again I've never been in one of his games and might have different expectations if I was.

[Balabanto]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Ah. my bad.

 

No wait. Balabanto said the Players should be expected to be crapped upon by the gm if they're captured because that's the source material.

 

But the source material doesn't have die mechanics and it isn't a cooperative story telling - so saying "this is what happens in comics" isn't necessarily appropriate.

 

So his examples again, aren't valid. They are, oddly enough, examples of temporary power subplots. There is no player to "want" the changes there is a writer who does the whole thing. No players involved. If Balabanto wants to write a story whole cloth with no players involved he should do so. Just not expect it to be a game.

 

But then again I've never been in one of his games and might have different expectations if I was.

 

Temporary power subplots? The point is that the idea of player consent is silly. When you start playing a game, you enter into a contract with the gamemaster to participate in his vision of the world. The GM is god. You don't get a say. That's when roleplaying is at it's best, when you exist wholeheartedly in the world the GM is created and a little piece of you becomes that character.

 

When Spider-Man got six arms, it wasn't up to the GM get him out of the situation, it was up to his player, because he entered into that contract.

 

When the Avengers wound up in that situation, they had to make a decision, and live with the consequences. Consequences. That's the key word. Actions have consequences. They don't exist in a vaccum because the player says they should. I hate that philosophy. It drives me nuts. It takes away my fun when I play, too, because it means all players are NOT created equal. The guy who whines the most always gets extra stuff, face time, and things like that.

 

That's not a game. That's an ego gratification zone.

 

In order for it to be a game, the possibility of losing/failure/less than optimal results has to be there in a very real way. You shouldn't play roleplaying games to feel successful. If you are, you're not doing it for the right reason.

 

In every truly great game I've ever played in, you check your ego at the door. Sometimes, your character will soar. Sometimes, your character will fall. Sometimes, your character will die.

 

These things happen. You reach across the table and shake hands with the guy running the game and say "Thank you."

 

You have to be a good sport.

 

Or it's not a game at all.

[Greywind]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Role-playing isn't a "win/lose" game.

 

It's an "everybody has fun" game.

 

If you enter into an area that a PLAYER can't/won't/doesn't have fun, then the GM has created a breach. If it happens often enough, the GM may find himself bleeding players, or find himself on the other end of the table because the players won't let him run anything. Any "victories" that the GM achieves in a game should be temporary.

 

Trying to equate a game to the source material is lame. Yes, that is where we get our inspiration from, but as you put it, the GM is God. In the source material the writer still has to answer to editorial, and the company has to answer to the buying public.

[Christopher]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Question' date=' does Power Girl have all the same powers as Supergirl?[/quote']

Generally Yes, but her powers tended to varry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Girl#Powers_and_abilities

 

Temporary power subplots? The point is that the idea of player consent is silly. When you start playing a game' date=' you enter into a contract with the gamemaster to participate in his vision of the world. The GM is god. You don't get a say. That's when roleplaying is at it's best, when you exist wholeheartedly in the world the GM is created and a little piece of you becomes that character.[/quote']

As you describe it, this does not sounds like fun at all.

In fact it sounds downright horrible for me.

 

When Spider-Man got six arms, it wasn't up to the GM get him out of the situation, it was up to his player, because he entered into that contract.

 

When the Avengers wound up in that situation, they had to make a decision, and live with the consequences.

Nope, Spiderman never entered into a Contract. Because there wasn't a player and a GM, only an autor. A single Storyteller. (but Greywinds comparsion with the company and buying public works well anyway).

 

RPG's are cooporative storytelling. One Story, multiple Authors (one per PC + GM).

If you do anything lasting to a character - especially things that take abilitie/cost points - without player consent, you are on a good way to loosing them.

 

I don't say those Storyarcs are bad - just that they should always be player initiated or be the core of an adventure (and left in peace after that, unless they want to revisit it).

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

By a strange coincidence here is Spider-Man. I worked up a version last night.

