orichalcum

[keithcurtis]

Re: orichalcum

 

I used to have a D&D pronunciation guide in an old issue of Dragon Magazine. I'd dig it out, but since it claimed the pronunciation of Pleistocene was "plee-ISS-toe-seen", it's probably moot. However, I think it's the closest thing TSR ever produced to a definitive list of pronunciations.

 

Oh, and for the record, my pronunciations:

 

Drow rhymes with Cow

Lich rhymes with itch

Ore-i-KAL-kum

Sahuagin = SA-hwa-gin. (People who say it "sa-HYOO-a-gin" probably hang out with Old Man and his Dro crowd.)

 

Keith "No science more exact than RPG lexicography" Curtis

[keithcurtis]

Re: orichalcum

 

OK, from Dragon Magazine #93, January (gasp) 1985

Article by Frank Mentzer

Drow = drow or dro (so there, everybody)

lich = litch or lick (well this was worth standing on a chair to get from the closet.)

Sahuagin = Sa-HWA-gin (and that solved something no one was arguing about)

No entry of course for Orichalcum

 

Anbody else want anything definitively solved while I've got it out?

 

Keith "Will waste time for... well, for something" Curtis

[Old Man]

Re: orichalcum

 

Sahuagin = Sa-HWA-gin (and that solved something no one was arguing about)

No entry of course for Orichalcum

 

That's retarded. Everybody knows it's supposed to be Say-Hway-Jin!!

[keithcurtis]

Re: orichalcum

 

Heretic!!!

 

Keith "Where is my auto-da-fay-o-mat?" Curtis

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: orichalcum

 

Say who again?

[Old Man]

Re: orichalcum

 

Well, at least bblackmoor is pronouncing it how it's spelled.

[Markdoc]

Re: orichalcum

 

I thought the D&D "lich" (aka "liche") came from the Old English word for "corpse"' date=' "lic". [/quote']

 

It does, sort of. Lic/lice (most likely pronunced, Lee-cuh, like in Swedish, as far as we can work out) is found in Northern Anglo-english and is thought to derive originally from Danish/Norse. Southern Anglo-english used the word cors/corsk (from which we get corpse). I don't know if that's Cleticor saxon in origin.

 

Oddly enough, lig/lic/lice means a dead, dead body - but the scandanavians had a word for a dead body that got up and walked around - Draugr. But that didn't seem to make it to Britain - or at least into English. It would have been a better name for what we roleplayers now call a lich.

 

And to round the thread out, Draugr is pronounced drow - to rhyme with cow*

 

cheers, Mark

 

 

 

 

 

*Well, cow pronounced by someone from Boston, anyway - it's actually more like cower.

[Dale A. Ward]

Re: orichalcum

 

That's the Danish wersion. We swedes like our consonants with a bit of edge! Corpse in swedish is lik, pronounced LEEK.

 

Yes, leek, as the vegetable. You gotta problem with that?!

 

Godfrey Daniels and his brother, Jack!!

 

Yet another pronunciation to add to the list!!

[Black Rose]

Re: orichalcum

 

OK, from Dragon Magazine #93, January (gasp) 1985

Article by Frank Mentzer

Drow = drow or dro (so there, everybody)

I thought I remembered that the PTB at TSR called it "drow like crow" back when I got into DnD. It got blurred in with my friend's Forgotten Realms campaign, which rapidly dropped the idea of gaming in favor of shared storytelling. Fun times.

 

lich = litch or lick (well this was worth standing on a chair to get from the closet.)

I always preferred "lich like itch", too.

 

Sahuagin = Sa-HWA-gin (and that solved something no one was arguing about)

I never knew if it was correct, but I said it "Suh HOO ah gin"

 

No entry of course for Orichalcum

Of course not, this is TST/WotC we're talking about.

[Trencher]

Re: orichalcum

 

The Norwegian word for corps is: Lik.

In the stories I heard Draugen (there is only one) is more of a ghost than a walking corpse.

[Barwickian]

Re: orichalcum

 

That's retarded. Everybody knows it's supposed to be Say-Hway-Jin!!

 

Isn't Say-Hway Jin a Jedi? And if not, why not?

[Captain Obvious]

Re: orichalcum

 

He would be if he could have kept from playing the horses. Jedi look down on gambling problems....

[Old Man]

Re: orichalcum

 

Isn't Say-Hway Jin a Jedi? And if not' date=' why not?[/quote']

 

Repped.

