Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Sounds good to me.

and the lamplighters.... *ouch*

 

High power game I take it

You can be the judge of that:

 

http://www.killershrike.com/MillennialMen/MillennialMen.htm

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

He just doesn't open his mouth, eat the magic missile and say 'yummy!'.

 

LOL!

 

Good use of special effects too. I'd rep you if I could.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Good heavens.

 

First, thanks for all the (initial) feedback. I have a player in the campaign now who... how to say... likes to abuse rules until they go home cryin' to momma. The same player who attempted to take Flight and then assign it the disadvantage: doesn't work underwater. You get the idea.

 

I see what everyone is saying about "not playing D&D in HERO, but making HERO recreate what I want," and I can get behind that, I really can. But my mentality is such that I like at least having a grounding point for people to spring board from. Because I'm using a closed magic system (again, as much by preference as to any options I have) that's going to be a major factor in my decision as to how to set up the Spell Casting option.

 

Because I intend to have people package in their Class & Race combo, after that the limits are pretty much out there for them to seize. I run a fairly skill heavy game, so I'll have to spend some time determining what I can expect from the PCs, their dice, etc. Besides, giving them all 125 pts. & a pair of package deals will actually save them points in the long run, since the packages themselves are self-contained circuits. The other beauty of the package system is, as I mentioned before, it allows me to build specific prestige classes that represent mile stones in a characters career.

 

"You've graduated from the academy! Take the PrC "Order of the Silver Crescent" and add it to your template!" I can't do that in D&D. I wanted to. Believe it. But it was literally impossible to:

 

a) Find what I wanted, which would've been a 5 lvl PRC (or a set of them) that accounted for the major roles in an OSC squad (OSC is the name of an organization in my HB campaign).

 

Build what I wanted, as dey ain't no rules for that, thar ma'am. Nosireebob, they ain't. Y'all just gonna have to wing it. Well, that bird don't fly, if you get what I'm saying. Guaranteeing balance is nigh impossible.

 

c) Play Frankenstein with the PrCs until I'd pieced together what I wanted, that didn't look too much like a base class or wasn't seemingly balanced against everything else. The amount of work required to do that grossly outweighed the benefits of having done it. The process wasn't mathematical, nor was it intuitive, so I couldn't emote my way through it, nor reason through it, and any middle ground was gone as I racked my brain trying to balance the whole mess.

 

There are things in D&D that smack of 20th century gaming. MM is one of them, as is "Wish." 20 years later everyone is still arguing over the Paladin build. With HERO I can have all different kinds of Paladins, depending on how they wanted to handle their builds. Pally A wants to be a Healer, first & foremost. They buy up their LOH & Divine Casting ability. From my understanding, in HERO they can do that. No such animal exists in d20. Pally wanna smackdown? You can do that instead. You can balance it all out. What this does is give my PCs flexibility & options, two things they sorely lack in d20.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Good heavens.

 

First, thanks for all the (initial) feedback. I have a player in the campaign now who... how to say... likes to abuse rules until they go home cryin' to momma. The same player who attempted to take Flight and then assign it the disadvantage: doesn't work underwater. You get the idea.

Hope you pointed out Flight doesn't work underwater by default...

 

Send your player here. We will show him the correct way to be a HERO. And we're always friendly. (unless he insults us.)

 

As for PrC in HERO - I think they're even easier to build, you simply decide what kind of skills (Talents/Perks/Spells/etc...) a PrC should have and then have the Player spend Experience to get them, once they have all the of they've effectively taken on the PrC. Besides, PrC's should have been more about roleplaying being a part of an organiztion or some specialized archetype than adding a different kind of level.

[LordGhee]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

On the subject of +2 swords and such.

 

 

In general in my campains over the years players have made and found many items. (thease do not cost points)

 

I feel that some Hero players have lost some of the wonder in that they requrie points to be spent on items.

 

I Have player find a +1 sword (it just feels right ) and a +1 sword that dose an extra +1 damage ( well blanced and sharpe)

 

Finding treasure is one of the best things about adventuring!

 

A player found some Lotus plants and gather some of the pollen and created a sleep dust (sounded cool so the dust gave the points).

