Sweet! you rolled a 3

[Jhereg]

My group plays a lot of Heroic campaigns where realism is important. That means making it lethal. I use the optional Critical Hit rules, in which a result of 2x the Defenders DCV gets max damage.

 

So in the case of a "3" (which even with 4 players, usually only happens once per session), I usually take over with a narrative, forgoing the location or damage rolls. I make it worth the role, of course; keeping it cinematic. If it's a PC hitting an unimportant NPC, I'll make it an auto-kill.

 

Similarly, I take over with a narrative for "18"s, taking GM liberties with critical fumbles (PC's shooting himself in the foot, or ejecting his clip instead of firing). It's usually humorous, regardless of the campaign's tone.

[Christougher]

3! 18! 3! 18!

 

Our group uses a variant of the double-damage on a 3 rule - if you rolled a 3, roll again. If you hit the second time, you get double damage. Cuts down on the double damage to the "Can only be hit with a 3" lightly defended martial artists from constantly getting splattered.

 

The last game I was in, everyone at the table rolled a 3. One player had two 3s and two 18s.

[Tech]

Just one of our house rules for a perfect 3 attack is to add 1 to the damage per d6 of the attack.

 

ex. a 10d6 attack adds 10 stun.

 

A killing attack gets the option to either increase the Stun Multiplier or add Body. We're not firm on this part of the ruling yet.

 

The fun part is a perfect 3 on Autofire. So far, the attacker has 2 choices: all the shots hit or on the # of shots that did hit, those are a perfect hit.

 

Not perfect but it works.

[CorpCommander]

3's and 18's

 

Some people have trouble giving extra benefit or detriment to 3's and 18's but my feeling is it adds color.

 

The concept of a critical hit is enormously heart warming to players. The fear of a fumble chills their hearts. It makes sense to have such type of events in certain genres. Unless you are playing some hyper-realistic game, such things are common in literature and film.

 

I like to include crits and fumbles but not with a strict codifying of what happens. Generally I think of 3 cases for both.

 

Case A: mundane crit/fumble. Nothing spectacular was going on so you just get full damage or lose a 1/2 phase.

 

Case B: exciting crit/fumble. The character was doing something difficult at the time like hanging upside down from the branch of a tree shooting at an otherwise unspectacular target. For a fumble, clearly the Hero falls out of the tree or something bad happens. The shot might hit some critical component and not just cause damage but also prevent the target from taking an action or using some equipment.

 

and finally Case C: Once in a Life Time crit/fumble. Not only is the character doing something exciting (acrobatic leap with two swords over the Gap of Death while gnomes ride the heroes back and provide archery fire along the way) the target is either extremely tough and nigh invulnerable but is also perhaps doing something either extraordinary or critical to the plot. In this case the crit stops the target cold. A fumble takes the character out of combat or if the player was told of the risks leaves a nice snack for the carrion crawlers at the bottom of the Gap of Death.

 

I've never had case C ever come up. Case B has been rare and Case A just happens. The best thing to do is think of a special effect/stunt you've seen in the movies and attribute that to the situation. If the party is fighting generic orcs make the crit a decapitation with a case B crit resulting in a 3D6 range in hexes for how far the head got batted. Someone mentioned giving automatic AP to the hit. I like that too! There is a lot you can do with crits and fumbles that make the game fun.

[austenandrews]

Yeah, I've had 3's and 18's change the conditions of battle either minorly or greatly, depending on what's the most fun at the moment.

 

Last night a player rolled an 18 to hit. He made a DEX roll to avoid dropping his weapon out of the tree he was in. It was a reasonable risk for a casual situation.

 

The same player has spent the last few games blowing his skill roll to cast spells, to the point of frustration. Last night, as the group was beginning a large and grueling battle, he rolled a 3 for his skill roll. I ruled that he finally "found his stride" and gave him a pass on skill rolls for the next 2 Turns. The way it brightened him up easily justified the ruling.

