Jhamin

I think the critical thing to keep in mind is that if the title is going to be used, is has to be concise. BBB and FREd caught on partly because they were quick and easy to type. Two or Three word names are too hard to type. reFred actually works pretty well. Unfortunatly there is baggage....

A supplement like that is on the list of things Hero wants to do when it gets the chance. As for a Mini-Crime kit, rather than worry about the minutia you are probably better off just buying it as a bonus to your Criminology roll with a Focus.

There is alot of discussion on this over in the company questions forum. It has it's own topic & discussion has spilled over into the "When do "we" get to know" thread. FREd Jr. is a way to go, but it sounds like it will be just as big, so Jr. seems inappropriate. It is also 4 more keystrokes, which is a pain. FREdRe perhaps?

The BBB has come and gone. FREd led us out of the wilderness, but it's time is ending. Now 5th Edition Revised in on the (distant) horizon. What will we of the herodom boards call it?

In terms of point cost you probably don't want to just buy a disadvantage as an attack power. That isn't what they are there for and their costs are not balanced for that. If you can buy unluck to go after your enemies, then what is to stop someone from buying "Hunted by Mechanon, 14-, useable against others" to get out of buying a 1200 point summon on a 14- activation roll? If you want to give someone the effect of having the disadvantage, then the change environment or transform options are the way to go.

One of the things I loved about V:COTS (and it's 4th ed version) was the way it laid out an organization as something bigger than they nest you were clashing with right now. If Demon is supposed to be this world wide conspiracy, lets get into some detail as to how it works. - How are communications handled? Does everyone report to a superior, until you eventually reach a member of the inner circle? Or do the Morbanes take direction but run day-to-day operations on their own? What are the factions, if any? - If there will be a generic Demon "Magical Style" how do they interact with other dark magicians of other styles? Do Voodo priests for example join Demon, or do they clash with it? - A more exact idea as to how all these legions of cultists get all those magic wands and enchanted amulets. Are they really that easy for anybody with a black cloak to make? Or is there an artificer somewhere turning them out by the truckload? - How does someone get into Demon? Are you recruited? Do you seek them out? What sort of initiation is there? How far in do you have to be before you get your Brazen Wand? - "A week in the life of a Demon Brother" What do these guys do when they aren't sacrificing chickens? Do they have jobs, families? - If the inner circle worship elder beings from beyond time, but the rank and file summon infernal muscle when they need it, where in the command structure does this shift? And how do the Elder beings and Infernal Princes like having the organization split between them? - Viper:COTS had a whole section on the vehicles that back up agents. Does Demon have an equivalent? - Demon in varous environments. Do they menace Atlantis? Orbital Facilites? Tibetan Temples? Monster Island? If so, what are they doing in these places? - How does Demon fund all these operations? Black Candles are suprisingly spendy. Do they commit crimes for mere wealth? Do they conjure up money as needed? Do they have wealthy benefactors? I for one would rather avoid having them steal their money, that crosses over too much with Viper, but it is something I would like to see addressed. - In related areas, if Demon can summon supernatural servents, why doesn't every two bit Demon Brother have a legion of Devil Knights at his command? What resources does Demon need to call up servents? Can the heroes track someone by staking out the local ethnic food stores waiting for somebody to buy an unusual spice? And to second a couple of other posts: - I agree with the posters asking for consistency in the "Demon Style" of magic, or at least several defined substyles. - I would also like to see both a list of Demon's commonly used supers and several generic monsters that could be called upon by a cult being hunted down by the PCs.

I would say it comes down to game effects. If there is a big advantage to be gained by real blood and realistic wounds, it should cost something . Maybe a bought-as-a-power disguse roll. On the other hand, if it is no more useful than the disguise provided by the difference between young Billy and Shazaam! then I would say it is just special effect.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but... What was so bad about the cover?

This might be borderline for my campaign. The power itself is fine, but I'm not sure about how well it fits in with the other slots. A multipower is supposed to be one power with different effects or a very closely related set of abilites that come from one source. Your multipower has a bunch of "Martial Arts Ki-Magic" type powers and one slot for a weapon. I would be cool with "Martial Arts Ki-Magic" as a source for a framework, or "Martial Ars Weapon Mastery" as a source, but about the only way I can see to combine them is to make it "Ninja Guy Abilites" which would get way too broad for my taste. As I said, it is borderline, I may just let it ride. If you changed the physical darts to "Soul Splinters" or something, which did the same thing but were magic & cost End I would be much more comfortable with this multipower.

