Heroes for pay

[AnotherSkip]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

there are the Industrial and Entertainment Divisions. So even if you don't want to use yours powers risking your life, you can make a living or at least some extra cash.

 

Zip Boy from The Specials movie had just this sort of a job. He was looking to get the main character into plastics work using his laser powers....

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

The Avengers stipend was last mentioned in the 1980's, IIRC, so there has been some inflation since then, but it was intended as a stipend, not as valuing their services. It was noted at the time that most Avengers donated the funds back, or to a charity, but those without other means of support did retain the funds. Let's also remember that they tended to live at the Avengers Mansion, so they were getting free accommodations and meals, in addition to this weekly stipend.

 

It was very attractive to Spider-Man at the time, even though he would not live at the mansion.

[AnotherSkip]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Jarvis aint no slouch in the kitchen!

[The Weapon]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

I would think: God damn' date=' is he nuts? Depending on the weapons of the robber and himself people could have gotten hurt. People tend to get overconfident when they have a weapon and thinking "I can take him on" without having training will just get bystanders get into the line of fire or the line of swing.[/quote']

 

In the US cops have about 11% mistaken self-defence shootings, citizens have 2%. It's a bit hard to argue that it's safer to leave it to the experts. In fact of course the cops are likely to never actually have an on-duty gun fight or even draw their guns. Given this most had the minimum level of skill that allowed them to pass their qualification last time. And since then it's gone down.

[Christopher]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

In the US cops have about 11% mistaken self-defence shootings' date=' citizens have 2%. It's a bit hard to argue that it's safer to leave it to the experts. In fact of course the cops are likely to never actually have an on-duty gun fight or even draw their guns. Given this most had the minimum level of skill that allowed them to pass their qualification last time. And since then it's gone down.[/quote']

x% of what?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

In the US cops have about 11% mistaken self-defence shootings' date=' citizens have 2%. It's a bit hard to argue that it's safer to leave it to the experts. In fact of course the cops are likely to never actually have an on-duty gun fight or even draw their guns. Given this most had the minimum level of skill that allowed them to pass their qualification last time. And since then it's gone down.[/quote']

 

x% of what?

 

Exactly. Does this mean 11% of shots fired by police officers in self-defense were mistaken, while 98% of citizen gunshots were, in fact, in self-defense, or does it mean that 11% of all police officers (all of whom have been trained in firearm use, carry firearms in the course of their duties and are very likely to find themselves in situations where they must defend themselves) in the have fired a gun and were found not to be shooting in self-defense, but only 2% of citizens (including citizens who have never handled a firearm) have fired a shot which later was determined not to have been in self-defense?

 

I have never, and never expect to, been in a situation where, while carrying a firearm, I yelled "Freeze" at a fleeing person suspected of having committed a violent criminal offense, only to have this person whip around with his/her hand reaching to their waist or a pocket. As such, I have never had to make the split second decision whether to fire my weapon out of concern my life may be in immediate jeopardy. I suspect that, if we determine the percentage of qualified police officers who are in such a situation in the course of, say, a one year period of employment as a police office, that percentage will be more than 5.5x the percentage of the general population who found themselves in such a situation.

 

Assuming I am correct in this regard, then the fact that the percentage of police officers who made an error in such a situation is less than 5.5x the percentage of the general population who has been in such a situation and made such an error indicates the police do, in fact, make fewer mistakes in this regard.

[megaplayboy]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_%26_Bunny

 

The theme of the above series seems apropos here.

[matthewcelis]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

It all depends on how they are played and how the GM sets up the scenarios. After all, Luke "Power Man" Cage and Iron Fist were "Heroes for Hire." They were very heroic. If I recall, they would charge rich clients but were always helping everyone with a sob story for free. I know Luke Cage never wound up saying no to anyone in need that came to him.

[TheQuestionMan]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

In the Hero Central: New Players Welcome the the Superheroes were offered a salary by PRIMUS. Two Teams one Sponsored Publicly and the other Covertly.

