What does a SuperTeam need?

[Agent X]

I'm thinking of pitching a new campaign to the players in the group I'm in and I'm hoping to get them to thinking about the roles they can play in game.

 

Looking at the Champions game, it has a decent list of roles for characters in a game but I don't think it's particularly in-depth.

 

What do you think?

What kind of abilities does a superteam need to get the feel of a group like the Avengers or the Justice League?

 

What sort of skill roles are needed?

What kinds of technology do they need access to?

 

What sort of character dynamics in terms of interpersonal relationships have you seen in comics that you think work well? For example, I really like the old Booster Gold/Blue Beetle buddy thing.

[mikesama]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

For a group the types of skills that will generally show up in any medium to large super hero team:

 

Criminology and Forensics

Major sciences

Medicine

 

As far as technology goes almost any major hero team will have at least some access to high tech gear past the norm for the rest of the world.

 

As far as dynamics it's really better if you let the PCs handle them as group dynamics can change and it's really better if the PCs come up with it on thier own.

 

As for what you need consider this the base checklist for creating a super team.

 

Things needed

a Brick

a Science based character(Power armor, Gadgetteer...)

Someone to bankroll the group

Transportation for the group

Base

 

Almost everything else is negotiable, and you can get almost all of what I listed with one character if you built them right.

 

As far as heroic abilities let everyone go thier own way and you'll probably see all of the major super powers that a hero team will need as long as everyone doesn't play the same 2-3 archetypes. Other than that tell your PCs you want them to make a team, you'd be suprised at just what crazy ideas other people will come up with on thier own for making a team.

[Eosin]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

Let's see.... JLA Level (or Avengers).

 

Tech - Nearly the highest achievable but somehow still make room for badguy super tech that is untracable.

 

Base - Has to be wicked cool with all the alien tech and stuff.

 

Transportation -- I prefer the Legion Flight Rings myself. Maybe with a touch of Mind Link to really demonstrate the coolness of the premire team.

 

CHARACTERS:

THE Brick -- You know the one everyone else wants to imitate or beat up but never can.

 

Everyone Else: While the other folks will have some differing traits it is important to note that they all should meet the criteria for mid-grade brick unless their power dictates otherwise. 75% of the JLA/TMA are mid-grade powerhouses of better (just off the top of my head).

 

1. Flying - Energy Projector Brick

2. Speedster or MA Low Grade Brick

3. The Mind-Screwing Brick

4. The Earth/Water/Diety Brick

 

Now what do those guys need to express themselves as?

 

Strategist.... usually combined with Patriot.

Thinker.... usually combined with Scientist.

The Hot Head/Flyboy.... usually combined with Rich Playboy

The Occultist (if you like magic mixed in with your super power).... usually... nope, no usually here.

[Eosin]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

Oh yeah, gotta, gotta, gotta have at least 3 cool... I mean Galactus kinda cool villains to put the team up against to start out their "stable."

[MCMaenza]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

It really depends upon the campaign you want to do. If you want to go (what I'd consider) big with a JLA/Avengers like level, you need some heavy hitters. A decent brick, someone with good energy attacks, a clear leader - not always the strongest of the group and a tech/intellect type. Beyond that, fill in with personalities. Speedsters and mentalists can be a headache for you as a GM - as I have found they can tend to through the game out of balance unless you have some restrictions on what they can and cannot do.

[Superskrull]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

I just wanna go on record as not wanting to play either the brick OR the leader. If I am forced to play leader, I'm holding my breath til I turn blue.

[CourtFool]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

All you need is love.

[Eosin]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

I just wanna go on record as not wanting to play either the brick OR the leader. If I am forced to play leader' date=' I'm holding my breath til I turn blue.[/quote']

 

You're playing Archangel? He never was much of a leader.

[shadow_walker]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

What does a Team need you ask? From my experience in the game I vote for good teamwork and cooperation skills.

[Hermit]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

I'm thinking of pitching a new campaign to the players in the group I'm in and I'm hoping to get them to thinking about the roles they can play in game.

Not sure I can add much so a lot of what I'll say will just be repeating.

Looking at the Champions game, it has a decent list of roles for characters in a game but I don't think it's particularly in-depth.

 

What do you think?

What kind of abilities does a superteam need to get the feel of a group like the Avengers or the Justice League?

I think the Base and other mentions were good but in addition...