While I agree that the OIHID limitations would probably need to be better defined for my campaign as well, I would just handwave the "Biofeedback to change" bit. I have a philosophical objection to making a character buy powers or skills whose only purpose was to allow them to access their powers. Why should you have to spend points for the privlege of not being totally hosed by a -1/4 limit? If you are IIF guy, you can put on your Slighly Rusy Anklet of Cosmic Power and get all your stuff without spending points on the ability to fasten it. If you traded that build in in for OIHID; Must fasten Rusty Anklet to Trasnform (Which has the same value BTW) why should anyone have to spend points on the ability to fasten it?

I know the Hero guys are reluctant to clutter up the place with new forums, but I think a discussion like the one you propose would be a natural for a "Character Corner" forum. You could also use it to discuss "alternate world" characters and "What would your character do" threads.

If you want to use teams, why not some of the less sociopathic guys from CKC? Grab might be game, and the high babe factor would impress the TV executives. It might be fun to use the Ultimates and watch Binder lose it around episode 3. Then it gets really fun when you rearrange the teams half way through and all the hidden rivalries pop up.

Outsider is absolutely right. Define what each level of rank gives you, then stat it out from there. An Example from the Babylon 5 Universe: I based this on the theory that in a B5 campain military rank was important, but that it only helps you with other members of earth force, the aliens don't care. In those cases your official areas of expertise and responsibility come into play. For Example; Mr. Garabauldi had law enforment powers and the Station commander was also an ambassador, so aliens did have to listen to that. In an all-Earth Force game, the ranks would cost more. Enlisted - 0 Points Low Officer - 1 Point Officer - 2 Points High Officer - 3 Points Then mix with the following: Authority - 1 Point, You have official clout and others of lower/equal rank *must* obey you in these matters. Expertise - 1 Point, in your area of knowledge your opinion counts as official fact. Department Head - 2 Points, others below you in *your branch* orginization must follow your commands. Command - 3 Points, you may give orders to anyone below your rank in a large orginization Ambassador - You are recognized as speaking for your people and must be resepected by everyone who does not wish to insult your race. Examples: Mr Garabauldi = Officer, Authority (Security), Expertise (Security), Department Head (Security) 6 Points Lt. Cmdr Ivoniva = Officer, Authority (Shipping Regulations), Department Head (Command & Control), 5 Points Dr. Franklin = Enlisted, Authority (Medical Matters), Expertise (Medicine), Department Head (Med Lab) - 4 Points Cmdr Sinclair = Officer, Command (Babylon 5), Ambassador - 8 Points Captain Sheriden = High Officer, Command (Babylon 5), Ambassador - 9 Points (and later, Command - Rangers, bringing him up to 12) Mr. Bester = Officer, Authority (Psi Corps regulations), Expertise (PSI Abilites), 4 Points Lt. Keffler = Low Officer - 1 Point Zack Allen = Low Officer, Authority (Security) - 2 Points (In later seasons he gain rank, become a department head and gain expertise, bringing him up to 6) Lt. Corwin = Low Officer, Authority (Shipping Regs) - 2 Points (In season five he becomes a Department Head) Random Starfury Pilot = Enlisted - 0 Points (but you do get to fly around) Random Security Guard = Enlisted, Authority (Security) - 1 Point Under this system rank and title end up costing more than they do in Outsiders Star Trek system, but then "pulling rank" comes up alot more on B5 than it does on Star Trek.

I always enjoyed Jackhammer & Chainsaw from the Destruction Company (High Tech Enemies). They were every hillbilly good ol' boy cliche in suits of power armor built for them by someone alot smarter.