 

In a previous game the group was facing a giant lizard that could possibly have slaughtered them. They stood on a bridge over a river, while the beast crouched on a nearby waterfall. When it leapt onto the bridge, I threw an 18 for its DEX roll. The monster landed wrong, scrambled to pull itself up, took a couple of free shots from the PCs and then plopped into the river. The PCs made an easy escape and a potentially deadly battle turned into a funny story.

 

I like 3's and 18's. They're a fun random element, making me do things that normally wouldn't occur to me as a GM.

 

-AA

[Nevenall]

Some of my favorite game moments have come from unusual skill rolls. Like accidently stealing our powerful mage rival's entire house.

Slicing my character's ear off with a misfired bow, and then casually picking it up, dusting the sand off, and placing it in my belt pouch.

 

Critical results can add a lot to the game.

[BoneDaddy]

ICE's crit tables were fun, but not serious stuff.

 

The "fumble" rule (drop a weapon on a 3, or a 1 in a d20 game) always irritated me. I once had a Cavalier so skilled he could drop and pick up his sword in the same round. Butterfingers, they called him. I had a Ranger who carried around 20 extra bowstrings. Dice and I don't always obey the laws (suggestions, really) of probability. More dispiriting than enjoyable.

[CorpCommander]

Lottery!

 

Originally posted by BoneDaddy

Dice and I don't always obey the laws (suggestions, really) of probability. More dispiriting than enjoyable.

 

Sure you follow the laws - in an aggregated sense. Everytime Butterfingers drops his sword some lucky bastard in the Midwest gets another number on the lottery card. Just because you can't see the balance doesn't mean it isn't there!

 

I tell you what. Lets do an experiment. I'll get a lottery ticket and you roll dice like crazy this weekend. If I win I'll split the proceeds with you.

[JohnTaber]

Hi Gents,

 

In my games I use slight tweaks for Heroic vs Superheroic. Here is what I do...

 

Heroic

+ If you get half of what you need to hit with a HTH weapon you max it out. Ranged weapons don't crit. I think this used to be an old FH rule or something but it sorta stuck with my gang.

- On an 18 you are at half DCV or some other combat disadvantage (i.e. jam, broken weapon, etc).

 

Superheroic

+ On a 3 you do 1.5x the damage you roll.

- On an 18 you are at half DCV.

[NuSoardGraphite]

Lets start with the basics:

 

Like many here, I play that 3 is an automatic hit/success. 18 is an automatic miss/failre.

 

I also use Critical Success and Critical Failure rules. I think skill should be a serious factor in how often you can crit, I use the Roll Less than Half method.

 

That means when my players are fighting minions (we call them "Scrubbs") critical successes are pretty frequent. I use the optional rules from the FREd where a critical success achieves a maximum result on the dice (if there is dice involved..if not I'll use some other effect) and I'm perfectly okay with this. Scrubbs should go down quickly and with little effort (unless there's a lot of them, and even then, the PC's should be able to reduce their numbers significantly before fleeing or being KO'ed) and it doesn't matter to me if thats from the fact that they have low Stun (never more than 20) or they've been killed by a Critical Success. Besides, it makes the players feel like their characters are being effective. That way, when the main villian shows up and kicks their asses all over town, they don't feel quite as bad...at least they wiped the floor with his minions!

[zornwil]

3s always give something extra special, 18s always suck more than just blowing the roll. However, I fully admit to being arbitrary about to what degree. It depends on the circumstances. The more mundane the roll was, the less likely the result will be spectacular. The more dramatic/tense the moment, the more meaningful. No real formula, though.

 

I recall when a mage in my prior campaign rolled a "3" when gambling against Puck! Puck, who had thought he had it rigged, had to honor his loss and I ended up awarding an interesting little pouch that never ran out of money. And I gave the player a good gambling skill.

[Steve Trustrum]

Would you belive this issue has never come up in any of the HERO games I've participated in? Wow, I've no idea how so many people failed to even ask "so, anything special when I roll three 1s?"

[Guest WhammeWhamme]

Originally posted by slaughterj

Interesting stuff.