A sense of heritage

Such a team is among the best, if not THE best, and they need to show that in their past, be it a collective past, or individual history. No rookies unless they are very powerful (and even then maybe not), but experienced characters with positive rep perks and some degree of public trust. There can be exceptions, but they should be few, otherwise the exceptions lose their shock value and uniqueness.

Trophy rooms filled with Keys to Cities or devices left from fallen foes add to the flavor of this.

If they ever do lose the public trust, it should be part of a storyline to reclaim it, rather than a more Xmanish "hated by the people they have sworn to protect" status quo.

 

What sort of skill roles are needed?

 

They often overlap, but in my mind for the JL/Avengers dynamic, you need

At least...

1. One public face, usually a good Orator. The one everyone trusts.

2. One Scientist, often the BEST in his field, but just as likely to be an expert in many fields that don't often seem to mesh well ("You study Quantum fields AND know about the rare flamebeetles of bora bora?")

3. One Provider (either the typical 'rich guy', or the guy who can get odd resources thanks to his powers. Batman funds, Superman can lay his hands on rare metals found in the asteroid belt... that sort of thing)

4. One strategist/Tactician

5. One conscience. Yeah, this sounds odd on a team of paragons of virtue, but sometimes you need the streetlevel guy to remind the rest of the team that while they're battling cosmic menaces, gangs are pushing drugs on innocent kids, or the kind soul who points out that maybe, just maybe, the supervillain claiming he wants a chance at redemption deserves a shot. The "conscience" varies, but often they are more in tune with the common man than others, or at least have walked several miles in many shoes. Usually perceptive when it comes to social situations.

6. The scholar... because sometimes science isn't enough. Often the occult expert, even more mundane studies turn out to be of great use when you need riddles solved or objects de art analyzed.

7. "The Teammate" this poor guy never seems to get the spot light on him, yet he shows up for every meeting, he pulls his weight every time, and he doesn't even give the team leader any lip. And yes, he has Teamwork out the wazzoo.

8. The Stranger among us- Alien, Robot, or other non human... this guy is the one who maybe in the team, but he's an outsider everywhere else. Often for him, the team is the only family he can have. I know this isn't a skill set, but he almost always has some weird knack no one thought would come in useful.

 

 

What kinds of technology do they need access to?

IMO? At the very least top of the line plus 10 years.

What sort of character dynamics in terms of interpersonal relationships have you seen in comics that you think work well? For example, I really like the old Booster Gold/Blue Beetle buddy thing.

SHouldn't be forced on someone on either side... but...

 

Leader and the Rebel- IF the players are okay with this, this can lead to fun play. The secret is to do it more Captain America and Hawkeye than Cyclops and Wolverine. If the rebel leaves the team to go 'solo' all the time, it ruins the gaming for the other players, so it is better than he complains while still knocking himself out to do his part rather than just running off and forcing others to either let him handle it or stealing the limelight. The leader's player, in turn, has to have a good sense of humor (even if the character doesn't) about being the rebel's target for complaint. Also, when the chips are down, either would fiercely defend the other from outsiders ("That's OUR chew toy" etc)

 

 

The lovers- Be it unrequitted or an obvious relationship, this relationship can show either a bastian of something wonderful in what is often dark bussiness, or it can be seen as a possible weakness (If Ultra loves Lady Web, but must abandon her to get Dr. Omicron to the particle drive ASAP... will he be able to do it?). Sometimes it is both.

 

The buddies- Like your example, these guys are friends even when the costumes are off, and spend a lot of time together. They may eventually sound like an old married couple, or they might have a playful rivalry, but either way either would give his life for the other even if he wouldn't say so. Often male bonding at its finest, but obviously the ladies have their own version, one that is akin to voluntary sisterhood.

[Stray Cat]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

I just wanna go on record as not wanting to play either the brick OR the leader. If I am forced to play leader' date=' I'm holding my breath til I turn blue.[/quote']How come SS always gets to be blue?

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

I just wanna go on record as not wanting to play either the brick OR the leader. If I am forced to play leader' date=' I'm holding my breath til I turn blue.[/quote'] That only provides me incentive to encourage your nomination as leader.

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

How come SS always gets to be blue?

He knows the lyrics to the song that asks the question, "Am I blue?" ?

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

For a group the types of skills that will generally show up in any medium to large super hero team:

 

Criminology and Forensics

Major sciences

Medicine

 

As far as technology goes almost any major hero team will have at least some access to high tech gear past the norm for the rest of the world.

