Ninja-Bear

15 hours ago, Cygnia said:

It should read for everyone who can afford our ridiculous prices and whimsy on new editions. 

I exposed her to it slowly. And after twenty years of marriage she accepts if not understands it. It’s part of “For Better or Worse” 😉 She actually has bought a Champions book for me on her own. 😱

However, I tell my friends that if you want any of my gaming stuff after I die, hurry cause it won’t be in the house too long after the funeral! 😂

51 minutes ago, Cloppy Clip said:

As someone coming in with 6th edition, I'm not sure how exactly figured characteristics were used. Combat Values and Speeds can be set at any baseline, so if you start with a few extra points in those from DEX then that won't affect gameplay so much as long as everyone has similar DEX (if you don't mind everyone having similar DEX, of course), but Defence's value depends entirely on how it scales with Damage, and the figured characteristics from 5E seem to give you quite low defences compared to the damage you'd be dealing out. Were you expected to buy up defence on top of what your figured characteristics gave you, or was everybody playing a version of rocket tag back then?

 

Obviously each table would have come to their own solution, even if it's something like KingAdipose describes where you effective de-figure the characteristics, but I'm curious as to what most people did back before 6E.

Yup, you got a bump or rather the starting point of a Secondary Characteristic would be higher than the Base-for free. In 6th PD is starting at 2. However Pre-6th if I bought Strength at 20 then my PD would be (20/5) = 4. So if you had a Brick of 60 STR then your Starting PD is 12. 

14 hours ago, Duke Bushido said:

Thanks, N-B.

 

And while it might not have been distributed through formal company channels, it is by Allston; I think I would treat it as being just as official as if it had been bound and printed with the HERO logo on it. 

 

 

I forgot to say, yay it’s the original author so it has more weight than being published. It’s neat if you take a chance to read on the whole thing because of some of his thought processes are laid out. Interestingly he notes how Choke Hold is a misprint BUT then Steve Long modified it so it works the way it’s printed and he’s ok with it. Also he had a rule but didn’t make in (Tai Chi can push multiple people) until again Mr. Long asked him for the rules. Oops. I myself want to try sometime the S-Damage rule and see how that works out instead of NND. Again, I dig on how and why he came up with that optional rule. 

Here it is @Duke Bushido

NINFIX13.ZIP

3 minutes ago, Duke Bushido said:

I see.   Thank you, Sir.

 

Is the five-point doubling part of the errata, or in the book?

 

 

It’s in errata. When I get home I’ll check to see if it’s in the book. Also I’ll see if I can send the errata file.

On 8/20/2023 at 12:24 PM, Duke Bushido said:

Thanks, N-B!

 

Which edition and page?

 

Thanks!

.

Fourth Edition of Ninja Hero however the errata is something I downloaded from the Red October (RSS?) So it’s not an “official” publication. 

I’ve been close to dying but since that GM ran a more Silverish game. I survived. I have killed Black Claw because it was a different GM and I didn’t understand that it was a Silverish game. 
 

@Christopher R Taylor, I mentioned years ago on this forum that I had an idea for a game where the player was on getting killed in an opening game so the players knew that death was possible. Man the disagreements I got for that was more than what I would’ve expected. It was akin to me saying something blasphemous. 
 

P.S. I ran a few weeks back a solo adventure with one of my Champions characters, a Stretching guy. He got shot twice from a Covert Viper Agent, even Dodging the second shot, and well, dying as I didn’t buy him any Resistant Defenses. 

@Hugh Neilson, the Auto-Roll rule., I like. I heard Matt Colville express something similar but he didn’t have a name for it. When I remember, I do try to use something like it.

On 8/20/2023 at 1:42 PM, Chris Goodwin said:

Even in Fantasy Hero back in the day, you had to have 18 DEX and 18 CON (for the Figureds), and 4 SPD (because everyone else was 4 SPD), it seemed.

 

Someone years ago, I can't remember where or when, said "SPD equals fun".  I'm not sure I agree, fully, but they had at least somewhat of a point.

 

(Also, why do we expect wizards to be rickety old grandpas with long beards?  Why can't wizards be in at least reasonably decent shape, especially if they're spending their own END for spells?  And we know that people who don't maintain a healthy lifestyle into the years that more and more of us are starting to see don't live as long.)

