Christougher

3 hours ago, wcw43921 said:

"NA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NA--BATMAN???"

It's Batman Space Ranger!

3 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Both summon and duplication (and follower for that matter) are a little bit off in cost because of how many more points it takes to make the same character in 6th but there's not an easy way to fix that.

Your thread on same actually led to this one.   Though I'm not worrying about what you can build, but why the costs are the same but the benefits seem to be so dissimilar.  

1 minute ago, Grailknight said:

Variable Fade rates being the biggest benefit unrestricted recipients and threshold triggers are also enabled without having to apply modifiers to the basic Drain power.

I get that you can apply different fade rates to the Drain and Aid.  But what is a threshold trigger?

How are Duplication and Summon balanced against each other? 

In 5Er and 6E, it costs 80 points to create a 400 point duplicate, and the same 80 points for a 400 point summon.  The cost of higher powered, or additional bodies, appears to be the same.

The duplicate is controlled by me and absolutely loyal.  If the duplicate dies, it stays dead.  If I want a duplicate to have different powers than me it takes a +1 Advantage.

The summon has to be bribed or threatened to do a handful of things and then is done.  Or it takes a +1 advantage to make it as loyal as the duplicate, and I still don't control it.  If it dies I can just summon another, unless I take another +1 advantage to make it summon the same being.   If I want a summon to have different powers than me, it is free, unless I want to be able to have any powers, then it's a +1 advantage for Expanded Class.

Those are the differences in the power as I understand them.  The underlined portion is the basis of my question.  Why does it cost twice as much for a Summon to behave the same way as a Duplicate?   Do the other points listed under Summon justify this price?  Is there something else relevant that I am missing?

Chris.

9 hours ago, unclevlad said:

 

First, I think it has to be noted that Transfer was removed. from 6E.

 

Second:  Transfer can be defined as a Drain triggering an Aid...but that Aid is self only.  You're applying UOO and probably Ranged, so those alone mean at least +3/4.  Assuming you are using the earlier Transfer, we're still looking at +1/2 as a minimum.  

I know that Transfer was removed, but I'm still playing mostly 5Er plus a few things stolen from 6E.  That right there basically proves my point: Instead of one clean and simple power, you have to go and link two powers.  And then I still have to Advantage around the forced self-only Aid for it to affect someone else.  If I want to lose the abilities I'm Aiding, then I have to apply Side Effects.  Altering the definition of Transfer to move points from A to B, and change who gains and who loses, covers all these cases in a much less complicated way.

Chris.

Transfer officially states it takes points from an opponent and adds it to self.  Wouldn't a lot of builds be easier if it just applied 'from one target to another'?  This would allow healing type effects where the characteristics are donated by the healer or an (un)willing third party.  Perhaps a+1/4 advantage to change between operational modes would be needed.

Chris.

3 hours ago, Pariah said:

Is it okay to shoot a mime if you use a silencer? 

 

(Asking for a friend.)

Yes, it is a requirement.  Five shot burst or full clip is shooter's choice.

Chris.

19 minutes ago, Ockham's Spoon said:

I have fond memories of this game...

What Obi Wan should have told Luke about how his father died...

1 hour ago, Tjack said:

 Giving somebody superpowers without Magic, Science or Mutation is kind of like skiing through a revolving door, but...  

This is indeed the crux of the problem and why I've turned to Herodom Assembled for additional ideas.

2 hours ago, Clonus said:

Then you need to define the origin in a way that has that make sense.  Which is to say you don't use a word like "Natural" which precludes superpowers and instead use a word like "Training".  Fun fact, Moondragon is not a mutant, not a magician, not an alien, not an inhuman, not a radiation accident.  

 

She's just..."trained".  She unlocked the powers of her mind through training/meditation and did it so well that her feats match those of Professor Xavier.  Utterly absurd power manifestations through nothing but training are more typical of Chinese and Japanese comic book heroes.  It means they had to work at for many years using very exotic training methods, but it allows anything.  

"Natural" is the term used by City of Heroes, and includes things like training and skill, Ch'i abilities and mundane technology, and leaves the door open to other suggestions.

All of these that I have so far tend to violate reasonable plausibility when it comes to things like fists and armor of actual stone and firing off blasts of radiation.  So I'm looking for additional ideas to make "superpowers" available to those who don't fit the other origin types.

Chris.

During a discussion on character creation and CIty of Heroes style origins of powers, the Infinity Gauntlet was mentioned.  I considered the idea of a similar artifact, but related to power Origins.  So our would-be Thanos gathers the Tech Stone, the Science Stone, the Magic Stone, the Mutant Stone... And then picks up an unremarkable rock off the ground, and slams it into the gauntlet as the Natural Stone.

1 hour ago, Tjack said:

  That was actually a thing in the original Legion of Superheroes.  Most members were just very accomplished ordinary members of their planets population.   Saturn Girl was a talented telepath and Cosmic Boy was a top level athlete at the sport of Magno-ball.  Only a small percentage were like Lightning Lad or Sun Boy who got their powers in another more standard comic book origin way.

 

     BTW;  I thought somebody was going to hand me another couple of origins to come up with?   Like the lady said “Bored now.”

