Toadmaster Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 I use the the title Horror for pretty much any modern (19th Century to present) game featuring the supernatural. So I consider a game like Stalking the night fantastic and some X-files Horror (although I know X-files also falls into modern conspiracy) I'm just wondering if this meets the general opinion of the rest of you. Does horror have to be scary or just have nasty unnatural creatures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryB Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? It could be considered Horror of a different calibur for sure, but it sounds like it mixes in a lot of ideas from the Dark Champions camp when you go Buffy or X-Files. Perhaps Horror Adventure is what you have there. Horror doesn't need to 'scare' people. I myself define a horror story as something abberant to the the normal world. Something malfaic from something innocent, or benevalent. For instance, a typical vampire was once a normal human, evil or not who was turned into something unholy and unnatural. Frankenstein's Monster was supposed to be something beneficial for man but went wrong. Generally they are stories of man vs the abberant universe. That is to say, normal men (well trained or not). When faced with something that should not be the way it is, it becomes horrific. The other way is through the loss of control. In Steven King's Needful Things, there wasn't anything horrific about getting what you wanted until you realized the price you had to pay and what you loose in return. The loss of control for those people when they realized what was going to happen was thier particular horror. In turn, they became the boogey monsters. And lastly is the ultimate fear of man, which comes from what is unknown to them. Dealing with powers and entities they cannot explain, especially something more powerful than them is definately a mind quaking horror for many people. The good part about using the unknown factor is that it can turn out to be a benevalent force. If you are using people who are used to the horrors of the world and hunt monsters for a living, it may not be too horrific for them. But the monsters and challenges they face are still horrific to the world around them and must be stopped. Thus, perhaps Horror Adventure might be a good way to categorize this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchpad Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? I think that horror has to include an element of fear within it. Basic monster hunting has some horror elements, but movies like Van Helsing would be more like Dark Champions instead of Horror. A Horror campaign to me are things closer to Silent Hill, Resident Evil, Dracula, Alien, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starwolf Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? I once ran a Champions scenario where the group was induced into exploring Hill House (from the Haunting), however I changed the main bad guy into the devil himself (Satan/Lucifer/Etc). He was supposed the be the father of one of the heroes that was trying to reject his devilish side. The tortured souls in the house were trapped and being tormented for not stopping the initial conception/rape of the young boys mother. Now grown to a man and having no memory of ever being there, he and his companions were manipulated into returning to the house.... My players were definately experiencing a sense of horror until they unraveled the mystery behind the house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidV Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? Basically, what Sketchpad said. It can be, but isn't automatically. It's all in how it is played out. If the characters spend most of their time hunting down and battling the monsters without there being a real element of fear or suspense, then it is more like a contemporary fantasy campaign or even DC. If the hunters are perpetually on the edge and never really certain what they are going to face when they finally confront the monster, then you are into horror territory. Blade (as played out in the movies) isn't really horror. It's more of a supernaturally charged action story (think DC with FH and HH elements). X-Files, when it was at its best, could definitely fit in as horror because Mulder and Scully were often in the dark about what they would find in the end and were often shocked (as was the audience) when they found it. Hopefully, Horror Hero will address some of these distinctions, but that's my take on it. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinanju Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? I ditto Sketchpad: It _can_ be horror, but not necessarily. If the only question in your mind while battling the monster is whether you can kill it, it ain't horror. If you're wondering how such an abomination can exist, and what it means to your understanding of the world that such things exist when science says they can't/shouldn't, then it's horror. If after killing the monster, you make a 007-style quip, it's not horror. If you say your buddies (the ones still standing, anyhow). "Holy ****! We just killed a vampire! An honest-to-god, bloodsucking VAMPIRE!" then I'd say it's horror. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HewhoisMatt Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? I use the the title Horror for pretty much any modern (19th Century to present) game featuring the supernatural. So I consider a game like Stalking the night fantastic and some X-files Horror (although I know X-files also falls into modern conspiracy) I'm just wondering if this meets the general opinion of the rest of you. Does horror have to be scary or just have nasty unnatural creatures. To me Horror has to be scary. If it is not scary then I would probably call it suspense. Alien = Sci-Fi Horror Aliens = Sci-Fi Suspense/Action Horror - A strong feeling of fear, repugnance, or alarm. Horrify - To affect or fill with Horror. In closing I would say if I spend my time trying to get away it is a Horror game, where as if I just want to kick somethings ass it is Suspense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paigeoliver Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? If the characters are hunting monsters it is Dark Champions, Fantasy Hero, insert genre here. If the monsters are hunting the characters then it is horror. As for Van Helsing? I would be more likely to categorize that as low powered supers, but with a char maxima of 30 or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkdguy Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? I agree that there needs to be an element of fear to classify the game under the horror genre, monsters or no. I would classify Buffy and Van Helsing under the action genre. Likewise, Kindred: The Embraced would fall under the drama category, while Ghostbusters is obviously a comedy. Also, you don't need monsters in a horror campaign. Lots of things that happen in the real world caused by people definitely fit the bill. The biggest challenge is scaring the players. If they aren't scared, chances are, their characters won't be either. Maybe you can have the PCs be the last survivors of a team, and they're the newbies. The veterans, including the team leader, were all