 

My character has wealth and works as an Actor, Model, Singer, Stuntman, and Bodyguard/Male Escort.

 

QM

[Greywind]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

It all depends on how they are played and how the GM sets up the scenarios. After all' date=' Luke "Power Man" Cage and Iron Fist were "Heroes for Hire." They were very heroic. If I recall, they would charge rich clients but were always helping everyone with a sob story for free. I know Luke Cage never wound up saying no to anyone in need that came to him.[/quote']I was more impressed by how he went to Latveria because Doom skipped out on his bill.

[matthewcelis]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

HERE, HERE!

 

Some of the most important jobs for a viable modern society are some of the worst paid. And those are the ones that I put at the top of my own list.

 

Former sailor (AT2),

Mother is a retired teacher,

numerous friends are teachers, soldiers, and sailors, as well as police and firefighters

 

Gemphyre

 

Teachers, police, and firefighters are among the best paid professionals out there. This myth that they are underpaid is always trotted out along with the myth that they are inherently heroic occupations.

[Christopher]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

In the Hero Central: New Players Welcome the the Superheroes were offered a salary by PRIMUS. Two Teams one Sponsored Publicly and the other Covertly.

 

My character has wealth and works as an Actor, Model, Singer, Stuntman, and Bodyguard/Male Escort.

 

QM

I've already written about our group, QM:

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php/56851-Heroes-for-pay?p=2229732#post2229732

 

Teachers' date=' police, and firefighters are among the best paid professionals out there. This myth that they are underpaid is always trotted out along with the myth that they are inherently heroic occupations.[/quote']

For wich country is your information valid?

[TheQuestionMan]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Oops!

 

My Bad

 

QM

[The Weapon]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Exactly. Does this mean 11% of shots fired by police officers in self-defense were mistaken, while 98% of citizen gunshots were, in fact, in self-defense, or does it mean that 11% of all police officers (all of whom have been trained in firearm use, carry firearms in the course of their duties and are very likely to find themselves in situations where they must defend themselves) in the have fired a gun and were found not to be shooting in self-defense, but only 2% of citizens (including citizens who have never handled a firearm) have fired a shot which later was determined not to have been in self-defense?

 

I have never, and never expect to, been in a situation where, while carrying a firearm, I yelled "Freeze" at a fleeing person suspected of having committed a violent criminal offense, only to have this person whip around with his/her hand reaching to their waist or a pocket. As such, I have never had to make the split second decision whether to fire my weapon out of concern my life may be in immediate jeopardy. I suspect that, if we determine the percentage of qualified police officers who are in such a situation in the course of, say, a one year period of employment as a police office, that percentage will be more than 5.5x the percentage of the general population who found themselves in such a situation.

 

Assuming I am correct in this regard, then the fact that the percentage of police officers who made an error in such a situation is less than 5.5x the percentage of the general population who has been in such a situation and made such an error indicates the police do, in fact, make fewer mistakes in this regard.

 

Of course it's percentage of self-defence shootings that were mistaken. I don't know what you're trying to pretend I was saying. Cops AREN'T likely to be in a situation where they have to use lethal force, most cops never have that situation in their entire careers. Therefore it couldn't possibly be that 11% of cops mistakenly shoot people, that's more than the percentage who ever have to fire their guns. Hell it's probably more than the percentage who ever had to draw them. That the police create situations where they might be mistaken about whether or not people are reaching for a gun is part of the point. Relying on the experts is not safe. It's 5.5x more dangerous. Police are given minimal training, much of it bad (e.g. they are trained not to confront a "spree shooter" with armed force, despite that being 100% effective and 100% non-lethal to the person confronting them). They train yearly to qualify on their firearms, much less than people who actually think it's likely they'll have to defend themselves, who don't miss a week.

[Checkmate]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Teachers' date=' police, and firefighters are among the best paid professionals out there. This myth that they are underpaid is always trotted out along with the myth that they are inherently heroic occupations.[/quote']

 

Oh really? Care to back that statement with some facts? I can tell you in the small city I live in (around 56,255 according to google) that the Fire Fighters makes exactly $0 an hour, averaging out to an annual salary of $0. Now I don't know how much you get paid for what you do, but $0 seems pretty low.