I haven't really done aliens in my world for that exact reason - whole races of similarly powered individuals.  I do acknowledge it as a possible answer to my issue though:  How does an essentially unpowered superhero exhibit power special effects that usually require other superpowered Origins to explain?  If Jace Jammer absorbs a lethal amount of gamma rays and survives with the ability to fire radioactive blasts, that's a Science Origin nobody would blink at.  But how would Jace be able to fire off those same blasts without having had that accident?  It's not like it's 1985 and he could just pick up plutonium at the corner drugstore.

And bonus points to you for my favorite Willow phrase.  

Chris.

6 hours ago, Pariah said:

The one I live with is off the top end at 5' 9". 

And how does she feel about you calling her 'average' ?

14 hours ago, Tjack said:

  Give me an power set and an origin type and I’ll come up with a story that makes it happen.  That’s easy...trying to create a person you want living in your head....that’s hard.

Try the Natural origin Stone Tank and Natural origin Radiation Defender that started this thread?

29 minutes ago, DShomshak said:

Not every origin type must accommodate every imaginable powerset. Let them have their own flavor.

 

At the very end of the day,  I'm looking for a believable way for every origin to have every powerset. 

Meta Gene or latent mutant moves them into other Origin categories.  Green Lantern, by virtue of using the ring, is most likely Tech.  

What am I looking for?  Starting with just the two examples, and working out to a generic version of the question:

How does a "normal" or Natural origin hero have the abilities of a Stone Tank or Radiation Defender or whatever - without it being Magical, latent Mutant, high Tech, or weird Science?  The type of thing where anyone /could/ but only a few actually do.  

Some other Natural origins I use include extreme training, normal level items, and Ch'i abilities.  But those don't lend themselves to a lot of powers or special effects. 

The MMORPG City of Heroes let you choose the Origin type of your powers from Magic, Mutant, Natural, Science and Tech, and this played a minor role in the game. Most of these were self explanatory how their powers originated, but Natural was for those heroes "without" superpowers per se.  Batman and Green Archer would be simple examples of this - people of mostly normal ability who were on par with other superheroes.  Marvel's Bullseye could even be considered Natural as his powers are highly developed accuracy.

I like the idea of broad grouping of origins, but the wide range of abilities (not just CoH, but easier to explain with) don't often lend well to some powersets.  Sure any weapon wielding scrapper, even Claws or Super Reflexes work, but how does one justify things like Stone Tank or Radiation Defender powers from someone who...doesn't really have superpowers?  Without turning this into a list, does anyone have ways to explain how mostly normalish people can have some of the stranger superpowers and special effects?

Chris.

9 hours ago, Ockham's Spoon said:

It makes me worry when the AI has a mocking sense of humor.  I had to change my password the other day (again), and after multiple attempts that didn't meet various password requirements, in frustration I typed in MYPENIS.  It came back with an error message saying that was too short.

Strange, when I tried it, the error message came back "Get a new joke."  

38 minutes ago, Ragitsu said:

 

Talk about forward thinking: there's a built-in cup holder.

That old joke has been around so long that when someone used a broken CD drive as an actual cupholder, he couldn't convince the tech that it wasn't that old joke in action.

7 minutes ago, Logan.1179 said:

Was out in public the other day and a young lady was wearing a plague doctor mask in lieu of the standard anti Covid masking...

On 7/22/2021 at 2:54 PM, Logan.1179 said:

I spent the morning down at the beach feeding cannabis laced brownies to the seabirds.

 

No tern was left unstoned.

Many moons ago, we were at a LARP event hosted in a former apple grove.  The alcoholic fruit salad had apples added to celebrate the occasion but they absorbed WAAAY too much of the alcohol - it earned a 'poison apple' moniker that year.  Most celebrants tossed the apple bits aside.  We awoke the next morning to very drunk birds having feasted upon them...

It hasn't actually been playtested; my child suggested the idea and I got caught up in writing it.  My thought was that the per-segment actually gave it a chance to build up/down during the character's off phases so they feel the difference on their Phase.  Especially given the Constant AOE still applying during the off segments.  Perhaps adjust it by a 1/4 if it is too much change. 

But that's why this thread is ideas, not official rules.  

Chris.

20 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Multipower doesn't ignore active point limits.  You have a 100 point multipower, you just let that character have a 100 active point power.  To bypass the limitations that multipower usually applies; negating its purpose.  If you can just build a multipower big enough to allow you to have several gigantic powers on at the same time, all that's happened is that you've let people buy a ton of powers cheaply.

Other examples lay out the math, but to make the verbiage clear:  Having a Multipower with more points than your AP limit does NOT negate the AP limit of individual powers / slots.  It lets you have multiple slots running.

Chris.

Increases over Time: This (-1/2) Limitation makes a Constant power start slowly and build up to its full effect.  The power starts at 10 AP/2d6 and increases by the same amount per Segment.  For a Constant Area of Effect attack, this Limitation can be applied so that the AOE increases by 2m per segment.  Both versions may apply to the same power.

Decreases over Time: This (-1/4) Limitation makes a Constant power slowly lose its effectiveness.  The power decreases by 10 AP/2d6 per Segment.  For a Constant Area of Effect attack, this Limitation can be applied so that the AOE decreases by 2m per Segment.  Both versions may apply to the same power.

Chris.

16 hours ago, dmjalund said:

This is going to be a pain when you are hit by multiple sources and only some of them have this limitation

Wound tracking for everyone!

Cumulative on Blast/KAs might be used to make a single wound worse, so that it exceeds per-wound Healing.