 

Lord Ghee

[ghost-angel]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

On the subject of +2 swords and such.

 

 

In general in my campains over the years players have made and found many items. (thease do not cost points)

 

I feel that some Hero players have lost some of the wonder in that they requrie points to be spent on items.

 

I Have player find a +1 sword (it just feels right ) and a +1 sword that dose an extra +1 damage ( well blanced and sharpe)

 

Finding treasure is one of the best things about adventuring!

 

A player found some Lotus plants and gather some of the pollen and created a sleep dust (sounded cool so the dust gave the points).

 

Lord Ghee

I agree on the points bit. I'd only make a character pay points for something they wanted to make a permanent part of their character. Otherwise assume anything you paid no points for is effectively Independant and may go away at some point.

[Savinien]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

IMO (and I hope this isn't considered blasphemy by my cohorts), balance in the HERO system is a myth. 5 pts of STR doesn't really equate perfectly with a 1d6 EB.

 

BUT (and this is a big one) HERO does the building blocks of existence that is awesome compared to D20/D&D. It doesn't have the haphazard creation feeling. Elves are not affected by sleep. Magic Missile always hits. Shield spell blocks Magic Missile. All of that is just foolishness and creating relationships betwixt these haphazard 'add-on' rules is what is broken in the Game that Must Not be Named.

 

Take that for what it is worth. ($.02 if I'm lucky.)

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

So the argument is that so long as its an OIF and can be removed, then it shouldn't cost points. That points are things that are built into the character, like brick into mortar. Ne'er shall the twain be split. Mui importante, gracias! If I were to create a "+2 Longsword" (to remain consistent) would that equate to:

 

+2 OCV (this weapon only, OIF) and +2 Body? Would that be overpowered, should I just give it Extra Stun (1/4)? Would the +2 BODY stack with the STUN roll (I'm assuming yes). I'm asking because I don't fully grep all the rules yet, or how much Body a Fantasy Hero should end up with. I know that Fantasy Hero is going to be pretty brutal, combat wise, especially because everyone is swinging for Killing Damage, although I've also heard the argument that HERO is less lethal, which I don't really understand. Specifically:

 

Your average Fighter is going to be swinging with a 15 STR. We'll say a Greatsword deals 1d6+1/2 HKA, which stacks to 2d6 1/2 HKA. I roll straight killing damage (avg. 8 BODY) and come close to killing me a commoner who is likely not wearing resistant armor, and if not dead, they're almost guaranteed to be unconcious (28 avg. STUN) and dead from a Coup de Grace on the next segment.

 

Warning: Newbie shorthand follows. Now we make our Fighter a Demon. We'll make it a sneaky demon. We'll make it a sneaky demon with a 20 STR and a 30 DEX, immunity to all sorts of things (poison, lightning, possibly limited transform), and Sneak Attack (2d6 HKA, only works from behind, must be an edged weapon, target must be distracted/unaware, must be within 6" if used at range, prereq for Range usage: Point Blank Shot, linked to normal attack). And he uses a short sword (1d6 HKA) and gets the drop on the target. Unless the hero has resistant armor, he's looking at ... 5d6 1/3 HKA, averaging 16 BODY and 56 STUN, if I did my math right.

 

That, to me, is extremely lethal. Now, granted, odds are good my heroes will have resistant armor (hardened leather, plate, etc.) but I haven't play tested the system enough to know whether or not this is going to end someone outright. I'm not saying I'm not willing to drop a PC if the dice dictate it, I'm saying I don't want the fight to be unfair.

 

Thoughts?

