Blue Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Heheh. Curious: Has he hit on any married Avengers? Or is that baggage just carried over from Phoenix/Marvel Girl days? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supreme Serpent Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine I think they're referring to him hitting on Mary Jane Watson-Parker, Spidey's wife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Yup... though to be fair, I exagerate. One could view it as Wolverine just being an @$$ and razing Peter about how such a babe is wasted on him rather than true interest in MJ herself, but IMO, it has come across as more than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstone Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Who maybe somewhat torqued by the many appearances he hasn't made There's no denying Wolverine and Spiderman helped boost sales. Even if nither of them stick around for the long run, they brought in new readers who just might stay on for more. That's what Marvel hopes to gain. That's all I'm sayin'. If only those were used. As it stands, his major contributions seem to be belching, hitting on married women, and then vanishing when he could be useful on a trip to Japan. Unfortunatly I can't deny that, but it's not like it's Wolverine's fault that Bendis doesn't know how to write him None of the team are really being used to their full potential. Not even close. It's sad too, 'cause I like most of the individuals on the team, it's just not much of a team yet... Clearly, Stark is paying him too much... but at least that makes sense as the man can't clone himself. According to editorial, none of the New Avengers are actually taking home a paycheck. It's strictly volunteer at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine That's all I'm sayin'. No denying the sales aspect. I was thinking more 'in character' stuff rather than marketting, but you're right that he is a major Cash Cow and he's not the only one. Unfortunatly I can't deny that, but it's not like it's Wolverine's fault that Bendis doesn't know how to write him True, but it does make it harder to tolerate him as a character on the team. None of the team are really being used to their full potential. Not even close. It's sad too, 'cause I like most of the individuals on the team, it's just not much of a team yet... You got me there, Tex. See my gripes elsewhere about how I'd like to see the New Avengers win some more on their own collective two feet instead of having to bring in folks According to editorial, none of the New Avengers are actually taking home a paycheck. It's strictly volunteer at this point. Yeah, I know Spidey got told there was no pay (though now he's got a cushy pad in the tower) and Tony mentioned he couldn't write the checks anymore. But there's definitely wheeling and dealing that has occured for Logan. New Avengers #8 Bottom of Pg. 9 I think. Tony is trying to convince Logan to join up Tony: "All Right, let me put it this way... I'm a very rich man. What do you want that you don't have?" Logan: "You bribing me?" Tony: "Trading" .......... To be fair to Wolverine, he does have a great line in that very comic later on as he's getting up from being nailed by a supervillain "I haven't made a good descion in fourteen years, I swear to..." That did make me chuckle and was one of the better moments for Bendis with Wolverine imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikathos Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Is it wrong to imagine Wolverine as a Wille E. Coyote or Daffy Duck figure? Constantly taking damage no human much less hero could take and coming back for even more. Oh the possiblities! Hence my glee at remembering how Frank Castle blew his face off with a Shotgun. The only times I liked the character were the X-Men Vs. the Hellfire club. Getting his density increased falling through the floor and then ending up in the Sewer with a look etched on his face that there would be a reckoning! And the Limited Series Miller did in the 80's with Wolvie. Ninja's gotta love the ninjas. And of course Wolvie getting pierced by 50 arrows. That's it, now..he is tired and grossly overused as a marketing idea. Which begs the question. "What Marvel title has he NOT been in?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy Gnome Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Clearly' date=' Stark is paying him too much... but at least that makes sense as the man can't clone himself. [/quote'] I wonder. His regeneration got ridiculously powerful that time Magneto or Lady Deathstrike or whoever it was stole his adamantium. Has he ever tried cloning himself? Fission isn't just for paramecia and radiation accidents anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Are Colossus and Magik still dead? No and ..NO? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstone Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine No and ..NO? Colossus is very much alive. Illyana is still very much dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transmetahuman Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Illyana is still very much dead. Given the nature of Limbo and her stepping disc power, that could change at the drop of a hat, easy. It almost seems bizarre that she hasn't been "resurrected" yet, as a slightly younger Illyana who mis-stepped through time. It'd be so easy. Maybe it wouldn't be contrived and stupid enough? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Colossus is very much alive. Illyana is still very much dead. oh well, 50/50 Thanks Bloodstone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutant for Hire Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine All things considered, Illyana is one of the lucky ones. Female characters in the Marvel Universe tend not to do too well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike W Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Wolverine's problem is the same as Batman's problem is the same as most comic book characters' problems anymore. Too many fanboys who think they can write have been allowed to prove(often again and again) that they cannot write or even have the beginnings of an idea of how to write well. The things that make Wolverine great and unique are generally sacrificed on the altar of people who seem him as a psycho with claws and just enough restraint to not turn into Sabretooth but otherwise define him as a "good guy" because he elects to beat up "bad guys" as opposed to "innocent people" or other "good guys". Quite frankly, the number of good comic writers can be counted on one hand right now, which is why I recently stopped picking up my books. Too much money for stories that I wouldn't dare bring to my game group, let alone try to pass off as publishable quality writing that I would expect people to fork over money for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerhouse Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine when a woman is abused or raped in a comic/movie/tv show, it gives the other characters the liscence to go and "save the day" without any grey areas. It's also a cheap and easy way to add a "dimension" to any female character... which is why some huge rediculous amount of comic heroines have been raped, beaten, had pregnancies caused from something akin to supernatural rape... It's retarded. Rape & spoucal abuse = bad btw. __________________ Ok, that's outta left field. My point was however that I don't understand (outside of a sales PoV), how Pym gets dumped on so much compared to Wolverine. Pym did a lot less and did alot more to make up for what he did and is still looked at badly. Wolvie is hanging out at the Xavier mansion as if nothing bad happened. WTH? Just poor, poor writing and continuity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstone Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine ...ok... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjcurrie Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine You know in all the Champions campaigns that I have run or played in over the years, I can only remember one Wolverine clone and that was a character a friend of mine quickly threw together to help test out the Champions rule in late 1982. And that wasn't a character he ever intended to use in a campaign. In truth, while there were a few characters that were inspired in part by comic book characters in those campaigns, I can't think of too may that were outright clones. Perhaps it was because we were all in at least our early twenties and the character cloning thing may be more of a teenage thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squall Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Given the nature of Limbo and her stepping disc power' date=' that could change at the drop of a hat, easy. It almost seems bizarre that she [i']hasn't[/i] been "resurrected" yet, as a slightly younger Illyana who mis-stepped through time. It'd be so easy. Maybe it wouldn't be contrived and stupid enough? Actually, I'm pretty sure she's back. Or, at least, some straight-haired blond teenager with a silver arm, access to Limbo, stepping disc powers, etc, etc, has been hanging out at Xavier's School, in some of their latest New Mutants stuff. I can't promise they called her Illyana (I was just flipping through the comic at my local shop), but...uhh...yeah. Kinda feels that way. Just off the top of my head, and not counting alternate realities or (of course) supervillians, I've got Collossus, Illyana (several times now), Jean Grey (who's still counting?), Superman, Donna Troy (six or eight times by now, I'm sure) Jason Todd, Bucky, Hawkeye, and however many dozens (or hundreds) of others. Or, of course, counting the times all the X-Men "died" or all the JLA were "surely killed," or whatever. Those are just the major deaths, off the top of my head, that DC or Marvel made a big deal about, each and every time. I wish the head honchos of all the various titles (and both major companies)would realize just how much it belittles the value of heroism and bravery, to have death be so impermanent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dynamo Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Which begs the question. "What Marvel title has he NOT been in?" Howard the Duck? Damn, no duck emoticon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow_walker Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine I'm still trying to figure out what he brings to the New Avengers beyond a super sniffer and the "I go stabby" power. Maybe he's going to be the team's new mascot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZootSoot Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine My take is that I like Wolverine. He's a great character when used correctly for a few reasons: 1. Mysterious past 2. Attitude 3. He's often the rebel of the team 4. Empowerment- let's be honest, haven't we all wanted to be like Wolverine just once? The big problem is that he's been used too much by too many writers which has not