 

As far as dynamics it's really better if you let the PCs handle them as group dynamics can change and it's really better if the PCs come up with it on thier own.

 

As for what you need consider this the base checklist for creating a super team.

 

Things needed

a Brick

a Science based character(Power armor, Gadgetteer...)

Someone to bankroll the group

Transportation for the group

Base

 

Almost everything else is negotiable, and you can get almost all of what I listed with one character if you built them right.

 

As far as heroic abilities let everyone go thier own way and you'll probably see all of the major super powers that a hero team will need as long as everyone doesn't play the same 2-3 archetypes. Other than that tell your PCs you want them to make a team, you'd be suprised at just what crazy ideas other people will come up with on thier own for making a team.

I was thinking of having everybody write down their three favorite characters from the Justice League and the Avengers and then show everybody else and the have the players negotiate rolls from there.

 

I want a very strong Four-Color/Bronze feel to the game so I really want to steer these guys toward homages (rip-offs) of the big names.

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

Let's see.... JLA Level (or Avengers).

 

Tech - Nearly the highest achievable but somehow still make room for badguy super tech that is untracable.

 

Base - Has to be wicked cool with all the alien tech and stuff.

 

Transportation -- I prefer the Legion Flight Rings myself. Maybe with a touch of Mind Link to really demonstrate the coolness of the premire team.

 

CHARACTERS:

THE Brick -- You know the one everyone else wants to imitate or beat up but never can.

 

Everyone Else: While the other folks will have some differing traits it is important to note that they all should meet the criteria for mid-grade brick unless their power dictates otherwise. 75% of the JLA/TMA are mid-grade powerhouses of better (just off the top of my head).

 

1. Flying - Energy Projector Brick

2. Speedster or MA Low Grade Brick

3. The Mind-Screwing Brick

4. The Earth/Water/Diety Brick

 

Now what do those guys need to express themselves as?

 

Strategist.... usually combined with Patriot.

Thinker.... usually combined with Scientist.

The Hot Head/Flyboy.... usually combined with Rich Playboy

The Occultist (if you like magic mixed in with your super power).... usually... nope, no usually here.

The flight ring thing sounds really interesting. Nobody even blinks when you do that for a futuristic game. Could be a very good twist for a present-day game to have some very useful equipment like that.

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

It really depends upon the campaign you want to do. If you want to go (what I'd consider) big with a JLA/Avengers like level' date=' you need some heavy hitters. A decent brick, someone with good energy attacks, a clear leader - not always the strongest of the group and a tech/intellect type. Beyond that, fill in with personalities. Speedsters and mentalists can be a headache for you as a GM - as I have found they can tend to through the game out of balance unless you have some restrictions on what they can and cannot do.[/quote'] I don't think mentalists are that much fun for the players in my group anyway. When someone runs one it usually seems like they are trying to get an "edge" and I really don't want that in this game.

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

Not sure I can add much so a lot of what I'll say will just be repeating.

 

I think the Base and other mentions were good but in addition...

A sense of heritage

Such a team is among the best, if not THE best, and they need to show that in their past, be it a collective past, or individual history. No rookies unless they are very powerful (and even then maybe not), but experienced characters with positive rep perks and some degree of public trust. There can be exceptions, but they should be few, otherwise the exceptions lose their shock value and uniqueness.

Trophy rooms filled with Keys to Cities or devices left from fallen foes add to the flavor of this.

If they ever do lose the public trust, it should be part of a storyline to reclaim it, rather than a more Xmanish "hated by the people they have sworn to protect" status quo.

 

 

 

They often overlap, but in my mind for the JL/Avengers dynamic, you need

At least...

1. One public face, usually a good Orator. The one everyone trusts.

2. One Scientist, often the BEST in his field, but just as likely to be an expert in many fields that don't often seem to mesh well ("You study Quantum fields AND know about the rare flamebeetles of bora bora?")

3. One Provider (either the typical 'rich guy', or the guy who can get odd resources thanks to his powers. Batman funds, Superman can lay his hands on rare metals found in the asteroid belt... that sort of thing)

4. One strategist/Tactician

5. One conscience. Yeah, this sounds odd on a team of paragons of virtue, but sometimes you need the streetlevel guy to remind the rest of the team that while they're battling cosmic menaces, gangs are pushing drugs on innocent kids, or the kind soul who points out that maybe, just maybe, the supervillain claiming he wants a chance at redemption deserves a shot. The "conscience" varies, but often they are more in tune with the common man than others, or at least have walked several miles in many shoes. Usually perceptive when it comes to social situations.