 

 

 

Spider-Man

 

Val Char Cost

40 STR 30

23 DEX 39

20 CON 20

10 BODY 0

18 INT 8

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

16 COM 3

16 PD 8

8 ED 4

4 SPD 7

12 REC 0

40 END 0

40 STUN 0

Total Characteristics Cost: 126 Points

 

Cost Skills

3 Acrobatics 14-

2 AK: New York City 11-

3 Breakfall 14-

6 Combat Luck +3 rPD +3 rED

2 CSL: Entangle +1

5 CSL: HTH Combat +1

30 Danger Sense [Out of Combat/Any Danger/Immediate Vicinity] 14-

2 Eidetic Memory, Visual Only (-1), OAF: Camera (-1)

2 PS: Photographer 11-

3 SS[iNT]: Chemistry 13-

2 Rep: "Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man" 11-

3 Shadowing 13-

3 Stealth 14-

Total Skills Cost: 66 Points

 

Cost Powers

10 Clinging 40 STR

3 ES: PER +1

10 EC [Web Shooters]-15 Points, OIF: Web Shooters (-1/2)

23 1) Entangle 4d6, DEF 4, [32c] (+1/4)

10 2) Swinging 15", 4x NCM, No END (+1/2)

2 Running +1"

Total Powers Cost: 58 Points

 

Total Cost: 250 Points

 

150+ Disadvantages

20 DNPC: May Parker (Unaware Incompetent) 8-

10 DNPC: Mary Jane Watson (Normal) 8-

10 Hunted: Green Goblin (As Powerful) 8-

10 Hunted: J. Jonah Jameson (Less Powerful/NCI) 8-

20 PsyL: Code versus Killing (Common/Total)

20 PsyL: Protective of Innocents (Very Common/Strong)

10 SocL: Secret Identity [Peter Parker] (Occasionally/Major)

Total Disadvantages Cost: 250 Points

 

 

 

And one of my favorites

 

 

 

Spider-Woman

 

Val Char Cost

40 STR 30

23 DEX 39

20 CON 20

10 BODY 0

13 INT 3

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

18 COM 4

16 PD 8

8 ED 4

4 SPD 7

12 REC 0

40 END 0

40 STUN 0

Total Characteristics Cost: 122 Points

 

Cost Skills

3 Acrobatics 14-

2 AK: San Francisco 11-

3 Breakfall 14-

6 Combat Luck +3 rPD +3 rED

3 Conversation 12-

2 FB: Private Investigator License

2 PS: Private Investigator 11-

3 Shadowing 12-

10 SL: Overall +1

3 Stealth 14-

3 Streetwise 12-

Total Skills Cost: 40 Points

 

Cost Powers

10 Clinging 40 STR

15 EC [spider-Powers]-15 Points

25 1) EB 8d6

16 2) Flight 10", 4x NCM, 1/2 END (+1/4), OIF: Glider Wings (-1/2)

8 ES: RPT, IIF: Avengers Communicator (-1/4)

12 LS: High Radiation, Immunity [Poisons]

2 Running +1"

Total Powers Cost: 88 Points

 

Total Cost: 250 Points

 

150+ Disadvantages

15 DNPC: Current Client (Unaware Normal) 8-

5 DNPC: Lindsay McCabe (Useful Normal) 8-

10 Hunted: Enemies of Current Client (Less Powerful/NCI) 8-

10 Hunted: Hydra (As Powerful) 8-

10 Hunted: Viper (As Powerful) 8-

20 PsyL: Code versus Killing (Common/Total)

20 PsyL: Protective of Innocents (Very Common/Strong)

10 SocL: Secret Identity [Jessica Drew] (Occasionally/Major)

Total Disadvantages Cost: 250 Points

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

There might be something valuable in gaming terms for temporary powers. Think of The Greatest American Hero. As he learned to use the suit new powers came up from time to time. This could be accomplished with a Multipower, and experience points are used to buy powers with the (-2) No Conscious Control.

[Greywind]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

The Avengers "wanted" to keep a man alive so that the earth wouldn't explode?

 

The only thing I can recall about this story was that it was a fill-in issue and it was never referenced again. Which, since the guy was put into deep-freeze in one of the various sub-basements, and that after Disassembled and the destruction of the mansion that power was cut-off to the mansion, everything that happened after that doesn't matter, because with the earth being destroyed when he thawed out all the excrement that Marvel has put out was just a bad dream.

[phoenix240]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Question' date=' does Power Girl have all the same powers as Supergirl?[/quote']

 

And two bigger ones.