Re: Focus/Independent Questions While I generally agree with Monolith, let me add a couple of addendums. You can't just have a bunch of stuff because you are rich, otherwise every rich person would have a closet full of Iron Man battle armor. You still need to pay points. Wealth is still very worth it for all the noncombat/roleplaying value it has. -Stately Wayne manor just sounds so much better than Apartment 3b. The batcave cost points, the mansion is just a bennie of the wealth. -Do you need to make sure a villian never gets his hands on a rare/evil book? Buy it. -Does the team need to get to the Outback to stop Dr. Unconscionable and the omegajet is all banged up? 4 1st classs tickets on Quanza coming up. -Is Sen. Anti-mutant's reelection going off without a hitch? Contribute heavily to the other guy. A good oppertunity to use all those KS: Government and Persuasion skills out of costume. Anything that they will have for more than a combat ought to either cost points or be a plot device. Having a Weaponsmith contact just allows you to justify having a Mutant Nullifier when your charcter barely finished High School. If you are going to tote around a bunch of gizmoes all the time, then that is what Gadget Pools are made for. Just buy the VPP and swap out "must visit lab" with "must talk to Jimmy the Weaponsmith". On the other hand, if you are about to fight Dr. Arctic then I would probably allow you to score a flamethrower by calling in a favor from the Marine Quartermaster that owes you. I just wouldn't let you keep it. Or do it all the time. Don't get too hung up on the powers and points and how they are related. A Gadget is really just a power the character has with a neato justification. Don't let bad guys steal them anymore than you would let someone steal a wizard's magic. Let them lose the focus, that's what the limit is for, but don't let them lose the power. They just can't use it until they get their gear back. Heck, there are whole characters who are based off of taking/inheriting gizmoes from someone else. I doubt that anyone would argue that Green Lantern doesn't need to pay for the ring because some dying alien just gave it to him. The Hobgoblin got everything he had by taking it from the Green Goblin. Even though it was basically the same gear, and somone else had paid for it, because that stuff became the basis for his powers he still paid points for all of it.

An idea I've been kicking around for my Star Hero fleet was to use the US Navy practice of picking a scheme for each type of ship and sticking with it, then trying to find a nice international feel for united earth ships. Options: Military Leaders - Hannibal, Alexander, Rommel, Ghengis, Sun Tzu, etc. Of course, I perfer myth as a source for future names: Mythical Warriors - Galihad, Hiawatha, Sigurd, Gilgamesh, etc Mythical Creatures (really appropriate for uber-battleships) - Kraken, Grendel, Fafner, Windigo, Kinie Ger, etc Legendary Scientists/Wisemen (good for science ships) - Daedelus, Myrlin, Imhotep, etc Mythical Weapons - Mjolner, Excalibur, Gae Bolg, etc

Although it wasn't labeled as such, we sort of already had a couple of WWYLTS threads. Of course, they quickly veered off into discussions about superheroes vs. military vehicles.

I agree that "Does not Bleed" can exist both as the power and the special effect. Mechanon is not human in any way, but doesn't have any of the automation rules. He can be stunned, but because of the SFX of his powers (I'm a Robot!) he would be immune to Bloodstone. It's no different that Spiderman ignoring mutant nullification attacks, cause he isn't a mutant. I guess it's really just a question of how you wanted Ironclad to work.

You are correct of course. This works in our game primarily becuse I have players wor are willing to buy to concept. The fact that nonresistant characters tend to get gutted by 60AP killing attacks is generally enough of a disadvantage that my players avoid them until they really need to do some property damage. If it is supposed to be a killing attack, it OUGHT to do more body, and the flat x3 lets it do that without ratcheting up the stun.

While I agree that alot of your numbers sound right, I don't agree that a X in MSH = Y in Hero type conversion. I also probably wouldn't use the numbers you have there in a straight champs game, even though the probably do reflect what these guys do in the comics. I'm basing my conversion on the assumption that the strongest 3-4 guys in Champions can compete with the strongest 3-4 guys in Marvel. This is admittedly makes an assumption that you want to have a Marvel U that works on the same benchmarks as Champions. My first point was that Marvel, DC, and Champs are based on different campaign limits, so not making that assumption and using a different benchmark is perfectly acceptable but you have to acknowledge that you are doing so. My methodology was inspired in part by the "universe crossover" series that have come out in the last 5 years where heroes from DC and Marvel go toe to toe. In those series, Batman and Cap go toe to toe and are almost totally evenly matched even though the both have comics that might imply different levels of ability. Why? Because they are both "at the limit of human" and their similar Iconic functions imply they ought to be about even. This is also why Thor and Supes can throw down even if Superman's feats of Str are always more stupendous than Thors. They have similar "Iconic Strong Guy" roles. If you go with that system of conversion, then a "Thor in the Champs U" method should ignore the fine points of his stats in other systems or what he lifted in issues xxx, and just focus on who he should be able to armwrestle to a standstil. By that logic Thor ought to have around a 90-100 not because of his abilities in the comics, but because that's what Ripper and Grond have, and he should be about even with them. (Mjolner's +to HA would up his damage, but his Str is still in the same league) By the same token, if Ripper took on the Fantastic Four in a MSH game, he should have Uneartly Str when powered up, regardless of what his Champs stats ought to convert to.