[ghost-angel]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

So the argument is that so long as its an OIF and can be removed, then it shouldn't cost points. That points are things that are built into the character, like brick into mortar. Ne'er shall the twain be split. Mui importante, gracias! If I were to create a "+2 Longsword" (to remain consistent) would that equate to:

 

+2 OCV (this weapon only, OIF) and +2 Body? Would that be overpowered, should I just give it Extra Stun (1/4)? Would the +2 BODY stack with the STUN roll (I'm assuming yes). I'm asking because I don't fully grep all the rules yet, or how much Body a Fantasy Hero should end up with. I know that Fantasy Hero is going to be pretty brutal, combat wise, especially because everyone is swinging for Killing Damage, although I've also heard the argument that HERO is less lethal, which I don't really understand. Specifically:

 

Your average Fighter is going to be swinging with a 15 STR. We'll say a Greatsword deals 1d6+1/2 HKA, which stacks to 2d6 1/2 HKA. I roll straight killing damage (avg. 8 BODY) and come close to killing me a commoner who is likely not wearing resistant armor, and if not dead, they're almost guaranteed to be unconcious (28 avg. STUN) and dead from a Coup de Grace on the next segment.

 

Warning: Newbie shorthand follows. Now we make our Fighter a Demon. We'll make it a sneaky demon. We'll make it a sneaky demon with a 20 STR and a 30 DEX, immunity to all sorts of things (poison, lightning, possibly limited transform), and Sneak Attack (2d6 HKA, only works from behind, must be an edged weapon, target must be distracted/unaware, must be within 6" if used at range, prereq for Range usage: Point Blank Shot, linked to normal attack). And he uses a short sword (1d6 HKA) and gets the drop on the target. Unless the hero has resistant armor, he's looking at ... 5d6 1/3 HKA, averaging 16 BODY and 56 STUN, if I did my math right.

 

That, to me, is extremely lethal. Now, granted, odds are good my heroes will have resistant armor (hardened leather, plate, etc.) but I haven't play tested the system enough to know whether or not this is going to end someone outright. I'm not saying I'm not willing to drop a PC if the dice dictate it, I'm saying I don't want the fight to be unfair.

 

Thoughts?

Several points:

1) Don't expect to be able to have immuity to things like Poison, Lightning, etc... HERO doesn't do Immunity very well. There are several threads that talk abot methods for this, but I suggest you guys avoid adding onto the Core System until you're comfortable with it.

 

2) in Heroic Games, especially Fantasy HERO, most weapons have a STR Miniumum required to weild it that don't add to damage. Keep that in mind.

 

3) You can never ever more than Double a Killing Attack with STR - your demon weilding a 1D6 Sword won't ever do more then 2D6 Damage with it.

 

Lethality in HERO can be controlled, if you want less Lethal results allow higher Resistant Defenses, you more more lethal results force lower Resistant Defenses. You rarely have to mess with the actual damage to gain lethality.

 

The biggest difference from D20 you'll note in HERO is Armor does not add to your ability to Not Be Hit - it adds to your ability to No Take Damage.

 

I would model a +2 Long Sword as a +2 OCV Only, allowing for it to hit more often or by adding a 1/2D6 to the base Damage of the sword (+2 Damage Classes), but not both. That's a personal thing though.

 

Oh, to touch on the very first part of your post: The rule of thumb is if it can be taken away (regardless of focus or not) permanently then no points should be spent. If the character wants an item/ability or whatever to be part of their character and never permanently taken then have them spend points on it. You can always take it temporarily - especially if it's part of a focus (that's the downside to a focus, it can be removed from you), but the character should end up with it again later in the story or the next adventure if it's an episodic campaign.

[Dale A. Ward]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Several points:

1) Don't expect to be able to have immuity to things like Poison, Lightning, etc... HERO doesn't do Immunity very well. There are several threads that talk abot methods for this, but I suggest you guys avoid adding onto the Core System until you're comfortable with it.

 

No? What about Life Support: vs. poison, etc.?

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Dont have time to parse all of that -- have to get ready for work and all that -- but here is how I handle Magic Items:

 

http://www.killershrike.com/FantasyHERO/HighFantasyHERO/shrikeMagicItems.shtml

 

 

As far as making Package Deals self contained, I would highly recommend against doing it for any Package Deal where the player has any control over the situation. Ive experimented with it extensively in the past, and while there are some advantages to it from an accounting standpoint, it leads to uneven power scaling. I do it for Race Packages and it works out because players have zero control over it and can't adjust the packages. Profession Package on the other hand are a lot more malleable/customizable.