[Cassandra]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Power Girl

 

Val Char Cost

50 STR 40

18 DEX 24

25 CON 30

10 BODY 0

13 INT 3

11 EGO 2

15 PRE 5

18 COM 4

20 PD 10

15 ED 10

5 SPD 22

15 REC 0

50 END 0

48 STUN 0

Total Characteristics Cost: 150 Points

 

Cost Skills

3 Computer Programming 12-

2 PS: Software Designer 11-

Total Skills Cost: 5 Points

 

Cost Powers

15 Damage Resistance 20 rPD 10 rED

15 EC [Yellow Sun Energy]-15 Points

23 1) EB 8d6, Variable Special Effects [Heat Vision/Super-Breath] (+1/4), 2x END (-1/2)

12 2) Flight 10", Variable Advantages (+1/2), [Megascale, Use Underwater, or 1/2 END Only (-1/4)]

19 ES: N-Ray Sight [Lead], PER +1, Telescopic Hearing +2, Telescopic Sight +2

11 LS: Extended Breathing [1 END/Minute], High Pressure, High Radiation, Intense Cold, Intense Heat, Low Pressure/Vacuum

Total Powers Cost: 95 Points

 

Total Cost: 250 Points

 

150+ Disadvantages

10 DNPC: Matt Cable (Unaware Useful Normal) 8-

10 Hunted: Ultra-Humanite (As Powerful) 8-

20 PsyL: Code versus Killing (Common/Total)

20 PsyL: Protective of Innocents (Very Common/Strong)

10 SocL: Secret Identity [Kara Zor-L/Karen Starr] (Occasionally/Major)

15 Suscept: Green Kryptonite Radiation, 3d6 STUN/Turn (Uncommon)

10 Vuln: Magic, 1 1/2x STUN (Common)

5 Vuln: Red Solar Radiation, 1 1/2x STUN (Uncommon)

Total Disadvantages Cost: 250 Points

 

 

 

Power Girl is a fast hard hitting brick not know for being subtle.

[Balabanto]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

Generally Yes, but her powers tended to varry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Girl#Powers_and_abilities

 

 

As you describe it, this does not sounds like fun at all.

In fact it sounds downright horrible for me.

 

 

Nope, Spiderman never entered into a Contract. Because there wasn't a player and a GM, only an autor. A single Storyteller. (but Greywinds comparsion with the company and buying public works well anyway).

 

RPG's are cooporative storytelling. One Story, multiple Authors (one per PC + GM).

If you do anything lasting to a character - especially things that take abilitie/cost points - without player consent, you are on a good way to loosing them.

 

I don't say those Storyarcs are bad - just that they should always be player initiated or be the core of an adventure (and left in peace after that, unless they want to revisit it).

 

Clearly your definition of "cooperative" and mine differ. I take that to mean that you cooperate with the GM and participate in his vision. You're not the equal of the GM. The GM makes the world. He makes the rules. You obey those rules as a player. You do not break the GM's rules. If you're going to argue with the GM about something, you don't do it during game time. You do it away from the table.

 

If you do something to a character without their consent, their actions have to lead to it. If you enter Mechanon's base alone, expect to get smeared.

 

Actions have consequences. You revisit those actions all the time.

 

Once a character in my game had his DNPC kidnapped by a villain. The villain, being evil, dressed the DNPC up in an aluminum mockup of his armor and had him prepared to fight the heroes after liberal doses of brainwashing and drugs.

 

Sure enough, the super speedster impetuously ran the DNPC through with a sword without checking, and the DNPC died.

 

Actions have consequences. That action still reverbrates in my game. All the time.

 

The GM has to play fair with the players. But some things are nastier than others. You can't put a hard and fast label on "cooperative storytelling." Because if you do, at some point, it becomes nothing but ego gratification and "wow, we really beat those guys."

 

The best fights aren't when you smear the bad guys all over the room. The best fights are when there's one guy standing and he has 1-3 STUN left.

 

Why?

 

Because you EARNED it. If you never have to work or struggle for anything, everything starts to look the same. And that's why I run my game the way I do. Because if you don't want to work for anything, you'll never have anything. Feel-good memories are just that. But the ones you feel the best about are always the ones you work the hardest for.

 

So I run tough. But I'd rather be tough than easy.

[Greywind]

Re: Cassandra's Corner

 

"Co-operative" also requires the GM to work within the vision of the PLAYERS' ideas of their characters.

 

It's the GM's world. That does not give him carte blanche to run all over the characters on a whim.

 

I've had players, after a hard won fight sit there and go "WOW!", because it worked out just like it would have in the comics.

 

I have had players, after a twist in a storyline, go "you know, I'm not really comfortable heading in that direction." Out of respect for them, and very likely our friendship, you do an editorial re-write and decide "that never happened like that". All it requires is to write a small bit to explain HOW it actually came out, adjusting for the player's feelings.

 

On the other side of this, yes, actions have consequences. I'm more concerned about REAL LIFE consequences than what may happen in a game.

 

Somehow I don't think I'd ever really enjoy playing in one of your games.