Super tech effects on the world at large.

[drunkonduty]

Originally written by Bloodstone:

 

>>>Well, I don't want to derail, but lets look at a common Power Armor trope: Boot Jets.

 

The tech necessary to make something as "simple" as boot jets would change the world as we know it. It's massively advanced super science that most people kinda just shrug about because Iron Man's been doing it for years in the comics. A lot of high tech stuff is treated like that.

 

So basically, most games I've been in allow amazing technology without dealing with any of the implications. I've had GM's go out of their way to preserve the status quo when the super tech guys tries to change the world with some innovation or another.<<<

 

 

Regarding "super tech impact on the world at large" thing. Myself and a friend of mine have in mind a campaign where all super powers are tech/gadget based. But all tech that is significantly advanced from real world tech is considered experimental and is subject to activation roles, catastrophic failure, limited range, etc. We'll run the game as alternating GMs.

 

To start the campaign I'll run a "flying saucer under the Arctic ice" game in which a variety of organisations (UNTIL, VIPER and Master Control) race for the secrets contained therein. The idea is that everyone gets away with something from the saucer, setting off a super tech arms race. Thereafter, as the narrative demands/allows, tech advances are made and the GM removes some restrictions/ups the DCs on some powers for some organisations. And of course the tech eventually spreads through wider society.

 

That's the plan at least. Finding the time to actually game is proving difficult.

[Clonus]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Realistically man-portable weapons-systems are not going to be the first applications of fundamentally new technology. You can expect to see large war machines first. Bolos, Battlemechs, whatever.

[drunkonduty]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Oh yeah, that was certainly part of the idea. Big, cumbersome machines (tanks, giant robots etc.) or in other words: Bulky Focus limitation.

[Nagisawa Takumi]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Problem is... How do you think the established corporate base is going to react when you throw in all these new toys? Toys that they can't make and market.

 

Not very nicely, I can imagine.

[Clonus]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Oh yeah' date=' that was certainly part of the idea. Big, cumbersome machines (tanks, giant robots etc.) or in other words: Bulky Focus limitation.[/quote']

 

Of course the PCs may end up being the agents of the guys who got their hands on the ships medical equipment and got a head start on actual genetic engineering, assigned to steal someone else's giant robots.

[drunkonduty]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Re: Unfriendly Corps. Well Master Control is the head of a tech-based mega corp. As for other corps: that's what corporate espionage is for. Nice won't come into it at all.

 

Genetic Engineering: I was thinking of letting VIPER get that. It would be nice to have genetically modified supers spring out on the heroes as a big surprise. Was thinking the Ripper. But hey, if it ever gets played what the players do will effect who gets what. That way the PCs actions early in the campaign will have an ongoing effect on the campaign.

[Certified]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

So recently I've been working on a setting where Super Tech does exist but hasn't filtered down to mainstream life as of yet. Here are the factors I used why deciding what was more common than others. First and foremost cost, virtually all other aspects factor in here. This can also be equated to how advanced is the technology?

 

The more advanced it is the more difficult to machine and manufacture. While a Plasma Rifle "Insert Super Gun Name Here" might require a leap in laser, cooling and battery technologies it is something where a basis already exists it's more a mater of scale and power so in this instance your gun man be in the thousand to ten thousands range instead of the hundreds. This puts it out of the range of most individuals, realistically, it's not like you can take out a loan for a gun. However, this does put in range for things like the military but we still have to question would they spend the money for one gun when they can just as easily by fifteen? They may have specialized support unites who use a super gun but it's not going to replace the standard weapons any time soon.

 

Then there's the question of your independent organizations. Can they afford said super gun? I know some of you may be saying well they're evil why not just steal it? Sure they may be able to hijack a supply of them or raid a manufacturing plant and take what's there but what is rate that they are being produced? Are they even being mass produced? If demand doesn't dictate it why would the entity to produce this super gun invest money into mass production? Now, if your evil organization happens to steal the schematics and technical specs for said super gun they are still going to need the resources to produce it themselves this may involve other thefts, although I'm sure they can acquire some of what they need through legitimate means but there in lyes a plot thread.

 

So there you go, economics of super tech for Metahuman's Rising and why street level technology is still relatively the same while you still have power armor and and other classic comic book science around you.

[Logan D. Hurricanes]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

I have a few thoughts on the matter of supertech. For the most part, it doesn't bother me, but there is a line. I can't define the line exactly, but I can give some examples. In DC, the JLA has teleport tubes and that bothers me. That is something earth shattering which is being hoarded. Jet boots don't bother me quite so much because we can see they are fairly ubiquitous. Nearly every government has some form for their special military. One thing I do like about Iron Man is that at least his tech takes up volume. Cramming all of his powers and force field tech into a skintight suit bothers me.

 

There was a story in the Fantastic Four not long ago in which a throwaway line explained a lot of where the supertech went. Paraphrasing poorly:

Reed: "Here, take this to Megaco while you're out."

