Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

[phoenix240]

I think this is appropriate for this forum. Has anyone read or even played this? How does it compare to Champions? I've been following some of the threads on other boards with interest and trying to piece together the basics. So far it seems like an unusual system but I haven't played any Cortex games before.

 

This thread has a pretty detailed example of play. http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?616754-Marvel-Heroic-Roleplaying-Example-of-Play-Maximum-Wesker

[TheQuestionMan]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Apples and Oranges. I have played both and enjoyed both. The GM and Player knowledge of Game Mechanics is important.

 

I prefer Hero System. Just remember that player do not have to pay for something to use something. If they keep it and use it a lot then I might make them pay points for it.

 

 

Having fun is what it is all about.

 

 

QM

QM

[Asperion]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

I really do not know this Marvel system other than what was shown here. However I believe that Champions is not for someone just starting RPGs for the fist time (the Marvel FASERIP system is better here), but this new Marvel seems to be even more complicated than Champions is and for even more advanced players.

[Ndreare]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

It is not as bad as it seams. A player willing to learn will be able to learn any system. I have had some pretty challenged player who were able to "get" hero ssystem and role master both of which are consider pretty complex. I cannot imagine cortex being more complicated

[RexMundi]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Cortex is just clunky, not complicated. Does what needs to be done when you need it to do it. If you like, Lots of Dice Variety in addition to your lots of Dice then it's functional.....

 

HERO is pretty easy to pick up. Even for the new folks... It just looks intimidating but it's not like it's Phoenix Command heh... HERO is far more versatile then Cortex, and a lot smoother. Cortex clunks itself up the more "power it gets" the rougher the road but it does the job at the lower levels. That's what makes it look more complicated. In Dice, Cortex basically goes Stat+Skill+Extras+Others - Complication Stuff try and hit the target number for difficulty, then apply the effect. Since you can have a basically every die under the sun going on there even at the Normal Human levels, it clunks up pretty quickly...

 

Better off with HERO in the long run. Any thing you want when you want it, minimal clunk. Just got to pay attention to the scale of the game a bit here and there other then that it's actually fairly basic, especially 6th which removed the main thing that used to terrify certain gamers....

 

~Rex

[Matt the Bruins]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

The COM stat?

[Christopher]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Figureds?

[phoenix240]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Even after reading several examples of game play I admit I have very little idea what's going on.

[mattingly]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

I've played a few other CORTEX games, and after the first one, I got the hang of it. I'll be playing Marvel in a few hours, without having looked over the rules beforehand. I expect that it'll be fine.

[phoenix240]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

I've played a few other CORTEX games' date=' and after the first one, I got the hang of it. I'll be playing Marvel in a few hours, without having looked over the rules beforehand. I expect that it'll be fine.[/quote']

 

If you have the time and inclination, I'd really like to hear what your experience was with the Marvel RPG.

[Christopher]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

I found some information about the underliying game system: Cortex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cortex_System#The_Cortex_System

 

I remember playing the Demo adventure for the new Battlestar Galactica RPG, wich uses Cortex.

 

If I remeber the basics right, your Atributes are Measured as Dice. so you have a STR between 1d2 and 1d12, with every even numbered dice being a "Step".

Skills or Atributes are also rated a 1dX, dependign on how much you invested.

When you make a Roll your Atribute, Skill and other modifiers are rolled togehter. The atribute changes, depending on the action (remeberign a fact about Spaceships is INT+Spaceships/Pilot; flying one is DEX+Spaceship/Pilot).

[mattingly]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Overall, the system wasn't bad. The best part was, of course, playing iconic superheroes with friends that I haven't played with in a while.

 

In a nutshell, you have powers with dice attached. You roll some certain number (and shape) of dice, then add two of them for your result ("to hit") and choose a die type ("d8") for effect/damage. As bad things happen to you, or as you draw focus on a deep character element, you gain plot points, which allow you to do even more cool stuff.

[Christopher]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Overall, the system wasn't bad. The best part was, of course, playing iconic superheroes with friends that I haven't played with in a while.

 

In a nutshell, you have powers with dice attached. You roll some certain number (and shape) of dice, then add two of them for your result ("to hit") and choose a die type ("d8") for effect/damage. As bad things happen to you, or as you draw focus on a deep character element, you gain plot points, which allow you to do even more cool stuff.

Sounds pretty much like unmodified BSG Cortex. There invoking complications gave you plot points. Aside from increasing your rolls, you could also use them to directly alter the gamereality:

Easiest was it when usign traits (like "Friends in high places" or "Ace Pilot"), but given enough points a character without any applicable trait could "find the key for the door in the flowerpot next to it" - despite the GM never putting it there*

 

*the cost of such things are up to the GM.

[RexMundi]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

Overall, the system wasn't bad. The best part was, of course, playing iconic superheroes with friends that I haven't played with in a while.

 

In a nutshell, you have powers with dice attached. You roll some certain number (and shape) of dice, then add two of them for your result ("to hit") and choose a die type ("d8") for effect/damage. As bad things happen to you, or as you draw focus on a deep character element, you gain plot points, which allow you to do even more cool stuff.

 

Yeah I didn't find it much different in play then their Smallville game, albeit the stuff you play is more Iconic. I still find it very clunky but it's always cool to see a super hero game on the shelves.....

