Teleporter character build (5EdR)

[Beast]

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport, and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering", that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.

then there is no need for the trigger

But 1m of flight is the smallest unit so it becomes a full move to set up

 

But then what is the sfx of the flight(granted I have a character that does both and is gravity based and only does mega scale t-port by using gravity create a warp between 2 points in space)

Just doing the plan I set out pretty much handles it all

[Lucius]

you still need to figure out what to do after the flight kicks in as your move is done and are now a floating duck who cannot even shoot back

 

There's nothing to figure out, because there's nothing to do, You're a floating duck who cannot even shoot back. Much like any other character who has completed their actions and now are waiting for their next phase, except that unlike most other characters you happen to be hovering in midair as an even more obvious target.

 

you need to switch to another mode of movement which means you start falling

 

The entire point of the power is that you never start falling.

 

If this is going to be another NCM teleport you are going to fall for 2 phases

at speed 6 this is 4 segments

when your flight kicks in again you will be at a velocity of 40m/sec and 100m down

 

No, when your Flight kicks in you are at velocity 0 because it activates before you begin to fall.

 

your flight will only slow you 5m a phase

at best you will hit with 55m of velocity(27.5 d6)

 

Like I said a little planning and you look cool falling with grace

you just need the right tools and 1m of flight is not enough

 

 

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport' date=' and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.[/quote']

 

I was going to object to this statement then I read it more carefully. You may be right. Possibly it can be bought Linked with the Teleport and after every teleportation you are assumed to be "hovering" - even if it's hovering in contact with the ground.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering"' date=' that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.[/quote']

 

bigbywolf: First, taking Instant off the construct means there is nothing stopping you from hovering there phase after phase Instant means it only lasts for a phase.Next phase you start to fall, unless you teleport at once.

 

edit: Beast: "What is the sfx of the flight." A good question, actually, I'd kind of wondered. WHY does this character hang there in temporary defiance of gravity?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary says that no matter how you slice it, it looks like a 1 pt Power (barring house rules)

[bigbywolfe]

you still need to figure out what to do after the flight kicks in as your move is done and are now a floating duck who cannot even shoot back

 

There's nothing to figure out, because there's nothing to do, You're a floating duck who cannot even shoot back. Much like any other character who has completed their actions and now are waiting for their next phase, except that unlike most other characters you happen to be hovering in midair as an even more obvious target.

 

you need to switch to another mode of movement which means you start falling

 

The entire point of the power is that you never start falling.

 

If this is going to be another NCM teleport you are going to fall for 2 phases

at speed 6 this is 4 segments

when your flight kicks in again you will be at a velocity of 40m/sec and 100m down

 

No, when your Flight kicks in you are at velocity 0 because it activates before you begin to fall.

 

your flight will only slow you 5m a phase

at best you will hit with 55m of velocity(27.5 d6)

 

Like I said a little planning and you look cool falling with grace

you just need the right tools and 1m of flight is not enough

 

 

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport' date=' and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.[/quote']

 

I was going to object to this statement then I read it more carefully. You may be right. Possibly it can be bought Linked with the Teleport and after every teleportation you are assumed to be "hovering" - even if it's hovering in contact with the ground.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering"' date=' that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.[/quote']

 

bigbywolf: First, taking Instant off the construct means there is nothing stopping you from hovering there phase after phase Instant means it only lasts for a phase.Next phase you start to fall, unless you teleport at once.

 

edit: Beast: "What is the sfx of the flight." A good question, actually, I'd kind of wondered. WHY does this character hang there in temporary defiance of gravity?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary says that no matter how you slice it, it looks like a 1 pt Power (barring house rules)

Instant

Value: -½

This -½ Limitation converts a Constant Power

into an Instant Power. It only remains in effect for,

at most, the Phase in which it’s turned on — just

long enough for the character to make an Attack

Roll.

An Instant Power lasts just long enough for the

character using the power to make an Attack Roll.

Examples include Powers like Blast, Entangle,

and Flash. Although an Instant Power lasts for

just a second (at most), its effects may linger. For

example, the damage from a Blast could last for

minutes, or even days; an Entangle remains in

effect until the victim breaks out (or is broken out

by someone else). These “lingering” effects cannot

be Drained, Dispelled, or the like, since the Power

is no longer “in use.”

My understanding of this is that you would fall in the next Segment (as it lasts "just a second at most"). A person with SPD 2 would have to hover there for 6 seconds. Maybe I'm being too literal.

 

I agree that it is probably a 1 pt Power regardless of build and counteracting falling is not needed unless it is built to be an issue.

[Beast]

you still need to figure out what to do after the flight kicks in as your move is done and are now a floating duck who cannot even shoot back

 

There's nothing to figure out, because there's nothing to do, You're a floating duck who cannot even shoot back. Much like any other character who has completed their actions and now are waiting for their next phase, except that unlike most other characters you happen to be hovering in midair as an even more obvious target.

 

you need to switch to another mode of movement which means you start falling

 

The entire point of the power is that you never start falling.