Sue: "What is it?"

Reed: "It's a permanent battery. They'll pay millions to keep us from making it public."

 

I like the mad science route, the idea that the wild supertech is largely dependent upon the inventor to actually make it work. The creations don't really work, but due to contact with a mad genius that has subtle, undetected reality warping powers, they do. Once it leaves them, it wears down, breaks, or flat out doesn't work.

[matrix3]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

I like the mad science route, the idea that the wild supertech is largely dependent upon the inventor to actually make it work. The creations don't really work, but due to contact with a mad genius that has subtle, undetected reality warping powers, they do. Once it leaves them, it wears down, breaks, or flat out doesn't work.

 

That is how I usually run the stuff that would really upset the status quo. I let governments, terrorists, and a few select corporations have plasma cannons or power armor, but it is always at a diadvantage: bulky, very rare elements, or very labor intensive. The really wild science like matter-energy conversion, force fields, or slim, portable energy weapons with coin-sized "atomic batteries" all fall into "SCIENCE!" (gotta be all caps, and with at least one exclamation point). These all have to be special focuses or gadget pool stuff that can only be used by the character, although if two characters (or a PC and an NPC) have very similar special effects to their SCIENCE!, then I usually allow an activation roll to use each other's gear.

[Cancer]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

For true evil, all SCIENCE! items need to have at least one subtle, long-term lasting or developing side effect.

 

Coin-size atomic last-forever batteries? Turns out they are weak radiation sources that cause sterility if you keep one on your person for several hours a day, five days a week.

 

High-powered plasma weapons? The muzzle flash puts minute amounts of cumulative toxins into the soil, so battlefields become uninhabitable.

 

Power armor? Lack of adequate redundancy feedback in the control systems leads to them become increasingly inaccurate as they are used in the field, with one possible catastrophic failure mode being the suit tears itself apart (and its passenger) because the two legs misapply the windage corrections independently and jump in different directions to get someplace.

 

Sonic weapons? As the ultrasonic oscillators get mistuned with stress and use, they start broadcasting power in glass-breaking frequencies all around the weapons. Oh, and the local animals would all go berserk, too.

[StGrimblefig]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

There are two concepts that have been presented before that I think are pertinent here:

 

First, in the 4th Ed suppliment "High-Tech Enemies," there is a quick discussion at the end of the book about what is called the "Sci-Tech War" -- a kind of supers-centric cold war/arms race. It is always in the supers' (heroes and villains) best interest to not share their super-tech inventions with the world. It would be bad for them if every police officer had access to the same equipment that they had. It could also be used to generate scenarios for tech-based hereos -- attempts by corporations and/or supervillains to steal the plans/technology/etc. of techaman's armor.

 

Second, in an old issue of the Adventurers Club magazine (sorry, I do not remember which one, and they are not readily available atm) there was an article about the "Papa Schimmelhorn Effect." This was, in essence, saying that perhaps one reason why several high-tech inventions are not for sale at Wal-Mart is that the inventor causes them to work, and without his/her/its direct influence, they would cease to function. This means that the gadgeteer's superpower is the ability to "bend the laws of science" in their immediate vicinity and allow their inventions to work.

[transmetahuman]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

From a GM's perspective, I can see the appeal of having super-tech be "unconscious super powers"... but from a player's perspective, I can totally understand why that might be unappealing. Your concept is of a guy who is smart, a trailblazing scientist/engineer. Then you find out you've just been completely deluding yourself; your whole premise was based on not knowing some really obvious scientific facts that everyone else knows makes your theory impossible. "I have a 300 IQ... but when I started my latest project, I totally spaced on that whole square-cube law thingie. Yeah. Good thing it worked anyway."

 

It's okay for the occasional mad scientist, but come on... Would you look at Reed Richards at all the same way if it turned out his stuff was all based on self-delusion?

[assault]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

When I don't simply ignore the issue, I adopt one of two approaches.

 

1. Supertech is a recent innovation. It hasn't had time to be implemented on a sufficiently large scale to change the world. This works when the PCs are among the first generation of (public, modern) superbeings. It doesn't work when the campaign is set now, and superbeings first appeared in the 1930s, for example. In that case, I go with the following option:

 

2. Supertech has, indeed, changed the world. In this case, you take all the technology from a "future" setting and apply it to the current day. This means that the campaign will have flying cars, robots, jetpacks, cities on the moon, and all the other kitsch of retro-technology.

 

In other circumstances I use both: time travel between "the present" and "the future" is relatively common. In this case, of course, "the present" generally refers to the period between 1930 and 1970, while "the future" can either mean the early 21st Century, or the period between 2030 and 2070, depending on my mood.

[drunkonduty]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Hey Cancer: I might borrow some of those side effects for my campaign.

 

I first came across the SCIENCE! as the result of unconscious reality manipulation by the SCIENTIST! back in the Wild Cards books. I liked it there but I wouldn't want to play it. Much prefer the economics reasons for slowing the spread of super-tech.