I figured the characters were SPD 4 because most monsters were SPD 3. That extra Phase can be a big game changer.

I was just reading Ninja Hero errata. While looking for something else I came across where it’s recommend for SuperHeroic to use the +5 point doubling. Also he has a warning that if someone does this so that he can lend out a weapon to everyone the GM should quash that. And if you don’t like this option, he gives another Paired Weapon (-1/4) as a Focus option. Interesting.

Am I the only one who said that Figured and Non figured depends on style of game? I think the one issue is that it seems that the answer has to be a one or the other.  The reason I answered upthread awhile age is that depending on the needs of the game, one figured or non works better for THAT game. And that is mainly due to the players involved. For Super hero it seems to work best to be more cookie cutter with less clutter. One player is a long time player and has the rules down and the other two are not so up on the rules. Also game expectations. I’ve made characters for a Supers game within the NCM for example and I don’t have fun. So yeah if Figured gives me a boost then the character “realistically” should have, I ok with it now. It’s a comic thing which I read in MHRPG. What a lightbulb moment. Now for Heroic where it seems that more granularity is need to distinguish players. Non figured is great.

1 hour ago, Scott Ruggels said:

It's these sorts of discussions that chase me back to want to use 2nd or 3rd edition rules. Much less to read.

I’ve honestly tried 3rd. For my uses it’s 4th with similar feelings.

@Lord Liaden, I do Fantasy Hero for 4th and both companion books.

@Lord Liaden, for the game I’m actually I’m looking at two types of games. One is just a solo game with my youngest. He’ll be playing Kratos so it’s using SuperHeroic rules (6th). I took a Storm Giant for a starting point and so far we’re at 500 pts. didn’t even buy his weapons yet.  I have Monsters, minions and Marauders which I’m using as a base and I can power them up as needed. Being solo I’m not worried about points just for feel and relationship of Kratos to the monsters.

Then it hit me at work that when a group of us play it’s usually Fantasy and talking to my other son he likes the idea of playing just a Norse style Fantasy game. Here of course will be Heroic level game and points and balance will be a bigger consideration. I told my youngest though he can have a Kratos “lite” version in that game. 
 

So I’m going to see what I can reskin or modify and limit. For example, no plate armor. I’ll probably keep it to just humans. Trolls don’t have regeneration either. Stuff like that.

Hello fine folks,

My boys have lately gotten into God of War/ Ragnorak games. Now talking to them, they would be interested in the next time I run some Fantasy Hero to run it Norse style. I do have some resources but I’m always ready to listen to others if they have advice on tailoring generic fantasy to a Norse style game.

6 hours ago, Hugh Neilson said:

 

BTW, @Duke Bushido, technically that means that playing by the 2e rules is following 6e RAW.

Wait! Is that a Paradox somewhere? 😱😂😜

I’m just going to add that I don’t mind if someone points outs if a rule is RAW or not. I just recently asked a question about RAW in 4th because I wanted to know how it was supposed to be. And every one was helpful. It’s the I’m doing it homebrew and someone then insists it wrong. 

@Doc Democracy, your ideas on GMing are like mine. What I’ve notice on the boards here and there and other games is that people can’t fathom that what works for me may not work for you but that is fine. 

I think the biggest problem with Killing Attack is the HKA with Range, why should I bother with an RKA. Also while not as free points as STR plus HKA, Blast does have the advantage of reducing DCs for OCV.  I think most people can visualize losing damage to Spread your attack and make it easier to hit someone. Why shouldn’t someone in HtH be able to reduce their DC and raise their OCV? The sfx would be, I try to hit as quick as I can but sacrifice power.

4 hours ago, Hugh Neilson said:

 

It would be easier if your goal is to develop your own content. But then, why not just develop all your own content from scratch, rather than acquire an obscure IP - no, the CU is not going to attract hundreds of thousands of subscribers from the ranks of Hero Gamers - that will only provide a starting point because it is not generating much, if any, new content. A multimedia giant regularly spins off new content, so all we need to do is adapt it to the game.

 

 

D&D is a known brand name.  They won the marketing war. Where would you expect Hero to get the investment capital to publicize their name to a remotely similar extent?