6. The scholar... because sometimes science isn't enough. Often the occult expert, even more mundane studies turn out to be of great use when you need riddles solved or objects de art analyzed.

7. "The Teammate" this poor guy never seems to get the spot light on him, yet he shows up for every meeting, he pulls his weight every time, and he doesn't even give the team leader any lip. And yes, he has Teamwork out the wazzoo.

8. The Stranger among us- Alien, Robot, or other non human... this guy is the one who maybe in the team, but he's an outsider everywhere else. Often for him, the team is the only family he can have. I know this isn't a skill set, but he almost always has some weird knack no one thought would come in useful.

 

 

 

IMO? At the very least top of the line plus 10 years.

 

SHouldn't be forced on someone on either side... but...

 

Leader and the Rebel- IF the players are okay with this, this can lead to fun play. The secret is to do it more Captain America and Hawkeye than Cyclops and Wolverine. If the rebel leaves the team to go 'solo' all the time, it ruins the gaming for the other players, so it is better than he complains while still knocking himself out to do his part rather than just running off and forcing others to either let him handle it or stealing the limelight. The leader's player, in turn, has to have a good sense of humor (even if the character doesn't) about being the rebel's target for complaint. Also, when the chips are down, either would fiercely defend the other from outsiders ("That's OUR chew toy" etc)

 

 

The lovers- Be it unrequitted or an obvious relationship, this relationship can show either a bastian of something wonderful in what is often dark bussiness, or it can be seen as a possible weakness (If Ultra loves Lady Web, but must abandon her to get Dr. Omicron to the particle drive ASAP... will he be able to do it?). Sometimes it is both.

 

The buddies- Like your example, these guys are friends even when the costumes are off, and spend a lot of time together. They may eventually sound like an old married couple, or they might have a playful rivalry, but either way either would give his life for the other even if he wouldn't say so. Often male bonding at its finest, but obviously the ladies have their own version, one that is akin to voluntary sisterhood.

Really good points. I especially like your bringing up the "conscience" of the team.

 

This group is all-male and none would be too keen with dealing with romance as a female player character. I think I'll have to toss in an NPC or two and encourage at least one player to run a character with an NPC lover a la Hawman and Hawkwoman. Perhaps, if I bribe them by not making them buy the character as a follower but controlling the character myself it just might work.

[Superskrull]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

He knows the lyrics to the song that asks the question' date=' "Am I blue?" ?[/quote']

 

Eiffel 65 is a fine band. A fine band, I tell you. And, yeah, I do know the lyrics. I also know the lyrics to "Can Blue Men Sing The Whites?" by the Bonzo Dog Band.

 

Anyway, I'm gonna make Champsguy or Stray Cat be leader. That'll learn 'em. I'm just gonna make suggestions, probably in hindsight. That's always fun.

[Trained Chicken]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

Things needed

a Brick

a Science based character(Power armor, Gadgetteer...)

Someone to bankroll the group

Transportation for the group

Base

 

I must disagree. Certain archetypes are not mandated for a supergroup- a group can get by without any particular superpower or super-archetype. It is however difficult to get by without a couple of combat monsters of some variety. In fact, it's usually the most fun when everyone can somehow get some licks in against the bad guy- but not even this is mandatory.

[Karma]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

The 'Must Have' for any team:

A Mentalist who can help protect the team from mental attacks or some technology to do the same. Lets face it, a Mentalist can take a party unprepared for their brand of attack down faster than anything (except possibly a speedster) and can do it undetected. What's worse they can stuff your reputation as heroes/good people/upstanding citizens in the toilet and flush.

 

To reiterate: Mentalists are dangerous, be prepared.

 

All this, of course, goes out the window if the GM says 'there are no Mentalists, or mental powers in this world'.

[assault]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

The 'Must Have' for any team:

A Mentalist who can help protect the team from mental attacks or some technology to do the same.

 

This is a wargamer-ism.

 

The fact is that a group can't cover all contingencies - and shouldn't try.

 

Characters should be chosen because they are fun to play, and for no other reason.

 

It is a fact of life that every team, and every character, will get hosed every now and then. The best thing to do is to choose your vulnerabilities, so you get hosed in fun and interesting ways. If you try to ensure you don't get hosed, you will get hosed anyway, and annoyed as well.