My group went to a flat x3 multiplier over a year ago. It's worked out pretty well.

This is exactly why I've adopted the system for conversion that I have. Supers are getting "powered up", altered, losing/gaining powers, etc every few issues. At the end of the day, they still exist somewhere in the pecking order of their universe. After all these power ups/power downs is Colossus stronger or weaker than the Hulk? Thor? Hercules? Wonderman? The Thing? Is he one of the strongest characters in the Marvel universe or is he just one of the really strong ones? Or is his power level, while impressive in the league he plays in, just not all that amazing next to the real heavyweights? (Luke Cage fits this catagory pretty well) It all comes down to pecking order. In the Champions U we have a nice, well defined set of stats for everyone. When we do conversions we have to comapare how a charater in their universe compares to their fellows.

I think what it really comes down to is the "campaign limits" of the various comic universes. Some people seem to operate on the assumption that a super is a super, but in fact what you need to be powerful depends alot on what limits your GM has set. If you are in a world where 10d6 is a standard attack, your 12d6 eyebeams look pretty good. In a world where 14d6 is average, you need 16d6 (or 30 AP more) to stand out. Marvel and DC do not use the same "campaign limits". A really strong charcter in Marvel doesn't need to buy his STR up as high to stand out as he would in DC. This doesn't mean he isn't as cool, it just means that the goalpost in in a different place. Heck, it isn't even consistant across comics. What it takes to be really strong in a Batman comic doesn't even get you noticed in a Superman book. IMHO the "campaign limits" that have evolved for Champions are internally consistant, but that doens't mean they translate well into other "campaigns". A really good conversion looks a the pecking order of the world they come from and compares it the pecking order of the champions universe. If you assume that a Champions heavy hitter is the equal to a heavy hitter in another universe, then if Grond fought the Hulk one of them would have to be converted so they were both playing by the same character build rules. The strongest guys in Champions hover around 90-100 Str (Grond, Ripper, Gargantua). The Marvel "Heavy Hitters" like Hulk and Juggernaught ought to be in this range. "Middleweight" bricks in the Champs universe are guys like Iron Clad, Blackstar, and Ogre. They have Str from 60-70, This means that as a middle weight Marvel brick Colossus should also have a "middle weight" brick Str of around 60-70. (the heroic Rusky can trade blows with Thing, but gets clobbered by Gladiator of the Imperial Guard) This leaves people like Iron Man and Rogue who are way strong but who don't trade punches with the big boys (and tend to rely on other powers) to have a Str of around 40-50, which tracks well with the "lesser bricks" like Defender. These things can apply to other stats as well, for example you might convert Reed Richards and Tony Stark by comparing them to the "uber brains" of the Champions universe and figuring out what it takes to stand out for your brain power.

One of the Supreme Serpent decoys from Viper 4th (an android in a nice suit as I recall) had this exact power. It was bought as a transform "People without vulnerability to electricity to people with x2 from electric attacks". He was so over the top anyway that active point limits didn't really apply, but the thing that always struck me about it was that it was just mean . When characters take a big hit, the Players deal with it. If a charcter gets nailed with a transform to mess with his character, then gets hit by a power he is now vulnerable to, that will just stick in his craw.

Although a couple of the example races were mentioned elsewhere, Endless horde: Borg, Mechanoids, Zentradi, Invid Militant Xenophobes: Cylons, Daleks. Shapechangers: Founders, Dire Wraiths Mythic Figure Aliens: Gould, Vorlons, Apollo from "Star Trek"