Champions Begins - the GM Starter pack

[Amorkca]

I vote for a reboot of Deathstroke, myself.  One of the ways new players can learn to design characters is to check out how other characters are designed, so they can see what can and cannot be done with the game, and get their own ideas for builds and powersets.

 

Plus, on a sentimental level, I was fond of the Villains & Vigilantes introductory adventure Crisis At Crusader Citadel.  I think something like that would work really well for Champions.

 

I actually ran this at a con putting all the characters into Hero 4th edition, it was fun!!

[Amorkca]

 

 

Plus, on a sentimental level, I was fond of the Villains & Vigilantes introductory adventure Crisis At Crusader Citadel.  I think something like that would work really well for Champions.

 

I actually ran this at a con putting all the characters into Hero 4th edition, it was fun!!

 

oops double post...

Edited March 7, 2016 by Amorkca

[Christopher R Taylor]

OK we need to decide what adventure we're going to give to the GM to run as an introduction to Champions.

 

 

So, here's a poll.  I can't figure out how to add one into a comment so I'll just do it manually:

 

WHAT ADVENTURE SCENARIO DO YOU PREFER

1) Viper's Nest

2) Deathstroke

3) Some other conversion from Champions past (please specify)

4) A conversion of some other product (please specify and explain)

5) A totally new adventure

 

 

my vote is 2, then 1 as an alternate.

[steriaca]

Mine is 5 followed by 1, then 2.

[wcw43921]

I vote for Option 2, with my second vote for Option 5 with a all-new supervillain group.

[rjd59]

As Deathstroke happens to be my all time favorite champions super-villian team, I must vote for number 2 with number 1 as second and 5 is third. 

[massey]

I'd prefer new adventures.  Plural.

 

I was thinking about it, and I think a series of intro adventures/campaigns would be the best bet.  You could have, say, 4 or 5 different "Champions Begins" products, campaign books geared around familiar-feeling characters to give people a nice introduction into the system.  The different character groups would focus on different aspects of the system, gradually familiarizing players and GMs with much of the Champions game, super-heroic RPGs in general, and the Hero system.

 

For instance, let's say you've got the following books (with the serial numbers filed off, of course):

 

Batman and Robin and Batgirl in Gotham City -- an adventure book for a GM and 1-3 players.  A street level campaign for a small group.

Spider-Man -- an adventure book for a GM and 1 player.  A street level campaign for you and a friend.

The X-Men vs the Sentinels -- an adventure book for a GM and 3-6 players.  A team of average power level characters, for an average sized group.

The Avengers vs whoever -- an adventure book for a GM and 3-6 players.  Roleplaying powerful characters, for an average sized group.

Superman -- an adventure book for a GM and 1 player.  Cosmic superheroes and how to handle them, for a GM and a friend.

 

The idea would be an easy to read, step by step intro process that teaches you the game as you play.  Possibly where you could play through the book, even if you didn't own Champions Complete or 6th Edition.  It wouldn't have the full game rules, just what you needed at the moment.  Someone could play through all the adventure books, and then have a pretty good grasp of how to play (and/or GM) the Hero system.  Of course, they buy the rulebook to get the full version.  But it would be similar to when I first started roleplaying, and joined a D&D group.  I didn't have the books or anything, but I played a fighter.  People told me "roll this".  I didn't know what I was doing, I didn't understand how magic worked, but it didn't take long before I had a basic idea of how the game functioned.  That's what Hero needs -- a very easy and simple introduction that leaves out all the hard crap.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Well I think we can look at maybe more in the future, if we can pull this off and its popular.  I like the idea, especially with the different sorts of approaches, but right now its a question if we can get one out yet.

[rjd59]

The idea would be an easy to read, step by step intro process that teaches you the game as you play.  Possibly where you could play through the book, even if you didn't own Champions Complete or 6th Edition.  It wouldn't have the full game rules, just what you needed at the moment.  Someone could play through all the adventure books, and then have a pretty good grasp of how to play (and/or GM) the Hero system.  Of course, they buy the rulebook to get the full version.  But it would be similar to when I first started roleplaying, and joined a D&D group.  I didn't have the books or anything, but I played a fighter.  People told me "roll this".  I didn't know what I was doing, I didn't understand how magic worked, but it didn't take long before I had a basic idea of how the game functioned.  That's what Hero needs -- a very easy and simple introduction that leaves out all the hard crap.

 

IMHO placing the rules within the adventures, scenarios, whatever you want to call them is not the way to go! 1st of all, the rules are in Champions Complete, no need to put them in the new stuff, avoiding any copyright issues, and someone within the playing group should at least own a copy! That's how I got into RPG's without having the books, another player owned whichever book, for whichever system. Until I would either buy the book, or not play the system. (I completely know what you're saying about being told what to do untill you learned however!)

Setting up scenarios, adventures, etc. and pointing the newbies to the page or pages the particular rules needed in Champions Complete is much more practical and probably legal. 