only created boredom with the character but confusion with all of the multiple interpretations. There hasn't been an effort to keep the character consistent that I can see. Personally, the biggest problem I have right now is the terrible continuity of Logan. He killed tons of people when he was under Hydra control yet has been welcomed back with open arms. I'm sorry but "I was mind controlled" just doesn't cut it. I don't think anyone could ever trust him again or be comfortable around him. Heck, he's still in the mansion despite having killed Northstar- you can't tell me the student could see him and not run screaming in the other direction. Edit: I just thought of something. Henry Pym gets more grief even today for having hit the Wasp once after he was exposed to mind altering chemicals thatn Wolverine does for being a mind controlled assassin who killed hundreds. WTH? I missed him killing Northstar (though I have read it around here before). Was it slow and painful? Agonizing and sadistic? Did Northstar have to crawl through his own blood and filth? If the answer to any of the above is no, please don't tell me, I need the fantasy . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Actually, I'm pretty sure she's back. Or, at least, some straight-haired blond teenager with a silver arm, access to Limbo, stepping disc powers, etc, etc, has been hanging out at Xavier's School, in some of their latest New Mutants stuff. I can't promise they called her Illyana (I was just flipping through the comic at my local shop), but...uhh...yeah. Kinda feels that way. Just off the top of my head, and not counting alternate realities or (of course) supervillians, I've got Collossus, Illyana (several times now), Jean Grey (who's still counting?), Superman, Donna Troy (six or eight times by now, I'm sure) Jason Todd, Bucky, Hawkeye, and however many dozens (or hundreds) of others. Or, of course, counting the times all the X-Men "died" or all the JLA were "surely killed," or whatever. Those are just the major deaths, off the top of my head, that DC or Marvel made a big deal about, each and every time. I wish the head honchos of all the various titles (and both major companies)would realize just how much it belittles the value of heroism and bravery, to have death be so impermanent. Illyana has only died once too my knowledge, and that was because of the Legacy Virus [which in my opinion should've been a snap for the various Marvel superscientists to fix but that's a rant in and of itself]. This death happened in the ninetys just after X-cutioner's Song if I'm not mistaken. I do recall reading that Cannonball went to the funeral. Previous to that of course she'd been kidnapped by Belasco, artificially aged in Limbo, turned into a part demon, helped the X-Men defeat Belasco to become ruler of Limbo, been part of the New Mutants, lost Limbo to S'ym, and de-aged back to her normal age after the Inferno storyline was over. However, she hadn't died previous to the death I remember, to my knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstone Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Actually' date=' I'm pretty sure she's back. Or, at least, some straight-haired blond teenager with a silver arm, access to Limbo, stepping disc powers, etc, etc, has been hanging out at Xavier's School, in some of their latest New Mutants stuff. I can't promise they called her Illyana (I was just flipping through the comic at my local shop), but...uhh...yeah. Kinda feels that way.[/quote'] I didn't read this, but I think I know what you are talking about. Illyana was "back" during the New Mutants issues of House of M. Gwen Stacy, Uncle Ben and Howard Stark (Tony's dad) all made appearances during that event. None of them are actully alive in the real 616 timeline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Yes I think that is what he's talking about Bloodstone. I did a little research and it seemed that Magik did return during House of M in the Scarlet Witch's alternate reality. Before the Scarlet Witch was defeated, Illyana teleported to Limbo causing fans to hope that Illyana might have survived. I know I'm hoping that cause I really liked Illyana's character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstone Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine I missed him killing Northstar (though I have read it around here before). Was it slow and painful? Agonizing and sadistic? Did Northstar have to crawl through his own blood and filth? If the answer to any of the above is no' date=' please don't tell me, I need the fantasy . . .[/quote'] You know, I probably don't want to know the answer but... um... Why would you want him to die like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squall Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 Re: Sick of Wolverine Yes I think that is what he's talking about Bloodstone. I did a little research and it seemed that Magik did return during House of M in the Scarlet Witch's alternate reality. Before the Scarlet Witch was defeated, Illyana teleported to Limbo causing fans to hope that Illyana might have survived. I know I'm hoping that cause I really liked Illyana's character. That might've been all it was. Like I said, I was just sort of flipping through it and killing time, so it might have just been a House of M instead of a really crappy "real" comic (I wasn't too impressed, either way). Thanks for setting my mind at ease. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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