 

 

As far as "CLASSES" go, Ive found that its much better to provide Packaged Deals mirroring Classes for those that are comfortable with that idea, but to not require them. Players will find a balance that they are happy with -- using the Packages as is so they can get started playing, or reading the rules and coming up with ideas of their own, or somewhere in between. Take that for what its worth.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

As an aside, I dont have time to do the math on your damage calc, but basically, if using a 1d6 HKA sword, youre only going to be able to add another 1d6 from STR due to the doubling rule, also dont forget about STR Minimums if you are using them. Alo there is no provision for 1/3d6 -- but Im going to assume that is a typo.

 

Also Sneak Attack is already covered by the "DEADLY BLOW" talent in Fantasy HERO, so theres no need to recreate it, but thats a close enough approximation.

 

Technically Deadly Blow counts as "base damage" and thus expands the doubling rule quite a bit, but personally I put some limits on that to prevent some absurd situations that can occur.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

No? What about Life Support: vs. poison' date=' etc.? [/quote']

Nothing is garaunteed. I like the idea that nothing is 100% Absolute, keeps 'em on the edge.

 

But yes, there is Life Support: Poisons.

 

But not Lightning.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

So that would be an Energy Resistance vs. Lightning then. Immunities are a no go, again, good to know. As I mentioned, I'm fighting my way (in a baby vs. bear sort of way... and the bear isn't being gentle) with the 4th Ed. CHAMPIONS book, and it's driving me vaguely batty. On the one hand I have the GM telling me that the changes from 4 to 5 are minimal, but I have to believe that there's some sort of improvement to the general formatting of the beast.

 

Energy Resistance can do just fine in lieu of an immunity, and I'm down with that. I also come from the SOT which says "The only absolute is that there are no absolutes." Which makes Magic Missile & Immunities an anomaly compared to how I think, but I'm so garf-barking used to them that it's difficult to get out of my head.

 

Killer Shrike - my concept of a 'class' structure is to give the PCs a launching off point, especially in terms of casting ability, knowledges and what have you. I've also been introduced to the idea of spells requiring either knowledge rolls to cast or hit rolls to connect, and those both seemed astonishingly spiffy to me. As I said prior, MM is a lame duck which was never put out of my misery. It's fantastic for CRPGs and group mosh games (D&D Heroes, etc.) but as a general rule, it's an over powered, under leveled spell. What was really entertaining is in d20/3.5 when they introduced Scorching Ray, which is even more absurd, and simply requires a to-hit roll assuming the target has only their dex mod & the grace of God on their side.

 

Yikes. Anyway.

 

I will look up Deadly Blow in my copy of 4th and see what it says. I'll also bear in mind that it stacks with the 'doubling rule.' So the Doubling Rule says I can never stack more STR than I have innate weapon damage dealing ability? Mui importante, muchos gracias. That will help keep things under control. Y'all also aren't the first folk who've said that the RAW naturally controls damage dealt and lethality; I'm nervy about it, but I'll take the blind leap of faith required.

[ghost-angel]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

If you can wing it I suggest picking up Fifth Revised, don't know if any hardcopy are available at the moment, but PDFs never run out.

 

Changes are minimal for those who have played for years, but there are changes and your sanity is best served by just getting the latest version.

[Markdoc]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Couple of things to keep in mind, from someone who has made the conversion.

 

1. YES - Hero can be a lot more lethal than D20. Your sneaky demon may or may not put the hurt on Sir Pher the sunbleached if it catches him with all his armour on, but catch him by surprise when he's at the beach in just his heralidic swimsuit and he could easily end up dead.

 

This - to me - is a feature, not a bug, because it ends the 120 HP tank guy phenomenon, but it does mean you have to be bit more careful with PCs. My suggestion is to start your combats off with smaller, feebler foes until you're hip to the system and can better judge what will and will not lead to massive player death.

 

cheers, Mark

[Susano]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Hmm... while we're at it, let me post some links to some Feats and Magic items for HERO I was sent (and finally got around to posting).