[massey]

IMHO placing the rules within the adventures, scenarios, whatever you want to call them is not the way to go! 1st of all, the rules are in Champions Complete, no need to put them in the new stuff, avoiding any copyright issues, and someone within the playing group should at least own a copy! That's how I got into RPG's without having the books, another player owned whichever book, for whichever system. Until I would either buy the book, or not play the system. (I completely know what you're saying about being told what to do untill you learned however!)

Setting up scenarios, adventures, etc. and pointing the newbies to the page or pages the particular rules needed in Champions Complete is much more practical and probably legal. 

 

Given that this proposal is for a PDF that we make and then give to Hero Games, for free, for them to sell, I am not worried in the slightest about copyright issues.  They own the rights to their own game system.

 

As far as the rules go, I think that is absolutely the way to do it.  Imagine this was 2nd ed D&D, and you've got an adventure for the GM and one player (who is playing a fighter).  You give him the following info:

 

Bob

5th level Fighter

 

Hit points: 30

Armor class:  3

Thac0:  16

Damage:  Longsword, D8+1

Attacks per round:  1

 

Bob is a proud and skilled warrior.  He has a 15 Str (If he needs to perform a feat of great strength, he will need to roll under this number on a d20).  He wears banded mail armor and carries a shield.  He has a magical sword that comes from the elves.  He gets a +1 to hit with it, and does the damage listed above.

 

You don't include info on saving throws, because there aren't any required in the adventure.  You don't include info on other weapons, because he has a longsword.  You don't include info on weapon specialization, because he isn't specialized.  You don't even have to give his full stats, because it doesn't matter.  The only thing he's going to be doing is going into a dungeon, killing some orcs and goblins, and finding some treasure.  The purpose of the adventure is to teach the player how Thac0 works, as well as damage and hit points.

 

It is a plot on rails adventure, where you spoon-feed the player everything he needs, bit by bit.  

[massey]

Well I think we can look at maybe more in the future, if we can pull this off and its popular.  I like the idea, especially with the different sorts of approaches, but right now its a question if we can get one out yet.

 

I'm kicking around a format in my head right now.  If I get it worked out properly, it would be very easy to do multiple different books in the same style.

[Christopher R Taylor]

I agree, no rules, except the very basics on how to play for the GM in the most simple terms (how to roll to hit, roll damage, do speed, etc) in a tutorial format is the way to go.  I think Cracked's text with a goofy picture breaking it up regularly is welcome today.  I don't mean to imply that modern people are morons, just that they are used to small bits of text so its best to spoon feed info.

[Christopher R Taylor]

OK I've been in contact with Jason who handles this kind of thing and he's on vacation right now, but will be back in a couple of weeks so I would like to have a proposal ready to give to him so he can pitch it to the guys who own the Champions IP.

[rjd59]

OK I've been in contact with Jason who handles this kind of thing and he's on vacation right now, but will be back in a couple of weeks so I would like to have a proposal ready to give to him so he can pitch it to the guys who own the Champions IP.

 

What do you need done that I could do?

[steriaca]

This is my outline of what we need, per chapter.

 

Chapter 1: Teaching basic combat. Character sheets down to bare bones. STR, CON, DEX, OCV, DCV, STUN. Nothing does BODY or Knockback.

 

Chapter 2: Investigation. Skills and basic skill rolls.

 

Chapter 3: Advance Combat. Add Body, END, SPD. Things suffer from Knockback. Things can break. People can die.

 

Chapter 4: Interrogation. Contested skills.

 

Chapter 5: Complete Combat. OMCV, DMCV, PRE and PRE Attacks.

[Meganeura]

I would be highly interested in this sort of product. I don't think there's a whole lot I could contribute aside from interest, sadly, but I'll be following this thread for sure, and wish you all the best in getting something like this produced. 

[Diamond Spear]

Feeling under the weather at the moment but still planning on playing coordinator. Was thinking about trying to get as many of the interested people together in the chat room either Thursday or Friday night after 7pm EST. Can people make it?

[Christopher R Taylor]

Might be worth slipping CON into session 2 so people get stunned in combat 2 instead of 1, but its not that complicated a mechanic

[massey]

In keeping with the idea of making it read like a Cracked article with funny pictures....

 

I'm thinking the Superman analog should be Señor Superior, and his arch nemesis is an evil billionaire with obviously fake hair, who lives in NYC and hates aliens. And he wants to be President.

[Diamond Spear]

In keeping with the idea of making it read like a Cracked article with funny pictures....

I'm thinking the Superman analog should be Señor Superior, and his arch nemesis is an evil billionaire with obviously fake hair, who lives in NYC and hates aliens. And he wants to be President.

I think we should leave politics out of it.

[massey]

I think we should leave politics out of it.

Politics?

 

I thought it was a clear Lex Luthor ripoff.

[steriaca]

Might be worth slipping CON into session 2 so people get stunned in combat 2 instead of 1, but its not that complicated a mechanic

CON is in session one, the first combat.

[Diamond Spear]

Will anyone be able to be on chat tonight?

[Christopher R Taylor]

I can be, if it works for everyone.  Its worth hashing some basic concepts out at least

[steriaca]

Must of missed the meeting