 

If this is going to be another NCM teleport you are going to fall for 2 phases

at speed 6 this is 4 segments

when your flight kicks in again you will be at a velocity of 40m/sec and 100m down

 

No, when your Flight kicks in you are at velocity 0 because it activates before you begin to fall.

 

your flight will only slow you 5m a phase

at best you will hit with 55m of velocity(27.5 d6)

 

Like I said a little planning and you look cool falling with grace

you just need the right tools and 1m of flight is not enough

 

 

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport' date=' and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.[/quote']

 

I was going to object to this statement then I read it more carefully. You may be right. Possibly it can be bought Linked with the Teleport and after every teleportation you are assumed to be "hovering" - even if it's hovering in contact with the ground.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering"' date=' that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.[/quote']

 

bigbywolf: First, taking Instant off the construct means there is nothing stopping you from hovering there phase after phase Instant means it only lasts for a phase.Next phase you start to fall, unless you teleport at once.

 

edit: Beast: "What is the sfx of the flight." A good question, actually, I'd kind of wondered. WHY does this character hang there in temporary defiance of gravity?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary says that no matter how you slice it, it looks like a 1 pt Power (barring house rules)

So the character is doing a Wiley Coyote after he has run off another cliff

[MrAgdesh]

you still need to figure out what to do after the flight kicks in as your move is done and are now a floating duck who cannot even shoot back

 

There's nothing to figure out, because there's nothing to do, You're a floating duck who cannot even shoot back. Much like any other character who has completed their actions and now are waiting for their next phase, except that unlike most other characters you happen to be hovering in midair as an even more obvious target.

 

you need to switch to another mode of movement which means you start falling

 

The entire point of the power is that you never start falling.

 

If this is going to be another NCM teleport you are going to fall for 2 phases

at speed 6 this is 4 segments

when your flight kicks in again you will be at a velocity of 40m/sec and 100m down

 

No, when your Flight kicks in you are at velocity 0 because it activates before you begin to fall.

 

your flight will only slow you 5m a phase

at best you will hit with 55m of velocity(27.5 d6)

 

Like I said a little planning and you look cool falling with grace

you just need the right tools and 1m of flight is not enough

 

 

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport' date=' and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.[/quote']

 

I was going to object to this statement then I read it more carefully. You may be right. Possibly it can be bought Linked with the Teleport and after every teleportation you are assumed to be "hovering" - even if it's hovering in contact with the ground.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering"' date=' that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.[/quote']

 

bigbywolf: First, taking Instant off the construct means there is nothing stopping you from hovering there phase after phase Instant means it only lasts for a phase.Next phase you start to fall, unless you teleport at once.

 

edit: Beast: "What is the sfx of the flight." A good question, actually, I'd kind of wondered. WHY does this character hang there in temporary defiance of gravity?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary says that no matter how you slice it, it looks like a 1 pt Power (barring house rules)

I agree with you on the use of Instant to keep the flight until the start of the character's next phase.

 

The SFX is that the character is 'phasing' in. Reacclimatising to our world's gravity if you will, after a brief trip through the teleport dimension.

[MrAgdesh]

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport, and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering", that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.

 

The Trigger was theorised because the character doesn't really _have_ Flight. He cannot use it for any means other than hovering, briefly, after a teleport move. So it would not be correct to Zero Phase action turn on Flight prior to Teleport, and as has been said, Trigger will allow you to get around the no 0 Phase Actions after a Full Move rule, if bought at the right level.

 

So, game-mechanics wise, I can see no real difference, but I think Trigger more elegantly describes this effect.

[psyber624]

Why would you need trigger at all? you can RAW turn flight on and "hover" without using a movement action to do so and I don't believe there are any rules that activating teleport would turn off your flight. So you are hovering before your teleport, and hovering after your teleport, you should be okay.

 

You MIGHT have to take a half move to start "hovering", that's not really covered in the brief glance at the rules that i did but after that point I am pretty sure you can just keep your flight "on" (paying 1 end per phase of course) and teleport as your movement action.

 

The Trigger was theorised because the character doesn't really _have_ Flight. He cannot use it for any means other than hovering, briefly, after a teleport move. So it would not be correct to Zero Phase action turn on Flight prior to Teleport, and as has been said, Trigger will allow you to get around the no 0 Phase Actions after a Full Move rule, if bought at the right level.

 

So, game-mechanics wise, I can see no real difference, but I think Trigger more elegantly describes this effect.

Hmm, I can see that, although personally I would go with a limitation rather than the Trigger advantage to get the feel. I understand the need for something to prevent the player from just deciding to Hover whenever he felt like it (if that's not the flavor he is looking for) but as you are obviously making the power WEAKER (by limiting when he can use it) and not STRONGER (since he can, RAW, have it active after a teleport without the need of trigger) then it sounds more like a limitation to me "Only to momentarily hover after a teleport" (-1) than a complex Trigger setup.

 

Of course I am not trying to argue that it CANT be built that way (technically I am not trying to argue at all here) just stating my opinion that I don't feel it needs to be.