 

Now I realize the original post is around 4 years old, however to answer the question, I think there is a big difference between someone that gets paid to do heroic things versus someone who won't do heroic things unless they're paid.

[Christopher]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Of course it's percentage of self-defence shootings that were mistaken. I don't know what you're trying to pretend I was saying.

You gave an incomplete expression. Don't give the blame of misunderstanding to others, who only got this incomplete expression.

 

Also, could you back up this claim with facts/studies or another source?

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Of course it's percentage of self-defence shootings that were mistaken. I don't know what you're trying to pretend I was saying. Cops AREN'T likely to be in a situation where they have to use lethal force' date=' most cops never have that situation in their entire careers. Therefore it couldn't possibly be that 11% of cops mistakenly shoot people, that's more than the percentage who ever have to fire their guns. Hell it's probably more than the percentage who ever had to draw them. That the police create situations where they might be mistaken about whether or not people are reaching for a gun is part of the point.[/quote']

 

It's their job to stop suspects, so I would say "the police create situations" is overly inflammatory.

 

Relying on the experts is not safe.

 

So, are you getting your statistics from experts (which is not safe) or from non-experts (who lack any credibility)?

 

It's 5.5x more dangerous. Police are given minimal training' date=' much of it bad (e.g. they are trained not to confront a "spree shooter" with armed force, despite that being 100% effective and 100% non-lethal to the person confronting them). They train yearly to qualify on their firearms, much less than people who actually think it's likely they'll have to defend themselves, who don't miss a week.[/quote']

 

As others have asked, where is the source for your information? I'm interested in the fact that you know how police training, firearms qualification, etc. is administered world wide, for example.

[Orion]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Oh really? Care to back that statement with some facts? I can tell you in the small city I live in (around 56' date='255 according to google) that the Fire Fighters makes exactly $0 an hour, averaging out to an annual salary of $0. Now I don't know how much you get paid for what you do, but $0 seems pretty low.[/quote']

 

Seems to me you are talking about volunteers, whereas matthewcelis was talking about paid employees.

 

 

http://www.texastribune.org/library/data/government-employee-salaries/austin/titles/firefighter/3749/?page=16

 

Austin, TX - median firefighter salary is $62k. From local newspaper reports, I get the idea pay is slightly higher here than in the other large Texas cities, but not overwhelmingly so. During the last round of union negotiations, one of the big issues was that the firefighters get a bonus/increase/something over standard firefighter pay to offset the cost of living in Austin. Of course, many don't actually live in Austin, but still get that increase.

 

http://www.ci.austin.tx.us/police/recruiting/benefits.htm

Austin TX - police salary can be $60k or so after 1 year on the job. There are numerous reports of police (and I'm talking sergeants and patrolmen, not the police chief) of make in the $125k and above range. Some of this is overtime, but some is just due to high wages after a few years.

 

http://archive.austinisd.org/inside/docs/hr_salary_11_12.pdf

Austin TX - teacher salary. Looks like you can start at about $42k. I think that is for the partial year, but may be wrong.

 

Two of these jobs have potential danger, but the actual percentage injured is quite low. Two also have to put up with a lot of grief from everyone looking over their shoulder. Still, in my opinion they are overpaid, especially considering the low education requirements for the jobs. These three jobs aren't being paid so well because of the danger or grief or value to society - they are paid that much because they have unions that basically blackmail the city government.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Two of these jobs have potential danger' date=' but the actual percentage injured is quite low. Two also have to put up with a lot of grief from everyone looking over their shoulder. Still, in my opinion they are overpaid, especially considering the low education requirements for the jobs. These three jobs aren't being paid so well because of the danger or grief or value to society - they are paid that much because they have unions that basically blackmail the city government.[/quote']

 

So have you applied, if the criteria are so low and the pay so excessive?