killed by vengeful monsters. This idea, of course, was taken from John Carpenter's Vampires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug McCrae Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? No. In horror the monsters are supposed to do the hunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubric Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? Just because it has supernatura "monsters" doesn't make it horror. Look at something like the movie "Love at First Bite". It has vampires in it, but it is clearly a comedy and NOT horror. Also, as somebody else mentioned, Steven King has been writing horror for years, much of which has NO supernatural elements at all (psychological horror, etc.) Personally, I think a Van Helsing-type game would be perfect for Pulp Hero, but it would work in Dark Champs also. Actually, I feel the same way about most stories involving the classic movie monsters -- Frankenstein, Dracula, the Mummy, werewolves -- these are great material for adventure stories, but they don't really qualify as "horror" any more (if they ever did) because the stories are so common place now. The two areas where Hollywood is still good at making scary (horror) monster movies is with ghosts, and with "creepy crawlies" like spiders, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curufea Posted March 8, 2005 Report Share Posted March 8, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? Van Helsing - and also Ghostbusters I'd class as monster-based Pulp Hero. To me, Horror should be horrific. To feel horror is not to feel fear, or to be scared. We have separate words because they are separate feelings. I can well imagine a WW1 or 2 campaign that is realistic - would be classed as horror. "Saving Private Ryan" springs to mind as a horror movie. Although you could subclass it as "historical, war, action horror". Scares are, to me at least, merely short-term shocks and suprises. Fear is more longterm. Suspense is a mixture of low-level fear and other emotions, a bit like trepidation. Horror is confrontational. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted March 8, 2005 Report Share Posted March 8, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? For me, horror must seek to scare, by definition. "Horror" without horror is like "Romance" without romance. I'd classify most monster-hunting as "dark fantasy," especially in RPGs. I like "horror adventure" as a subgenre name, too. It's not accurate descriptively but it does evoke the correct memes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joe Posted March 10, 2005 Report Share Posted March 10, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? Though I am generally sympathetic to most of the answers posted above, mine is different. I believe that thinking too much in terms of genres is detrimental to creative thinking. So ultimately, I don't know or care whether monster-hunting counts as horror. But I do not thereby mean to dismiss the answers given by others, which were generally interesting and thoughtful. It's just that what I find interesting about them is not their final yes or (more often) no answer. I think He who is Matt's example of Aliens is worth dwelling on. He did not classify it as horror. Others, I'm sure, would. And for those who think the answer is important, I'm sure one can come up with a pretty good argument for either answer. What strikes me as interesting, however, is that: 1. It was a very enjoyable movie. 2. It did not fit into the typical mold of either a horror or an action movie.* 3. 2 probably is probably part of the explanation for 1. 4. Something roughly like it is particularly suitable to being played as an RPG. * I am of course not denying that it had some features in common with typical horror or typical action movies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agemegos Posted March 10, 2005 Report Share Posted March 10, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? Does horror have to be scary or just have nasty unnatural creatures. I think it has to be horrifying (which is more 'disturbing' than 'fightening') and does not have to have nasty unnatural creatures. I think a story about an alcoholic father could be very horrifying while being utterly realistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agemegos Posted March 10, 2005 Report Share Posted March 10, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? What strikes me as interesting, however, is that: 1. It was a very enjoyable movie. 2. It did not fit into the typical mold of either a horror or an action movie.* 3. 2 probably is probably part of the explanation for 1. 4. Something roughly like it is particularly suitable to being played as an RPG. "You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later." I owe Just Joe rep for this post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trencher Posted March 11, 2005 Report Share Posted March 11, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? If the focus is on fighting and action then it is defined as being in the action genre with some horror elements. Basically I think that if you can kick the demons ass in hand to hand it is not horror. It might be a scary and hard won fight but it is not horror. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st barbara Posted March 24, 2005 Report Share Posted March 24, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? When I was a teenager (many years ago now !) I read a story in a book of "Horror Stories" called "The Vertical Ladder" (I can't remember the author) which was all about a teenaged boy climbing the vertical ladder on the side of a very large, disused tank (like a water tank). It simply descibed his feelings as he attempted to conquer his fear and climb the tank. It was CHILLING ! Horror doesn't have to have monsters or haunted houses or any of the usual cliches, IF the writer is good enough at conveying the feelings of his characters ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rover Posted March 24, 2005 Report Share Posted March 24, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? Hi All, In answer to Toadmaster's question; only if the monster catches and eats the player's family, and their friends, and thier pets, and the people that owe them money and finally the players No, really. I grew up with a lot of COC games so I'm quite used to killing and getting killed, figuratively speaking If you're running a game where the players are settled into thier characters the best way to introduce this idea is while thier characters are out of town(Buffy went to Vegas, right? What, like she was going to fight evil in Sin City? In that outfit? Whooo, that outfit! Whoops! Sorry, I digress ) and introduce some new characters while failing to inform them your going to massacare them. You may find the players will stop taking thier character's immortality for granted and appreciate the game more with the spice of danger actually existing in the same game world. Regards, Rover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HewhoisMatt Posted March 24, 2005 Report Share Posted March 24, 2005 Re: Is monster hunting horror? We don't have any evil here. We are just misunderstood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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