[Lucius]

Orichalcum

 

Hmm....anyone know how electrum is pronounced? I remember being surprised to learn that, like orichalcum, electrum is actually an ancient word.

 

Then again, I was really surprised when I found an ancient Roman source stating the manticore shoots iron spines from its tail....sometimes it seems D&D doesn't play as "fast and loose" with the source materiel as I usually think.

 

But I really want to ask about liches. I have a vague idea that there was a Persian belief in a kind of undead wizard who could not be killed because he had preserved his internal organs and kept them in a safe place, and could only be destroyed if you found that hiding place and attacked his naked heart, brains, etc. (Perhaps an idea derived ultimately from Egyptian funereal practice??) Of course this is also just a special case of the fairy tale motif found everywhere of the giant/wizard/whatever whose heart/life/soul is not in his body. But if any of you impressive scholars can give me more information, or can direct me to good sources, I would appreciate it.

 

Oh, and does anyone know what Lewis Carroll MEANT by the word "vorpal?"

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The first part of palindromedary is pronounsed as in "palindrome" and from the "d" forwards is pronounced like "dromedary."

[Barwickian]

Re: orichalcum

 

el-EC-trum. It's a Latin word - a mixture of gold and silver, I believe.

 

Don't know about undying Persian wizards, by lich is an Old English (ie, Anglo-Saxon) word for corpse. You still find it used in the lich-gate of English chuches, or in dialect such as Yorkshire's Lyke Wake Walk, which follows an old burial trail.

 

Vorpal is a word Carroll made up to fit the rhythm and feel of the poem (Twas brillig and the slithey toves did gyre and gimbol in the mire...).

[Curufea]

Re: orichalcum

 

Possibly the intention of Carroll for a Vorpal sword was that it could go snicker-snack and kill a Jabberwock.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: orichalcum

 

Yep. The whole head-lopping aspect of the word "vorpal" came from the fact that the hero went galumphing back with the Jabberwock's head.

 

And by the way, the slithey toves were gyring and gimboling in the wabe, not the mire.

[Teflon Billy]

Re: orichalcum

 

From the rec.games.frp.dnd FAQ File (part 5 of 9):

 

G2: How do you pronounce...?

 

A: Here are some commonly mispronounced words, with their dictionary

pronunciations, where available, and common practice/TSR rulings where

not. For more general pronunciation help, see the article "Ay

pronunseeAYshun gyd" by Frank Mentzer in Dragon #93 (Jan. 1985); for

help pronouncing Forgotten Realms-specific words and names, see the

Forgotten Realms box set; for help pronouncing the names of the

various Tanar'ri and Baatezu types, see MC8 Outer Planes Appendix

or the Planescape MC appendices.

Note: the "correct" pronunciation of Drow is taken from Page 9 of

_A Grand Tour of the Realms_ (2nd edition Forgotten Realms boxed set)

where it states, "Dark elves, also called Drow (pronounced to rhyme

with now or how)..."

 

Aarakocra = a-rah-KO-krah

Arquebus = AR-keh-bus (like "Masque of the Red Death")

Baatezu = bay-AH-teh-zu

Bardiche = bar-DEESH

Bulette = boo-LAY

Catoblepus = kuht-OH-bleh-puhs, also kah-TA-ble-pus

Chatkcha = CHAT-k-cha [Thri-keen throwing weapon]

Chimaera = ky-MAEE-ruh, or ky-MAI-ruh (rhymes with "care of")

Chimera = ky-MIER-uh, or kuh-MIER-uh ("MIER" rhymes with pier)

Chitin = KITE-in

Cuirass = KWEE-rass

Drow = DROU (as in drowsy), (however, DROH is often heard anyway)

Dweomer = DWEH-mer (rhymes with "hem her"), or DWIH-mer

Falchion = FAL-shee-on

FAQ = FACK, eff-ay-cue, or, as sometimes heard on

rec.arts.comics.marvel.xbooks, fuh-cue

Geas = GEE-***, or GYASS (both with a hard "g")

Gygax = GY-gaks

Halberd = HAL-berd, (not HAL-bread)

Herb = ERB

Ioun = EYE-oon

Iuz = YOOZ, or EE-uz

Ixitxachitl = iks-it-ZATCH-i-til, or ik-zit-zah-chih-tull

Lich = LITCH (as in ditch), *not* LIKE or LICK

Lycanthrope = LY-kun-throhp, LY-kan-throhp (like lichen rope/my tan

rope)