 

Feats: http://surbrook.devermore.net/herosource/feats.html

 

Magic Items: http://surbrook.devermore.net/herosource/magicitems.html

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

And in all honesty, I think I prefer it that way. It's hard to explain; I'm not, by any stretch of the imagination, a PKer. It just isn't how I do things. But, with that in mind, I do want a certain level of lethality; I want the players to go into combat scared, and d20 is scaled in an extremely bizarre way that makes balancing combat border on voodoo.

 

One of the big examples I like to use to illustrate the flaw in d20 goes something like this:

 

According to RAW, a group of 4 adventurers, of X level, can engage a creatures with a Challenge Rating (CR) of X, to challenge them, X+1, to threaten them, X+2, to endanger them, X+3, kill them, X+4. So a group of 3rd level characters should be able to engage a single 3 CR creature and consume 25% of their total resources (spells, HP, etc.). So far, so good. The system is theoretically scaled to support any special abilities that a MOB may have against the resources of the PCs. With me so far? Good.

 

A Cockatrice (p.15 - 16) is a standard CR 3 MOB from the Monster Manual. It's primary ability is to turn people to stone. It has a strong to-hit ratio, and about 28 HP. If it connects, the PC must make a DC 12 Fortitude saving throw or get turned into a rock. Translated, that's a 40% survival rate on a d20 check, straight up. Add in a Fortitude save (+1, roughly without going into class breakdowns) and you're at 45%. We'll be nice and grant a CON bonus of +1, even though for a lot of people it's a dump stat, so even 50%.

 

I have 6 3rd level party members, which makes two of these things a (theoretically) fair fight. If both swing, and both hit (odds of which are good to very good) I'm going to have a statue on my hands, because they gave a CR 3 MOB what we refer to as a Save or Die. In HERO, this doesn't happen without a massive expenditure of points to generate a Transform Killing attack (shape: Stone).

 

Under HERO, I can either make Transform the MOBs primary ability with a massive dice chuck (8d6, say, to deal double body on average to a commoner and guarantee the transform (24 avg. Body to a 10 Body normal), or the way I preferred to do it was a 2d6 Cumulative Transform, which would make the fight both terrifying, and fair.

 

I realize I'm tangenting, but this is one of the major examples of how d20 is just p*ssing me off, because it's not gauged in a way that makes logical sense. Yes, the PCs killed both MOBs, but the Paladin made a save by 2; any other character on that roll would've been stuck in a garden with a bird bath.

[Old Man]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

No? What about Life Support: vs. poison' date=' etc.? [/quote']

 

Have to read rest of thread but wanted to say this.

 

Life Support vs. Poison, Disease, whatever, works backwards. You see, the reason LS would work is because Poisons, Diseases and such are often built NND, (maybe Does BODY) Defense is LS: Immune to XX.

 

If the GM wants to make a special poison, then the defense would be different.

[Susano]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

A Cockatrice (p.15 - 16) is a standard CR 3 MOB from the Monster Manual.

 

What does MOB stand for?

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Susano: MOB stands for Mobile Object Beast, it's a holdover term from MUDs (Multi-User Dungeon) and is slang for monster or creature. It's used to represent anything that isn't a major PC or NPC. Golems, Cockatrice, Dragons, and worms that say 'allo! are all MOBs.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

...the 4th Ed. CHAMPIONS book, and it's driving me vaguely batty. On the one hand I have the GM telling me that the changes from 4 to 5 are minimal, but I have to believe that there's some sort of improvement to the general formatting of the beast.

Not much has changed from a MECHANICS perspective, but a lot has been ADDED in the way of new modifiers and copious explanation of various unusual combinations or circumstances and a lot of erata and common sense adjudication.

 

Personally I would highly recommend getting 5th Edition Revised, with the strongest emphasis possible.

Energy Resistance can do just fine in lieu of an immunity, and I'm down with that. I also come from the SOT which says "The only absolute is that there are no absolutes." Which makes Magic Missile & Immunities an anomaly compared to how I think, but I'm so garf-barking used to them that it's difficult to get out of my head.

Well, actually, the HERO System does do absolutes -- but there are always exceptions. There are so many ways to build things in the HERO System that no defense is perfect, and on the otherside all open ended power constructs require a "reasonably common" SFX or circumstance that stops them.