 

All of this means that while it's fine to have a mentalist in the team, it is not required. Of course, the team will then be vulnerable to enemy mentalists, but that's just part of the business.

[OddHat]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

I don't think mentalists are that much fun for the players in my group anyway. When someone runs one it usually seems like they are trying to get an "edge" and I really don't want that in this game.

 

What works for one group might not work for another. My own groups have included a fair number of mentalists over the years (we've done a few Psionic campaigns, and telepaths on traditional Super teams), and none of them were there for their war-game or munchkin value.

[OddHat]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

What do you think?

What kind of abilities does a superteam need to get the feel of a group like the Avengers or the Justice League?

 

Most importantly, they need to be powerful and effective by the standards of the game world. The JLA/Avengers are their world's most powerful heroes. They have a few second-string supers, but on the whole they are the best their worlds have to offer. You can do that on any point level, but you need to keep an eye on both Hero and NPC design.

 

What sort of skill roles are needed?

 

Characters who can serve as experts on mystic, psionic, street level, business, poitical, cosmic, and scientific matters. Splitting up the roles is fine. Having an expert on field X makes running an adventure in that field that much less frustrating for the players and that much easier for you. The expert doesn't need to be able to pull the answer ot of his hat; he's there so that you can feed the players whatever information that's needed to keep the story moving.

What kinds of technology do they need access to?

 

What kind of adventures do you want to run? For a full cosmic group of heroes, a spaceship with teleporter tech is handy, letting you get straight to the action. Lower tech works as well, so long as the team can get to where you need it to be.

 

I like to keep labs and libraries in the base for JLA level teams unless visiting the lab is part of the adventure.

 

What sort of character dynamics in terms of interpersonal relationships have you seen in comics that you think work well? For example, I really like the old Booster Gold/Blue Beetle buddy thing.

 

Drinking buddies work well, as do romantic entanglements if you have the right players. Mentor-Student and Hero-Sidekick can work very well if the players like each other and have fun with it. Reversals like the idiot Hero and his smart Sidekick can also be fun.

 

I find that the "Heroes who despise each other, but learn respect" thing brings very negative energy to my groups. I've seen people more than once who were ready to quit the game over the way their characters were being treated by other PCs.

[Agent X]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

Most importantly, they need to be powerful and effective by the standards of the game world. The JLA/Avengers are their world's most powerful heroes. They have a few second-string supers, but on the whole they are the best their worlds have to offer. You can do that on any point level, but you need to keep an eye on both Hero and NPC design.

 

 

 

Characters who can serve as experts on mystic, psionic, street level, business, poitical, cosmic, and scientific matters. Splitting up the roles are fine. Having an expert on field X makes running an adventure in that field that much less frustrating for the players and that much easier for you. The expert doesn't need to be able to pull the answer ot of his hat; he's there so that you can feed the players whatever information that's needed to keep the story moving.

 

 

What kind of adventures do you want to run? For a full cosmic group of heroes, a spaceship with teleporter tech is handy, letting you get straight to the action. Lower tech works as well, so long as the team can get to where you need it to be.

 

I like to keep labs and libraries in the base for JLA level teams unless visiting the lab is part of the adventure.

 

 

 

Drinking buddies work well, as do romantic entanglements if you have the right players. Mentor-Student and Hero-Sidekick can work very well if the players like each other and have fun with it. Reversals like the idiot Hero and his smart Sidekick can also be fun.

 

I find that the "Heroes who despise each other, but learn respect" thing brings very negative energy to my groups. I've seen people more than once who were ready to quit the game over the way their characters were being treated by other PCs.

Yeah, my theory is, if a player wants a base and isn't trying to use it to have a "crystal ball" or a teleportation UAO increased range to a trap inside the base then, as long as they fully flesh it out and draw it out, I'll give them the XP for it.

 

And rivalries have to be carefully used - they can't be the "despise each other" variety.

[Logan D. Hurricanes]

Re: What does a SuperTeam need?

 

All groups need a cute one, a tough one, a sexy one, a smart one, and one who can actually sing.

 

 

But seriously, I have never considered a mentalist or a mystic as essential. I suppose if it were a cosmic level campaign it might be necessary, but a street level would most likely be overkill. My favorite groups (like the FF) didn't have these, and the functioned very well, thank you. Even the speedster (a more beloved archetype in my eyes) isn't necessary, though there is usually someone who operates faster than the others. Frex, the Human Torch is the fast guy in the FF, but he's no speedster.