 

I've seen people post before about benefits for rolling a 3 (e.g., max damage, etc.), or for rolling under 1/2 what you needed to roll. I agree with not giving bonuses for rolling a 3 if only a 3 would have succeeded! I basically let a 3 be an auto-hit (if it were possible to hit), no particular bonuses associated with it.

 

As for 18s, I tend to "wing it" with effects, e.g., possibly swing to hit your neighbor, possibly break your weapon, possibly drop your weapon (happened to one character in the sewers, dropped into the deep rank depths, had no choice but to dive after it ). I've always had an issue with "hitting your neighbor", specifically what mechanic to use. It didn't make sense to use the character's OCV, because just because he hits his opponents better doesn't mean he should hit others better on accident. I like some of the ideas I've seen here, and think I'll go with the following: 0 OCV attack against neighbor's DCV/2 (halved based on being "surprised") - I like using the neighbor's DCV rather than one person's suggested 11-, because the target should have some bearing on it. I'm not sure about whether to incorporate the fumbler's OCV levels like the person with the 11- suggested, might do that as well.

 

Suggestion:

 

For their OCV, use how much they missed by. (The worse they are, the more likely they are to get a decent swing in at their ally...)

[slaughterj]

Originally posted by WhammeWhamme

Suggestion:

 

For their OCV, use how much they missed by. (The worse they are, the more likely they are to get a decent swing in at their ally...)

 

Ah, very nice! Then I can use the character's OCV levels to lower that, representing a highly skilled character being less likely to hit their friend as well.

[slaughterj]

What are some good, common fumble results to use?

 

Offhand, I can think of:

1. hitting a friend (if adjacent/possible)

2. dropping a weapon

3. breaking a weapon

4. miscasting a spell

 

Others?

[Hugh Neilson]

Originally posted by slaughterj

What are some good, common fumble results to use?

 

Offhand, I can think of:

1. hitting a friend (if adjacent/possible)

2. dropping a weapon

3. breaking a weapon

4. miscasting a spell

 

Others?

 

Slip/Stumble (reduced DCV until next phase)

 

Overreach (target gets OCV bonus against you until next phase)

 

Trip (prone to next phase)

 

Shoot self in foot (here's where Personal Immunity pays off!)

 

Weapon damaged (firearm jams; bowstring breaks; weapon has reduced OCV and/or damage until repaired)

 

Pull a muscle (reduced OCV and/or STR for some period)

 

Hit obstacle/ground HTH - you take damage

 

Damage to environment (set building on fire; damage/break treasure like jewelry, glasswork, potion bottles)

[slaughterj]

Originally posted by Hugh Neilson

Slip/Stumble (reduced DCV until next phase)

 

Overreach (target gets OCV bonus against you until next phase)

 

Trip (prone to next phase)

 

Shoot self in foot (here's where Personal Immunity pays off!)

 

Weapon damaged (firearm jams; bowstring breaks; weapon has reduced OCV and/or damage until repaired)

 

Pull a muscle (reduced OCV and/or STR for some period)

 

Hit obstacle/ground HTH - you take damage

 

Damage to environment (set building on fire; damage/break treasure like jewelry, glasswork, potion bottles)

 

Good stuff, keep 'em coming!

[pinecone]

I use criticals in Heroic and treat a 5 or less as a hit, and a 3 as a crit in supers, but never hose the hero...if you only meant to KO you get to pull and it succeeds (you rolled a 3) as for Fumbles...only someone with Unluck can fumble, Superheros are just to good to mess up that bad without a limitation....

[TheQuestionMan]

Sometimes I love you folks

 

Last night I was play testing the HERO System 5th Edition Rule and trying to work in all the "Optional Effects from Damage Rules" . When I rolled a "3" on an attack , consulted the "Hit Location Table" and applied the appropriate multipliers it just got ugly . a 3d6+1 HKA did 17 Body and x2 Stun . Can you say GINSU ( I new you could ) .

 

Where's the "Poll : Do you Use this" options for Critical Success or Failures ???