[GhostDancer]

I stand by my post #6, and don't feel Modifiers need apply. If the GM feels that the build requires at least 2" of Flight, so be it. I'd make no such requirement, given that Flying 0" is less than half of Flying 1".

[MrAgdesh]

Hmm, I can see that, although personally I would go with a limitation rather than the Trigger advantage to get the feel. I understand the need for something to prevent the player from just deciding to Hover whenever he felt like it (if that's not the flavor he is looking for) but as you are obviously making the power WEAKER (by limiting when he can use it) and not STRONGER (since he can, RAW, have it active after a teleport without the need of trigger) then it sounds more like a limitation to me "Only to momentarily hover after a teleport" (-1) than a complex Trigger setup.

 

Of course I am not trying to argue that it CANT be built that way (technically I am not trying to argue at all here) just stating my opinion that I don't feel it needs to be.

 

 

Don't worry, I know you're not arguing, just debating your point. Always good to get different points of view, especially with HERO.

 

When you say RAW, I take it that you mean he is activating his Flight before he 'ports?

 

One problem would be say, if the character initiated a teleport, but failed to say that he was turning on his Flight prior to the 'port. Yes, you should probably be forgiving as a GM as you know that his power is 'meant' to work like this. But what if he was Mind Controlled to 'port? With Trigger the Flight will kick in regardless. Just seems to me to be a more intuitive way to handle it. Although Trigger is an advantage, the power is limited enough in other ways (Only to Hover, Instant) that it will bring the cost down. To be honest, the Flight is so minimal that it will be dirt cheap to buy anyhow.

[Greywind]

RAW - Rules As Written

[MrAgdesh]

Yes, thanks Greywind I did understand the abbreviation, I was just confirming that the Flight would need to be activated pre-'port. (which is not technically correct for this build).

[IndianaJoe3]

I'm not even sure you can use two different movement powers simultaneously under 5er. (I's explicitly forbidden under 6e.)

[Lucius]

Are you saying it's not possible to take a Leap with a Running start?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary wonders exactly what is meant by "simultaneously."

[Hyper-Man]

Are you saying it's not possible to take a Leap with a Running start?

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary wonders exactly what is meant by "simultaneously."

A leap with a running start is considered a normal use of Leap. A character can normally use 2 different movement abilities in 1 Phase if they are Half Moves of each movement type. They are using their entire Phase for movement actions. If they want to use a Half Phase for Movement (Half Move) and still have a Half Phase Action remaining for other non-movement actions then the Trigger based hovering Flight is probably the best way to do it.

[psyber624]

The problem with that is the Hover aspect of flight. If the only way you can use a movement power is to take a move action then if you want to "hover" in place you would technically have to spend a half move every phase even if you are not moving at all. And since "position shift" allows you to use a movement power as a zero phase action (just to stand up) I don't see why hovering wouldn't work without needing an action. I do agree MrArgadesh that he might "forget" to declare its turned on and that could be weird.

 

While I know there is a rule somewhere that states you can't use two movement powers as part of the same ACTION (for instance combining 8" of running with 20" of Flight to move 28" as a full move (or 14" as a half move) I don't remember anything stating that they cant be "on" at the same time. Did I miss that somewhere?

[Christopher]

I am pretty sure that "Swimming, only to stay on the Surface" does not require a boat to spend a half-phase action to not sink. Otherwise boats without somebody on the controlls would always just sink in Hero! (Seriously, the difference between Swimming and Flight is the medium you move through)

 

The only rule that applies about hovering is that you still have to spend at least 1 END/phase (unless bought 0 END).

Flight is a Constant Power. You can use Flight to move, but I found no rule that says "You have to spend a half phase action to hover". Naturally you cannot use Walking or Jumping while Hovering, but Teleport has no such Limitation.

And I of course asume power is bought outside of any Framework:

2 "I Float!" 1" Flight, Persistent, 0 END, Only to Hover(-1)

[Christopher]

Okay, I asked if my build (a 6E varriant of it) would be working:

http://www.herogames.com/forums/forum/hero-games/hero-system-6th-edition-rules-questions/3595118-hovering-after-teleport-into-air

 

I found an earlier discussion that states Persistent Flight works even when K.O. (this was even for 5E according to dates and answer):

http://www.herogames.com/forums/forum/hero-games/hero-system-6th-edition-rules-questions/2246-flight-persistent-0-end

[bigbywolfe]

Okay, I asked if my build (a 6E varriant of it) would be working:

http://www.herogames.com/forums/forum/hero-games/hero-system-6th-edition-rules-questions/3595118-hovering-after-teleport-into-air

 

I found an earlier discussion that states Persistent Flight works even when K.O. (this was even for 5E according to dates and answer):

http://www.herogames.com/forums/forum/hero-games/hero-system-6th-edition-rules-questions/2246-flight-persistent-0-end

Any Persistent Power works even when knocked out. That's what Persistent does.

[Christopher]

Okay, we got an answer from the Rules Forum:

Technically he would have to spend a half phase action to start hovering and continue hovering. But it won't break the game to make it a Zero-Phae action or even Action that takes no Time.