 

Well If i won that huge lottery, I could use it as a tax write off? 😁

3 hours ago, Hugh Neilson said:

Sounds like "they are also markedly underpriced for their utility".

Well, I thought the argument was that STR itself was underpriced and that caused the pricing issue. If STR was costed at 2 pts I believe then MA would be fine. And If I recall, the reason was that STR was so cheap was twofold. 1) Because of point totals you wanted STR cheap. 2) Because most Heroes had STR higher than Normals, being SuperHeroic, it was easy to have people like GL and such to be stronger than normals for a few points.

4 minutes ago, Duke Bushido said:

 

I have no dog in this fight, but have enjoyed the discussion immensely; my thanks to everyone who had something to say on the subject.

 

I did want to visit that comment above for a moment.  First, I would like to mention that before you can decide that, you must first decide if the hit location chart is going to be in play.  If it is, remember that depending on how well you roll there, a normal can one-shot a normal, and a super can accidentally kill one.

 

If you are using the hit location chart, you may want to put a little extra thought into what defenses and what levels of them are acceptable.

 

 

I also wanted to comment that when that epiphany hit me--  "Rule of X means how many hits before they drop," I walked away from HERO for almost a decade.  All that I had percieved as a precise, detailed system for resolving combat, etc, all boiled down to "how many times do I want them to roll to hit before it is over?"

 

At that moment, I became a narrator telling exactly the story I wanted to tell and they had no idea that everything they did was futile:  I could pre-determine the outcome of every battle by setting the villains such they could absorb one more hit than could the heroes, or that they could "Typically" drop an opponent with one less strike, or reverse those, and the heroes were nearly gauranteed victory.

 

Not by their actions, so much, but because I could decide on Thursday who was going to fall or reign supreme on Saturday, and because everything was built within the required campaign limits, no one ever doubted that it was all on the turn of the now-almost-pointless dice.

 

So I walked away.  I went back to Traveller, some Space Opera, some Space Master, lots of Car Wars and a few other things, but it was almost ten years before I thought about going back to Champions / HERO.  Eventually we slid a then-in-progress Traveller game onto the Champions wheels, and it worked out well enough, plus allowed for a lot of creative freedom.

 

We used it for a couple of short fantasy games, and that was working great until I felt myself matching characters and their equipment do campaign limits and realized that I could again simply replace everything with odd-or-even and three hit points.

 

Anyway, I obviously did come back, but in the examples set by Superman and Batman or Wonder Woman and some guy with a wingsuit and a club or pretty much _anyone_ and the Flash, I have pretty much ignored forcing any limits on characters or the game.

 

If the writers can find something for Batman to do that really does contribute to what Superman is doing, then I can find a way to make a team up between Ultra-God and the Bohemian Bedazzler work out as reasonable, too.

 

I wont pretend that it isnt hard or that everyone should try it, but it has brought back to me the fun I used to have with HERO before I realized it was "knock three times for victory!"  when using campaign limits.

 

 

Funny thing about perception. I see the opposite of you. Campaign limits are to help layout game expectations. If the fame world agents should be one hit wonders then they are built that way because that is the expectation (and fun). If I plan to be Super then I want my Super to be Super. And through my years of playing, adjusted numbers still seems to be no match for players skill or probably more importantly luck. 

And Resistant Defenses of some sort even if its Heroic Luck. Golden Age have a LOT more Killing Attacks!

On 8/10/2023 at 4:05 AM, assault said:

I did a bit of stuff with the Golden Age about 15-20 years ago.

 

Golden Age superheroes were very cookie cutter. After noticing this, I created a template that included the common features of most Golden Age heroes, allowing me to really churn out the write-ups.

If I get around to it, I will post it here. It's on my old computer, so I can't just grab it. In any case, it was based on 250 point 5e characters, and would take a bit of modification for 6e and another point total.

Briefly though, I went with 20 Str, 20 Dex, 20 Con and 5 Spd as the baseline. About 100 points of characteristics, 125 of powers and 25 points of skills. Modify from there. Fairly low powered, but everyone was more or less the same. Naturally, these were starting versions of the characters.

I would live to see this too. When I mess around with PDSH, I used Skilled Normals for gansters and built Heroes from there.