 

Killer Shrike - my concept of a 'class' structure is to give the PCs a launching off point, especially in terms of casting ability, knowledges and what have you. I've also been introduced to the idea of spells requiring either knowledge rolls to cast or hit rolls to connect, and those both seemed astonishingly spiffy to me.

Sure, I understand the value of Package Deals -- Im Mr. Package Deal; I've provided probably somewhere around a couple hundred on my site (Ive never bothered to count), and since they are designed to be modular the number of combinations climbs into some big number.

 

I just think its important to point out that there is definitely a difference between a HERO Package Deal, which is useful as a building block or conceptual convenience, and a CLASS which are fixed and inflexible and force characters down a particular development path. Package Deals are a lot more flexible and organic of a concept, really.

 

As far as Magic Systems are concerned, I provide a pretty wide assortment of them on my site for perusal including a very expansive set of "Vancian" Magic Systems that are D&D-eque; this document compares them to each other to help figure out which ones are good at what:

 

http://www.killershrike.com/FantasyHERO/HighFantasyHERO/shrikeMagicSystemAdvisor.shtml

 

And, if you prefer to make your own I provide a document discussing some theoretical things to keep in mind here:

 

http://www.killershrike.com/FantasyHERO/HighFantasyHERO/shrikeMagicDesign.shtml

 

and some generally useful practical application considerations here:

 

http://www.killershrike.com/FantasyHERO/HighFantasyHERO/shrikeMagic.shtml

 

There are also around 12 sample Magic Systems given in the current edition of Fantasy HERO, and some others have posted up their Magic Systems as well. A veritable plethora of options essentially.

 

 

I will look up Deadly Blow in my copy of 4th and see what it says. I'll also bear in mind that it stacks with the 'doubling rule.' So the Doubling Rule says I can never stack more STR than I have innate weapon damage dealing ability? Mui importante, muchos gracias. That will help keep things under control. Y'all also aren't the first folk who've said that the RAW naturally controls damage dealt and lethality; I'm nervy about it, but I'll take the blind leap of faith required.

 

As far as the doubling rule is concerned, yes basically. However Active Points have to be considered also; STR is prorated across attacks w/ Advantages applied. Actually the damage adding rules are one of the things that have changed a bit in 5th Edition; especially Hand Attacks.

 

You wont find Deadly Blow in 4th Edition -- its in Fantasy HERO for 5th Edition.

[Killer Shrike]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Under HERO, I can either make Transform the MOBs primary ability with a massive dice chuck (8d6, say, to deal double body on average to a commoner and guarantee the transform (24 avg. Body to a 10 Body normal), or the way I preferred to do it was a 2d6 Cumulative Transform, which would make the fight both terrifying, and fair.

Transform is inherently CUMULATIVE in 5th Edition, FYI. One of the "little changes" we've mentioned

 

There is also an advantage now for "Partial Transform" which should be obvious in context.

 

 

 

That aside, you could also build a turn to stone attack as a straight up KILLING ATTACK with the SFX of turn target to stone. Its only useful as a Transform if turning them to stone doesnt actually kill them. A Stone To Flesh equivalent in the "Petrification as Killing Attack" model would be Healing w/ the Ressurect adder (another new feature in 5th Edition, though it was a common house rule in 4th), and Limited to Only vs Petrified People.

[Old Man]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Forgot to add, ss an option instead of awarding straight exp for some quests/goals, you can give characters X points in Perks or Skills.

[Thia Halmades]

Re: Fixin' what's broken - switching from d20 to HERO

 

Originally Posted by Killer Shrike

That aside, you could also build a turn to stone attack as a straight up KILLING ATTACK with the SFX of turn target to stone. Its only useful as a Transform if turning them to stone doesnt actually kill them. A Stone To Flesh equivalent in the "Petrification as Killing Attack" model would be Healing w/ the Ressurect adder (another new feature in 5th Edition, though it was a common house rule in 4th), and Limited to Only vs Petrified People.

 

Pardon me.

 

What?

 

Gracias!