[megaplayboy]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

A 1st year associate at a large law firm makes 160,000 a year, with a chance for a bonus of up to 40,000 dollars. A starting doctor, post-residency, will make 100,000 to 250,000, depending on specialty. A United States Congressperson makes 168,000 a year plus an awesome array of perks and benefits. Investment bankers do quite well for themselves, of course. With whom are you comparing those salaries and concluding they're overpaid?

[csyphrett]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

starting teachers are listed at 33k. You have to put in 20 years before you hit anywhere near 60k

CES

[megaplayboy]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Cops, Firefighters and Teachers also have to deal with high stress, low morale, higher burnout and divorce rates, etc.

 

By no means are these "easy" or "cushy" jobs. I worked as a substitute teacher, for 80 bucks a day, in the 90s. Some days it was okay, other days a kind of living hell. It takes serious skills to get a class under control, to establish a rapport with the students, and to impart knowledge that will stay with them. That's before you even get to the level of being able to inspire them.

[Checkmate]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

Seems to me you are talking about volunteers, whereas matthewcelis was talking about paid employees.

 

 

http://www.texastribune.org/library/data/government-employee-salaries/austin/titles/firefighter/3749/?page=16

 

Austin, TX - median firefighter salary is $62k. From local newspaper reports, I get the idea pay is slightly higher here than in the other large Texas cities, but not overwhelmingly so. During the last round of union negotiations, one of the big issues was that the firefighters get a bonus/increase/something over standard firefighter pay to offset the cost of living in Austin. Of course, many don't actually live in Austin, but still get that increase.

 

http://www.ci.austin.tx.us/police/recruiting/benefits.htm

Austin TX - police salary can be $60k or so after 1 year on the job. There are numerous reports of police (and I'm talking sergeants and patrolmen, not the police chief) of make in the $125k and above range. Some of this is overtime, but some is just due to high wages after a few years.

 

http://archive.austinisd.org/inside/docs/hr_salary_11_12.pdf

Austin TX - teacher salary. Looks like you can start at about $42k. I think that is for the partial year, but may be wrong.

 

Two of these jobs have potential danger, but the actual percentage injured is quite low. Two also have to put up with a lot of grief from everyone looking over their shoulder. Still, in my opinion they are overpaid, especially considering the low education requirements for the jobs. These three jobs aren't being paid so well because of the danger or grief or value to society - they are paid that much because they have unions that basically blackmail the city government.

 

There are no paid firefighters in my city, and to get paid that much as a teacher requires your Masters degree. So like megaplayboy said, what job that requires a 6 year degree gets paid less?

 

EDIT: Also in case it wasn't clear where I was going: In order to get the "large paycheck" Firefighters get, they typically have to work a few years for free.

[Orion]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

So have you applied' date=' if the criteria are so low and the pay so excessive?[/quote']

 

No need - I make a good living working for the state government. I've been doing it long enough that dropping out of the state retirement system would require a much better job than any of these offer. For that matter, I'd only consider a job teaching children if the only other option was living under a bridge, and I'd really have to think about it for a while first.

[Orion]

Re: Heroes for pay

 

A 1st year associate at a large law firm makes 160' date='000 a year, with a chance for a bonus of up to 40,000 dollars. A starting doctor, post-residency, will make 100,000 to 250,000, depending on specialty. A United States Congressperson makes 168,000 a year plus an awesome array of perks and benefits. Investment bankers do quite well for themselves, of course. With whom are you comparing those salaries and concluding they're overpaid?[/quote']

 

Most factory workers, at least in this area. Grocery store employees. Mall store managers. Etc. Being a policemen or fireman does not take any more education than what I've just mentioned. While many might have a college education, it isn't needed for the job. It takes a certain type of personality to do the jobs, but not education. I know I'm in the minority, but I do not see police and fire fighters being that special, and think getting an average salary for the area should be enough.

 

As for the lawyers, doctors, and such you mention, I think they are in the grossly overpaid category, but that's a topic for another thread.