 

Got to say that the Fantastic Four paraphrase above makes me a bit uncomfortable. Richards' basically just put himself into the evil bastard category with that attitude of "sod the world at large, I can make personal profit." Not very heroic. Of course, I never did like the plonker, Sue should have stuck with Namor.

[Clonus]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Hey Cancer: I might borrow some of those side effects for my campaign.

 

I first came across the SCIENCE! as the result of unconscious reality manipulation by the SCIENTIST! back in the Wild Cards books. I liked it there but I wouldn't want to play it. Much prefer the economics reasons for slowing the spread of super-tech.

 

Got to say that the Fantastic Four paraphrase above makes me a bit uncomfortable. Richards' basically just put himself into the evil bastard category with that attitude of "sod the world at large, I can make personal profit." Not very heroic. Of course, I never did like the plonker, Sue should have stuck with Namor.

 

Well all Reed did was sell something to someone who in a sane world would put it on the market. He was merely cynically musing that they probably wouldn't.

 

As far as restricting the spread of supertechnology approachs I have taken included making it be dependant on room-temperature superconductors that were not producible by Earth technology (but were producible by a mutant called "Valence"), or having it be dependant on actual alien technology like power cells or focusing elements. In this case however the tech is being restrained, at least temporarily by it all being in the hands of small-minded covert agencies who by their nature are limited to regarding it as a stick to use on each other.

[GoldenAge]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

I just whittle it down to production costs...

 

Sure, Iron Man's boot jets would be an amazing product... Unfortunately, they can't be mass-produced (due to the complex melding of micro-circuitry and composite components). The cost for the micro-jets alone would mushroom into the hundreds of thousands of dollars range. The entire suit could retail for tens of millions of dollars!

 

There's a reason that so many power-armored individuals are incredibly wealthy or backed by government resources.

 

Beyond the skunkworks military possibilities, the real benefit of developing such an armor system are the subsequent patents and their worth in general technological improvements. Components of the Iron Man armor may lead to the development of a cheaper microwave oven. Maybe Detroit can utilize the composite compound cohesion system to create better bumper components. The list of money-making devices that could be birthed from a single suits tech is staggering... and quite profitable!

[st barbara]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

I've often wondered why villains such as "The Wingless Wizard", who can produce (in some quantity) a device that fits in the palm of your hand that can conquer gravity, hasn't retired as a squillionaire after patenting his anti-grav technology and, if he dislikes someone like Reed Richards, he can just buy him out or use other financial methods to make his life unbearable !

[assault]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

I've often wondered why villains such as "The Wingless Wizard"' date=' who can produce (in some quantity) a device that fits in the palm of your hand that can conquer gravity, hasn't retired as a squillionaire after patenting his anti-grav technology and, if he dislikes someone like Reed Richards, he can just buy him out or use other financial methods to make his life unbearable ![/quote']

 

There's a reason it's called "mad science", rather than just "science".

[Clonus]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

I've often wondered why villains such as "The Wingless Wizard"' date=' who can produce (in some quantity) a device that fits in the palm of your hand that can conquer gravity, hasn't retired as a squillionaire after patenting his anti-grav technology and, if he dislikes someone like Reed Richards, he can just buy him out or use other financial methods to make his life unbearable ![/quote']

 

Not a good example. The Wizard's career as a supervillain is his retirement. He'd already made a fortune from his inventions. It's possible that SHIELD pays him a royalty for every flying car and helicarrier they build. He pummels the Fantastic Four for the sheer challenge of it. In his debut he lured the Human Torch into the mansion where he lives and defeated him.

[Jinx999]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

My idea for this (if i ever end up running a campaign (which will have to include a frozen hell)), is that all supertech depends on "singularities" what one irritated scientist called "crystallised holes in the laws of physics". They're easy to make, and backyard tinkerer can do so. However, you can't do so reliably. You never know what each one will do. The genius part comes in when you can find a use for each one. Luckily, ones that would be truly destructive will destroy themselves before doing significant damage.

 

The ones that are really valuable are the ones you can use to run a major power plant off to generate effectively free, non-polluting energy. . . . except for the security costs, which can be significant.

[Clonus]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

Back to the actual subject of the thread, one option could be to have the aliens themselves looking to eradicate the cultural contamination. They have a Prime Directive and their interpretation of it is that they need to hunt down all the missing technology and anyone who learned from it, and remove them.

[Doctor Agenda]

Re: Super tech effects on the world at large.

 

You could have a hard-to-obtain component or substance that bends the laws of physics to make certain gadgets work. The economic limitations apply, the builder can still be a genius at getting the darn things to do what he or she wants, and all rubber-physics tech has a common special effect to target. This would be something like the Ghost Rock in Deadlands or the Possibility Capacitors for Weird Tech in Torg's Pulp settings. Weird effects when they get destroyed could be very colorful.