 

~Rex

[DreadDomain]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

In MHRPG, characters are very broadly defined. Not only there are only 4 levels of magnitude (d6 being roughly normal human, d8 being enhanced (Cap’s STR), d10 being super (from Spidey to Iron Man’s STR) and d12 being cosmic (from Colossus STR and up)) but the exact effects of the powers in combat are mostly left to the players and GM (although there is some definition in the SFX). Plot point a currency to activate some advantages/effects. They are mostly gained by activating the character’s limitations in game. Contests inflict stress on characters which are sort of temporary limitations until “healed” or could give temporary assets or complications. The game is resource driven (plot points, stress) and narrative (let’s read the dice and decide what it means) at the same time. Of course, this summary is certainly incomplete and keep in mind that I have read the book but haven’t played it.

 

Someone on RPG.net (loosely) said that Marvel Heroic RPG was a comic book simulator while games like M&M are super-heroes simulator in the sense that one simulates the flow of actions or story as shown in the comics while the other is more concerned by detailing what a super-hero can do. I think this is not a bad assessment and that HERO, at last as a default, is more a super-hero simulator. One significant difference over some other SH simulators is that by turning a few switches on or off, HERO is also a great at mimicking other styles. Using a few tweaks, it can also become a comic book simulator. The trick would be to turn on the options aiming at reducing bookkeeping and enhancing improvisation and freeform powers. A sample of those could be :

 

1) Heroic/Villainous Action Points which have the same function as the Plot Points in MHRPG (6EII p. 287) giving more improvisational and influence power to players.

 

2) Enhanced use of the Power skill (APG p.39) to give more flexibility to players. Using the Power skill, a character could create the equivalent of MHRPG Assets and Complications by using a Transform (at a value of 1/3 his AP in his power).

 

3) Powers cost no END to use (6E1 p.46) and Extensive Use of Pushing (APGII p.68). Again for the extra flexibility but also to reduce bookkeeping. Since nothing would cost END at default, what can be pushed would be left to common sense, description of effect and fun value.

 

4) Uses of rules like Contest of Powers (APGI p.174) and Pushback (APGI p.176). The first might contravene the “less bookkeeping” rule but it is so much in style and the second gives more flexibility to players.

 

5) Complications don’t give points during character creation but give HAP when they come into play (6E1 p.415). Using the beneficial complications rule (APGII p.54) would also enhance the freeform play style.

 

6) A simpler initiative and sequence process can also be put in place by giving everyone SPD 4 or by using an optional SPD system (APGI p.158). The Countdown method seems particularly appropriate. It gives a more dynamic flow but might require a bit more bookkeeping.

 

7) One could go as far as using the optional skill difficulty system (APGII p.9). That would have the benefit of unifying the combat and skill mechanics and every rolls would be opposed rolls as it is in MHRPG.

 

Some of these would reduce the need for power frameworks which is in line with a more flexible play style. The GM could relax the “if you use it often, you should pay point for it since by not paying point, the character would have access to a tiring (END or HAP) power or a less effective power (Power skill).

Using these rules should help simulate a comic book flow better. It would still not play as MHRPG, it would still have a much better definition of character abilities at the price of more crunch but still, HERO already has all the switches and dials to be an excellent comic book simulator.

[RexMundi]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

The single best Comic Book Simulation RPG I have ever seen, was the Marvel Universe Role Playing Game, that Marvel put out (Though the MEGS system ranks up there with it, MURPG had more granularity at the lower end of the scale so I bumped it a notch). I loved the format, it played Lighting Fast, Did everything you have ever seen in a comic book the way you see it in a comic book. It had a rather unique dice-less system that I actually found tolerable and a lot of people new to gaming picked up really quick, fantastic production quality, wasn't too over priced for what it could do though by volume and word-count it was a touch pricey.

It's only real mistakes where it basically wasn't supported or pushed (though they did an X-Men and a Hulk/Avengers Supplement), and they had a couple of game mechanics they just didn't bother to explain but where on a lot of the character builds (Accumulate Energies comes to mind). They were also a great example of a "CONCISE" set of rules. Here is what you NEED. Here is the Consistent Art, Right where it needs to be, this is how you do 2+2=4. Almost impossible to find stuff for it though you can still find the books, but good luck getting answers about game things related to it (Again, Accumulate Energies)....

 

Either way the Cortex folks seem to have found it's niche, and it's fanbase and they are happy with that, so I don't expect to see them go away anytime soon....

 

~Rex

[KawangaKid]

Re: Marvel Heroic Role playing compared to Champions/Hero System

 

I put up a review of Marvel Heroic Roleplaying on my gaming blog.

 

I think it's worth noting that if you're uncomfortable with some of the more indie / narrative gaming mechanics, this may send you spinning.

 

There are no specific stats to speak of, there's a "fate point" mechanic in there by another name that is used very similarly to the FATE ruleset, but without the FUDGE dice rolling, since we're using Cortex Plus. There's a "Doom Pool" representing the dice pool of the GM as an overall representation of the escalating level of threat. There's an 'experience point' system that allows you to earn XP in game, and spend it in game as well in a manner akin to both 'fate points' and 'experience points' in other narrative games besides FATE. Player dice pools are created using appropriate 'tag' based abilities such as Affiliations (are you working solo, with a buddy, or as part of a team RIGHT NOW?), Distinctions (I'm tapping my "Never Give Up, Never Surrender" distinction for d8), and your relevant ability to do something, plus anything extra from spending points.

 

Character creation doesn't use points, really. Although character concept is really at a premium, since you're sort of forced to have only a limited number of what we HEROphiles might call 'special effects' for your abilities. Note that SFX is used differently in the game, as are Stunts, and Limits, so tread carefully when reading the rules -- the words may not mean what you think they mean.

 

Rules aside, it's a fun read, captures the atmosphere of the current Marvel Universe comic book genre (complete with action and drama). I haven't played it yet, though. Narrative mechanics frustrate me when trying to envision running a game. I think I'm just too traditional to take to these things easily.