Lycanthropy = ly-KAN-thruh-pee

Mage = MAGE (as in age), *not* MADGE (as in badger)

Mana = MA-nah (MA = as in cat), MAH-nah

Melee = Either MAY-lay (preferred), may-LAY, or meh-LAY

Otyugh = AHT-yuhg

Palladium = puh-LAY-dee-um

Sahuagin = sah-HWAH-ghin

Scythe = SYTH (rhymes with tithe)

Svirfneblin = svirf-NEB-lin

Tanar'ri = tah-NAHR-ree

Tarrasque = tar-RASK (like "Masque of the Red Death")

THAC0 = Either THAK-oh (preferred), or THAKE-oh

Wyvern = WIH-vern (as in did), or WHY-vern

Vargouille = var-GWEEL

Vrock = vrahk

Zaknafein = zack-NAY-fee-in

TB

[DrTemp]

Re: orichalcum

 

In my campaign (ca. 1300 AD in the Holy Roman Empire), "orichalcum" is too complicated for most people to pronounce, so they all just say "oricum".

[Guest bblackmoor]

Re: Orichalcum

 

But I really want to ask about liches. I have a vague idea that there was a Persian belief in a kind of undead wizard who could not be killed because he had preserved his internal organs and kept them in a safe place' date=' and could only be destroyed if you found that hiding place and attacked his naked heart, brains, etc.[/quote']

 

That premise occurs in a number of faerie stories, Persian ones included. It later appeared in a little-known novel by an English professor named "Tolkien". But any connection between those tales and the word "lich" is an extremely recent application of the term.

[ThothAmon]

Re: Orichalcum

 

But I really want to ask about liches. I have a vague idea that there was a Persian belief in a kind of undead wizard who could not be killed because he had preserved his internal organs and kept them in a safe place' date=' and could only be destroyed if you found that hiding place and attacked his naked heart, brains, etc. (Perhaps an idea derived ultimately from Egyptian funereal practice??) Of course this is also just a special case of the fairy tale motif found everywhere of the giant/wizard/whatever whose heart/life/soul is not in his body. But if any of you impressive scholars can give me more information, or can direct me to good sources, I would appreciate it.[/quote']

 

I know of it from a couple of sources - an Arabian Nights movie (or perhaps Sinbad) and a Fritz Leiber 'Grey mouser' story wherein the heroes end up in ancient Tyre.

 

Not scholarly but you did ask...

[keithcurtis]

Re: orichalcum

 

Here are some commonly mispronounced words, with their dictionary

pronunciations, where available, and common practice/TSR rulings where

not. For more general pronunciation help, see the article "Ay

pronunseeAYshun gyd" by Frank Mentzer in Dragon #93 (Jan. 1985)

...snip...

As I noted when I referenced the Mentzer article earlier in the thread, the guide had numerous mispronunciations of real wolds, most notably "plee-IS-to-seen" for Pleistocene. That article should be taken with a grain of sodium chloride. However, if those words in the article you cited are taken to be TSR/Wizards/Hasbro/whoever's official stance, it should stand as written.

 

Keith "especially since it agrees with my own pronunciations. :)" Curtis

[Lord Mhoram]

Re: orichalcum

 

 

Drow rhymes with Cow

Lich rhymes with itch

Sahuagin = SA-hwa-gin. (People who say it "sa-HYOO-a-gin" probably hang out with Old Man and his Dro crowd.)

 

I go with the first two.

Sahuagin - SA-how-gan.

I never noticed the second C in Orichalcum so I always pronounced it

Or-RICK-ya-lum

[L. Marcus]

Re: orichalcum

 

Koshei the Deathless - now there's an example of keeping your heart to yourself!

[Lucius]

Re: Orichalcum

 

That premise occurs in a number of faerie stories' date=' Persian ones included. It later appeared in a little-known novel by an English professor named "Tolkien". But any connection between those tales and the word "lich" is an extremely recent application of the term.[/quote']

 

Of course it is. I know that "lich" as in "lich gate" just means "corpse." I was hoping someone knew the Persian or other older term, assuming I'm not just completely off the mark in thinking I read somewhere about the idea coming from a Persian source.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary, alas, only goes back to 1990 AD - although similar animals go back much, much farther....